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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 9 adjusting the text to move a LINE that should be on page 9. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ OK. Makes sense to me. I don't HAVE, as in possession, a need to disbelieve that God can sacrifice his only begotten son for me and my sins, while currently I see no such thing even being possible. Would you be jealous if Jesus has a private conversation with me, before he pencils you in on his busy schedule? Not me, but I'm not the type to slam the door in HIS face either. I want to know the truth, from any messenger. ________________________________________ “And also Luke 8:12 KJV Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved. And in that verse the devil take the word so that they cannot believe.” ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The line above "And also..." has a line that is supposed to be below it. That line appears on the top of page 10. I can take out the lines, or I can take out some Text to move the line. I did this: ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ OK. Makes sense to me. I don't HAVE, as in possession, a need to disbelieve that God can sacrifice his only begotten son for me and my sins, while currently I see no such thing even being possible. Would you be jealous if Jesus has a private conversation with me, before he pencils you in on his busy schedule? Not me, but I'm not the type to slam the door in HIS face either. I want to know the truth, from any messenger. ________________________________________ “And also Luke 8:12 KJV Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved. And in that verse the devil take the word so that they cannot believe.” _________________________________________ +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 20 ++++++++++++++++++++++++ Here is the source: If you can't find the time to read the book then you will not have as much information available to make sense of the quote: ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I can take out the line "Here is the source:" or I can add the Title to the book. I did this: ++++++++++++++++++++++++++ If you can't find the time to read the book from which the quote below is published, then you will not have as much information available to make sense of the quote: +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Index Link number 8 I took out a link that was not an Amazon book link, and I replaced it with the Amazon book link, because the other one started some advertizements. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 40 +++++++++++++++++++++++ "I am telling you that there are prejudiced people that H A T E black people and those types of prejudiced people are poison. I am saying be +++++++++++++++++++++++ PagThere is a lot of space between "that H A T E" I did this: ++++++++++++++++++++++ "I am telling you that there are prejudiced people that H A T E black people and those types of prejudiced people are poison. +++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 41 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The bathwater, when I employ that analogy, means the lies that cover up the violence. And the violence and the threats - all part of the bathwater; and the baby is all that can be done by people to survive and survive better without that bathwater. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ That second sentence is very poor to me. I did this: +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The bathwater, when I employ that analogy, means the lies that cover up the violence. The violence, the threats too, are all part of the bathwater; and the baby is all that can be done by people to survive and survive better without that bathwater. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 50 +++++++++++++++++++ I said, “It was not my money, in that case. +++++++++++++++++++ Missing quotation mark. ++++++++++++++++++++++ I said, “It was not my money, in that case.” ++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 53 ++++++++++++++++++++++++ Means, a word, BEING DEFINED according to an authoritative source that DEFINES the word "means:" means plural of means (Noun) Noun: An action or system by which a result is brought about. Money; financial resources. ++++++++++++++++++++++++ Now reads: ++++++++++++++++++++++++ Means, a word, BEING DEFINED according to an authoritative source? Google Search for “means definition.” I find: means plural of means (Noun) Noun: 1. An action or system by which a result is brought about. 2. Money; financial resources. +++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 55 +++++++++++++++++++ This is a dragon you are fighting and that dragon is hinted at in the quote published by Erich Fromm on Carl Marx - if you have forgotten it I can re-publish it here. +++++++++++++++++++ Karl not Carl +++++++++++++++++++ This is a dragon you are fighting and that dragon is hinted at in the quote published by Erich Fromm on Karl Marx - if you have forgotten it I can re-publish it here. +++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 56 ++++++++++++++ can immobilize, without harming anyone, other than relatively harming them in the sense that they don't get to murder and torture someone, which to them is a loss of their valuable time and energy. ++++++++++++++ Replaced period with a question mark. ++++++++++++++ can immobilize, without harming anyone, other than relatively harming them in the sense that they don't get to murder and torture someone, which to them is a loss of their valuable time and energy? ++++++++++++++ Note: I had removed an extra space between "please." and "Romans" on Page 55. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 76 ++++++++++++++++++ "He seemed to listen." ++++++++++++++++++ I added a note this way: ++++++++++++++++++ "He seemed to listen." [Author: Not a reference to Romney] ++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 76 ++++++++++++++++++ "He seemed to listen." ++++++++++++++++++ I added a note this way: ++++++++++++++++++ "He seemed to listen." [Joe: Not a reference to Romney] ++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 79 ++++++++++++++++ [editorial note bear: I must answer, “No faith is not earned. Ephesians 2:8&9 (quoting so may not be perfect) “For by grace are ye saved THRU FAITH AND THAT NOT OF YOURSELVES, IT IS A GIFT OF GOD, NOT OF WORKS, LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST.” Faith is a gift. We will not stand in our own merit. It will all be of God. I will not be able to stand there in his presence and say, “Look what I have done to get here.” Joe the point is: I can't get there alone. I am without hope in this world without Christ bear, If you can please add that answer to that question if it is a reference to the book, my ears can listen, but I am only one lost soul. –Joe] +++++++++++++++++++++++ That looked clumsy to me with the Brackets. I did this: ++++++++++++++++++++++++ "...I have even had my faith shaken." How can you remain faithful if you do not resolve contradictions that may appear to be contradictions in time? You are not God, so you will not know everything. And I thought that faith was earned, not handed to you on a silver platter, am I mistaken? “No faith is not earned. Ephesians 2: 8 - 9 (quoting so may not be perfect) “For by grace are ye saved THRU FAITH AND THAT NOT OF YOURSELVES, IT IS A GIFT OF GOD, NOT OF WORKS, LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST.” Faith is a gift. We will not stand in our own merit. It will all be of God. I will not be able to stand there in his presence and say, “Look what I have done to get here.” Joe the point is: I can't get there alone. I am without hope in this world without Christ.” That answer to that question is added to this book, because my ears can listen, but I am only one lost soul. [Joe: additions to original] "But haven’t we talked about the cost of all the deceit?" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 98 ++++++++++++++++++++++ So...you have someone joining them, everyone has joined ‘em. If you use dollars, you are a member if the Union, but the level of "interest" is interesting. ++++++++++++++++++++++ if is now of ++++++++++++++++++++++ So...you have someone joining them, everyone has joined ‘em. If you use dollars, you are a member of the Union, but the level of "interest" is interesting. ++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 103 ++++++++++++++++ After the months these symbols in English were invented, produced, and published as currency, verbal currency, equitably transferred on the Forum called The Daily Paul. Since then, and credited to bear’s diligent help, I’ve made major breakthroughs in thinking – I think. ++++++++++++++++ I need to rewrite that, but it is time for dinner. ++++++++++++++++ These symbols in English were arranged and published as currency, verbal currency, equitably transferred on the Forum called The Daily Paul, over a span of many months. Since then, and credited to bear’s diligent help, I’ve made major breakthroughs in thinking – I think. ++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 109 was: ++++++++++++++++++++++ Video: [Joe: generously offered by bear to Joe] “Ron Paul: Unless we understand…we must protect life, we cannot protect liberty.”30 Nice, very nice, link to Ron Paul - thanks a million - that link it is a precious idea well communicated by Ron Paul. ++++++++++++++++++ Page 109 is now: ++++++++++++++++++++ Video: [Joe: generously offered by bear to Joe] “Ron Paul: Unless we understand…we must protect life, we cannot protect liberty.”30 Nice, very nice, link to Ron Paul - thanks a million - in that link are precious ideas well communicated by Ron Paul. ++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 118 was: I was the Libertarian voice during one official Congressional debate. I went alone to it, at my own expense. The incumbent did not attend, at my expense, too. Page 118 is: I was the Libertarian voice during one official Congressional debate. I went alone to it, at my own expense. The incumbent did not attend at my expense too. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I am at the Sympathy but Not Empathy Chapter and I decided to contact the Daily Paul Forum Member whose words are quoted in that Chapter. I am sending the following message to her via the personal contact channel at The Daily Paul. If she does not respond, I will not edit the Chapter. Title Quoting words here, placed in a book Text fonta, I am Joe Kelley, my handle here on this forum is Josf, we have exchanged published words on this forum, and I have those words cut and pasted into a book that will be printed, published, and sold, unless you decide otherwise. Since my words are going to be printed in the book, I will then need to replace your words with references to the anonymous person who inspired me to write the words I wrote, and the words that inspired me will be missing. http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2821837 bear, another forum member, is helping me publish this book, and she decided to cut the words out of that link above, which are now words pasted into a file that will be sent to printers for a book. Your name is not mentioned, my name is mentioned, there is a link to that web page in the book, so far as the book exists in a Word file at this point. bear, the same forum member helping me publish this book, is concerned about using quotes where the people who published those quotes may not want their words printed in this book. I am doing what I think should be done, in this case, asking for your permission to print those words of yours. I don't want to cut this chapter out of the book. If you demand that I do not include any connection to you, whatsoever, in the book, no link to that discussion, no mention of you whatsoever, I still have my words that I will somehow place in the book, and somehow avoid any unwelcome connection to you, if that is your decision. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 130 ++++++++++++++ What does the FED produce? Counterfeit Money. +++++++++++++++++++ Now: ++++++++++++++++++ What does the FED produce? The FED produces: Counterfeit Money. ++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 133 Was: ++++++++++++++ The Legal Criminals must make sure that no one else gains more power than their own small network of sociopaths. That is demonstrable fact, and those facts are actually well recorded in the documents that those criminals produce, in fact, but on a more principled account. The logic and reason of Power can remove all doubt about the right answer to the question. +++++++++++++++++ Now: +++++++++++++++++ The Legal Criminals must make sure that no one else gains more power than their own small network of sociopaths. That is demonstrable fact, and those facts are actually well recorded in the documents that those criminals produce, in fact. On a more principled accounting: the logic and reason of Power can remove all doubt about the right answer to the question concerning the right or wrong of legalized fraud. +++++++++++++++++++ Was: +++++++++++++++++ That means: As more and more people are free to compete in the work that does effectively produce more wealth, more things of value, more actual value, more actual productive power, as more and more production is produced. The result of all that "economy" is a reduction in the price of all that "economy," as fewer people have nothing and more people have plenty. The stuff of value goes down in price, as a matter of fact, in reality. +++++++++++++++++++ Is: +++++++++++++++++++++++++ That means: As more and more people are free to compete in the work that does effectively produce more wealth, more things of value, more actual value, more actual productive power, as more and more production is produced... The result of all that "economy" is a reduction in the price of all that "economy," as fewer people have nothing and more people have plenty. The stuff of value goes down in price, as a matter of fact, in reality. ++++++++++++++++++++++++ Was: ++++++++++++++++++++ That is called monetary appreciation (gaining power) or deflation (gaining power). +++++++++++++++++++++ Is: +++++++++++++++++++++++ That is called monetary appreciation (gaining power) or deflation (gaining power). Two words for the same thing. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 134 Was: ++++++++++++ Economic Law remains true with or without LAW. ++++++++++++++ Now: +++++++++++++++++ Economic Law remains true with or without Political LAW. ++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 138 +++++++++++++++++ John: "The thing that most people may not understand concerns the difference between the concept of "public" and "private" jurisdictions in law, and as your question has been explained to me by my trainers. These products are limited by law as to how much profit the bank can make as in the term not-for-profit may suggest. If you are familiar with the term…" +++++++++++++++++++++ Now: ++++++++++++++++++++++ John: "The thing that most people may not understand concerns the difference between the concept of "public" and "private" jurisdictions in law. This applies to your question, as this has been explained to me by my trainers. These products are limited by law as to how much profit the bank can make as in the term not-for-profit may suggest. If you are familiar with the term…" ++++++++++++++++++++++ |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 151 added a coma 3. The People, in a democratic, voluntary government are the ultimate sovereigns both factually in a physical form and legally in a psychological form, which means that no one in a democratic, voluntary government has a right to give any other Sovereign any rights - or take them away. 3. The People, in a democratic, voluntary government are the ultimate sovereigns both factually in a physical form and legally in a psychological form, which means that no one in a democratic, voluntary, government has a right to give any other Sovereign any rights - or take them away. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 151 Added WITHOUT QUESTION I can explain each point in much greater detail, and I will offer at least three more paragraphs on each point in combination with the whole concept of VOLUNTARY GOVERNMENT VERSUS BLIND OBEDIENCE TO FALSEHOOD WITHOUT QUESTION. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 151 The first amendment was attached to the Document that intended to make Slavery Legal, which was The Constitution. So as to make Slavery less legal during the False Advertisement Campaign that is well documented in The Federalist Papers whereby the Evil Half of the Founding Fathers, exemplified by Alexander Hamilton and George Washington, were promising an Energetic Government (code for Consolidated Nation State with National Debt Slavery, Central Bank, and Direct Taxation of the Subjects who would no longer be The People, as in sovereigns). And that First Amendment Failed to keep the Liars and the Frauds "out of office," so it was a total failure - until now. Was that is now: The first amendment was being attached to the document that made slavery legal: The Constitution. The first amendment was an attempt to make Slavery less legal, and that attempt was done during the False Advertisement Campaign that is well documented as being those False Federalist Papers whereby the Evil Half of the Founding Fathers, exemplified by Alexander Hamilton and George Washington, were promising an Energetic Government (code for Consolidated Nation State with National Debt Slavery, Central Bank, and Direct Taxation of the Subjects who would no longer be The People, as in sovereigns). And that First Amendment Failed to keep the Liars and the Frauds "out of office," so it was a total failure - until now: World Wide Web. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 152 Was And when you have the answer to "who," then you have found a criminal, legal or otherwise, you have found a criminal. Test yourself first. Is And when you have the answer, when you know who did it, then you have found a criminal, legal or otherwise, you have found a criminal. Test yourself first. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Page 152 Was And this device was a Cell Phone-sized Camcorder that recorded any event in real-time uploading that record of that event whereby the user of the device felt threatened and the user of the device pressed a trigger, and the threat was thereby rendered immobile for 1 hour of time, with no health risk to the immobile person. Any contention of false "shooting" by the defender who is being accused of being "trigger happy" is recorded live on the internet, and can be a part of an insurance type service intending to represent users of the device in case the user of the device is accused of being "trigger happy." is And this device was a Cell Phone-sized Camcorder that recorded any event in real-time uploading that record of that event whereby the user of the device felt threatened and the user of the device pressed a trigger, and the threat was thereby rendered immobile for 1 hour of time, with no health risk to the immobile person. Any contention of false "shooting" by the defender who is being accused of being "trigger happy" is recorded live on the internet, and can be a part of an insurance type service intending to represent users of the device in case the user of the device is accused of being "trigger happy." Disarm yourself? |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 Removed [ '] (single quote) from the footer of the title page until after the table of contents when page number begins in roman numerals until body of book is started |
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bear Guest
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6/7/13 Table of contents: Fixed commas. Economic Information Revolution……....….……,,…..1 Ill-Gotten Gains………………….....……,,,,.…………87 |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 page vi bear is the catalyst and therefore bear added comma bear is the catalyst, and therefore bear |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 page vi know better: from worse. changed punctuation know better - from worse. |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 page vi there is one of his poems offered on the back page. changed word "back" to "last" there is one of his poems offered on the last page. |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 page vii I remember taking note as Barack Hussein Obama traipsed around the world introducing himself during his first presidential campaign, and before he was even elected, meeting with cohorts and “experts” to begin solving the economic woes of these United States. changed to I remember taking note as Barack Hussein Obama traipsed around the world introducing himself during his first presidential campaign. And then before he was even elected, he met with cohorts and “experts” to begin solving the economic woes of these United States. |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 page viii That Joe spent countless hours walking me thru the basics of a Political Economy Liberty-themed Mindset changed punctuation That Joe spent countless hours walking me thru the basics of a Political Economy, Liberty-themed Mindset |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 page viii John 8:32 “And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free“ corrected end quote marks John 8:32 “And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free” |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 page viii 1 Chronicles 29:11-13 "Thine, O LORD is the greatness, and the power, and the glory, and the victory, and the majesty: for all that is in the heaven and in the earth is thine; thine is the kingdom, O LORD, and thou art exalted as head above all. “Both riches and honour come of thee, and thou reignest over all; and in thine hand is power and might; and in thine hand it is to make great, and to give strength unto all. “Now therefore, our God, we thank thee, and praise thy glorious name." fixed quote marks and italicized: 1 Chronicles 29:11-13 “Thine, O LORD is the greatness, and the power, and the glory, and the victory, and the majesty: for all that is in the heaven and in the earth is thine; thine is the kingdom, O LORD, and thou art exalted as head above all. Both riches and honour come of thee, and thou reignest over all; and in thine hand is power and might; and in thine hand it is to make great, and to give strength unto all. Now therefore, our God, we thank thee, and praise thy glorious name.” |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 page viii John 8:36 “If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.” What is this power that can make a person free? This same Jesus said in John 8:32 “And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free” changed spacing and italicized: John 8:36 “If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.” What is this power that can make a person free? This same Jesus said in John 8:32 “And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free” |
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bear Guest
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5/7/13 page viii John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” changed spacing and italicized: John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 Cover Page Changed Bear Publishing 2012 to Bear Publishing 2013 |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page xi but a forum none-the-less, in our time, a place called The Daily Paul. Changed punctuation: but a forum none-the-less, in our time: A place called The Daily Paul. |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 1 and 11 "I think there is a serious error in failing to know that the current government is counterfeit, or crime made legal, and therefore the concept of defense against crime is falsely viewed as being morally wrong, as morality and legality are confused by that bait and switch routine." —Joe Changed Punctuation: "I think there is a serious error in failing to know that the current government is counterfeit, or crime made legal; and therefore, the concept of defense against crime is falsely viewed as being morally wrong, as morality and legality are confused by that bait and switch routine." —Joe |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 2 Modern day information transfer is nothing short of a revolution, and in order to compete there are inventions that include free, or no Changed Punctuation: Modern day information transfer is nothing short of a revolution. And in order to compete there are inventions that include free, or no |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 2 Individual connecting points, or terminals, connecting to one homogenous medium of exchange and here you may want to know a thing or two about electricity and the concept of how electricity finds the path of least resistance. added comma: Individual connecting points, or terminals, connecting to one homogenous medium of exchange, and here you may want to know a thing or two about electricity and the concept of how electricity finds the path of least resistance. |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 3 Person C is informed about the impending crime and Person C is generous, or honest, or merely a talkative blabbermouth, or the town crier, or a Modern Day Paul Revere, a whistle blower, informer, news outlet, author, writer, sign maker, inventor, producer, and maintainer of vital questions and competitive answers, intending to connect the information about criminals to each current or potential victim. removed comma betwen "producer and maintainer" Person C is informed about the impending crime and Person C is generous, or honest, or merely a talkative blabbermouth, or the town crier, or a Modern Day Paul Revere, a whistle blower, informer, news outlet, author, writer, sign maker, inventor, producer and maintainer of vital questions and competitive answers, intending to connect the information about criminals to each current or potential victim. |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 3 benefits of doing crime on the criminal scale of cost over benefit. added hyphen "criminal-scale" benefits of doing crime on the criminal-scale of cost over benefit. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 4 Knowing how to get past the resistance to factual, accurate, information, a handy skill, is a skill that works to get past, get around, the false, inaccurate, deceptive versions of history. changed punctuation and added "and": Knowing how to get past the resistance to factual, accurate information (a handy skill) is a skill that works to get past and get around the false, inaccurate, deceptive versions of history. |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 5 and therefore this information if it is true, can empower the current victims, and the potential victims, removed comma: "victims and the" and therefore this information if it is true, can empower the current victims and the potential victims, |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 8 he thought was "of interest to Gold Bugs." You know: the concept of a 3-sided fence. changed to: he thought was "Of Interest to Gold Bugs." You know, the concept of a 3-sided fence: |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 8 Get this Tar Baby off my dinner table, what am I paying you to do?” Changed into 2 sentences: Get this Tar Baby off my dinner table! What am I paying you to do?” |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 14 Added an additional return after the Joe Quote at the top of the page so that the spacing would be the same as the spacing at the top of the other chapters. |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 14 The concept that falsehoods are dressed up to masquerade as truth, and that these costumes are worn by people, is necessary to understand and expose the lies perpetrated upon humankind. Changed wording: from "and" to "in order to" The concept that falsehoods are dressed up to masquerade as truth, and that these costumes are worn by people, is necessary to understand in order to expose the lies perpetrated upon humankind. |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 18 Torture and Murder made Legal, actions, perpetrated by guilty people upon innocent people. changed comma to colon and italicized actions: Torture and Murder made Legal: actions, perpetrated by guilty people upon innocent people. |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 18 Which version sends the more accurate, higher quality, lower cost, message through the medium of exchange removed comma: Which version sends the more accurate, higher quality, lower cost message through the medium of exchange |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 21 7. Documented ongoing Conspiracies versus a nebulous THING called "Conspiracy Theory" that exists like a boogie man lurking in the darkness of falsehood. removed period to be consistent with items 1 - 6 7. Documented ongoing Conspiracies versus a nebulous THING called "Conspiracy Theory" that exists like a boogie man lurking in the darkness of falsehood |
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bear Guest
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5/8/13 page 21 & 22 "I can understand and see that value in a privately sovereign individually based and issued currency." added comma: "I can understand and see that value in a privately sovereign, individually based and issued currency." |
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bear Guest
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I am currently in a quandary on page 22 as what I though was the rule with quotes and punctuation may have changed per http://typedesk.com/2011/02/15/chicago-manual-of-style-16th-edition-2/ Note the statement: "And who knows? Perhaps in another hundred years the semicolon will find its way back inside the closing quotation marks." I am finding that question marks as well, may not all belong in quotes... I am also wondering if all titles in the book like Equitable Commerce should be italicized...going to call it quits for tonight and start fresh tomorrow. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, At some point the decision to stay inside the lines, illustrated by the child's coloring book, removes too much freedom, and creating becomes difficult. I am benefiting from your help in punctuation, finding myself gaining a sense of disciplined understanding concerning symbol arrangements in specific order, so as to help transfer meaning intact, by avoiding too much ambiguity in language. Up to a point, this works, and then I get too caught up in the mechanics, as if the need to convey a message steps down off the list of things to do. When it is my turn again to edit the final book, I don't want to change anything without having your OK to do so, at that point, and in that effort, if you are willing, I can learn how to keep inside the lines better, improve the power to communicate accurately, and avoid conflicts in understanding why things are done the way they are done, when the idea is to communicate accurately. I guess I am saying that I appreciate your help, greatly, once again. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, ... a sense of disciplined understanding concerning symbol arrangements in specific order, so as to help transfer meaning intact, by avoiding too much ambiguity in language. That is the main point of punctuation that I am doing now. I for the most part have felt that I have corrected most (not perfectly) of the "staying in the line" issues. What I have been working on is making reading for the reader more understandable. At least that is what I am trying to do. I am also trying to keep the same form though out the document. Yesterday, on page 22 I ran across places with "? and with ?" As you know, I have stated that ? goes inside the " but I ran across info yesterday that I think says otherwise, so I would like to know which is correct. It seems that American sand the Britians also follow different rules... I will try not to get wrapped around the axle, being more precise than necessary. I think the most important at this point is to pick a way and be consistent. So of course, I would like to pick the "right" way, so I am going ot research a little further. I have been listenting to the Bengazi hearings this morning but am getting ready to pause that and start book work. Would it be best if I didn't talk to you while you are trying to write a fiction? ... |
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bear Guest
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5/9/13 Acknowledgments (I have decided to start at the beginning of the book to ensure that italics and quotes are incorporated correctly/consistently.) The Daily Paul connects the individual perspectives that would be singularly connected to the Monopoly Viewpoint otherwise. To acknowledge my brother Jack, whose help is immeasurable, there is one of his poems offered on the last page. Decided not to italicize The Daily Paul (even though it would fit the "rules" to do so since it is a name of a forum). However, I did remove a comma from the last sentence (which I had earlier missed): To acknowledge my brother Jack whose help is immeasurable, there is one of his poems offered on the last page. ******************************** I would also like Josf to note that his daughter is the only person in his mentioned family whose first name is not given. That may be artistic intent in the way that her name is given for the cover art, but on the cover art, her name is mentioned, but not that she is your daughter. I don't bring this up so that you will change anything, I just wanted to make sure that that is definitely the way you want it. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I agree with the concept of being consistent, and I think the American way is preferable over the English way, for reasons that you may guess. The Fiction work, as far as I can guess, will be a disciplined effort to get on task, and then stay on task, in fits of creativity, like music. I will probably find early morning sessions to be opportunities in this process, instead of picking up the guitar, I will have inspiration to write my thoughts into fictional story lines, and in time I may learn how to fuel that process. For today the inspiration was non-existent, compared to the other day when I threw myself into it. Meanwhile a second book on The Liberty Day Challenge could be moved ahead. I don't know how this works. The concept of being an author instead of being a laborer is still foreign. I worked as a mechanic, laborer, machine operator, etc. for so many years. It is in my blood. My wife and I spoke about my present role as housekeeper, cook, parent, the things she did, before I was no longer in demand as a laborer, before she drove herself into being a competitive business operator. The first book may provide evidence, or justification, in authorship combined with publishing power? |
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bear Guest
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My friendMeanwhile a second book on The Liberty Day Challenge could be moved ahead. I don't know how this works. The concept of being an author instead of being a laborer is still foreign. I worked as a mechanic, laborer, machine operator, etc. for so many years. It is in my blood. I can imagine using the body ia a different way is a new thing to learn. But, in my mind, it is the body that is being used, whether it is the brain and the strong muscles to acheive one kind of labor, or the brain and the soft muscles to acheive another kind of labor. Both kinds of labor are products of your mind, your ability, your muscles, and your time. Yes, I suppose one can command their body muscles to do whatever they demand (within reason), and it is different to command the mind to be artistic on demand. Sure, your fingers may be willing to type, but the mind may not be creative at the given moment. I think there is something called writer's block. Some writers go away to secluded areas so that they can write. Their characters become real to them and the rest of life pales in significance as writing is achieved. Joe, you are extremely intelligent. It is wonderful that you can use your mind now as a new kind of laborer as well as you were able to use your mind and muscles as a different kind of laborer. But you still labor. I used to come home mentally spent and exhausted when I worked at NASA. I was not so much physically spent because my days were at a desk. I remember the story you told me about sleeping while dumping rock. So, you may have been able to put your mind in nuetral at times? Maybe writing can work the same way? It was rude of me to start a conversation with you while you were writing even if I did have questions, I should have refrained. After all, I have book work to do as well.  I will try to get this finished ASAP. I have developed the concept of setting my kitchen timer for 30 minute intravals so that I get other things done too. Bookwork 30 minutes; housework 30 minutes. I am eating my bookwork time right now. It is much more pleasant for me to talk than consentrate. But, I think now that my meds are halved I can overcome what is more pleasant and do what is most necessary. The doc and I talked about that concept. Makes sense that I was too laid back to do anything that took effort...of course I have issues with lack of sunlight and it has been a long winter and spring has been mostley cloudy. I will be happy to work on Liberty Day Challenge too even if you are writing a fiction. No problem with having a storehouse? A manifestation of labor in the form of capital? After all there is a message to put forth! I got a phone call recording from Ron Paul today by Campaign for Liberty...it seems the gang of 8 is hiding a national ID card complete with biometrics within the undocumented worker legislation. US Citizens will not be able to work without that card according to Ron Paul. They wanted me to sign a petition and send money. You never know who you are talking to on the phone these days. It could all be a set up as far as I'm concerned. How could one know? Revelation 13:17 KJV And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. ... |
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bear Guest
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5/9/13 page ix Note: Scriptures used on the Title Page, Forward, and throughout are quoted from The Holy Bible, King James Version, unless otherwise noted. corrected typo "Foreword" & 5/14 added italics: Note: Scriptures used on the Title Page, Foreword, and throughout are quoted from The Holy Bible, King James Version, unless otherwise noted. |
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bear Guest
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5/9/13 page x JOE, I don't understand which sentences you are talking about. I don't think I have ever understood, but I never asked. I always just tried to figure it out myself, but never can. So...I better ask in case other people are as dull as I am So my power to convey meaning with English and to do so accurately has been, once again, exemplified by the first sentence: poorly. I have a hard time communicating. Then the second sentence intends to show a measure of improvement (in other words), an effort to sharpen the tool. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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This: I'm Joe and discussion has been a very dull tool in my life up to points in time that inspire the effort to sharpen that tool. Often times the inspiration accompanies dire straits. Dark Horizons? In other words a question: What brings people together so as to inspire them to be nice to each other, to cooperate, to compare notes, and to seek better from worse, and at the same time avoid harming each other? Under Duress? So my power to convey meaning with English and to do so accurately has been, once again, exemplified by the first sentence: poorly. That could be improved as being this: (?) I'm Joe and discussion has been a very dull tool in my life up to points in time that inspire the effort to sharpen that tool. Often times the inspiration accompanies dire straits. Dark Horizons? In other words a question: What brings people together so as to inspire them to be nice to each other, to cooperate, to compare notes, and to seek better from worse, and at the same time avoid harming each other? Under Duress? So my power to convey meaning with English and to do so accurately has been, once again, exemplified by the first sentence in this Introduction: poorly. The way I write, the way I think, is such that I don't know if that is an improvement to be precise to a point where the reader has no need to think, to be left without work to do, but failing to make any sense whatsoever is certainly a failure. |
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bear Guest
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Joe Which sentence is the 2nd sentence? |
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bear Guest
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5/9/13 Foreword & Introduction, pg 1: italicized FOX News The Daily Paul The Daily Paul Joe Quote |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I see now the problem you may have identified. I see a problem for sure. This: So my power to convey meaning with English and to do so accurately has been, once again, exemplified by the first sentence: poorly. I have a hard time communicating. Then the second sentence intends to show a measure of improvement (in other words), an effort to sharpen the tool. That should be "the fourth sentence," or the first three sentences should be combined to make one sentence. Does that make sense? I could rewrite as such: I'm Joe and discussion has been a very dull tool in my life up to points in time that inspire the effort to sharpen that tool. Often times the inspiration accompanies dire straits. Dark Horizons? In other words a question: What brings people together so as to inspire them to be nice to each other, to cooperate, to compare notes, and to seek better from worse, and at the same time avoid harming each other? Under Duress? So my power to convey meaning with English and to do so accurately has been, once again, exemplified by the first introductory sentence above: poorly. I have a hard time communicating. Then the competition (in other words) intends to show a measure of improvement, an effort to sharpen the tool. I intend to offer my end of any discussion - in dire straits - so as to compare notes, to learn, and to teach, to do so fairly, equitably, nicely, politely, if possible - often times failing miserably. I think that does help avoid the error in communication. Good find, and thanks again. This is becoming a much more serious effort to hammer out the words on the anvil as we work at being wordsmiths? |
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bear Guest
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This is becoming a much more serious effort to hammer out the words on the anvil as we work at being wordsmiths? Seems I remember a friend who participated in the process to create crushed rock? I think you gave me some words about that one time, and the concept of a rough cut becoming a finer cut. I think maybe it had to do with book writing, but as far as which abyss it is in...I have no idea Thank you for the words above regarding the sentences. I have been gone since 8 this morning so I haven't done any book work. But will start back with that incorporation and ask if I have further questions about it. I left you a reply here: http://www.power-independence.com/forum/view_post.php?post_id=5796 and would like to know that you received it. You do not need to reply, I just want to know that you got my words. They were meant to be an encouragement. Can your forum "nest" replies? I don't know if that is the proper lingo... yours truly, the toothless bear  ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I got the message. Revelation 13:17 KJV And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. While I listen to Bill Cooper my mind is working. I am thinking about Sergey, and I am thinking about the concept of ego. Confidence in being right? When a counterfeiter counterfeits... What is counterfeited? |
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bear Guest
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ego: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego Are you referring to one's own self-concept? Too much self-confidence could be egotistical? When a counterfeiter counterfeits... When a counterfeiter counterfeits... A counterfeit is counterfeited. So are you saying Bill Cooper is a counterfeit producing a counterfeit? We have had our little town fair today so I did not get any bookwork done. I am slow. Monday I have a "Mother's Day Tea" to attend and Tuesday I am driving the Amish. My bookwork is going slow. ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Generally speaking, not speaking about Bill Cooper, the idea that some THING can be counterfeited suggests that some THING exists. What is the thing being counterfeiting in any case of counterfeiting? If religion is seen only as a counterfeit, a fraud, then I think it may be a good idea to look for the THING being counterfeited. That was my point. Bill Cooper was shot and killed, and that could be understood as a murderous act, or an investment made by someone to reach a goal, or who know what, there was no Trial by Jury concerning the death, as far as I know, and there was no counterfeit Trial by Jury, again, as far as I know. |
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bear Guest
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5/13/13 page x I'm Joe and discussion has been a very dull tool in my life up to points in time that inspire the effort to sharpen that tool. Often times the inspiration accompanies dire straits. Dark Horizons? In other words a question: What brings people together so as to inspire them to be nice to each other, to cooperate, to compare notes, and to seek better from worse, and at the same time avoid harming each other? Under Duress? So my power to convey meaning with English and to do so accurately has been, once again, exemplified by the first sentence: poorly. I have a hard time communicating. Then the second sentence intends to show a measure of improvement (in other words), an effort to sharpen the tool. I intend to offer my end of any discussion - in dire straits - so as to compare notes, to learn, and to teach, to do so fairly, equitably, nicely, politely, if possible - often times failing miserably. replaced with (per Joe) I'm Joe and discussion has been a very dull tool in my life up to points in time that inspire the effort to sharpen that tool. Often times the inspiration accompanies dire straits. Dark Horizons? In other words a question: What brings people together so as to inspire them to be nice to each other, to cooperate, to compare notes, and to seek better from worse, and at the same time avoid harming each other? Under Duress? So my power to convey meaning with English and to do so accurately has been, once again, exemplified by the first introductory sentence above: poorly. I have a hard time communicating. Then the competition (in other words) intends to show a measure of improvement, an effort to sharpen the tool. I intend to offer my end of any discussion - in dire straits - so as to compare notes, to learn, and to teach, to do so fairly, equitably, nicely, politely, if possible - often times failing miserably. |
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bear Guest
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5/13/13 page x In other words a question: What brings people together so as to inspire them to be nice to each other, to cooperate, to compare notes, and to seek better from worse, and at the same time avoid harming each other? Under Duress? So my power to convey meaning with English and to do so accurately has been, once again, exemplified by the first introductory sentence above: poorly. I have a hard time communicating. Then the competition (in other words) intends to show a measure of improvement, an effort to sharpen the tool. I intend to offer my end of any discussion - in dire straits - so as to compare notes, to learn, and to teach, to do so fairly, equitably, nicely, politely, if possible - often times failing miserably. changed to add italics and modify puntuation: In other words a question: What brings people together so as to inspire them to be nice to each other, to cooperate, to compare notes, and to seek better from worse, and at the same time avoid harming each other? Under Duress? So my power to convey meaning with English and to do so accurately has been, once again, exemplified by the first introductory sentence above: poorly. I have a hard time communicating. Then the competition (in other words) intends to show a measure of improvement, an effort to sharpen the tool. I intend to offer my end of any discussion - in dire straits - so as to compare notes, to learn, and to teach; to do so fairly, equitably, nicely, politely, if possible - often times failing miserably. |
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bear Guest
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5/13/13 page xi A small part of the entire, and ongoing, process of discussion is documented in this book, whereby discussion on vital matters happened, and is exemplified for those who share that interest in knowing better, and those who understand the vital necessity of accurate communication in Liberty. Changed punctuation: A small part of the entire and ongoing process of discussion is documented in this book. Whereby discussion on vital matters happened and is exemplified for those who share that interest in knowing better, and those who understand the vital necessity of accurate communication in Liberty. |
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bear Guest
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5/13/13 page 1 Clashes in the Power Struggle is the human condition happening in times and in places; and these events are ongoing in the minds of individual examples that represent Mankind, including bear, who tends to be a better representative of spiritual POWER, and the struggle includes Joe who represents, in his own mind, an average Joe worker, representing productive economic POWER, also known as Labor. Changed Punctuation: Clashes in the Power Struggle is the human condition happening in times and in places; and these events are ongoing in the minds of individual examples that represent Mankind, including bear, who tends to be a better representative of spiritual POWER, and the struggle includes Joe, who represents in his own mind, an average Joe worker representing productive economic POWER also known as Labor. |
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bear Guest
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5/13/13 page 1 This particular discussion quickly moves to the topic of Criminal Power and Victim Power as Joe continually reminds bear that what is meant for public consumption is not the truth, thus, the Joe Quote that begins this segment of discussion is the sobering reality that though many of us have been trained to believe that the powers that be are a loyal and patriotic lot working for their constituents, the reality is that criminals have taken control. Punctuation changed: This particular discussion quickly moves to the topic of Criminal Power and Victim Power as Joe continually reminds bear that what is meant for public consumption is not the truth; thus, the Joe Quote that begins this segment of discussion is the sobering reality that though many of us have been trained to believe that the powers that be are a loyal and patriotic lot working for their constituents, the reality is that criminals have taken control. |
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bear Guest
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5/13/13 page 2 Not only can someone be greedy, a Scrooge, supposedly evil incarnate, by miserly practices of always making sure that the soiled end of the stick is handled by other people, and not only are there generous charitable people who give away everything to other people, supposedly copies of Jesus Himself, but there are people who give things so as to then take things and there are people who take things so as to give things, and in the middle is equity? Changed punctuation: Not only can someone be greedy, a Scrooge, supposedly evil incarnate, by miserly practices of always making sure that the soiled end of the stick is handled by other people. And not only are there generous, charitable people who give away everything to other people, supposedly copies of Jesus Himself. But there are people who give things so as to then take things, and there are people who take things so as to give things. And in the middle is equity? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Thanks for taking so much care in fixing these rough edges. |
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bear Guest
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You're welcome, Joe. As much as I have WANT to talk, I just can't, so I will LACK that pleasure. I have alot on my plate right now. I am going to spend all spare time working on editing. I got my garden in yesterday. I would have liked to take pictures and do a DP post, but I just didn't have time for that pleasure. I am with the Amish today and we will be on the go most of the day so I am not expecting much down time. The boys have a concert performance tonight and tomorrow we are going on an all day school field trip to Fantastic Caverns. Jeff is off Wed so we will drive south as a family instead of north to school. I am looking forward to it. I agree with Surgey on Music. Bill Gothard speak of beat and harmony and I have also heard of a missionary whose children were playing rock music and the Africans wanted to know why the missionary's children were calling the demons to come... I really wanted to join the conversation On to book work |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 2 Modern day information transfer is nothing short of a revolution. And in order to compete there are inventions that include free, or no monetary price, information packets available everywhere on these terminals we call Lap Tops, Cell Phones, Personal Computers, I-Pads, and many other names for basically the same thing: terminals. Removed word "And" Capitalized I and T Modern day information transfer is nothing short of a revolution. In order to compete there are inventions that include free, or no monetary price, information packets available everywhere on these terminals we call Lap Tops, Cell Phones, Personal Computers, I-Pads, and many other names for basically the same thing: Terminals. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 2 Individual connecting points, or terminals, connecting to one homogenous medium of exchange, and here you may want to know a thing or two about electricity and the concept of how electricity finds the path of least resistance. Changed punctuation. Individual connecting points (terminals) connecting to one homogenous medium of exchange. And here you may want to know a thing or two about electricity and the concept of how electricity finds the path of least resistance. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 3 The victims may want to travel past all the resistance and the victims may want to find that information concerning those threats in time for them to then be able to avoid being victims. Added comma The victims may want to travel past all the resistance, and the victims may want to find that information concerning those threats in time for them to then be able to avoid being victims. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page xi The place of this small act in a large theater was a modern example of a Forum, such as those ancient ruins in Athens Greece. added comma The place of this small act in a large theater was a modern example of a Forum, such as those ancient ruins in Athens, Greece. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 3 The victims may want to travel past all the resistance, and the victims may want to find that information concerning those threats in time for them to then be able to avoid being victims. Made less wordy: The victims may want to travel past all resistance, and the victims may want to find that information concerning those threats in time to avoid being victims. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 3 So accurate, informative, useful, productive, defensive information, where the information can empower the victims with the power required to avoid being victims, WILL weaken criminals and raise the costs of doing crime and lower the benefits of doing crime on the criminal-scale of cost over benefit. Modified punctuation, took out "and" So accurate, informative, useful, productive, defensive information (where the information can empower the victims with the power required to avoid being victims) WILL weaken criminals, raise the costs of doing crime, and lower the benefits of doing crime on the criminal-scale of cost over benefit. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 3 So criminals place road blocks in between the information and the victims as the criminals invent, produce, and maintain these costly investments. Criminals are then faced with that very unfortunate consequence of the Law of Diminishing Returns. Each victim connects to powerful information allowing them to avoid being victims, raising the need for the criminals to find more victims, raising the need for the criminals to squeeze more value out of each victim, forcing an ever increasing demand for the criminals to then invent, produce, and maintain even more road blocks that keep the victims in the dark. Modified for readability/punctuation/changed and added words: Therefore, criminals place road blocks in between the information and the victims as the criminals invent, produce, and maintain these costly investments. Criminals are then faced with that very unfortunate consequence of the Law of Diminishing Returns. Each victim connects to powerful information allowing them to avoid being victims, raising the need for the criminals to find more victims, raising the need for the criminals to squeeze more value out of each victim, and thus forcing an ever increasing demand for the criminals to then invent, produce, and maintain even more road blocks that keep the victims in the dark. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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This looks good to me. Please continue. If you agree to help with the next book, the Novel, I may be much more interested in knowing why the improvements are being made to my efforts in transferring perspectives accurately. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, my main effort is readability right now. To achieve that goal, I am using punctuation and also making stand alone sentences where possible. I am using punctuation guidelines here: http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/566/01/ You are very good at working outside of the margins. I am a rule person. One thing I think to consider with McCarthy's work. If he is writing fiction, he maybe writing with words and concepts that people are very familiar with. I think Joe Quotes covers topics that are outside the realm of those who are fooled, as I was and still am, by Abject Believe in Falsehood. So, to me it seems very important that the book be easily readable so that the concepts you have so carefully set on paper are understood by the reader. Then again, I am not the sharpest pencil in the box. So sentences that I may think are difficult may be easy as pie to someone else. I don't know. You will see I left you an email asking for further help so that I can know better. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 3 Books, like the Bible, connected The Word with people who were powerful enough to read The Word, so criminals had to invent ways to censor The Word, or their criminal way of life would run out of victims rapidly, and their way of life would be starved out for the remaining number of criminals as the cost of living for criminals increases beyond a sustainable level, and as the benefits for crime dry up along with the diminishing supply of ready victims. When the victims know better they choose not to be victims. Broke into more sentences and added Italics: Books, like The Bible, connected The Word with people who were powerful enough to read The Word. So criminals had to invent ways to censor The Word, or their criminal way of life would run out of victims rapidly. And their way of life would be starved out for the remaining number of criminals as the cost of living for criminals increases beyond a sustainable level, and as the benefits for crime dry up along with the diminishing supply of ready victims. When the victims know better they choose not to be victims. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 3/4 History books written by Inquisition Victors, Pogrom Victors, Crusade Victors, and other Winners of massive expenditures of POWER called wars, aimed at massive torture and massive slaughter, throughout history have produced “common knowledge” (counterfeit) among the recent past generations and current generations of mankind. Moved comma from after "slaughter" to after "history": History books written by Inquisition Victors, Pogrom Victors, Crusade Victors, and other Winners of massive expenditures of POWER called wars, aimed at massive torture and massive slaughter throughout history, have produced “common knowledge” (counterfeit) among the recent past generations and current generations of mankind. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 3/4 A person capable of reading The Bible, The Word, may be powerful enough to accurately discriminate the difference between information that benefits the criminals and information that benefits the victims including the true meaning of such things as The Inquisition, The Crusades, and World War II. Added italics, comma, and colon: A person capable of reading The Bible, The Word, may be powerful enough to accurately discriminate the difference between information that benefits the criminals and information that benefits the victims, including the true meaning of such things as: The Inquisition, The Crusades, and World War II. |
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bear Guest
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5/14/13 page 4 Common Sense, 1776, Thomas Paine, 46 Pages: added Italics: Common Sense, 1776, Thomas Paine, 46 Pages: |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Looks good to me. I sent an e-mail reply too. |
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bear Guest
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5/15/13 page 4/5 What if a few people, or just two people, manage to combine their disconnected studies of divergent information, one being a spiritual education and the other being a political economy education, and it becomes obvious, at least to these two individuals, that government does not have to be evil at all; and therefore this information if it is true, can empower the current victims and the potential victims, with the defensive power that can enable honest productive people to be able to afford life on Earth for a little while longer, if not for eternity? Bypassing deceit, threats of violence, and violence made legal is the path of least resistance to the truth. Modified punctuation and added bold for readability/emphasis: What if a few people (or just two people) manage to combine their disconnected studies of divergent information (one being a spiritual education and the other being a political economy education), and it becomes obvious (at least to these two individuals) that government does not have to be evil at all; and therefore, this information if it is true, can empower the current victims and the potential victim with the defensive power that can enable honest productive people to be able to afford life on Earth for a little while longer, if not for eternity? Bypassing deceit, threats of violence, and violence made legal is the path of least resistance to the truth. |
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5/15/13 page 5 How much does one person give up in the effort to transfer vital questions and accurate answers to fellow Friends of Liberty and is the cost benefit analysis profitable for that individual? added comma: How much does one person give up in the effort to transfer vital questions and accurate answers to fellow Friends of Liberty, and is the cost benefit analysis profitable for that individual? |
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bear Guest
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5/16/13 page 7 "Why did your conversation end so soon with Person A? Because he had “respectful,” and yes he did use that word, disagreements? Maybe he just didn’t understand yet and needed to talk more. Didn’t you like talking to him?" Corrected punctuation by removing quotes within quotes and changing the subquotes to single quotes: "Why did your conversation end so soon with Person A? Because he had ‘respectful,’ and yes he did use ‘that’ word, disagreements? Maybe he just didn’t understand yet and needed to talk more. Didn’t you like talking to him?" |
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5/16/13 page 7 Person A laid it out, it seems to me, without reservation, which is a whole lot more than many people do, and so I am grateful for such generosity of spirit, that is The Spirit of Liberty, it seems to me. Broke into 2 sentences: Person A laid it out, it seems to me, without reservation, which is a whole lot more than many people do, and so I am grateful for such generosity of spirit. That is The Spirit of Liberty, it seems to me. |
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5/16/13 page 7 Can language become deceptive or do people use tools to reach the goal of deception? Added comma: Can language become deceptive, or do people use tools to reach the goal of deception? |
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5/16/13 page 7 How about an exemplary sentence, to be measured for deception? Authority of Man upon Man is a lie, so why believe it? Is that sentence deceptive? Does that sentence confess my goal of seeking deception? It is, as in is, a question. Removed comma and joined paragraphs and added emphasis How about an exemplary sentence, to be measured for deception: Authority of Man upon Man is a lie, so why believe it? Is that sentence deceptive? Does that sentence confess my goal of seeking deception? It is, as in "is," a question. |
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bear Guest
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5/16/13 page 8 Gold bugs? What is the meaning of that? Gold is fine, very good, but very expensive money when adding up the costs associated with crime prevention. As it may not be a good idea to carry around pockets full of Gold in crime infested waters, advertising the fact: “Hey, look here, I'm ripe for the plucking…” having and holding large amounts of very launderable money. Took out word "As" and changed quote end place and changed colon to comma: Gold bugs? What is the meaning of that? Gold is fine, very good, but very expensive money when adding up the costs associated with crime prevention. It may not be a good idea to carry around pockets full of Gold in crime infested waters, advertising the fact, “Hey, look here, I'm ripe for the plucking...having and holding large amounts of very launderable money.” |
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bear Guest
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5/16/13 page 8 JOE, I NEED HELP HERE: NOT SURE WHO IS DOING THE SPEAKING IN QUOTED TEXT, OR ARE THE QUOTES SIGNIFYING SARCASM? “Really bad things, those paper dollars, bad, bad, evil, evil, paper, the scourge of the earth, that paper, that, that, worthless, worthless paper?” |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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E-Mail reply was sent, and yes it is meant as sarcasm, explained in the e-mail. I don't know if adding something like the words sent in the e-mail may help, or if the communication of sarcasm could be better communicated with italics, or some other signal to the reader of better, more effective, design. |
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bear Guest
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5/17/13 page 8/9 Added words provided via email. Currently the page count has moved from 174 to 175. Perhaps if I don't have pagecount resolved before sending the book back to you, you will be able to resolve it back to 175. The words in red are the words that have been added: Gold bugs? What is the meaning of that? Gold is fine, very good, but very expensive money when adding up the costs associated with crime prevention. It may not be a good idea to carry around pockets full of Gold in crime infested waters, advertising the fact, “Hey, look here, I'm ripe for the plucking…having and holding large amounts of very launderable money.” Real cash, if not the stuff needed for Tax Liabilities? So the competition is really bad, you know, that fraudulent stuff used by very bad criminals who steal the law power, and then make it a crime to use any other money. “Where is my washing machine?” “Really bad things, those paper dollars, bad, bad, evil, evil, paper, the scourge of the earth, that paper, that, that, worthless, worthless paper?” Do you see? That is a parody on the Austrian Economist Dogma. Fiat currency is bad, so bad, and if it is so bad, why are you using it to such great effect? The False Capitalists are as easy to spot as the False Socialists. Why? They are both false. They want to launder something. They want to keep their ill-gotten gains well hidden, and how are you going to do so unless you have available a washing machine whereby the evidence of having gained your power working in concert with the rats, pigs, scoundrels, or mammon, whatever, soils the money, marks the money, as blood, or dirt, is on the money, and therefore there is a desire to wash the evidence off the money. If the idea is to keep the evidence of an exchange from the Tax Collector, a case can be made that it is an innocent person working to avoid having their earnings stolen by the big bad wolf, but is that the same big bad wolf that is called whenever a problem arises during a loss of property at the hands of known criminals? So what is it, exactly, since I'm receiving mixed messages here: either the paper is worthless or it is evil, and it can't be both can it? Re-organized/Edited/Punctuated to this: Gold bugs? Really bad things, those paper dollars, bad, bad, evil, evil, paper, the scourge of the earth, that paper, that, that, worthless, worthless paper? What is the meaning of that? Gold is fine, very good, but very expensive money when adding up the costs associated with crime prevention. It may not be a good idea to carry around pockets full of Gold in crime infested waters, advertising the fact, “Hey, look here, I'm ripe for the plucking…having and holding large amounts of very launderable money.” Real cash, if not the stuff needed for Tax Liabilities? So the competition is really bad, you know, that fraudulent stuff used by very bad criminals who steal the law power, and then make it a crime to use any other money. Where is my washing machine? Do you see? That is a parody on the Austrian Economist Dogma. Fiat currency is bad, so bad, and if it is so bad, why are you using it to such great effect? The False Capitalists are as easy to spot as the False Socialists. Why? They are both false. They want to launder something. They want to keep their ill-gotten gains well hidden. How are they going to do so unless they have available a washing machine whereby the evidence of having gained their power working in concert with the rats, pigs, scoundrels, or mammon…whatever soils the money or marks the money…as blood or dirt…is on the money…and there is, therefore, a desire to wash the evidence off the money. If the idea is to keep the evidence of an exchange from the Tax Collector, a case can be made that it is an innocent person working to avoid having their earnings stolen by the big bad wolf, but is that the same big bad wolf that is called whenever a problem arises during a loss of property at the hands of known criminals? So what is it, exactly, since I'm receiving mixed messages here: either the paper is worthless or it is evil, and it can't be both can it? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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A fine job of improving the power to convey accurate meaning in my opinion. When it is my turn to edit I can first return here to make sure that I am not undoing something already undone, and I can learn how better to be consistent in those areas where 6 of one is worth half a dozen of the other, where it is better to keep asking for 6, or asking for half a dozen, rather than working to keep the reader's head spinning. |
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bear Guest
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A fine job of improving the power to convey accurate meaning in my opinion. I agree, Joe, you did a very fine job! I was able to work some on the text that you so kindly provided so you may like to take a 2nd look. I moved the part about the bad bad paper money to the Gold Bugs paragraph. I did this because I was struggling with wanting the text to be italicized, but it was in a paragraph alone and could have been confused with bear words since those words are stand alone italicized paragraphs (with quotes, though). So, see if you like the reorganization. I think it works. But I do not have your brain. You may still like to make some changes when back in your court |
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bear Guest
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5/17/13 page 9 Can it be worth less and be so powerful as to consume every scrap of extra value including the nails that nail down anything that can be nailed down? Italicized "less": Can it be worth less and be so powerful as to consume every scrap of extra value including the nails that nail down anything that can be nailed down? |
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bear Guest
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5/17/13 page 9 (Note, also went back to page 5 to format Common Sense passage with block quotes per below.) “They are just as really currency as the specie dollar, the greenback, or the bank bill. A field which has no fence up one of its sides is not fenced in, no matter how high and strong its fences may be on the other sides. So, the volume of currency is not, in any true sense, limited by prohibitions of free banking, by a return to specie basis, or by any other means, so long as negotiable paper can be freely issued by individuals; and this free issue of negotiable paper is too useful, and too well entrenched in necessity, ever hereafter to be interfered with.” SA3 Removed space bar at beginning. Removed SA from end because Steven Pearl Andrews is already named in introducing paragraph. Also removed quotes and changed to block quote (indented -though I am not showing indent here because I don't readily know the html code)since it is more than 3 lines: They are just as really currency as the specie dollar, the greenback, or the bank bill. A field which has no fence up one of its sides is not fenced in, no matter how high and strong its fences may be on the other sides. So, the volume of currency is not, in any true sense, limited by prohibitions of free banking, by a return to specie basis, or by any other means, so long as negotiable paper can be freely issued by individuals; and this free issue of negotiable paper is too useful, and too well entrenched in necessity, ever hereafter to be interfered with.1 |
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bear Guest
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5/17/13 page 9 I was once more desperate to gain the ears of Conservative Republican, Austrian Economist Gold Bug types; to get their angle of view clear in my mind concerning information such as the above, which is based upon the work done by Josiah Warren in Equitable Commerce. But after so many decades of seeking this information, and coming up very short, it occurs to me that such things are trade secrets, kept secret, for fun and profit. Patents Pending? Italicized Equitable Commerce and changed semi colon to colon: I was once more desperate to gain the ears of Conservative Republican, Austrian Economist Gold Bug types: to get their angle of view clear in my mind concerning information such as the above, which is based upon the work done by Josiah Warren in Equitable Commerce. But after so many decades of seeking this information, and coming up very short, it occurs to me that such things are trade secrets, kept secret, for fun and profit. Patents Pending? |
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bear Guest
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5/17/13 page 9 In the absence of confessions, I am left with guesses and my own research, finding Menger and Rothbard which was a Topic plopped onto the discussion table, here in this forum. Changed punctuation: In the absence of confessions, I am left with guesses and my own research: finding Menger and Rothbard, which was a Topic plopped onto the discussion table, here in this forum. |
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bear Guest
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5/17/13 page 9/10 Or more like the splattering sound that might be heard when a Tar Baby is served up at the otherwise very attractive dinner, right there on the dinner table: smack. Where are all my workers, employees and the like, when good help is so hard to find - at a discount? Get this Tar Baby off my dinner table! What am I paying you to do? Combined into single paragraph and italicized the information being said by the fiction. Or more like the splattering sound that might be heard when a Tar Baby is served up at the otherwise very attractive dinner, right there on the dinner table: smack. Where are all my workers, employees and the like, when good help is so hard to find - at a discount? Get this Tar Baby off my dinner table! What am I paying you to do? |
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bear Guest
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OK, Joe, I am at another point of indecision. I am adding more italics. The italics added in the post above are right before bear words which are also italicized. Before this edit, not many things were italicized except for bear words. Now I am feeling a need to make bear words stand out in another way, and have considered underlining. I don't know if I am now overbaking the art. Do you have any thoughts/ideas? It is not that I want bear words to stand out because they are my words. But I do want them to stand out because they are the words that your words are answering. So I feel like the reader needs to easily know when a new topic/bear question is being introduced, which was the original intent of italicizing bear words. What do you think? (I could put the italics in the post above in quotes, but back when the false capitalist and false socialist were talking about fiat money, I used italics for tbe "quotes" by those fictions because it seemed best.) |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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I think your viewpoint on this is decisive, and we need to invent a better mouse trap to answer this particular problem. I don't like the underlining fix for this problem, if for no other reason that the reason of using too much ink. Looking at the underlining, in my mind, looks too messy too. I'd prefer using another color, or using bold, as you did in the Index, that to me is better than underlining. It matters not to me who gains or loses any "headlines" or "credit' either, so your words being 2 sizes larger and twice as BOLD is no problem for me, the idea is to convey a message worth conveying, in a better way, as the worse way is unaffordable. Is there a way to slightly make some words bolder or a slightly different shade? Did you know that Josiah Warren saw this problem and fixed this problem of having too many limits placed into the STANDARD methods of communication and so he invented ways to fix those limitations? He used CAPITALS a lot, and he also applied the same type of solution to the communication of Music. I think you are onto a method of improving the book greatly, thanks again. I don't know which fix will be the best one yet, please experiment some with the book as it is now, while you have it. If you don't find a competitive fix, I'll see what I can do with the book on my end. |
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bear Guest
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Work from 5/18. Copied from WORD converted to HTML but italics etc, did not copy so I will need to go back and add HTML code here for appearance sake, or I can continue bookwork. 5/18/13 page 10 Here again the concept of closing doors quickly when Bible Thumpers appear on the threshold of the Kingdom: “What happened to my sanctuary?” Modified to incorporate italics for fiction quote Here again the concept of closing doors quickly when Bible Thumpers appear on the threshold of the Kingdom What happened to my sanctuary? 5/18/13 page 10 Based upon as much as I can gather from your words there is little to disbelieve in scripture, mere common sense; reinforcements concerning ideas and concepts that are plagued with doubt and uncertainty given the weight of the consequences for failing to know better. Changed punctuation (maybe again?) but I think this is best. Based upon as much as I can gather from your words there is little to disbelieve in scripture, mere common sense; reinforcements concerning ideas and concepts that are plagued with doubt and uncertainty given the weight of the consequences for failing to know better. 5/18/13 page 10 As to the demarcation lines, well drawn, there is still room for equitable transfers of reinforcing information, despite the confidence in current belief. In my case, I just don't know, for example: this person named Jesus died for me. I just don't know that fact, if it is a fact, and we can call it belief, and how does that work in English, in other words? Changed punctuation: As to the demarcation lines, well drawn, there is still room for equitable transfers of reinforcing information, despite the confidence in current belief. In my case, I just don't know for example, this person named Jesus died for me. I just don't know that fact, if it is a fact, and we can call it belief. And how does that work in English, in other words? Would also like to change this sentence (moving the modifier WELL DRAWN before demarcation and making it WELL-DRAWN), but did not because it may be just exactly as you want it. If I did change it, it would read as follows, and make the sentence less complex (however, I feel it slightly changes the intent): As to the well-drawn demarcation lines, there is still room for equitable transfers of reinforcing information, despite the confidence in current belief. 5/17/13 page 10/11 ________________________________________ “And also Luke 8:12 KJV Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved. And in that verse the devil take the word so that they cannot believe.” _________________________________________ changed to: “It says in Luke 8:12: ‘Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.’ Do you see? he devil takes the word so that they cannot believe.” 5/17/13 page 11 Luke 8: 12 “Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved." Removed space in Scripture reference, and changed end quote format: Luke 8:12 “Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.” 5/17/13 page 11 To me, being so far incapable of accepting all the words in The Word (drawing the line in at least one place), the above makes sense in that The Word is (indirectly or directly) Hate Evil. Took 1 set of parenthesis out: To me, being so far incapable of accepting all the words in The Word, drawing the line in at least one place, the above makes sense in that The Word is (indirectly or directly) Hate Evil. 5/17/13 page 11 And such things, being Evil, and such things being deceptive, can be the False Front of Global Warming hiding the fact that productive people are providing the means by which we suffer, having Aluminum and Barium sprayed into the atmosphere causing Global Warming so that the few most powerful among us can inspire us to pay them even more of the stuff that provides the means by which we suffer? Changed punctuation. Was going to make into 3 sentences but added ellipses (…) instead because I wasn’t sure if I should end each of the sentences with a “?”: And such things, being Evil, and such things being deceptive can be the False Front of Global Warming…hiding the fact that productive people are providing the means by which we suffer…having Aluminum and Barium sprayed into the atmosphere causing Global Warming so that the few most powerful among us can inspire us to pay them even more of the stuff that provides the means by which we suffer? 5/18/13 page 12 Watch Video: Storm Clouds Gathering4 Watch Video: The Natural Rights Foundation5 (bear links) Added italics: Watch Video: Storm Clouds Gathering4 Watch Video: The Natural Rights Foundation5 (bear links) 5/18/13 page 13 The Rebels in 1776, for example were genuine agents of good government when they avoided resort to deceit upon the innocent, and when they avoided resort to threats of violence upon the innocent, and when they avoided resort to violence upon the innocent. Added comma after “for example”: The Rebels in 1776, for example, were genuine agents of good government when they avoided resort to deceit upon the innocent, and when they avoided resort to threats of violence upon the innocent, and when they avoided resort to violence upon the innocent. 5/18/13 page 13 “Contemplate the mangled bodies of your countrymen, and then say 'what should be the reward of such sacrifices?' Bid us and our posterity bow the knee, supplicate the friendship and plough, and sow, and reap, to glut the avarice of the men who have let loose on us the dogs of war to riot in our blood and hunt us from the face of the earth? If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!” Sam Adams Changed to block quote since more than 4 lines: Contemplate the mangled bodies of your countrymen, and then say, What should be the reward of such sacrifices? Bid us and our posterity bow the knee, supplicate the friendship and plough, and sow, and reap, to glut the avarice of the men who have let loose on us the dogs of war to riot in our blood and hunt us from the face of the earth? If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! —Sam Adams 5/18/13 page 14 I have to get work done. I stopped the Tom Woods video on a very good suggestion by Tom Woods and we can play along. I will hit this ball back in your side of the court and ask you to offer the Top 10 Questions that will not be asked during the Election Debates (which I won't be watching without a representative of Liberty allowed into the "debates") and then when I get more free time (ha, ha) I will offer my Top 10 Questions That will be censored from History, or whatever title works best for these Top 10 Questions. Changed punctuation: I have to get work done. I stopped the Tom Woods video on a very good suggestion by Tom Woods, and we can play along. I will hit this ball back in your side of the court and ask you to offer the Top 10 Questions that will not be asked during the Election Debates (which I won't be watching without a representative of Liberty allowed into the "debates"). And then when I get more free time (ha, ha), I will offer my Top 10 Questions That will be censored from History, or whatever title works best for these Top 10 Questions. In an effort to differentiate bear words from the rest of the book words I changed bear font to Angsana New 11 and italicized it and set the font size to 12. I don’t know that his was a good move. You see what you think. 5/18/13 page 15 In this chapter you will find various concepts, things, and actions compared with one another; thus lifting the cloak of deception so that one might peer into well-lit rooms where truth illumines thru comparison. The concept that falsehoods are dressed up to masquerade as truth, and that these costumes are worn by people, is necessary to understand in order to expose the lies perpetrated upon humankind. When we look within the costume and find the person, the Criminal is exposed and perhaps the people bound can be unfettered. While things cannot be held accountable for the actions of individuals, bear continues to feel that certain costumes are better used to conceal the culprit(s) and to enhance the charade in the oppression of humanity. Changed punctuation: In this chapter you will find various concepts, things, and actions compared with one another, thus, lifting the cloak of deception so that one might peer into well-lit rooms where truth illumines thru comparison. The concept that falsehoods are dressed up to masquerade as truth, and that these costumes are worn by people, is necessary to understand in order to expose the lies perpetrated upon humankind. When we look within the costume and find the person, the Criminal is exposed, and perhaps the people bound can be unfettered. While things cannot be held accountable for the actions of individuals, bear continues to feel that certain costumes are better used to conceal the culprit(s) and to enhance the charade in the oppression of humanity. 5/18/13 page 15 Having managed to get to this point a reader may find the chaotic arrangement of English symbols oddly readable, as the information flow inspires many conflicting emotions including boredom on one end of a scale and then, perhaps, something resembling epiphany on the other end, as if to say to oneself, that is a novel idea, so why did I not see that, in that way, before now? Changed punctuation: Having managed to get to this point, a reader may find the chaotic arrangement of English symbols oddly readable as the information flow inspires many conflicting emotions including boredom on one end of a scale, and then perhaps, something resembling epiphany on the other end. As if to say to oneself, “That is a novel idea, so why did I not see that, in that way, before now?” |
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bear Guest
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5/19/13 page 15/16 The concept of willful intent may be worth considering in any case. I've thought about this some. It is possible to be less dangerous to life on earth in general, and less dangerous to one life on earth specifically, to be suffering from a dictator who is willfully, knowingly, distorting the truth, whereby the actual goal is thoughtful, measured, and finite, whereby the victim is to be squeezed, and bled, and suffering to a point just short of death. While on the other hand the dictator who merely parrots a lie, where the parroting dictator believes the lie, may not be as well governed, and the subjects are, or subject is, tortured and then murdered, for their own good: according to the well-meaning, but evil, dictator. changed words/punctuation for readability: The concept of willful intent may be worth considering in any case. I've thought about this some. It is possible to be less dangerous to life on earth in general and less dangerous to one life on earth specifically. To be suffering from a dictator who is willfully, knowingly distorting the truth whereby the actual goal is thoughtful, measured and finite. Whereby the victim is to be squeezed and bled, suffering to a point just short of death. While on the other hand, the dictator who merely parrots a lie, and the parroting dictator believes the lie, may not be as well governed. And the subject(s) are tortured and then murdered for their own good, according to the well-meaning, but evil dictator. |
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bear Guest
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5/19/13 page 16 1. Willful, purposeful, deceivers who dictate those deceptions, threats, and violence, while knowing their deceptions are false. removed 2 commas: 1. Willful, purposeful deceivers who dictate those deceptions, threats, and violence while knowing their deceptions are false. |
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bear Guest
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5/19/13 page 16 Which brings back to my mind the words of Henry Ford: changed Which to This as suggested by MS Word Grammar check: This brings back to my mind the words of Henry Ford: |
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bear Guest
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5/19/13 page 16 (also did this on page 21 and will continue to do so throughout as needed) ________________________________ “It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning.” _______________________________ changed line spacing to make more even: ________________________________ “It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning.” ________________________________ |
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bear Guest
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5/19/13 page 15 & 17 As I was beginning to edit punctuation on Joe Quote on page 17, I realized it was different from Joe Quote at the beginning of the Chapter on page 15 so I have made page 15 to reflect the quote on page 17. page 17 read: As with counterfeit religion (crusades, inquisition, end times) the thing being counterfeited is often opposite the genuine article, and knowing this ought to clue the person knowing this on the actual tool being counterfeited, as to why it was counterfeited, and what the genuine article was actually designed to accomplish. changed punctuation wording to: As with counterfeit religion (crusades, inquisition, end times), the thing being counterfeited is often opposite the genuine article. Knowing this ought to clue the person knowing this in on the actual tool being counterfeited, as to why it was counterfeited, and what the genuine article was actually designed to accomplish. |
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bear Guest
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5/19/13 page 17 Exactly as opposite as is religion opposite false religion, and here is where this meaning may only make sense to someone who is truly religious, since non-religious people or false religious people may consider all religion to be false. So the analogy does not work for them, but suffice to say that an honest factual communication of truth, such as "do not look directly at the sun for more than a few seconds because you will harm your eyes," is opposite a lie such as "please stare at the sun for as long as you can stand it because that is the right way to make your eyes work better for you." Changed punctuation, and added capitals & italics: Exactly as opposite as religion is opposite false religion, and here is where this meaning may only make sense to someone who is truly religious, since non-religious people or false religious people may consider all religion to be false. So the analogy does not work for them, but suffice to say that an honest factual communication of truth, such as, "Do not look directly at the sun for more than a few seconds because you will harm your eyes," is opposite a lie such as, "Please stare at the sun for as long as you can stand it because that is the right way to make your eyes work better for you." |
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bear Guest
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5/19/13 page 17 The word Union has a much greater significance now that I can apply it to the Union of Law professionals, which is specifically designed to be monopolistic. To thereby make Law Power scarce so as to make the cost of Law unaffordable for specific people targeted for exploitation. changed punctuation and made into 1 sentance (I may be undoing something I did earlier...) The word Union has a much greater significance now that I can apply it to the Union of Law professionals, which is specifically designed to be monopolistic to thereby make Law Power scarce, so as to make the cost of Law unaffordable for specific people targeted for exploitation. |
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bear Guest
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5/19/13 page 17 (also changed same way on page 19) Can I pile more hard work on you by rewriting your sentence above so as to reinforce the new keys that you now have in your control? "I was born 49 years ago. I only know how Legal Crime is used by individuals today. I know how Legal Crime is used by decision makers in Legal Crime." added brackets to emphasize changed words: Can I pile more hard work on you by rewriting your sentence above so as to reinforce the new keys that you now have in your control? "I was born 49 years ago. I only know how [Legal Crime] is used by individuals today. I know how [Legal Crime] is used by decision makers in [Legal Crime]." |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I need some help: Page 18: I am having trouble making sense of these words. I have a fuzzy fealing of what they mean, but by the time I get to the end of the paragraph, I do not completely understand: Our government is God's law according to you, and I can almost share that entire version of law according to you. But the words that I think I would use at this time are Common Law, or Natural Law, or God's Law, as our government, which is a voluntary agreement subject to revision, but based upon the same voluntary government avoiding deceit, threats, and violence willfully perpetrated upon the innocent. That above is how the paragraph currently reads as I had previously changed a word and punctuation. And still feel the need to do something with it. Originally it was written as follows: http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2815776 Can you see in your way of thinking a way to make the meaning more clear? Thanks! |
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bear Guest
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5/20/13 page 19 40 some odd years added hyphens 40-some-odd years |
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bear Guest
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5/20/13 page 20 I am not asking you to bla, bla, bla; not me. added italics I am not asking you to bla, bla, bla; not me. |
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bear Guest
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5/20/13 page 20 I am pointing out for your consideration, the very serious closed loop falsehood added hyphen I am pointing out for your consideration, the very serious closed-loop falsehood |
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bear Guest
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5/20/13 page 20 This is fundamental and if anyone challenges you on socialism versus capitalism then consider the possibility of challenging THEM on the verb, not the noun. Made 2 sentences and added comma: This is fundamental. And if anyone challenges you on socialism versus capitalism, then consider the possibility of challenging THEM on the verb, not the noun. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Here is the sentence: Our government is God's law, according to you, and I can almost share all of that version of law according to you, but the words that I think I would use, at this time, is Common Law, or Natural Law, or God's Law, as our government, which is a voluntary agreement, subject to revision, but based upon the same voluntary government, avoiding deceit, threats, and violence willfully perpetrated upon the innocent. I can restate the meaning as this: Our shared understanding is such that God is the power governing all creation, you are much more specific as to what is or is not God's Law, and I merely confess that I don't know much about those Laws that govern us, I can be satisfied with calling these Laws that govern us by using the word Natural Law, or even Common Law, so long as government is then understood to be our shared understanding to avoid harming each other. That is a different way of saying the same thing, and I don't know if you think one is better than the other, or if one can help the other in constructing a even better version. I can try again with another competitive example, if you think it may help in conveying the intended message without too much error or confusion. |
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bear Guest
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Thank you for the words, Joe. I have incorporated some of your new words into the paragraph and have come up with the following to page 18:Our government is God's law according to you, and I can almost share that entire version of law according to you. But the words that I think I would use at this time are Natural Law, or even Common Law, so long as government is then understood to be our shared understanding to avoid harming each other. Such a government that is a voluntary agreement subject to revision and based upon avoiding deceit, threats, and violence willfully perpetrated upon the innocent. If you would prefer something different, you can tell me now or make changes when the ball is back to you. Thank you for your help |
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5/20/13 Page 21 When I speak of getting a key, for example, it is illustrative, a verb, illustrative, illustrating, communicating, acting, action, moving, doing; not static, set, unmoving, fixed, and inert, and power-less. Added colon to begin the list and capitalization to maximize contrast: When I speak of getting a key, for example: it is illustrative, a verb, illustrative, illustrating, communicating, acting, action, moving, doing; NOT static, set, unmoving, fixed, and inert, and power-less. |
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5/20/13 Page 23 What is the meaning behind the employment of the words "Private" and "Public"? Changed quotes to italics (per last rule on this page http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/577/02/ ): What is the meaning behind the employment of the words Private and Public? |
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5/20/13 Page 23 When does a person stop being "private" and then the same person becomes "public?" When does a person stop being "private" and then that same person becomes "public"? When does someone stop being "Employer" and become "Employee?" When does someone stop being "Lender" and become "Borrower?" When does someone stop being "capitalist" and become "socialist?" changed the to that and took the question mark out of the quote mark per last rule on this page http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/577/03/ : When does a person stop being "private" and then that same person becomes "public"? When does someone stop being "Employer" and become "Employee"? When does someone stop being "Lender" and become "Borrower"? When does someone stop being "capitalist" and become "socialist"? |
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5/20/13 Page 23 Libraries are collectivism manifestations: things. Things that exist travel as many individuals transfer things, flowing, moving, things currently flowing from many places; then the flow of things flows into one collected collectivist flowing collection of flow, as the collective sum of things flow into the collected place called a Library. What happens if no one reads? edited for readability: Libraries are collectivism manifestations: things. Things that exist and travel as many individuals transfer things, flowing, moving things; currently flowing from many places, and then the flow of things flows into one collected, collectivist, flowing collection of flow, as the collective sum of things flow into the collected place called a Library. What happens if no one reads? |
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5/20/13 Page 23 Why is "collective" being used in a sentence as if a boogie man lurks in the darkness of "collective" things? Changed first collective to italics since the word itself is being referred to in accordance with rule link given in post above: Why is collective being used in a sentence as if a boogie man lurks in the darkness of "collective" things? |
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5/20/13 Page 24 A bank is a "collective" thing where individuals store individual things flowing; flowing along mediums of exchange, flowing currently from all the individual places, flowing along the avenues, many individual places, flowing into the one bank, collectivizing, collecting, collectivism, collections, like passing a collection plate in church, collectivizing, collections, of collectivism and within that thing lies the boogie man? Edited for readability: A bank is a "collective" thing where individuals store individual things, flowing: flowing along mediums of exchange, flowing currently from all the individual places, flowing along the avenues, many individual places, flowing into the one bank, collectivizing, collecting, collectivism, collections, like passing a collection plate in church, collectivizing, collections, of collectivism. And within that thing lies the boogie man? |
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5/20/13 Page 24 Consider the disadvantages of inaccurate currency as opposed to accurate currency demonstrated as a comparison. 1. Perhaps their goals were Equitable Socialism as opposed to Collective Socialism. 2. Perhaps their goals were Equitable Commerce as opposed to Crime made Legal. Edited to fix 1 & 2 to reflect bear words. Also added colon instead of period to introduce and put words Joe is replacing in for accuracy in brackets: Consider the disadvantages of inaccurate currency as opposed to accurate currency demonstrated as a comparison: 1. Perhaps their goals were Equitable Socialism as opposed to Collective Socialism. 2. Perhaps their goals were Equitable [Commerce] as opposed to [Crime made Legal]. |
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5/20/13 Page 24 The competitive version (2.) is demonstrable in fact as Equitable Commerce continues on today, in fact, in measurable fact where it is measurably, factually, occurring today; while at the same time, and in stark contrast, the opposite also occurs today where Crime continues to be made Legal in the form of what can be called by many names such as: The Dollar Hegemony, The World Reserve Currency, The Legal Money Monopoly Power, Wall Street, The Federal Reserve System of Fraud/The Federal Income Tax Extortion Racket, and U.S.A. Inc. (LLC). removed/added commas and broke into 2 sentences: The competitive version (2.) is demonstrable, in fact, as Equitable Commerce continues on today, in fact, in measurable fact where it is measurably, factually occurring today. While at the same time and in stark contrast, the opposite also occurs today where Crime continues to be made Legal in the form of what can be called by many names such as: The Dollar Hegemony, The World Reserve Currency, The Legal Money Monopoly Power, Wall Street, The Federal Reserve System of Fraud/The Federal Income Tax Extortion Racket, and U.S.A. Inc. (LLC). |
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5/20/13 Page 24 You have the key but you don't use it? added comma: You have the key, but you don't use it? |
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5/20/13 Page 25 So the boogie man socialism is rendered null and void, mere vapor, and now a new boogie man shows up called "collectivism?" Added quotes and moved question mark: So the boogie man “socialism” is rendered null and void, mere vapor, and now a new boogie man shows up called “collectivism”? |
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5/20/13 Page 25 Is there ever an end to the current flow of things to be held accountable for the actions of people? added italics for emphasis: Is there ever an end to the current flow of things to be held accountable for the actions of people? |
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5/20/13 Page 25 (in 2 places on same page) "If one is forced into a collective situation as far as I can understand they are no longer sovereign." Added punctuation: "If one is forced into a collective situation, as far as I can understand, they are no longer sovereign." |
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5/20/13 Page 25 Then what? Everyone is separated from everyone else completely because every single connecting medium has been corrupted by a few people to the detriment of everyone else? added dashes for emphasis: Then what? Everyone is separated from everyone else –completely- because every single connecting medium has been corrupted by a few people to the detriment of everyone else? |
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5/20/13 Page 25 1. "If one is forced into a collective situation as far as I can understand they are no longer sovereign." 2. "If one victim is willfully forced by a criminal to make the victim less powerful so as to make the criminal more powerful, as far as I can understand, the victim is no longer sovereign by that exact measure of that power being transferred that inequitable way precisely as it happens in time and place." Edited punctuation and to add brackets for Joe words as well as adding italics to indicate bear words: 1. "If one is forced into a collective situation, as far as I can understand, they are no longer sovereign." 2. “If one [victim] is [willfully] forced [by a criminal to make the victim less powerful, so as to make the criminal more powerful], as far as I can understand, [the victim is] no longer sovereign [by that exact measure of that power being transferred that inequitable way, precisely, as it happens in time and place].” |
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5/20/13 Page 26 One sentence demonizes a thing, blaming a thing for the actions of a person, in such a way as to be so ambiguous as to be interpretable in any way anyone cares to interpret that sentence, even to the point of meaning one thing one second and the opposite thing the next second. Added italics for emphasis, and a colon to introduce the thought, and the word so: One sentence demonizes a thing: blaming a thing for the actions of a person in such a way as to be so ambiguous, so as to be interpretable in any way anyone cares to interpret that sentence, even to the point of meaning one thing one second and the opposite thing the next second. |
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5/20/13 Page 26 If the goal is to enslave another individual, with a hammer, or with that power of sovereignty commanded by that individual, then there is an English word for that sovereign act by that sovereign individual, and the word may be useful or not. added back a comma that you had originally had in your original post at the DP and added an additional comma toward the end. If the goal is to enslave another individual, with a hammer, or with that power of sovereignty commanded by that individual, then there is an English word for that sovereign act by that sovereign individual, and the word may be useful, or not. |
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Ya, know...Joe, I have a bone to pick with you. Everytime I read this, I think it, but have said nothing. But tonight I am going to say, "You, Joe, had a knee-jerk reaction because I said the word socialism." Here. I said this: "Today we are in a system whereby we are forced coercively to participate in a collective socialist system which is beholden to crony capitalism." And then you said: Socialism must be demonized by you, or you don't feel good about your use of time and energy while you still have that power? And then you said this: Why does capitalism get the pre-qualifier while socialism arrives without such fine print? And now I am going to answer: I did put a pre-qualifier before socialism. I used the pre-qualifier collective on the heals talking about voluntary associations. I was trying in my ever-so-poor way to say involuntary collective socialism. I did give socialism a pre-qualifier. People being involuntarily, collected and forced into an involuntary socialist system. Here is the whole paragraph in context: "That is why you have helped me understand voluntary association. That is why each state should have its own voluntary system whereby people vote with their feet if they do not like the system. However, we do not find ourselves in that situation today. Today we are in a system whereby we are forced coercively to participate in a collective socialist system which is beholden to crony capitalism." I think you had a knee-jerk reaction! And I think that everytime I read that exchange. OK, please excuse this cowardice, toothless, parasidic-ridden bear outburst. I'll get back to work now |
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5/20/13 Page 27 "To me it is like you telling me I don’t care what color the Republicans say they are. I say they are blue. They were blue and they are blue. I don’t care if everyone else now says they are red because they changed from blue to red. Don’t you dare call them red. They are blue. And I say When a rose changes colors it is time to take note and change words." Updated to use quotes per As follows: “To me it is like you telling me, ‘I don’t care what color the Republicans say they are. I say they are blue. They were blue and they are blue. I don’t care if everyone else now says they are red because they changed from blue to red. Don’t you dare call them red! They are blue.’ “And I say, ‘When a rose changes colors it is time to take note and change words.’” |
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5/20/13 Page 27 "It is entertaining and fun to me and it is also work to try to apply new concepts to my thinking." added comma: "It is entertaining and fun to me, and it is also work to try to apply new concepts to my thinking." |
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5/20/13 Page 28 Carl Miller, if I remember right, says: "If you are not having fun, you are not doing it right." Removed quotes since this may not be a direct quote http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/577/01/ : Carl Miller, if I remember right, says: If you are not having fun, you are not doing it right. |
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5/20/13 Page 28 "I am not my own, I belong to everyone else, and this little space, this little place, I have found in writing and learning belongs to me. That may not make much sense to you, but it does to me. If that about me makes it so I am not qualified we need to know that. At the same time I need to have respect for the seriousness of the matter and the work you are about. I know it is serious. It is probably a coping mechanism for me not to think of the gravity involved; that being the complete disregard for human life and the bodies stacked high to heaven." changed punctuation: "I am not my own; I belong to everyone else, and this little space, this little place, I have found in writing and learning belongs to me. That may not make much sense to you, but it does to me. If that about me makes it so I am not qualified, we need to know that. At the same time I need to have respect for the seriousness of the matter and the work you are about. I know it is serious. It is probably a coping mechanism for me not to think of the gravity involved: that being the complete disregard for human life and the bodies stacked high to heaven." |
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5/20/13 Page 28 In context, to me, you have worked yourself, while making the best of it, into a very important victory. As stated earlier, identification of a closed loop in your own mind is a huge victory; almost incomprehensibly impossible to do alone, and if that has happened, then I am privileged to be a miniscule measure of help in that very serious battle and that very important victory. Replaced semicolon with period: In context, to me, you have worked yourself, while making the best of it, into a very important victory. As stated earlier, identification of a closed loop in your own mind is a huge victory. Almost incomprehensibly impossible to do alone, and if that has happened, then I am privileged to be a miniscule measure of help in that very serious battle and that very important victory. |
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5/20/13 Page 28 "I can say when the cubs are involved a mama bear does come out, with claws. Maybe I just talk big." Changed punctuation: “I can say, when the cubs are involved, a mama bear does come out with claws. Maybe I just talk big.” |
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5/20/13 Page 28 The messages are what they are separate from the messenger. added back comma like Joe had it originally The messages are what they are, separate from the messenger. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,OK, please excuse this cowardice, toothless, parasidic-ridden bear outburst. I'll get back to work now One of many repetitive faults are mine to either repeat or stop repeating, is this example being exemplified in this way, and it welcome, and it is appreciated, having help in recognizing the error, so as to have a way to stop repeating the error. Thanks again. |
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And I always thought myself to be a cute, sweet, kind and gentle, friendly, little bear. like this: http://www.dailypaul.com/user/50163 (and if I were as smart as Sergey, I could put a picture here. But you will have to click the link if you want to see.) Now look at me: ...a cowardice, toothless, parasidic-ridden bear... This is a rather disturbing sight, if you ask me. Parasites of suggestion have now infected my mind.  |
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5/21/13 page 29 If Legal Criminals could, it seems to me, they would have all the females (except their close nit group) plotting to torture and murder all the males, and of course to balance things out they would have all the males plotting to torture and murder all the females. added comma (maybe again, but I am not going to check) If Legal Criminals could, it seems to me, they would have all the females (except their close nit group) plotting to torture and murder all the males, and of course to balance things out, they would have all the males plotting to torture and murder all the females. |
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5/21/13 page 29 You used the term, if I remember right, man haters? added italics: You used the term, if I remember right, man haters? |
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5/21/13 page 29 To me it does not matter; a female brain in a male body. I don't have anything against that individual, if that is how that individual exists, that way, without question. I don't know; it seems to be possible, very real for them, but my questions concern how does that happen? Is it natural, meaning is it separate from a man-made alteration in genetics, or on the other hand, are there things being done willfully by people to cause those changes in genetics: done on purpose to cause specific things to happen? Changed punctuation To me it does not matter: a female brain in a male body. I don't have anything against that individual, if that is how that individual exists, that way, without question. I don't know. It seems to be possible, very real for them, but my questions concern, how does that happen? Is it natural? Meaning is it separate from a man-made alteration in genetics, or on the other hand, are there things being done willfully by people to cause those changes in genetics: done on purpose to cause specific things to happen? |
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5/21/13 page 29 And most people can't even ask this question if they are still assuming that "our" government is merely making mistakes when perpetual war for perpetual peace to save the children goes wrong for fully 2 centuries now. Changed italics And most people can't even ask this question if they are still assuming that "our" government is merely making mistakes when perpetual war for perpetual peace to save the children goes wrong for fully 2 centuries now. |
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5/21/13 page 29 Bloom appears to be infected with that nonsense, despite his obvious capacity to know much more about specific things than most everyone. He is a genius, one of a kind, and I have discussed my Joe's Law perspective with him on Skype. He responded to Joe's Law with, "That looks right to me," or some other positive reinforcement in other words; I did not quote him verbatim. Removed quotes since this may not be a direct quote. Added italics to Skyp and Bloom's indirect words for emphasis. Bloom appears to be infected with that nonsense, despite his obvious capacity to know much more about specific things than most everyone. He is a genius, one of a kind, and I have discussed my Joe's Law perspective with him on Skype. He responded to Joe's Law with: That looks right to me, or some other positive reinforcement in other words; I did not quote him verbatim. |
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5/21/13 page 30 I can say without reservation that I think that Howard Bloom is the genuine article, a genius, and he means well, so there should be a significant amount of consideration, on my part at least, given to what he has to say. Divided into 2 sentences: I can say without reservation that I think that Howard Bloom is the genuine article, a genius, and he means well. So there should be a significant amount of consideration, on my part at least, given to what he has to say. |
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5/21/13 page 30 In other words, wars do not happen by accident, or randomly: they are driven by the deliberate willpower of specific people in flesh and blood. Removed comma: In other words, wars do not happen by accident or randomly: they are driven by the deliberate willpower of specific people in flesh and blood. |
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5/21/13 page 30 It looks like you believe the words typed by the reporter. Modern Times still exists in many forms, who says that it "did not grow beyond a village?” moved question mark outside of quotes: It looks like you believe the words typed by the reporter. Modern Times still exists in many forms, who says that it "did not grow beyond a village”? |
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5/21/13 page 31 It was not labor-for-labor as in "The Labor Theory of Value." So that sentence is typically half true, failing to even touch upon the concept of TIME or ACTION. There is no mention of the COST principle; and therefore, the actual message by Warren is not simply discarded; it is falsified. Then the author claims that some THING creates a sovereign individual, which is patently absurd, because GOD creates sovereign individuals who are sovereign once they become independent beings past the stage of growth where the being, the living being, the living human being, as a child is nurtured by other people, parents, in a family, or if possible, but not likely: the child somehow manages to become independent and SOVEREIGN without parents, without a family, a real family, not a counterfeit family, a good family of good people doing good things like nurturing, not torturing, children. Changed punctuation. Broke into sentences. Added the word Individual to start another sentence. It was not labor-for-labor as in "The Labor Theory of Value." So that sentence is typically half true, failing to even touch upon the concept of TIME or ACTION. There is no mention of the COST principle; and therefore, the actual message by Warren is not simply discarded, it is falsified. Then the author claims that some THING creates a sovereign individual, which is patently absurd, because GOD creates sovereign individuals. Individuals who are sovereign once they become independent beings past the stage of growth where the being, the living being, the living human being, as a child, is nurtured by other people. Parents, in a family, or if possible but not likely, the child somehow manages to become independent and SOVEREIGN without parents, without a family, a real family (not a counterfeit family), a good family of good people doing good things like nurturing, not torturing, children. |
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5/21/13 page 32 I have a need to measure the accuracy of my viewpoint and so I offer words intending to communicate that viewpoint. added comma: I have a need to measure the accuracy of my viewpoint, and so I offer words intending to communicate that viewpoint. |
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5/21/13 page 33 The topic of prejudice arises and that thing, prejudice, or that action, prejudice, is shown as a tool: A tool for the use in perpetrating crime. Another costume: Prejudice. Changed punctuation. Added italics. The topic of prejudice arises, and that thing: prejudice, or that action: prejudice, is shown as a tool; a tool for use in perpetrating crime. Another costume: Prejudice. |
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5/21/13 page 33 bear: "Do you already know about this or am I telling you something new?" Added comma: bear: "Do you already know about this, or am I telling you something new?" |
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5/21/13 page 33 If it works to call the competition Black, while plotting evil to be done to the competition, then that works for liars. added italics: If it works to call the competition Black, while plotting evil to be done to the competition, then that works for liars. |
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5/21/13 page 33 I did not get the aversion to darker skin bug, so I like it when my skin turns darker in the sun. What is the problem with darker skin? added quotes I did not get the “aversion to darker skin” bug, so I like it when my skin turns darker in the sun. What is the problem with darker skin? |
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5/21/13 page 34 “Without prejudice” is a term, a pair of words in English; that may be worth knowing better. Removed blank space at beginning of sentance, and changed semi colon to ellipse. “Without prejudice” is a term...a pair of words in English...that may be worth knowing better. |
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5/21/13 page 34 I did not look at the links. I prefer to stay out of those types of fights when it looks like argument for the sake of argument with prejudice against those who know better. What is the point? Added commas: I did not look at the links. I prefer to stay out of those types of fights when it looks like argument, for the sake of argument, with prejudice against those who know better. What is the point? |
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5/21/13 page 34 Thanks for keeping the Speer information up to date, I've been running out of time of late, barely finding time to play the guitar, and my political/economy work has been focusing on Carl Miller as I'm making a reading list. Broke into 2 sentences: Thanks for keeping the Speer information up to date. I've been running out of time of late, barely finding time to play the guitar, and my political/economy work has been focusing on Carl Miller as I'm making a reading list. |
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5/21/13 page 34 I know that a person may be born with darker skin, so they are darker skin because of their genetic make-up, a race if you will, a genetic make-up that is specific to a set of human characteristics. changed the word skin to skinned: I know that a person may be born with darker skin, so they are darker skinned because of their genetic make-up, a race if you will, a genetic make-up that is specific to a set of human characteristics. |
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5/21/13 page 34 I don't normally spend much time on this subject; hence my ignorance about someone who is called a Jew or people who call themselves Jews. Added comma I don't normally spend much time on this subject; hence, my ignorance about someone who is called a Jew or people who call themselves Jews. |
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5/21/13 page 35 I don't know how to judge the future but by judging the past. So I prejudge the future based upon the past, knowing that I can be wrong Added comma and period: I don't know how to judge the future, but by judging the past. So I prejudge the future based upon the past, knowing that I can be wrong. |
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5/21/13 page 36 This is along the lines of thinking dynamically and not thinking in terms of THINGS being static: for us to use our brains as in a verb. As in “use it:” not possess it. changed punctuation: This is along the lines of thinking dynamically and not thinking in terms of THINGS being static...for us to use our brains as in a verb: As in “use it,” not possess it. |
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5/21/13 page 36 So prejudice, so defined as exemplified by insurance, is one thing. And then the idea is to use your brain to compare that one THING with a counterfeit version of it whereby the user intends to resort to deceit, threats of violence, and violence upon the targeted innocent people being targeted, and then to cover up those crimes with the word prejudice. Added comma and italics So prejudice, so defined, as exemplified by insurance, is one thing. And then the idea is to use your brain to compare that one THING with a counterfeit version of it whereby the user intends to resort to deceit, threats of violence, and violence upon the targeted innocent people being targeted, and then to cover up those crimes with the word prejudice. |
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5/21/13 page 36 The context here is my offering of words which are intending to convey specific, and not ambiguous, meaning. My intent is to convey a competitive perspective INTACT and to avoid having the competitive perspective misread, or misunderstood, so as to avoid any distortion. Removed the word and: The context here is my offering of words which are intending to convey specific, not ambiguous, meaning |
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5/21/13 page 36 And the reason I am saying that has to do with a person first checking their own mind to see if their own mind is the source of their fears as they may then be inspired to project that lie outward from within. added commas: And the reason I am saying that has to do with a person first checking their own mind, to see if their own mind is the source of their fears, as they may then be inspired to project that lie outward from within. |
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5/21/13 page 37 The first stone, it turns out, is a lie. The lie enters the victim’s brain, and then the victim begins to employ the lie, believing that the lie is true; then that belief in that lie inspires evil, inspires the infected person to pass on the lie to their "friends," which is evil and deceptive. Not willfully deceptive, since the infected individual is by definition infected, a "true believer," and so the lie spreads. And who benefits? took out semicolon and made new sentence: The first stone, it turns out, is a lie. The lie enters the victim’s brain, and then the victim begins to employ the lie, believing that the lie is true. Then that belief in that lie inspires evil, inspires the infected person to pass on the lie to their "friends," which is evil and deceptive. Not willfully deceptive, since the infected individual is by definition infected, a "true believer," and so the lie spreads. And who benefits? |
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First of all we thank Jeff for my birthday present of a mobile hot spot...I can now do bookwork just about anywhere! The connection is very fast here in Columbia, MO! 5/22/13 page 37 Imagine spending your whole life living a lie, and on the last day, you realize it. Poor me? changed period to colon: Imagine spending your whole life living a lie, and on the last day, you realize it: Poor me? |
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5/22/13 page 37 The original inventor of the lies, or those who know better than to actually believe the lie, and use the lie even if they have not invented the lie, benefit. Or so they calculate as their targeted victims are at each other’s throats inspired by that lie; victims growing weaker during the conflict, or the victims of the lie are separated and apart from each other, no longer benefiting from mutual benefit, whereby the lie causes either separation or conflict. Both being destructive in a relative sense, the targets grow weaker either way. Punctuation and wording changed for readability (I did a por job of initial correcting...adding a period before or which is better not there. Hopefully this is a better edit. The original inventor of the lies (or those who know better than to actually believe the lie, but use the lie even if they have not invented the lie) benefit, or so they calculate, as their targeted victims are at each other’s throats, inspired by that lie. Victims grow weaker during the conflict, or the victims of the lie are separated and apart from each other, no longer benefiting from mutual benefit, whereby the lie causes either separation or conflict. Both being destructive in a relative sense: the targets grow weaker either way. |
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5/22/13 page 37 If the goal of separation for all those white supremacist, skin head, neo-Nazis is to have nothing to do with the people they prefer not to have anything to do with, then relatively speaking, there would be a loss of at least one thing worth trading between one member of one group and another member of another group. Removed comma before neo-Nazi If the goal of separation for all those white supremacist, skin head neo-Nazis is to have nothing to do with the people they prefer not to have anything to do with, then relatively speaking, there would be a loss of at least one thing worth trading between one member of one group and another member of another group. |
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5/22/13 page 35 & 39 The base of the evil is merely evil; it is a desire to destroy. The coverings invented to hide the evil are legion, pick from the hat, any excuse will do, but specific excuses do tend to fit the occasion better than less powerful ones. Redid punctuation...again...I think this is better than my first effort The base of the evil is merely evil. It is a desire to destroy. The coverings invented to hide the evil are legion. Pick from the hat, any excuse will do, but specific excuses do tend to fit the occasion better than less powerful ones. |
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5/22/13 page 39 But when the innocent person targeted is not the same color: the race card lie works perfectly. changed colon to comma: But when the innocent person targeted is not the same color, the race card lie works perfectly. |
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bear Guest
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5/22/13 page 39 How do I know all this, you may ask, as I ask myself; and what comes to mind is the hatred I feel when thinking about evil people who lie, where they know their lies are invented to cover up their crimes, and where their crimes include the torture and murder of children on a regular basis. Changed punctuation: How do I know all this? You may ask, as I ask myself. And what comes to mind is the hatred I feel when thinking about evil people who lie, where they know their lies are invented to cover up their crimes, and where their crimes include the torture and murder of children on a regular basis. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I cannot understand why the word falsify is used in this paragraph. Can you please help me understand. I have to work to diffuse my own hatred, which can run very deep into my soul, as my mind is apt to invent any excuse that will excuse an outbreak of violence on my part, and the excuse intends to accomplish evil, to falsify my true, base, destructive human tendencies. ----------------- Wouldn't an outburst of evil tend to verify, confirm, validate or testify to true, base, destructive human tendencies? |
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bear Guest
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5/22/13 page 40 Which prejudice do you see when you see prejudice? Do you see the genuine tool, or do you see the lie that covers up "collective punishment?" Moved ? outside of the " Which prejudice do you see when you see prejudice? Do you see the genuine tool, or do you see the lie that covers up "collective punishment"? |
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bear Guest
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5/22/13 page 40 Beware, in case you come across that teaching it is not Biblical to Hate black people, but there are people who twist the Bible to make it say such things. Do not believe that twist. Beware. I am not being prejudiced by not listening to hateful people. I am not giving lies value or power by not entertaining or hearing them." Divided 1st sentence into 2 sentences. Removed double negative from last sentence. Beware, in case you come across that teaching .It is not Biblical to Hate black people, but there are people who twist the Bible to make it say such things. Do not believe that twist. Beware. I am not being prejudiced by not listening to hateful people. I am not giving lies value or power by entertaining or hearing them." |
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bear Guest
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5/22/13 page 40 And when they speak, they tell me such things as the Jews have been promised, by God, a section of Real Estate of some notable value; by God those squatters already living in the Promised Land had better start packing or else. Added colon. Also changed semicolon back to a comma and added back the word "and" (like you had originally written it )And when they speak, they tell me such things: As the Jews have been promised, by God, a section of Real Estate of some notable value, and by God those squatters already living in the Promised Land had better start packing or else. |
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bear Guest
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5/22/13 page 40 I ask “Or else what: torture and murder of the innocent? They say, with a hint of relish, yes, or else, God says so. I say or else they will be tortured and slaughtered for failing to obey the order to vacate the premises without question. They say it is God's will. Added punctuation appropriate for quotes/conversation: I ask, “Or else what: torture and murder of the innocent?” They say, with a hint of relish, “Yes,” or else, “God says so.” I say, “Or else they will be tortured and slaughtered for failing to obey the order to vacate the premises without question.” They say, “It is God's will.” |
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bear Guest
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5/22/13 page 41 Collective punishment is the employment of a counterfeit form of prejudice whereby criminals (with or without badges) employ prejudice to cover up their crimes as if their crimes where somehow justifiable by this tool called prejudice. Added comma before as and changed "where" to "were" Collective punishment is the employment of a counterfeit form of prejudice whereby criminals (with or without badges) employ prejudice to cover up their crimes, as if their crimes were somehow justifiable by this tool called prejudice. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am seeing some very poor editing done on my part earlier on. I hope I don't continue that trend in this current edit effort. Thank you for your patience. 5/22/13 page 41 The base of crime is for the criminal to target a victim, and by whichever means the act is covered up. The set of things done to cover up those crimes are LEGION, meaning of many forms, a tangled web, and an exponentially expanding universe of greater lies. More and more and more counterfeit prejudice or "collective punishment" is just one of many cover-ups, false fronts, excuses, false justifications, for the actual, willful, targeting, and then injuring of innocent people. changed word: "whichever" to "whatever" and made some punctuation changes: The base of crime is for the criminal to target a victim, and by whatever means the act is covered up. The set of things done to cover up those crimes are LEGION, meaning of many forms: a tangled web and an exponentially expanding universe of greater lies, more and more and more counterfeit prejudice or "collective punishment" is just one of many cover-ups, false fronts, excuses, false justifications for the actual, willful, targeting, and then injuring of innocent people. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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On the use of falsify. "Wouldn't an outburst of evil tend to verify, confirm, validate or testify to true, base, destructive human tendencies?" I am trying to say that the use of the tool "excuse" is used as a tool used to falsify, hide, cover up, the true motive. I have to work to diffuse my own hatred, which can run very deep into my soul, as my mind is apt to invent any excuse that will excuse an outbreak of violence on my part, and the excuse intends to accomplish evil, to falsify my true, base, destructive human tendencies. I can invent "reasons," which can be called rationalizations, or "justifications," or apologies for a per-meditated use of violence, so the excuse is falsehood, evil, and so is the violence, but the invention of the falsehood is meant to falsify the violence. Back to Solzhenitsyn on that relationship between falsehood and violence? When heart, or soul, is employed into work, the product may, or may not, communicate that employment of power in that way, but you know it? I see it. |
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bear Guest
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OK, I understand now. I just wasn't reading it right. Nevermind that I had been up since 4am and had to navigate multiple times in an unfamiliar town and had been sitting in one of those "Affordable Dentures" places where the video tape of their "offerings" continued to loop over and over and over again and the family next to me was a loud family and the lady was not a happy camper. So, I understand falsify now. I am home and it is quiet. I missed church and everyone else is there and now I cannot understand what you mean by the words: [quote} When heart, or soul, is employed into work, the product may, or may not, communicate that employment of power in that way, but you know it? I see it. I think I am overly tired because they sound like you are irritated at me. as in "you know it, WELL, I SEE it." and I don't even know what I KNOW or what you SEE. I think I have hit my limit for today. ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I often wonder about how repetition works as we are repeated exposed to things that may or may not adversely affect us, or affect us in a positive way. Constant bombardment of harmful radiation can be placed on a scale where the scale is constructed to begin to measure how constant bombardment, or repetition, of exposure to things may affect people like you, me, and everyone else. Repetitive exposure to whatever makes someone happy, their most happy experiences ever, can be on the other end of the scale built for seeing how repetition works upon people. People go in this direction and they find difficulties. People go in this direction and they find happiness. One of the possible affects of repetitive difficulties is to avoid that direction. One of the possible affects of repetitive happiness is to go in that direction. One of the possible affects of repetition is to see the thing repeating from different angles of view. If you have this affect going on, where you see things from a different view, when things repeat, then, to me, there are competitive examples of how you see things that repeat. You may see something that repeats from a viewpoint that is confusing. Then you see something that repeats from a viewpoint that is less confusing. The affect is less confusing viewpoints of things. I don't know if that can help explain this: When heart, or soul, is employed into work, the product may, or may not, communicate that employment of power in that way, but you know it? I see it. I don't know if writing that sentence again can convey the intended meaning. I can work at it. I can put my heart in it. I can force my will upon my soul, to use my brain, and my power over my living being, and I can write the perspective I have in other words, and my product may, or many not, communicate the employment of my power in that way. If I do not communicate well, it won't be due to a lack of effort, because I can repeat the effort, until I have no more power. If I do not communicate well, it could be because no one wants to know what I perceive, or it could be that someone wanting to know is someone who is currently very tired. The product is what it is, and if someone can see the effort put into the product, then someone can see it, and I do, I see the effort you put into the product of this book, as the sentences are becoming more consistent, and greater consistency, is greater repetition, which has an affect on people, and one probably affect is such that the reader has less work to do, and the intended perspective is easier to communicate effectively. |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 42 We can share and compare notes as we suffer, as we say to each other, oh yea, that is where the IRS is getting away with that much crime; by IRS I don't mean a building, and by IRS I don't mean a title. Changed punctuation by adding quotes and making 2 sentences We can share and compare notes as we suffer, as we say to each other, “Oh yea, that is where the IRS is getting away with that much crime.” By IRS I don't mean a building, and by IRS I don't mean a title. |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 43 I think he is way out of his league, when it comes to the concept of political economy, based upon your current reports. Removed comma ("when it comes to the concept of political economy" is necessary to the sentance. I left the last clause because that last phrase can be moved anywhere between the clauses and the sentences still makes the same sense See rule 4 and 8 on this page: http://owl.english.purdue .edu/owl/resource/607/02/.) I think he is way out of his league when it comes to the concept of political economy, based upon your current reports. |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 43 Why is it that risk is borne only by the borrower when he, or you, or I, consider this concept of "private loans?" Moved question mark: Why is it that risk is borne only by the borrower when he, or you, or I, consider this concept of "private loans"? |
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bear Guest
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bear note to Joe. Everytime you asked me that question about the difference between public and private, my thought was, "How should I know?" I think that is why I never answered the question at first until you pressed me. It was something I had to think about, and really didn't even know if my final personal conclusion was correct. Anyways, I am fixing some punctuation: 5/23/13 page 43 A person is said to be "private" one minute, and then something happens, and then the same person becomes "public," and then back to "private," then "public," so what happens? Ended the sentence with a period and started a new one that contains only the question. A person is said to be "private" one minute, and then something happens, and then the same person becomes "public," and then back to "private," then "public." So what happens? |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 43 Two questions restated below, enumerated, and offered as a possible road toward greater understanding as the answer may answer both questions. moved comma: Two questions restated below, enumerated and offered as a possible road toward greater understanding, as the answer may answer both questions. |
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bear Guest
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OK Joe, I am going to tell you something. I have come to this segment: 5/23/13 page 44 2. What constitutes the difference between "public" and "private?" and I am having to look it up here: http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/577/03/ because even though I just quoted you a bunch of rules about this over at the DP, I cannot apply the rule myself without going and checking because the answer is so against my ingrained training from NASA technical writing. But then again, maybe I was only putting commas and periods outside of quotes back then. I don't know. OK here is the rule from that site: Place a question mark or exclamation point within closing quotation marks if the punctuation applies to the quotation itself. Place the punctuation outside the closing quotation marks if the punctuation applies to the whole sentence. Now I ask myself, well, they are talking about exact quote from people, not quotes about things...so now I go on another rule hunt: so I go here: and find this: Here is a quick chart of the differences: http://blog.apastyle.org/apastyle/2011/08/punctuating-around-quotation-marks.html I will ad this link to my grammer resource segment here on your forum and I will come back later to figure out this answer (which I am sure I have already figured out before in my editing this time around.) See Joe, I have very poor retention, and it drives me crazy because I used to be able to remember everything. To enclose a quotation, use… American Style: Double quotation marks British Style: Single quotation marks To enclose a quotation within a quotation, use… American Style: Single quotation marks British Style: Double quotation marks Place periods and commas… American Style: Inside quotation marks British Style: Outside quotation marks Place other punctuation (colons, semi-colons, question marks, etc.)… American Style: Outside quotation marks* British Style: Outside quotation marks* *Place other punctuation inside quotation marks when that punctuation is part of what is being quoted, such as a quoted question. --------------- So the answer to my question is: 2. What constitutes the difference between "public" and "private?" should be: 2. What constitutes the difference between "public" and "private"?with the question mark outside of the quote because the quote is not the question |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 44 I think also along this unsolved mystery path, as if we are both searching for a new key; a key that is currently out of view where in the darkness there is a faint image of the answer, and the answer appears to be forming in the form of two words as such: Made into 2 sentences: I think also along this unsolved mystery path, as if we are both searching for a new key. A key that is currently out of view where in the darkness there is a faint image of the answer, and the answer appears to be forming in the form of two words as such: |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 45 Those criminal people want, demand, and get inequity. So how do they get it in the case of the Student loan compared to the Mortgage loan as a "standard of excellence" in the "loan" shark "business?" moved question mark outside of quotes. Those criminal people want, demand, and get inequity. So how do they get it in the case of the Student loan compared to the Mortgage loan as a "standard of excellence" in the "loan" shark "business"? |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 45 More on this avenue, if you can bear it, is the method of comparative measure used to help know better as a Free Market (in the genuine sense and not in the counterfeit sense) example can illustrate the point better. added comma: More on this avenue, if you can bear it, is the method of comparative measure used to help know better, as a Free Market (in the genuine sense and not in the counterfeit sense) example can illustrate the point better. |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 46 & 47 “when he says when people enter into a contract they need to keep their end of the bargain: "The Christian thing to do." Removed "when": “He says when people enter into a contract they need to keep their end of the bargain: "The Christian thing to do." |
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bear Guest
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I have something to say about thisSuffice to say that a potentially valuable student could be connected to a potentially valuable education more regularly, more abundantly, if a mechanism was in use (competition) by which investors were fighting over each other to pay the student the most money to get the students inspired to learn by that reward for that effort. I thought competition was in place in the form of dollars per hour that the student is worth based upon the type of education the student completed. At least that was the way it used to be...when my dad went to school and was able to pay his way thru school by sacking groceries. That was before a college education cost $50K a year give or take. But isn't the competition supposed to be in the hand of the student, not in the hand of the employer? Isn't that what supposedly made us a free society. Everyone was able to rise to the top based upon their own hard work and labor and not being dependent or beholden to an employer to provide that opportunity? Those were the days before 60% in taxes and regulations skimmed from the pockets of Americans...and before the debt clock that explifies holes in the pockets of the wage earner which will never be patched as their hard work and labor fall thru thoughs holes and into the coffers of...the slave owners. |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 46 In an upside down world good people are punished most, and bad people are rewarded most, so it may be a good idea to know better as to which mechanism is tabled for discussion? added comma: In an upside down world, good people are punished most, and bad people are rewarded most, so it may be a good idea to know better as to which mechanism is tabled for discussion? |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 47 1. You are holding government accountable because you know the lie and you are using it now. 2. You are holding government accountable because you are victim to the lie, even now. Changed periods to question marks : 1. You are holding government accountable because you know the lie and you are using it now? 2. You are holding government accountable because you are victim to the lie, even now? |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 48 He said: “It is your money.” changed colon to comma: He said, “It is your money.” |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 49 He said, “It was my money.” changed to be what he would have said: He said, “It is your money.” |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 49 the Human Resources liar, another well paid liar added hyphen the Human Resources liar, another well-paid liar |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 49 guys are well paid liars, added hyphen: guys are well-paid liars, |
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bear Guest
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5/23/13 page 50 "The original words Goy and Ethnos refer to ‘peoples’ or ‘nations’." Removed single quote marks as they were not necessary and their removal makes the punctation easier. "The original words Goy and Ethnos refer to peoples or nations." |
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bear Guest
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I got to the end of this chapter and the only thing left on a page by itself was your the line and your name so I have gone thru and removed some lines that were bordering my quotes, I removed one of the 3 returns at the beginning of the chapter and the return after the word "discussion" at the beginning of the chapter. None of those changes fixed the problem so I am putting 5/23/13 page 43 Me? You are warning me? on one line: Me? You are warning me? ---------------- page 44 1. Why are risks charged inequitably to the borrower? 2. What constitutes the difference between “public” and “private”? took out space between list: 1. Why are risks charged inequitably to the borrower? 2. What constitutes the difference between “public” and “private”? --------------------] Page 47 They nod. I try harder. moved to same line They nod. I try harder. --------------------- page 48 I've been wrong often. Back to competition: Moved to same line I've been wrong often. Back to competition: |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, After all your hard work I can't imagine me finding anything to edit. This may be a book printing that is worth more than 25 copies. If I get to that point, God willing, me having the power to do what I think is right too, then my thinking may be to bump up the number of books printed in the initial printing. I have thought about various marketing ideas including an idea of asking people I know to give me 100 dollars for a copy. I inform them that I will then use that money to make more copies, and I can ask them to sell the book after they are done reading it, and if they sell the book for 90 dollars, then the book costs them 10 dollars, and I can tell them to tell the same story to whoever they sell the book too. I can even tell them that I will keep their 100 dollars until they sell the book, and I can even say that I will give them the 100 dollars back if they prefer their 100 dollars after some time expires between the initial equitable trade and the moment they decide that the trade was not at all equitable. That is one example of one idea concerning marketing. |
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bear Guest
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Looks like I am nearly a 1/3 of the way thru. We have company tomorrow. Jeff and the boys are home Monday. I am not sure what I will get done between now and then. I should of stuck with my editing work this weekend instead of nosing around on the DP. I would probably feel less disgusted. |
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bear Guest
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5/25/13 page 51 NOTE: additional change on 6/16/13 - changed word "resorted" to "reverted" I am inspired as I read Joe’s words about bear being a teacher to turn my finger and say, you, Joe, have been the teacher. I ask questions and you answer ever so generously and I will forever be in debt for the knowledge you have ever so kindly and patiently passed my way as you have had to continue to hammer home the same points over and over as my mind accepted and then resorted back to previous thought patterns.. changed punctuation and removed duplicate period I am inspired as I read Joe’s words about bear being a teacher to turn my finger and say: You, Joe, have been the teacher. I ask questions, and you answer ever so generously. I will forever be in debt for the knowledge you have ever so kindly and patiently passed my way as you have had to continue to hammer home the same points over and over as my mind accepted and then reverted back to previous thought patterns. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,I thought competition was in place in the form of dollars per hour that the student is worth based upon the type of education the student completed. At least that was the way it used to be...when my dad went to school and was able to pay his way thru school by sacking groceries. That was before a college education cost $50K a year give or take. The above words inspire me to respond with the idea of many competitive forms of competition compete with one monopoly of money form of competition. My point is that managed scarcity is in competition with abundance, and when there is managed scarcity there is, all around, evidence of managed scarcity being the condition of human life imposed upon the victims by the Legal Criminals who use the power created by the victims, power stolen by the Legal Criminals, to make power scarce for the victims, as that scarce power is abundant only for the Legal Criminals, and in such a world, where scarcity RULES, the concept of education mimics the concept of money, as the Legal Criminals make accurate information scarce, and the Legal Criminals make FALSEHOOD abundant, as the victims are set one against the other, divided, and conquered perpetually. The competitive alternative to Legal Crime, Monopoly, falsehood, threats, and violence upon the innocent, by law, is what? What would the competitive alternative to Legal Crime be, how would the alternative to Legal Crime be manifested, measured, known, seen, as power was then used to make more power, and power was then abundant, including the power of accurate knowledge? So I wrote: Suffice to say that a potentially valuable student could be connected to a potentially valuable education more regularly, more abundantly, if a mechanism was in use (competition) by which investors were fighting over each other to pay the student the most money to get the students inspired to learn by that reward for that effort. Example of investors paying the student the most money to learn something valuable to the investor include the concept of internship, apprenticeship, and in other words investing in passing on knowledge and skills to those who are then empowered to use scarce power to good use, starting out with less power in the morning, and ending up with more power at the end of the day, instead of training people to kill the targeted innocent victims before the trainee is targeted and killed by the targets. I've been currently thinking about the concept of SECRETS and it is as if there is another dragon lurking in another dark room, and on occasion I see the whole thing, in clear view, but only for a moment, and then smoke and mirrors cover it up again. I don't know if my words accomplish the goal intended. But isn't the competition supposed to be in the hand of the student, not in the hand of the employer? Isn't that what supposedly made us a free society. Everyone was able to rise to the top based upon their own hard work and labor and not being dependent or beholden to an employer to provide that opportunity? Equitable Commerce was read by me at a moment in my life when the information answered many of the questions I was currently working on at that time, as if I was playing three way chess and Mike, my cousin who is too busy these days to write here, hands me a Queen to place on the board in front of me. When social connections are equitable, instead of social connections enforced by Fraud, Threats, and Violence upon the innocent, the word competition takes on a new meaning, a meaning that is no longer fraudulent, threatening, and violent upon the innocent, for fun and profit of the few "winners", at the expense of the many "losers". Which competition are you viewing when you view competition? Are you viewing Legal Crime competition? Are you viewing Equitable Competition? Are you viewing competition as if there is no clear discrimination between Legal Crime Competition and Equitable Competition and therefore much confusion is the result of having no clear demarcation understood as to which Competition is in view by you at any given moment in time and place? Competition can be anyone, anytime, seeking to find the thoughts and actions unique to that individual, where their unique, individual, thoughts, and their unique, individual, actions are better thoughts, and better actions, compared to anyone else on the planet, because no one else thinks that way, as well, or acts that way, as well, in that time, and that place. In other words, competition can be any person finding, more efficiently, the best place they can be, at the best time they can be in that best place, because in that best place at that best time that individual is better at doing what they do best in that place at that time. In other words it is spelled out well enough in Equitable Commerce, if the reader can see what is being spelled out in Equitable Commerce, in my opinion. Since my words fall so easily on deaf ears, I am thinking that I am probably seeing nothing of value, just an old man's incapacity to know better, and a false perspective of something better. Since Stephen Pearl Andrews, and then Benjamin Tucker saw what I saw too, in Equitable Commerce, I can claim to be less alone, less misdirected, and in good company, knowing what I know to be true, but only slightly less doubtful as before finding their symbols arranged in the way they arranged their symbols, their signs on the road, offering a competitive viewpoint. I may not have answered your questions at all. Those were the days before 60% in taxes and regulations skimmed from the pockets of Americans...and before the debt clock that explifies holes in the pockets of the wage earner which will never be patched as their hard work and labor fall thru thoughs holes and into the coffers of...the slave owners. So, knowing that, how can you see any manifestations of power independence, or power abundance, in any connection between any number of people anywhere on the planet Earth, where the Legal Crime Competition has not infected that connection to a point of almost total Absolute Abject Belief in Falsehood Without Question? I have no idea if my thinking is competitive at this point, other than the aforementioned arrangements of symbols arranged by those people mentioned in that order. Josiah Warren, Stephen Pearl Andrews, and Benjamin R. Tucker. I can add such arrangers of symbols as Lysander Spooner with the qualification of having in those symbols arranged by that person no references to Equitable Commerce as I understand Equitable Commerce to be what it is when it works the way it works in human interactions. Life can be lonely, scarcity of agreement? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, do not talk to me, but I am sending this along because tomorrow is Father's Day, and you are a Father. You said this: "Since my words fall so easily on deaf ears, I am thinking that I am probably seeing nothing of value, just an old man's incapacity to know better, and a false perspective of something better." Wycliff: Proverbs 16:31 A crown of dignity is eld (age), that shall be found in the ways of rightfulness. In otherwords: It is a glory to be old when practice righteousness! Geneva: Leviticus 19:32 Thou shalt rise up before the hoary [white/aged] head, and honour the face of the old man, and fear thy God: I [am] the LORD. God has a place for old men Why? Because they have the wisdom and experience and deserve respect for the number of days they have lived on this earth. |
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 51 “2: a means of guaranteeing protection or safety”18 removed space at beginning of sentence: “2: a means of guaranteeing protection or safety”18 |
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 51 Means, a word, BEING DEFINED according to an authoritative source? Google Search for “means definition.” I find: italicized Means and Google in accordance with italics rules at the bottom of the page found at: http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/566/1/ also replaced period with comma. Means, a word, BEING DEFINED according to an authoritative source? Google Search for “means definition,” I find: |
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 51 Indented the following text to set it apart: means plural of means (Noun) Noun: 1. An action or system by which a result is brought about. 2. Money; financial resources. |
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bear Guest
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Monopoly break...2nd game this week |
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 52 Take out the word insurance and take out the word verb and in place of those words put in the definitions I found and then see how the sentence (Insurance is a verb.) becomes a clearer message. An action or system guaranteeing protection or safety. added italics and commas and indent: Take out the word insurance, and take out the word verb, and in place of those words, put in the definitions I found, and then see how the sentence (Insurance is a verb.) becomes a clearer message:
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 52 What is an action guaranteeing protection or safety; if those actions can be conveyed as one THING without having to list all the actions one at a time? Insurance. removed semicolon and added indent: What is an action guaranteeing protection or safety if those actions can be conveyed as one THING without having to list all the actions one at a time?
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 52/53 I wonder if that word “equitablist” has gained currency according to the Google measure of currency. If you remember; that word you invented did not previously exist by that same Google measure of currency. You created a new word in English, as no one other than you created that word and published it on the net. Search the Web for the word Equitablist. About 279 results (0.25 seconds) Added italics, added colon, added indents I wonder if that word equitablist has gained currency according to the Google measure of currency. If you remember; that word you invented did not previously exist by that same Google measure of currency. You created a new word in English, as no one other than you created that word and published it on the net. Search the Web for the word Equitablist:
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 53 This is a dragon you are fighting and that dragon is hinted at in the quote published by Erich Fromm on Karl Marx - if you have forgotten it I can re-publish it here. Added comma: This is a dragon you are fighting, and that dragon is hinted at in the quote published by Erich Fromm on Karl Marx - if you have forgotten it I can re-publish it here. |
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 53 No, no need to foam at the mouth, I do not support Bolshevism, but "we" (U.S.A.) did through Wall Street and the money monopoly POWER, so don't blame me for Bolshevism (communism) - please. Made into 2 sentences: No, no need to foam at the mouth. I do not support Bolshevism, but "we" (U.S.A.) did through Wall Street and the money monopoly POWER, so don't blame me for Bolshevism (communism) - please. |
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 53 Romans 12:20 "Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head." formatted as bear quote: "Romans 12:20 ‘Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.’" |
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bear Guest
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6/15/13 page 53/54 (6/16/13) added another set of parenthesis Not to be confused with actions in self-defense when natural self-defense takes over when all other options (due diligence) are no longer available because some abhorrent criminal aggressively attacks you or someone else. Leaving no options left but self-defensive actions. And even then, as I have offered to you, why can't you have a device that can immobilize, without harming anyone, other than relatively harming them in the sense that they don't get to murder and torture someone, which to them is a loss of their valuable time and energy? changed punctuation: Not to be confused with actions in self-defense (when natural self-defense takes over) when all other options (due diligence) are no longer available because some abhorrent criminal aggressively attacks you or someone else, leaving no options left but self-defensive actions. And even then, as I have offered to you, why can't you have a device that can immobilize without harming anyone (other than relatively harming them in the sense that they don't get to murder and torture someone, which to them is a loss of their valuable time and energy)? |
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bear Guest
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6/16/13 page 54 Do No Harm (including do not abandon victims to be tortured and murdered by criminals) added period Do No Harm (including do not abandon victims to be tortured and murdered by criminals). |
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bear Guest
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6/16/13 page 54 What is insurance? An action or system guaranteeing protection or safety. Added indent: What is insurance?
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bear Guest
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Off to evening church. Hope to continue editing later tonight. Have a day with the Amish tomorrow, but maybe I will be able to use my hotspot to log in, not sure if it will work there or not. We will see. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am back home and I have some chores to do and then I will try to work some. Tomorrow is an early morning so I cannot work too late tonight. I got to thinking I might sound like a dictator or a censor by saying, "Don't talk to me." I hope I did not come across that way. It was not my intention. I can talk to you, but you can't talk to me nanny nanny poo poo. |
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bear Guest
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6/16/13 page 54 What is Trial by Jury, the real thing, when it actually worked as intended, and crime was minimized, and punishments were typically simple fines charged to those found guilty of the few remaining crimes? An action or system guaranteeing protection or safety. Changed punctuation and added indent: What is Trial by Jury, the real thing, when it actually worked as intended and crime was minimized and punishments were typically simple fines charged to those found guilty of the few remaining crimes?
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bear Guest
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6/16/13 page 54 “The Biggest Game in Town.”20 removed quotes and added italics in accordance with rules http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/566/1/ The Biggest Game in Town.20 |
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bear Guest
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6/16/13 page 55 You may not want to dig too deep. There are many very sad things to witness on that path, very sad things, very destructive, demoralizing, evil things to witness, very, very, very, bad. Changed comma to colon: You may not want to dig too deep. There are many very sad things to witness on that path: very sad things, very destructive, demoralizing, evil things to witness, very, very, very, bad. |
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bear Guest
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6/16/13 page 55 Lies are lies; that is what they are, and the liars don't, by definition, believe them. But a "true believer" in lies, by definition, is a sick person who is infected with falsehood, stuck in a closed loop, supporting a FALSE GOD: a lie. Changed punctuation (probably again) Lies are lies. That is what they are. And the liars don't, by definition, believe them. But a "true believer" in lies, by definition, is a sick person who is infected with falsehood, stuck in a closed loop, supporting a FALSE GOD: a lie. |
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bear Guest
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6/16/13 page 55 This one is not so bad, compared to what is being done to babies, toddlers, children, expectant mothers, but this link I will ask you to look at, is bad enough: The U.S.S. Liberty Murders21 Changed Punctuation and italicized ship name: This one is not so bad compared to what is being done to babies, toddlers, children, and expectant mothers, but this link I will ask you to look at is bad enough: The U.S.S. Liberty Murders21 |
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bear Guest
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6/16/13 page 55/56 I've told you the routine, it is not new. I found an example of the routine, reported in that link, on the U.S.S. Liberty. I found another example of the same routine in an old book titled “The Lost State of Franklin” where Legal Criminals solve the "Indian Problem" on the frontier with the same "Final Solution" used so often by Legal Criminals. In this example the Legal Criminals hire very evil people to dress up as "Indians" to slaughter Settlers: babies, pregnant mothers, toddlers, the more evil the better, and then blame the "Indians." They spread hatred into the Settlers so as to justify slaughtering the "Indians," who happen to be occupying that “Promised Land" (Later to become Kentucky) which is rich land, good land, abundant land, but occupied by that "problem." Which is the same routine problem, over, and over, and over, and over again, where there are PEOPLE already on that "Promised Land" that Legal Criminals promise to themselves for their own exploitation USING their duped subjects that are subjected to the lies, threats, and violence of those same Legal Criminals doing the same old things that work time and again, over, and over, and over, again, and again, like a broken record, or like a Business Psycho. Changed punctuation and added italics: I've told you the routine. It is not new. I found an example of the routine, reported in that link on the U.S.S. Liberty. I found another example of the same routine in an old book titled The Lost State of Franklin where Legal Criminals solve the "Indian Problem" on the frontier with the same "Final Solution" used so often by Legal Criminals. In this example, the Legal Criminals hired very evil people to dress up as "Indians" to slaughter Settlers including babies, pregnant mothers, and toddlers. The more evil the better, and then blamed “the Indians.” Spreading hatred into the Settlers so as to justify slaughtering “the Indians,” who happen to be occupying that “Promised Land” (later to become Kentucky) which is rich land, good land, abundant land, but occupied by that "problem." Which is the same routine problem, over, and over, and over, and over again, where there are PEOPLE already on that "Promised Land" that Legal Criminals promise to themselves for their own exploitation USING their duped subjects that are subjected to the lies, threats, and violence of those same Legal Criminals doing the same old things that work time and again, over, and over, and over again, and again: like a broken record or like a Business Psycho. |
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bear Guest
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6/17/13 page 56 I think I do in a competitive, dynamic sense, and it is more than "just" about money, but money is the connecting medium. So take that power back from them: Friends of Liberty taking back the power of their own, honest, accurate, productive, POWERFUL, money, from the criminals, the psychopaths, the sociopaths, the immoral evil non-human beings, the pathological liars, take it back peacefully, competitively, by making better money. And they, the Legal Criminals, simply go out of business. Even the "true believers," the minions, the subjects, take back the power of honest, accurate, communication, and the Legal Crime power is rendered power-less because no one can afford lies that no longer work. Changed punctuation for readability and added italics: I think I do in a competitive, dynamic sense. It is more than "just" about money, but money is the connecting medium. So take that power back from them: Friends of Liberty taking back the power of their own honest, accurate, productive, POWERFUL money from the criminals…the psychopaths…the sociopaths…the immoral, evil, non-human beings…the pathological liars. Take it back, peacefully, competitively, by making better money. And they, the Legal Criminals, simply go out of business. Even the "true believers," the minions, the subjects take back the power of honest, accurate, communication, and the Legal Crime power is rendered power-less because no one can afford lies that no longer work. |
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bear Guest
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6/17/13 page 56 "There was a war in 1967 where a lot of nations came against Israel and Israel won and won ground." ummm, this sounded like a 5th grader wrote it so i tried to rewrite to make bear sound a little more intelligent, at least like an 8th grader "There was a war in 1967 when several nations fought against Israel. Israel won and won ground." |
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bear Guest
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6/17/13 per this rule: Italicize foreign words. http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/566/1/ I have italicized cui bono on the following pages: ix, 25, 52, 58 |
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bear Guest
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JOE, I need some help on page 57. The sentence currently reads: You are led to believe that Zionists, the actual PEOPLE, the people running the criminal government, were not provoking the war, deliberately. I am specifically asking about the word deliberately. It is interesting the way it appears at the end of the sentence because the sentence can mean multiple things: 1. You are deliberately led to believe that Zionists, the actual PEOPLE, the people running the criminal government, were not provoking the war. or 2. You are led to believe that Zionists, the actual PEOPLE, the people running the criminal government, were not deliberately provoking the war. or 3. You are deliberately led to believe that Zionists, the actual PEOPLE, the people running the criminal government, were not deliberately provoking the war. I am thinking if you meant either 1 or 2 that I should move the word deliberately to the appropriate spot. If however, your intent was number 3 we could leave deliberately where it is at the end of the sentence, but folks may or may not pick up on the intention. |
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bear Guest
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6/17/13 page 56 The familiar story is that the aggressor, seeking to gain land promised to themselves, create a false flag event where the aggressors dress up as their victims. They slaughter people, such as the people on the U.S.S. Liberty. Blame that on their victims so as to "justify" the taking of "The Promised Land" from the native population who are already existing on that "Promised Land." Added "s" to the first aggressors. Added italics and changed wording last phrase: The familiar story is that the aggressors, seeking to gain land promised to themselves, create a false flag event where the aggressors dress up as their victims. They slaughter people, such as the people on the U.S.S. Liberty, and blame that on their victims so as to "justify" the taking of "The Promised Land" from the native population who already exist on that "Promised Land." |
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bear Guest
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6/17/13 page 56 It can get complicated, of course, and so then you need to have an official member of the defending nation to explain the justifications for these things, of course, and what happens in the unfortunate event when the targeted victims win? Split into 2 sentences and removed extraneous "and" & "to": It can get complicated, of course, so then you need to have an official member of the defending nation explain the justifications for these things, of course. And what happens in the unfortunate event when the targeted victims win? |
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bear Guest
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6/17/13 page 56 If the good guys won the 6 day war as History tells "us," Capitalized and hyphenated 6-Day War: If the good guys won the 6-Day War as History tells "us," |
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bear Guest
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6/17/13 page 56 Places with people already occupying the land promised to whom by whom? Added quotation marks for ironic emphasis: Places with people already occupying the land promised to “whom" by “whom”? |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 58 "The point is getting across. Person A doesn’t skip out on rent." added hyphen: "The point is getting across. Person A doesn’t skip-out on rent." |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 58 The World Reserve Currency POWER, having been a huge criminal process of taking power from other people and having that power benefit those people who FINANCE that power, is "skipping out on rent." And the records can show that without any room for doubt, all meticulously recording in documented fact. added hyphen to skip-out and changed recording to recorded: The World Reserve Currency POWER, having been a huge criminal process of taking power from other people and having that power benefit those people who FINANCE that power, is "skipping-out on rent." And the records can show that without any room for doubt, all meticulously recorded in documented fact. |
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bear Guest
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JOE, I NEED HELP. I DON'T THINK THIS SENTENCE MAKES SENSE, But I think I understand the intent so I moved the words around a little bit. CAN YOU PLEASE LOOK AT THE FINAL SENTANCE BELOW TO SEE IF IT IS CORRECT? 6/18/13 page 58 A victim of this big lie, this Dollar Hegemony, the new Caesar, with "that which is Caesar's," moves power inequitably from the victims to the criminals. changed to: A VICTIM of this big lie (this Dollar Hegemony) is ONE WHO HAS "that which is Caesar's," as the new Caesar moves power inequitably from the victims to the criminals. |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 58 In a relative sense, and I can illustrate this sense better, more accurately, those who "own" or "control" the Monopoly Power benefit by having that control. changed comma to colon: In a relative sense, and I can illustrate this sense better, more accurately: those who "own" or "control" the Monopoly Power benefit by having that control. |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 58 The Criminals who co-op the home field victims, or subjects, duping them into cooperating do so by "spreading the wealth" during the BOOM part of the Business Psycho. And during that time, in that sense, those who benefit are skipping out on the rent, or in other words, getting something for nothing, and in other words receiving stolen goods, and in other words getting a piece of the action, and in other words aiding and abetting criminals, and in other words profiting from aggressive wars for profit, and in other words: evil. changed punctuation for readability: The Criminals who co-op the home field victims, or subjects, duping them into cooperating, do so by "spreading the wealth" during the BOOM part of the Business Psycho. And during that time, in that sense, those who benefit are skipping-out on the rent. In other words: getting something for nothing; and in other words: receiving stolen goods; and in other words: getting a piece of the action; and in other words: aiding and abetting criminals; and in other words: profiting from aggressive wars for profit; and in other words: evil. |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 58/59 Acknowledging the facts could turn someone around and instead of ignorantly supporting those crimes with material support in the form of earnings (surplus wealth or Power to Purchase) the person acknowledges that support flowing in that way. And instead of doing nothing to stop that power flowing that way, the then aware person having acknowledged the facts, can begin to work to stop supporting those crimes in those ways. Broke into another separate sentence and added italics: Acknowledging the facts could turn someone around. And instead of ignorantly supporting those crimes with material support in the form of earnings (surplus wealth or Power to Purchase), the person acknowledges that support flowing in that way. And instead of doing nothing to stop that power flowing that way, the then aware person, having acknowledged the facts, can begin to work to stop supporting those crimes in those ways. |
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bear Guest
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JOE, NOT SURE HOW THIS SENTENCE SHOULD READ 6/18/13 page 59 says: Progress toward war is carefully monitored, well documented, FACT. Should it be: Progress toward war is a carefully monitored, well documented FACT. or Progress toward war is carefully monitored, a well documented FACT. |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 60 "Skipping out on Monopoly Game rent:" removed bear font and quote marks as the line seems to more yours than mine. Also added hyphen: Skipping-out on Monopoly Game rent: |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 60 When China has the World Reserve Currency POWER, no longer U.S.A. Inc. (LLC), added comma: When China has the World Reserve Currency POWER, no longer U.S.A., Inc. (LLC), |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 60 If that is not easy to see, for anyone else, so be it, and I can be wrong, but those are well documented facts to be known, or not known. Simple math, simple stuff, easy to know stuff, a third grader can know this stuff. So what is the problem? added hyphens: easy-to-know stuff |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 60 "Person A doesn’t skip out on rent." added hyphen: "Person A doesn’t skip-out on rent." |
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bear Guest
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6/18/13 page 60 In a specific sense, so far, Person A doesn't skip out on rent. A factual statement, so far. changed punctuation (again): In a specific sense, so far Person A doesn't skip out on rent: a factual statement, so far. |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 60 If that exchange, documented fact, could be known precisely, exactly, each step of the way. If such an understanding, precise, accurate, knowledge, the entire transaction, could be accountable as an inequitable transaction, whereby Person A "made a killing" at the expense of another person living in China. Perhaps a person his same age, but a person who for now, is on the wrong end of the Legal Money Monopoly World Reserve Currency POWER stick: there is accurate judgment in that case. changed punctuation and added the words that (first line) & then (last line) for readability: If that exchange, that documented fact, could be known precisely, exactly, each step of the way; if such an understanding (precise, accurate knowledge, the entire transaction) could be accountable as an inequitable transaction whereby Person A "made a killing" at the expense of another person living in China (perhaps a person the same age, a person who for now is on the wrong end of the Legal Money Monopoly World Reserve Currency POWER stick); then there is accurate judgment in that case. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Questions in editing? |
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bear Guest
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JOE, Yes, could you please look back at page 13 of this string and the questions I have are addressed to you with your name, Joe, and are in bold. There are a couple of them. Thanks! (I also talked to you on page 12, called you Joe, but didn't put it in bold. It was not a question though, it was a comment.) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hUy9ePyo6Q is deafening, and I can hardly stand it. OK I am back to bookwork for some time this afternoon. I have spent the morning in the yard and it was wonderful! I love flowers and spring in Missouri is nice. We have 4 distinct seasons here. Winter is hard on me though. I suffer emotionally. I think it is a lack of light. I hate the cold and I don't want to go outside AT ALL. Texas was Summer and Winter (Spring and Fall only lasted a week or two and winter was mild - rarely below freezing). I should name my Diary: Joe. I don't have a diary though. Thank you for your upcoming help. ... |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 61 It is exactly what Caesar says it is today and it can be exactly what Caesar says it is tomorrow, and tomorrow it might be opposite what it is today. added comma and of: It is exactly what Caesar says it is today, and it can be exactly what Caesar says it is tomorrow, and tomorrow it might be opposite of what it is today. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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My opinion:I am thinking if you meant either 1 or 2 that I should move the word deliberately to the appropriate spot. If however, your intent was number 3 we could leave deliberately where it is at the end of the sentence, but folks may or may not pick up on the intention. If there is a case where the writer prefers that the reader is beset with work to do in order to understand the writing, then this is that case. I prefer that the reader be left with some work to do, so my opinion is to leave it as written in this case. In this case I don't think that the reader is beset with too much work to do while reading. A victim of this big lie, this Dollar Hegemony, the new Caesar, with "that which is Caesar's," moves power inequitably from the victims to the criminals. That is an obvious improvement in communicating the intended message, thanks. Progress toward war is carefully monitored, well documented, FACT. I tried to say: Progress toward war is carefully monitored, accurately measured, meticulously documented, and factual. The second sentence is the most accurate improvement of the message intended. If that exchange, documented fact, could be known precisely, exactly, each step of the way. If such an understanding, precise, accurate knowledge, the entire transaction, could be accountable as an inequitable transaction whereby Person A "made a killing" at the expense of another person living in China (perhaps a person his same age, a person who for now is on the wrong end of the Legal Money Monopoly World Reserve Currency POWER stick): there is accurate judgment in that case. How about this: If that specific exchange could be known precisely as a documented fact, exactly each step of the way, completely understood from every conceivable angle, including Person A having "made a killing" at the expense of another person in China, then is there accurate judgment in that case, and could that case be measured as an equitable transaction, or is it by that measure another case of iniquity? The Chinese labor force is (temporarily) on the wrong end of the Legal Money Monopoly World Reserve Currency POWER stick. National Interest anyone? bear, My wife stumbled upon a book during some cleaning, where the book was written by my friend's father who was a veteran of World War II, and if you think it is worth publishing that book, with some edit work on your part, then on your say so I will try to reconnect with my friend and ask for permission to move that book into the current stream. I saw the pile of papers and considered the viability of turning that pile of papers into a book for sale, proceeds, if any, going to the publisher and the writers son, so I'm asking my favorite publisher if she is interested in more work that may not pay well. |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 61 Words spoken during well-earned good life, not necessarily a challenge of principles, and far from judgment day at the end of a human life in living form, sure, I get that. But we two are hunting dragons, and so for my part I am working an angle that has to do with false connections from which we all might want to disconnect, if we can figure out ways to do so without harming anyone. modified and punctuated for readability: Not necessarily a challenge of principles and far from judgment day at the end of a human life in living form, but words spoken during a well-earned, good life. Sure, I get that. But we two are hunting dragons, and so for my part, I am working an angle that has to do with false connections from which we all might want to disconnect, if we can figure out ways to do so without harming anyone. |
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bear Guest
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Joe OK, will leave as is: If there is a case where the writer prefers that the reader is beset with work to do in order to understand the writing, then this is that case. I prefer that the reader be left with some work to do, so my opinion is to leave it as written in this case. ----------------------------------------- I might like this sentence that you have created to replace the sentence we are discussing, what do you think? I tried to say: Progress toward war is carefully monitored, accurately measured, meticulously documented, and factual. in stead of: Progress toward war is carefully monitored, a well documented FACT. --------------------------------- On this new sentence you have written, I had been working while you were working and am not sure if you saw what I had finished with. Old sentence: If that exchange, documented fact, could be known precisely, exactly, each step of the way. If such an understanding, precise, accurate knowledge, the entire transaction, could be accountable as an inequitable transaction whereby Person A "made a killing" at the expense of another person living in China (perhaps a person his same age, a person who for now is on the wrong end of the Legal Money Monopoly World Reserve Currency POWER stick): there is accurate judgment in that case. Your new sentence: If that specific exchange could be known precisely as a documented fact, exactly each step of the way, completely understood from every conceivable angle, including Person A having "made a killing" at the expense of another person in China, then is there accurate judgment in that case, and could that case be measured as an equitable transaction, or is it by that measure another case of iniquity? The Chinese labor force is (temporarily) on the wrong end of the Legal Money Monopoly World Reserve Currency POWER stick. National Interest anyone? and this is what I had come up with before seeing your new sentence: If that exchange, that documented fact, could be known precisely, exactly, each step of the way; if such an understanding (precise, accurate knowledge, the entire transaction) could be accountable as an inequitable transaction whereby Person A "made a killing" at the expense of another person living in China (perhaps a person the same age, a person who for now is on the wrong end of the Legal Money Monopoly World Reserve Currency POWER stick); then there is accurate judgment in that case. So, let me know what you like better and I will incorporate accordingly ----------------------------------- bear, Yes, I'd be happy to work with you on this effort. Pay or no pay, and I'd certainly want you to be paid as you are...the middle man...but will also be doing the actual work with the printer, right? Do you need help typing the pages? I will count on you to help me with priorities. |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 61 And if the loop closes, if the lie infects the individual, the dragon is inside, the Trojan horse is inside, and almost all hope may be lost at that point because the individual may have to depend upon something outside for help in defeating that dragon, exposing the closed loop, and returning POWER to know better back to the individual. broke into 2 sentences and added the word "then" and removed the word "And": And if the loop closes, if the lie infects the individual, then the dragon is inside, the Trojan horse is inside. Almost all hope may be lost at that point because the individual may have to depend upon something outside for help in defeating that dragon, exposing the closed loop, and returning POWER to know better back to the individual. |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 61 The capacity for self-doubt may be a required power, if the idea is to have the capacity to know better? removed comma: The capacity for self-doubt may be a required power if the idea is to have the capacity to know better? |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 61 So there has to be a balance between self-doubt, and determined effort. removed comma: So there has to be a balance between self-doubt and determined effort. |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 62 What about the power of lies: who is responsible? Made into 2 sentences: What about the power of lies? Who is responsible? |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 62 The believer in the lie (not the liar, since the liar knows it is a lie) is responsible for whatever the "true believer" in the lie does as an individual. No different than a wild animal, lacking human reason, human conscience, human moral judgment, or "Common Sense.” So not coincidentally, much human effort including human spirituality is focused on accurate identification of facts so as to avoid injury by falsehood. Well, I decided to join one the middle sentence back with the 1st sentence like you originally wrote it. Removed the comma between animal and lacking. Added back commas off-setting "including human spirit" like you originally wrote it: The believer in the lie (not the liar, since the liar knows it is a lie) is responsible for whatever the "true believer" in the lie does as an individual, no different than a wild animal lacking human reason, human conscience, human moral judgment, or "Common Sense.” So not coincidentally, much human effort, including human spirituality, is focused on accurate identification of facts so as to avoid injury by falsehood. |
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bear Guest
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JOE, I am wondering if the end date of 2012 looks OK to you. I am asking because it is now 2013. What happens when someone reads this book in 2020 and nothing has changed? Anyways, just a thought that ran thru my mind that I though I would run thru yours 6/19/13 page 62 U.S.A. Inc. (LLC) (1788 to 2012) added comma: U.S.A., Inc. (LLC) (1788 to 2012) |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 62 and through my Product 1 and Product 2 illustration my intention is to communicate my current understanding of banking mortgages. added comma between illustration and my: and through my Product 1 and Product 2 illustration, my intention is to communicate my current understanding of banking mortgages. |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 62/63 That is the point of the challenge being offered to you, where you play the part of a customer, and then you play the part of a saleswoman, in a play acting, text version, of a Product 1 and Product 2 sale event at a new Legal Bank where equitablists have taken over America. changed punctuation: That is the point of the challenge being offered to you: where you play the part of a customer, and then you play the part of a saleswoman in a play acting, text version of a Product 1 and Product 2 sale event at a new Legal Bank where equitablists have taken over America. |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 63 If you have not read one of my sales pitch illustrations then you can read the one started in this thread between a fictitious John the customer, and Jane the salesperson. Added comma between illustrations and then. Removed word "a" and removed comma between customer & and: If you have not read one of my sales pitch illustrations, then you can read the one started in this thread between fictitious John the customer and Jane the salesperson. |
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bear Guest
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6/19/13 page 63 The idea is to covey what I have learned up to this date, and to do so intact without any miscommunication. And the idea further involves a promise of improvement as my own limited perspective can be sharpened by competitive, side-by-side, comparison with your perspective, as you play act either side in the Chess Match constructed in that way, where two people work out a banking transaction at a Legal Equitablist Bank. Changed covey to convey. changed punctuation and removed the word "and" at the beginning of 2nd sentence. The idea is to convey what I have learned up to this date and to do so intact without any miscommunication. The idea further involves a promise of improvement as my own limited perspective can be sharpened by competitive, side-by-side comparison with your perspective as you play act either side in the Chess Match constructed in that way where two people work out a banking transaction at a Legal Equitablist Bank. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,I might like this sentence that you have created to replace the sentence we are discussing, what do you think? Agreed on the change. So, let me know what you like better and I will incorporate accordingly The sentence you invented flows very well so it is easier to read and therefore better by that measure, in my opinion, so use your sentence please. Yes, I'd be happy to work with you on this effort. Pay or no pay, and I'd certainly want you to be paid as you are...the middle man...but will also be doing the actual work with the printer, right? Do you need help typing the pages? OK, I have lost touch with Dan Slockett who is the son of the author, so I have to find him and ask him first. The book is an important, honest, account of what happened when thousands of airplanes full of bombs were sent over Germany to destroy so much, for reasons that were as false as any reason ever told for war. Those who fight the wars pay the costs, while those who lie do so for obvious reasons. Dan's dad was a tail gunner in a B-17 bomber. The odds of survival for those people in those planes were low, not as low as the people who have those bombs falling on their heads, but the point of the book is honest records of what a human being thinks and feels in such times and places. If no one ever hears the words spoken by the survivors then the option to listen to those words is no longer an option. JOE, I am wondering if the end date of 2012 looks OK to you. I think it is OK to leave it as it is, and it is just as OK to change it to 2013, or there may be another option such as the "the present" or some such open ended date. What do you think about "the present," or words of similar meaning? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, What do you think about "the present," or words of similar meaning? I thought about that word too. But what if someone is reading this book and things are no longer as they are today or were in 1788? What if someone is reading this book and it is a time of equity? I think that is what bothered me. To say 1799 to 2012, 2013, or to present could all be wrong in their own way. We don't know what the future holds, but we know that things have not changed so far. I think what I am trying to say is: Would it give the reader a false hope if they see the date 2012 (or 2013, etc.) and they say, well this is 2020, so I am OK (when the facts may be that things are as they were in 2012). Or if they read the words to present, and things are no longer as they are, then that statement wouldn't be true. Do you see what I am saying? Or is this a case of a perfectionist getting "wrapped around the axel"? ------------------- The book sounds very interesting. I hope you are able to contact the son. It is wonderful that you have his father's words documented. That WWII generation is about gone. It is strange to me to see Vietnam guys with grey heads...they should be young as I remembered them. |
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bear Guest
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6/20/13 page 63 "So Joe, the way I am seeing this is that you have been handing me puzzle pieces and I am finally able to identify them and put some together, but somehow, there is a foundation that I fail to apply those pieces upon…like competition...and more recently holding "things" responsible. I think I even wrote about competition in my gushing thank you. But somehow I have all of these truths; but am not using them together." modified punctuation/words for readability: "So Joe, the way I am seeing this is that you have been handing me puzzle pieces, and I am finally able to identify them and put some together. But somehow, there is a foundation that I fail to apply those pieces upon…like competition...and more recently holding "things" responsible. I think I even wrote about competition in my gushing thank you. Somehow I have all of these truths, but am not using them together." |
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bear Guest
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6/20/13 page 63 OK, my view on that: well, life is short, and you can't expect to make short cuts, and you are not a teenager with teenager capacity to learn new things, and life is short, and you have responsibilities of parenting. Very high priority stuff, so forget about reaching ahead too far all at once. And in my opinion, you can step back, see how the new keys work, apply the Boyd strategy to many things; Observe, Orient, Decide, and Act, and digest, and process, and above all it seems to me, maintain that balance, that "pursuit of happiness" in this "animated contest of freedom" while it exists as it exists. And to me, what you will find is improvement because you find ways to improve, and you no longer settle for less. Even if external things are overwhelming, at the very least, you find how to slow down the injury which is a relative improvement. And YOU control that which is in your power to control because you are now, at least, taking on those responsibilities; those responses that you are able to act out in fact. modified punctuation for readability and emphasis. OK, my view on that: Well, life is short, and you can't expect to make short cuts, and you are not a teenager with teenager capacity to learn new things - and life is short - and you have responsibilities of parenting - very high priority stuff. So forget about reaching ahead too far all at once. And in my opinion, you can step-back, see how the new keys work. Apply the Boyd strategy to many things: Observe, Orient, Decide, and Act, and digest, and process, and above all, it seems to me, maintain that balance, that "pursuit of happiness" in this "animated contest of freedom" while it exists as it exists. And to me, what you will find is improvement because you find ways to improve, and you no longer settle for less. Even if external things are overwhelming, at the very least, you find how to slow down the injury which is a relative improvement. And YOU control that which is in your power to control because you are now, at least, taking on those responsibilities, those responses that you are able to act out in fact. |
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bear Guest
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6/20/13 page 63/64 The "big picture" is built up over time as all the little pictures work out over and over again and again in similar ways. This lie, you see, does that, you see. This fact, you see, works this way, you see. I'm telling you, it becomes very simple over time. You begin to see patterns, like learning how music works. You begin to see, oh yeah, that works that way. You see as I am now seeing with your help, that this "big picture" stuff is all well documented in scripture. It is the same stuff, lies are bad. OK, common sense stuff. Liars injure people. Wow! Who would have thought such things! ...on and on… Modified punctuation (again) for readability...I find myself correcting my corrections... The "big picture" is built up over time as all the little pictures work out over and over, again and again, in similar ways. This lie, you see, does that, you see. This fact, you see, works this way, you see. I'm telling you, it becomes very simple over time. You begin to see patterns…like learning how music works. You begin to see, oh yeah, that works that way. You see, as I am now seeing with your help, that this "big picture" stuff is all well documented in scripture. It is the same stuff: lies are bad. OK, common sense stuff: liars injure people. Wow! Who would have thought such things! ...on and on… |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am having this thought once again, and need your help I would like to capitalize the first letter of scripture = Scripture. But when that word appears in your words and I do not want to change the way you think about or say things. Some people, I think purposefully (not so much out of ignorance), but to make a point, type Bible as bible without capitalizing the first letter so as it lower that book to be less than what it is. I do not think you do that with the word scripture, but you type it starting iwth a lower case letter. I am used to seeing scripture written as Scripture. Just like God is God, not god. Just tell me either way, and I will change or not change accordingly that word when it appears in your words. |
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bear Guest
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6/20/13 page 64 Other people are infected. They need help. Your initial response may be to defend against them, but that does not help anyone, so what happens? You learn? Broke into an additional sentence: Other people are infected. They need help. Your initial response may be to defend against them, but that does not help anyone. So what happens? You learn? |
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bear Guest
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6/20/13 page 64 So...discussion is a two-way, equitable, street, or path. removed 2 commas per this rule: http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/607/1/ 6. Use commas to separate two or more coordinate adjectives that describe the same noun. Be sure never to add an extra comma between the final adjective and the noun itself or to use commas with non-coordinate adjective. So...discussion is a two-way, equitable street or path. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,Joe, I am having this thought once again, and need your help Please capitalize Scripture, my mistake. Do you see what I am saying? Or is this a case of a perfectionist getting "wrapped around the axel"? 1788 to Liberty Day, not yet realized at the time this book is written. ? The book sounds very interesting. I hope you are able to contact the son. It is wonderful that you have his father's words documented. That WWII generation is about gone. It is strange to me to see Vietnam guys with grey heads...they should be young as I remembered them. I found his name linked to Linkedin, but that program asks for the e-mail address, which I don't remember. I can look for a return address on the book he sent. Found Dan on Facebook and sent him a note. Yes, the young have grown old, and much of what they have learned is not recognized as being valuable, for some strange reason. |
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bear Guest
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6/20/13 page 65 What if a competitor was allowed to pay you to borrow money because your use of the money was worth the risk according to the competitor since the competitor benefits indirectly by your industrious use of the power to purchase loaned to you? added a comma set and hyphens for readability: What if a competitor was allowed to pay you to borrow money because your use of the money was worth the risk, according to the competitor, since the competitor benefits indirectly by your industrious use of the power-to-purchase loaned to you? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, OK, will do. Please capitalize Scripture ------------------------ Nice! I like it! 1788 to Liberty Day, not yet realized at the time this book is written. ------------------------ I am glad you found Dan! Yes, the young have grown old, and much of what they have learned is not recognized as being valuable, for some strange reason. Perhaps...it is because they have been demonized, in the case of the Vietnam Vets, and in the case of the WWII Vets...they did the patriotic thing to do, so one would NOT dare bring up something to negate that "patriotic" thing to do? Now bear has gone from bookwork to discussion. Shame, shame on bear. I am taking a Amitriptylin at Nite and it has done wonders for my focus, my ability to think, my organizational skills, and most of all my energy level. Hurray! |
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bear Guest
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6/21/13 page 65 2. Victims of lies: where these victims don't know that the lies are lies, but the lies are believed and employed. removed colon: 2. Victims of lies where these victims don't know that the lies are lies, but the lies are believed and employed. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,I am taking a Amitriptylin at Nite and it has done wonders for my focus, my ability to think, my organizational skills, and most of all my energy level. Hurray! A personal story I know about involves yet another family helped greatly with the use (not abuse) of drugs whereby the child grew up miserably, dealing with behavior that was costing the child and the parents much trouble, finally at the age when the child was resorting to violence something was done, now the child is very helpful, very easy to communicate with, a joy to be around, funny, witty, and the parents have a new world to enjoy, having left behind the hell on earth. I elaborated some. Question authority, but get back to work! |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Work you say? I have been working all day picking and pitting cheeries. Now I am finally done and exhausted but am going to do some bookwork as I relieve my aching back. Thanks for sharing the story. Oh, and the Sherrifs are about town looking for a guy in a red stocking cap...even asked my boys best buds if they had seen him. Got a call from the Death March widow...so I had to make multiple calls so I could tell her what was going on. She is a mite afraid and I am afraid she has passed her fear to me so I have double checked to make sure the doors are locked. It seems there are a few guys in their 20's walking around town as of late that are unknown by the locals. Our population is around 600 sew, I mean so, "strangers" are noticed. I'm not really afraid, but I did check the locks and warned the boys...life in a small town...I am 7 blocks away from the action and have been minding my own business, but I am in the know now that there is not much to know except they are looking for a guy in a red stocking cap...Santa Claus? |
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bear Guest
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6/21/13 page 65 3. Equitablists, or Friends of Liberty, and God's Children, and whoever else who are moral people, who do not use, and who are not subject to lies, threats, and violence as a means of gaining power from the targeted and innocent victims. Removed comma between use & and 3. Equitablists, or Friends of Liberty, and God's Children, and whoever else who are moral people, who do not use and who are not subject to lies, threats, and violence as a means of gaining power from the targeted and innocent victims. |
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bear Guest
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6/21/13 page 66 I'm not saying everyone is either/or 1,2,3, and nothing else, I'm saying that two goals, generally, are accomplished by people as they step into those roles listed above. replaced commas with periods after numbers and made into 2 sentences, and added colon at end: I'm not saying everyone is either/or 1. 2. 3. and nothing else. I'm saying that two goals, generally, are accomplished by people as they step into those roles listed above: |
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bear Guest
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6/21/13 page 66 1. Productive and Life Sustaining Use scarce power to make power abundant. 2. Destructive and Life Ending Use scarce power to take power from other people and use the stolen power to steal more. Added indentation (also ended definition, but was unable to figure code to show it here):
Use scarce power to make power abundant. 2. Destructive and Life Ending Use scarce power to take power from other people and use the stolen power to steal more. |
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bear Guest
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6/21/13 page 66 If you premeditate a lie knowing it is a lie, or if you employ a lie but are a "true believer" in the lie, if you commit crimes (lies, threats, violence upon the innocent), if you are a criminal in FACT, then you destroy life, in FACT, and there are easy, accurate, undeniable methods by which those FACTS can be measured as the bodies pile up, for one example: mass murder (aggressive war). Modified for readability: If you premeditate a lie knowing it is a lie; if you employ a lie but are a "true believer" in the lie; if you commit crimes (lies, threats, violence upon the innocent); if you are a criminal, in FACT; then you destroy life, in FACT. There are easy, accurate, undeniable methods by which those FACTS can be measured as the bodies pile up. For one example: mass murder (aggressive war). |
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bear Guest
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oh, how I want to discuss this concept, that which I just worked on above:If you premeditate a lie knowing it is a lie; if you employ a lie but are a "true believer" in the lie; if you commit crimes (lies, threats, violence upon the innocent); if you are a criminal, in FACT; then you destroy life, in FACT. There are easy, accurate, undeniable methods by which those FACTS can be measured as the bodies pile up. For one example: mass murder (aggressive war). Thinking about O'Connor and that concept of Criminals and that concept that the greatest Criminal is Lucifer who stole God's creation...can the innocent victims make a contract or a truce with criminals? Will Criminals abide by their contract? Or will Criminals resort to lies, threats and violence upon the innocent...even when there is a contract or truce in effect...or will Criminals always go the way of entropy disolving any possibility of ectropy? Is it wise to make a truce with a Criminal (Human) or with the Devil (Spirit)? Now Joe, I toss that out for you to mull over because the thought has crossed the bear mind. I listened to Cooper here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKpxIjZ6m48&list=PL11E33A6AEEB2674F and the episode above as I pitted Cherries. The discussion involved the occult side of the Rise of Hitler. I don't know if Sutton discussed that or just the Walstreet side. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I stumbled on another competitive example of someone inventing, or reinventing, ways to fight against Legal Crime. More and more I'm finding the English words being used by people in the fight moving toward Legal Crime. The criminals have taken over. Not a sound bite There is information in that video presentation that is the building blocks of something I call Despotism insurance. If you find the time to look at it you will probably recognize the concepts I've already spelled out in the illustration of the Defensive Weapon Story concerning a stun gun that records any event of using the stun gun and at the time of the event the video camera uploads the event onto the World Wide Web in real time. Of course the "police" have their dash cameras installed and in use for awhile now, but again of course those records of events are then lost, or the camera was broke, or the sun was in my eyes, or for some other reason the inculpatory evidence "disappeared". Not all cops are bad, not all soldiers are bad, not all lawyers are bad, not all judges are bad, but non-union jurors, being somewhat based upon sortition, are not by necessity on the same team reaching for the same goal as the Union Cops, Union Soldiers, Union Lawyers, and Union Judges who are paid employes of either The Devil Worshipers Union, The New World Order Money Monopoly Union, or whatever false front works best to hide the actual inculpatory facts that accurately identify the actual evil people making might right, or making their one legal money make money for them, or doing onto others before others can do onto them, or those specific people inventing producing, and maintaining Legal Crime. |
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bear Guest
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6/21/13 page 66 Two other points: 1. Do not abandon victims to be further victimized by criminals. 2. Do not punish innocent people because that is, in FACT, crime. Changed "other" to "more" and indented: Two more points:
2. Do not punish innocent people because that is, in FACT, crime. |
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bear Guest
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6/21/13 page 66 The Big Picture is elusive. And there are a whole lot of people who are either willfully perpetrating crimes or are following criminal orders without question. Rejoined these 2 sentences back together: The Big Picture is elusive, and there are a whole lot of people who are either willfully perpetrating crimes or are following criminal orders without question. |
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bear Guest
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6/21/13 page 11 Proverbs 8:13 “The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the forward mouth, do I hate. was looking for something else and noticed that ending quotation mark is missing so I added it. Hopefully I haven't missed too much in editing... Proverbs 8:13 “The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the forward mouth, do I hate." |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,Hopefully I haven't missed too much in editing... I can go through it again but I won't be doing any major improvements to the structure as you are now doing. The prototype run can work as a method of gaining additional editors, and the prototype run can work as a marketing device. I am speaking with Dan Slockett now on his Father's book. I can keep you posted. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, "Thinking about O'Connor and that concept of Criminals and that concept that the greatest Criminal is Lucifer who stole God's creation...can the innocent victims make a contract or a truce with criminals? Will Criminals abide by their contract? Or will Criminals resort to lies, threats and violence upon the innocent...even when there is a contract or truce in effect...or will Criminals always go the way of entropy disolving any possibility of ectropy?" Frank is more the pacifist, and so what does a pacifist do when facing a criminal, turn the other cheek? I don't know. I don't believe in Frank anymore than I believe in any other human being. I do know that the creator exists, that is merely common sense to me to know such things. Now there is a part in the video I have just found that helps with the concept of someone (not you, definitely not you) claiming that the proof of the question I ask concerning "What if the Devil wrote the Bible" is in The Bible, or it says so in The Bible that the Devil did not write The Bible, is explained in those words offered by the speaker here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=B3nok7Cby28 I urge you to stop book work long enough to listen (not just hear) those words in that report, and I urge you to do so for many reasons, including the reason of having an explanation as to why the proof of something isn't the written word claiming to be the proof of something. The written words are merely proof that words are written. Meaning, on the other hand, can be derived accurately, conveyed accurately, or not, from words, and my illustration of a road sign on a blind hill before a bridge intends to convey such an accurate message as the one intended here specifically. You are the judge as to what you will do with your time, as it must be, in any case other than Absolute Abject Belief in Falsehood Without Question, which is not me intending to say that I know anything, at all, about any Spiritual Connection with Jesus. I don't know about such things that I don't know about, so I have no power to comment on that, but as to other measurable things, I have my angles of view. |
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bear Guest
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Joe.Now there is a part in the video I have just found that helps with the concept of someone (not you, definitely not you) claiming that the proof of the question I ask concerning "What if the Devil wrote the Bible" is in The Bible, or it says so in The Bible that the Devil did not write The Bible, is explained in those words offered by the speaker here: OK, I am listening to the video now. It may take me some time to hear. We have a day out tomorrow so I don't know how much hearing I will accomplish. I do most of my listening while going to sleep, so, my hearing is limited. Looks like I need a couple of more hours of cherries to pit! Thank you though for the link and I will work at it. I am speaking with Dan Slockett now on his Father's book. I can keep you posted. Great! Yes, please do. It is nice you were able to hook up! |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Dan Slockett says hmmm He asks about rights, therefore he does not know about rights. Further communications as to rights is therefore potential, unwanted, or unfordable, costs. I suppose. I sent another message, and as far as I am concerned the idea is either good or bad according to Dan, and I do not see any need for me to push the idea in any way. I told Dan that I would keep him posted on my own (our) book project. If it works, to me, one book could become a flow of books offered by us, or you, or me, in that step by step fashion. How does anyone ever find their unique occupation? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, bear says, "Hmmm, so the 'rights' ball lands back in Dan's court." Are we, me or you, worried about rights, right? Assuming we are not worried about rights, what is the cost? ---------------------- I have finished listening to Eddie Craig Regarding your words: Now there is a part in the video I have just found that helps with the concept of someone (not you, definitely not you) claiming that the proof of the question I ask concerning "What if the Devil wrote the Bible" is in The Bible, or it says so in The Bible that the Devil did not write The Bible, is explained in those words offered by the speaker here: I am uncertain what I was supposed to hear, while listening, regarding the Bible defining the Bible except that Craig discussed words used in law also being defined in the law, and that one cannot assume a word means in law what it means in common English. He spoke to the fact that it is very important to understand the defined words according to the law code. I do not think I fell asleep today as I listened as I was concentrating on listening while hearing. But there is a chance I dozed off. I have heard him often this week, but I cannot say the other times I listened. A thought that did enter my mind as he discussed his website that he is hoping to launch that perhaps he is a person that would be very ineterested in the concept of a hand-held device that could stop, without harming, a crime in progress. Joe, earlier we were taling and to the information regarding God torturning and punishing his son, I answered that Satan did that. God allowed it. Satan did it. God allowed it for a purpose. It was prophesied here: Genesis 3:15 KJV And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Satan only bruised Christ's heel because Jesus rose again DEFEATING Sin and Death. The final blow will be to Satan's head. A blow that Satan will not recover from as Death and Hell are cast into the Lake of Fire for eternity. Jesus is the express image of the Godhead bodily. Jesus is the Logos, the Word of God, or the Logo of God. God took the punishmed of OUR sin upon HIMSELF. Just like we are body, soul and spirit, so is God. Jesus is the "body" of God. God put himself in harms way for our benefit. He could have delivered Himself from the Cross, but He did not. He could have destroyed the world and all of humanity in a moment's time. He did not. Instead He said, "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do." While hanging in shame upon the cross he had a heart of forgiveness for those who brutilized Him. Will you watch this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tV1HCK5yO_o You can stop it at 58 minutes. So, Joe, will you take 58 minutes of your time and watch this? ... |
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bear Guest
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6/24/13 page 66 There has to be, mathematically, a whole lot more victims than there are criminals since someone actually does have to produce something worth stealing or there isn't anything worth stealing for those criminals who choose that path. added comma before or: There has to be, mathematically, a whole lot more victims than there are criminals since someone actually does have to produce something worth stealing, or there isn't anything worth stealing for those criminals who choose that path. |
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bear Guest
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6/24/13 page 67 Take a wrong turn, figure it out; stop digging the hole that goes to hell. Broke into sentences: Take a wrong turn. Figure it out. Stop digging the hole that goes to hell. |
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bear Guest
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6/24/13 page 67 "Society in every state is a blessing, but Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one: for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same miseries BY A GOVERNMENT, which we might expect in a country WITHOUT GOVERNMENT, our calamity is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer." Removed quotes and made block quote since more than 4 lines long:
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bear Guest
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6/24/13 page 67 I think the instruction in Proverbs 8 says "Start looking". Periods belong inside quote marks per http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/577/03/ Also changed word from says to is to because it not a direct quote. Added colon to be consistent with next sentence. I think the instruction in Proverbs 8 is to: "Start looking." |
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bear Guest
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6/24/13 page 67 I say this is easy sometimes. I'm often wrong. Added quotes I say, “This is easy,” sometimes. I'm often wrong. |
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bear Guest
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6/24/13 page 68 3. Those who know that deceit, threats, and violence employed to gain at the expense of innocent victims is wrong, not right; wrongs to be avoided at least. No not abandon innocent victims and do not punish innocent people or do no harm by willful action or by willful inaction. Modified punction for readability and chanded phrase "No not abandon" to "Do not abandon." Changed is to are, Added the word the before least 3. Those who know that deceit, threats, and violence employed to gain at the expense of innocent victims are wrong -not right- wrongs to be avoided at the least. Do not abandon innocent victims, and do not punish innocent people, or do no harm by willful action or by willful inaction. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Sometimes I get an e-mail notice when replies are generated on this forum, other times I do not get an e-mail, and that contributes to delays in my answering questions. "I am uncertain what I was supposed to hear, while listening, regarding the Bible defining the Bible except that Craig discussed words used in law also being defined in the law, and that one cannot assume a word means in law what it means in common English. He spoke to the fact that it is very important to understand the defined words according to the law code. I do not think I fell asleep today as I listened as I was concentrating on listening while hearing. But there is a chance I dozed off. I have heard him often this week, but I cannot say the other times I listened." I will find it. Starting with 1:19 on the subject of presumption of innocence. Keeping in mind the presumption of innocence. Moving to Bills of Attainder. Simply meaning presumption of guilt. So... 1. Agreeable voluntary association depends upon an obvious need to prove guilt. 2. Disagreeable involuntary association depends upon an obvious need to bypass any awareness of innocence = the opposite of one. Where is the proof? Does it matter, at all, to anyone, ever, that proof of guilt (or innocence) exists? That is an offer by me to you. If you do not agree, then you don't, if you do agree, then you do, that proof matters, and proof is vital, and therefore it is an open request to you, asking for an answer. 1. Yes, proof matters, yes, proof is vital, yes, proof is required, yes, guilt must be proven, so yes, where is this evidence? 2. No, proof does not matter, no, proof is not vital, no, proof is not required, no, guilt does not have to be proven, so no, evidence does not matter. 3. Some other answer answering my offer. You, an individual, me another individual, I offer a viewpoint, in the form of a question, and you can counter offer, or reply to, my offer. Does proof matter in cases of disagreement whereby there is a question of guilt of any kind whatsoever? I can assume, which is my assumption of your innocence, that you agree with the idea that when human beings (not God and human beings) connect to, or have associations with, other human beings (not God connecting to, or having associations with human beings), there is, again my assumption, an agreement on your part, that in cases of guilt there is a need for evidence, inculpatory evidence, red handed evidence, whereby those presumed to be innocent are proven to be guilty instead of being innocent, beyond a reasonable doubt. I am therefore armed with this trust of you, I am therefore speaking to the choir, another member of what I consider to be Friends of Liberty, by my assumption of my agreement that there has to be proof, evidence, inculpatory, red handed, reasonable, removal of reasonable doubt, evidence of guilt, for there to be guilt, and therefore for there to be an accounting of guilt, connected to the person who was presumed to be innocent without that proof. I trust that your answer is yes, when asked if proof matters in criminal matters whereby the suspect of crime is presumed to be innocent. I can proceed without confirmation from you in matters of guilt held by one person upon another person, and again this is not a matter of God connecting to one person or another person, this is a matter in which a person connects to another person. You can inform me, one way or another, as to your agreement on the question of proof being necessary in the accounting of guilty by one person upon other people. I assume you answer yes. I presume that you answer yes. I trust that you answer yes. Now going back to (I had a hard time finding this again) time 1:00.00 AGAIN: NOT GOD or Spiritual Law - in matters of Man Made Law instead, or in place of, God's Law, while the idea, in my opinion, there is a desire to emulate God's Law, to replicate God's Law, to listen to God's Law, to hear God's Law, to practice God's Law, while on Earth as a human being connecting to other human beings. (b) Except as provided by Subsection (c), an operator who does not exhibit evidence of financial responsibility under Subsection (a) is presumed to have operated the vehicle in violation of subsection 601.015. I have chores to do at this time, or in a few minutes so I need to rap this up for now. It is the order of a man, the author of the order, declaring guilt, that itself is the proof of guilt. If evidence matters, then how does a criminal (devil) get around that agreement among peaceful people? The evidence of guilt is the claim of guilt itself. I can claim, under those rules, that you are guilty of breathing air, and the proof of your guilt is that you are breathing air? No Back. The answer is no, the authority is said to be found in the paper, the paper itself is proof of guilt, and it says so right there on the piece of paper, you, breathing air, caught red handed, there you go again, breathing air, and therefore what is the punishment? According to who? The paper. What if it says summary execution on the paper, for the crime of breathing air? The law enforcer shoots himself? No. Natural law kicks in whenever anyone obeys the man made law. You are ordered to stop breathing, it says so right on the paper, and the law says that the punishment for breathing is immediate execution for the crime of breathing. But clearly there is a problem with that law, so where is the authority that that law is based upon? It says so right here: (b) Except as provided by Subsection (c), an operator who does not exhibit evidence of financial responsibility under Subsection (a) is presumed to have operated the vehicle in violation of subsection 601.015. |
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bear Guest
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6/24/13 page 68 I get these wild ideas sometimes, like having a set of cards handy, and on these cards are blown up graphic pictures of innocent people being tortured and murdered, in your face stuff. So that anyone who begins to challenge my viewpoint, entering a political economy type discussion, challenging "where I am coming from," I have those signs ready. Sure, I can say, I may be blowing things out of all proportion. I may be raising my voice. I may be getting all worked up over nothing. Sure, I get that, sure, but what about this, and this, and this, and this. Look I say, look at this picture, it is real, look at it, in your face stuff; and might it be a good idea for someone to give a care once in a long while; someone who isn't going to be fooled into thinking that those people in those pictures deserved to be tortured by you and by me as we financed those horrible and torturous deaths, huh? So long as we are all up on our high horses of pretentious authority and all? OH, Joe, just calm down, we all know you have issues, and you have concerns, and bla, bla, bla, but... But, you know, Joe, the Mexicans are stealing our Jobs; and you know, those Terrorists have to be fought over there so we don't have to fight them over here; and you know, Joe, war is good for the economy after all; and those Democrats are Socialists; and everyone has to do their fair share with these Tax Liabilities. Except us, of course, but don't get caught, of course. ------------------ added a couple of words and punctuation changes for readability. Also added quotes for dialog. (I think I did quotes correctly: http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/577/04/ ) ------------------ I get these wild ideas sometimes, like having a set of cards handy. On these cards are blown-up, graphic pictures of innocent people being tortured and murdered. In your face stuff, so that anyone who begins to challenge my viewpoint, entering a political economy-type discussion, challenging "where I am coming from," I can have those signs ready: “Sure,” I can say, “I may be blowing things out of all proportion. “I may be raising my voice. “I may be getting all worked up over nothing. “Sure, I get that, sure, but what about this, and this, and this, and this?! Look.” I say, “Look at this picture, it is real, look at it, in your face stuff; and might it be a good idea for someone to give a care once in a long while. Someone who isn't going to be fooled into thinking that those people in those pictures deserved to be tortured by you and by me as we financed those horrible and torturous deaths, huh…so long as we are all up on our high horses of pretentious authority and all?” “OH, Joe, just calm down, we all know you have issues, and you have concerns, and bla, bla, bla, but... “But, you know, Joe, the Mexicans are stealing our Jobs; and you know, those Terrorists have to be fought over there so we don't have to fight them over here; and you know, Joe, war is good for the economy, after all; and those Democrats are Socialists; and everyone has to do their fair share with these Tax Liabilities. Except us, of course, but don't get caught, of course.” |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I see and have skimmed your reply, I have 30 minutes before starting some chores, so I am going to do bookwork for right now since I am in that mindset, and then when I come back I will better read your welcome reply and follow the instructions for listening. Thanks! |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, This is somewhat confused by current events, including the demand for chores, and including the forum software not allowing me to edit any further in my earlier response. A thought that did enter my mind as he discussed his website that he is hoping to launch that perhaps he is a person that would be very ineterested in the concept of a hand-held device that could stop, without harming, a crime in progress. The principle behind that idea is Defensive Power, and defensive Power includes the power of knowing before hand the causes of injuries so as to afford a person the time to avoid them. The use of a Network of people ready to monitor crimes in progress, ready to witness them, and ready to offer help to those potential victims is not a new idea, and now that the idea is being focused upon those who are False Authorities, so that the victims of False Authorities are now inventing, producing, and maintaining True Authoritative Defense against False Authorities, is the point. Reaching for False Authorities when threatened by False Authorities so as to utilize False Authorities in Defense against False Authorities is "providing the means by which we suffer" in obvious, and accurately measurable forms, such as paying Federal Income Taxes with Federal Reserve Notes so as to pay off National Debt that is increased each second of each day in direction proportion to each payment made to pay off the National Debt. Each payment of Federal Income Tax with each Federal Reserve Note is an investment toward the increase of National Debt, not the decrease of National Debt. Paying criminals very well to perpetrate inhuman crimes on a long list of inhuman crimes is a demand for inhuman crimes and there will be no shortage of suppliers willing to meet that demand up to a point at which the natural law known as the law of diminishing returns sets in. When there are no more innocent victims, when everyone volunteers to supply the demand for more lies, more threats, and more violence upon the innocent, so as to be paid well for being a criminal, then all hell brakes loose, each criminal is beset with the need to cut the throat of each other criminal before having their own throat cut by another criminal, and no one has time to do the chores that actually employ the available productive power in ways that make more productive power out of less productive power. "You can stop it at 58 minutes. So, Joe, will you take 58 minutes of your time and watch this?" Is there a goal to be reached in that use of my power? I ask for a reason that is not an excuse, or a dodge, or a prejudice, I ask so as to test to see if I do reach the goal, or falling short of the goal I can confirm that I have fallen short of the goal. The case of my asking you to watch the link with the person offering information on man made law was the goal of seeing how there are problems associated with man made claims of authority being embodied into the paper that those claims are written on. You did not reach the goal. So then you reported to me that you did not reach the goal. Then I offered a more detailed example of how the goal is reached, and I found, and I copied and pasted, an example of authority being claimed to be in the paper; which is the goal intended. The cut and paste of the paper that claims that the paper is the source of the authority is the goal I was asking for you to reach for and to find. You can agree to having reached that goal, or you can report to me that you have not reached that goal, in either case. So I am asking for that reason, is there a goal that I can reach for when watching that presentation of information? If the goal is to understand how the power of creation, or God, sacrifices some injury to God, so as to then give God a reason to not punish people for things that people do, then I am going to have a hard time understanding such things. I have a hard time understanding your words here: "Jesus is the express image of the Godhead bodily. Jesus is the Logos, the Word of God, or the Logo of God. God took the punishmed of OUR sin upon HIMSELF. Just like we are body, soul and spirit, so is God. Jesus is the "body" of God. God put himself in harms way for our benefit. He could have delivered Himself from the Cross, but He did not. He could have destroyed the world and all of humanity in a moment's time. He did not. Instead He said, "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do." While hanging in shame upon the cross he had a heart of forgiveness for those who brutilized Him. Will you watch this?" This: "God took the punishment of OUR sin upon HIMSELF." That makes no sense to me. Why is God in the punishment business? If God does not want to punish, then God can invent any reason not to punish, why does God need to punish "HIMSELF"? I don't even sign onto the idea that God is a he, and I don't get very far from God being the power of creation, so that is the reason for my asking anyone questions having to do with the claim that God is in the punishment business. I can't ask a video presentation the questions I have concerning the concept of God being in the punishment business. If the video presentation is a report concerning how God is in the business of punishment, then that is a possible goal to reach for, as far as I am concerned. Will that video explain to me why God is in the punishment business, assuming that God is, in fact, in the punishment business? So will I find some measure of proof, something reasonable, something I can believe, concerning why God is, in fact, in the punishment business? I can work to fit that viewing of that information into my schedule, my time, but for now I really have to get a chore done, a pile of dishes in a battle over how the kitchen is used by multiple users who do not all agree on standard procedures of use; the kitchen has to be cleaned up, and I am volunteering to do it at this point in time. Then there are other demands to meet, other things I can supply something I can supply, to meet those demands. I want to watch the presentation. It is on my list. Will I reach the intended goal according to your measure of reaching the intended goal? Did you reach the intended goal of seeing why authority on paper, where the paper says that the paper itself is the authority, is an example of false authority? I invented the obvious illustration of how that is a false authority. If the paper says that it is illegal to breath, and the paper says that those found guilty must be executed on the spot, and the proof of guilt is the paper itself, then that is exactly what that is, false authority, right there on that paper, so that paper is, in fact, inculpatory evidence of fraud, so who is the author? I am cluttering up this topic, and I don't see an easy way out of this mess, so I continue. The Story of Jesus can be confirmed through careful study? 1. Yes 2. No 3. Maybe 4. To a degree of success measurable as removing reasonable doubt? Does the study material offered by the known liar (known by you as a liar, but not known by me as a liar, since I have no evidence proving a lie to be one) Frank O'Collins offer any reasonable doubt, if that evidence is heard, and judged, by the judge in any case? I do not have a stake in the argument as to which belief between any two believers is the true belief. I have my own belief in God proven to be exactly what it is each moment of each day. I do not need to know what my own belief in God is, since it is what it is, and since it will become what it will become, as a function of POWER that is not my POWER. I can ask for words that work to cause other people to form their beliefs, and I can ask Jesus to help me know better, but for me to ask Jesus to do something ambiguous is ambiguous, and therefore not knowable. As far as you are concerned there is meaning, specific meaning, in the questions, or requests, that you have asked Jesus for, and you have a specific answer to your requests, or your questions, that you ask specifically to Jesus. What are those requests and questions specifically? 1. Blank 2. Blank If I read your words, your own words, or words taken out of scripture, translated from the original script to English, by someone, some man, or some woman, and I find ambiguity, each time I look, then there is still, remaining, to date, yet to be specified, meaning in those questions, I read, and those requests, I read, in those words offered by you, or by scripture, or by kids acting in a youtube video. I am going to try to look back into this forum topic to find anything I may have missed, offered by you, and worth my time to find. I looked and found more editing work done by you, which I still see as evidence of God at work, for someone to be so generous to me, despite all my faults, my lack of belief, you offer your help, and I appreciate it, for what it is, help. Even if you were to stop now, for whatever reason, I have been helped by you. My daughter's friend asks about the book often. He is impatient. I am not impatient, and I work at avoiding impatience. I work at avoiding impatience ever since my dad was dying before my eyes and he asked if I could help him change his pajamas. I was in a hurry. He said words, that I cannot quote, having to do with my being in a hurry, something along the lines of negative words, such as "don't be in such a hurry," or a question "what is your hurry?" I thought, at the time, that I was not in a hurry, I am always working to be faster at things, to be competitive, but I got the message as intended, as far as I can tell. Death arrives on time, so there is no demand to move that date forward, at least none that can pass the test of reason as far as I am concerned. Hey, on the subject of writing, I e-mailed and have received a response from a group who are in demand of writers. Here Your work to improve my writing is humbling to me. I can work at reading your corrections, as you teach me the lessons I once paid 500.00 Federal Reserve Notes to a "teacher" to teach me, and your competitive offerings, generous gifts, render that "investment" much lower in quality, and much higher in cost. |
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bear Guest
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Does proof matter in cases of disagreement whereby there is a question of guilt of any kind whatsoever? Innocent until proven guilty by a court of law…Proof does matter. So in regards to: (b) Is a presumption of guilt allowable? How does one ever appear in a court of law if there is not a presumption of guilt? I am not arguing. I am sorting things out in my mind. I have always understood “innocent until proven guilty by a court of law.” Didn’t we hear that 100 million times one 1 Adam 12? Did you watch that show when you were a kid? Is the point that one should not have to show those insurance papers, etc, until an accident has taken place? No wonder our foreign policy is to strike before struck. Is that not what is happening every day during traffic stops? Should we just wait for people to have an accident and not be able to pay for their damages? Is liability insurance a payment made to the guy with a baseball bat? Pay up or you cannot operate a vehicle? But if you pay up and you have a wreck, well then, we will take care of the damages? Pay up or else? I don’t know Joe, these ideas are new to me. I have handed my cards over the 3 times since 16 that I have been stopped…2 times for speeding, 1 time for turning from the wrong lane. I was guilty of braking traffic laws all 3 times and I knew it before the lights and sirens were turned on. That being said, that does not give the officer a license to suspend the constitution or Miranda rights, assuming that is what happened. You know the guy they were looking for in the red stocking cap? Now he is innocent until proven guilty, but the story has it that he was visiting with a family the day before and while the parents were at work the next day, he kicked down the back door of the house and raped their 11 year old daughter. So, I am having trouble now as I think of the 11 year old girl, who may or maynot be a “woman of the world.” So, what give the police the right to pick up the guy? His victim identified him? I don’t know. So now he goes to court and stands trial. His word against her word? I suppose her physical damages are also a witness. Perhaps his DNA is a witness too. So, he will be proven guilty in a court of law. But something had to incriminate him. He must have been presumed guilty to be picked up by the Sheriff. How does that work? ------------------------------------- Is there a goal to be reached in that use of my power? Yes, my goal is that you might see Jesus through the eyes of a child…a simple story. Is faith abject believe in falsehood? Jesus said this as reported by Luke: 15 And they brought unto him also infants, that he would touch them: but when his disciples saw it, they rebuked them. 16 But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God. 17 Verily I say unto you, Who soever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein. Is believing the Bible to be Inspired by God abject believe in falsehood? Jesus quoted the Old Testament and called it the Word of God: • Matthew 4:4 KJV But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. • Matthew 4:6 KJV And [Satan] saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone. • Matthew 4:7 KJV Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God • Matthew 4:10 KJV Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve . Jesus says, “It is written…” multiple times in other places in the Bible: http://beta.biblestudytools.com/search/?q=it+is+written&c=gos&t=kjv&ps=10&s=Bibles So, my goal, my goal is that you might have eyes that see and ears that hear and seek as a little child. Yes, God knows where to find you, and He already has. Did he not send me to speak of Him? "God took the punishment of OUR sin upon HIMSELF." Joe, God is righteous. God is holy. God is Just. God is a consuming fire. We are not. Because He is, all sin receives its just reward. What is the reward for sin? The lake of fire is the reward for sin. All sin will receive its reward there. God loves you Joe. That is why God took your reward upon Himself. It was the only way for justice to be served in the face of righteous holiness. Will that video explain to me why God is in the punishment business, assuming that God is, in fact, in the punishment business? Joe, I hope so. Did you reach the intended goal of seeing why authority on paper, where the paper says that the paper itself is the authority, is an example of false authority? So, which paper is the authority? The law code? Or the document that is to be produced so as not to be assumed guilty? Is it the law code written upon a piece of paper that sets itself up as judge and jury? Is that what you are trying to get me to see regarding the Bible? It is printed words on paper setting itself up as the authority? Is the Creator the authority? If the Creator is righteous, holy, and just is not what that Creator writes upon a piece of paper Righteous, Holy and Just as well? The Creator Himself took your wages of sin upon Himself to delivery you from the paycheck due each time the sin time clock is punched. If a criminal writes words upon a piece of paper, are those words then the transport of crime in progress? Satan has written all over God’s Creation, “mine, mine, mine.” But the final choice is yours, Joe, as God says, will you be mine instead? Will you come as a child and believe My Word? God has explained everything there and not one jot and not one tittle will pass away without being fulfilled. So, I asked you to watch a children’s drama about Jesus. Hoping that maybe, those words there and those pictures there might give a glimmer of what I try to explain ever so poorly. If the paper says that it is illegal to breath, and the paper says that those found guilty must be executed on the spot, and the proof of guilt is the paper itself, then that is exactly what that is, false authority, right there on that paper, so that paper is, in fact, inculpatory evidence of fraud, so who is the author? There will be a day when a mark on the hand or forehead will be required to buy or sell. If one does not have that mark, they will be punished. Who will write those rules? Who has told us those rules will be written? I joked at Walmart today about the self-check out and someday being able to scan the back of my hand so that no one will need to assist me. The 2 clerks looked at each other in a telltale way and acknowledged my comment with the fact that there are other (non Walmart) stores already doing that. Makes me think…perhaps that is why they cleanse the population of Christians as the routine is worked…we will not take the mark. Getting rid of the opposition beforehand?. So, the other thing I have asked to listen to is Cooper’s Mystery Babylon series. The reason is because it puts into words who and what is behind this global criminal element. He also talked about an androgynous God as being part of that system. I think I heard that information in episode 3 or 4. You read Sutton. Did Sutton give you the method to alleviate the criminal element? Cooper doesn’t either. But it is information. Just like Sutton is information. Sutton’s Wall street Analysis and Cooper’s Spiritual Analysis perhaps go hand in hand? I am very piggish with Joes time. Cooper’s series starts here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2iCLykzJ0d8&list=PL11E33A6AEEB2674F More important though, to me, is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tV1HCK5yO_o But bear being a pig wants Joe to listen to all of them -------------------- I am going to rest abit before answering your latest welcome reply which was separated from the first one because the forum wouldn't let you edit. It may be tomorrow. I am playing Mom Taxi all week long, and I am only home for a couple of hours this afternoon before I have to start driving again. The youngest has a 9pm baseball game tonight as well. ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I have to drop what I am doing and get to work on a few chores. I want to read your latest offering, but that will keep. Meanwhile I am cutting and pasting my first rough draft submission to the 1776 online magazine. I will need to look over, and fix, or edit, the rough version, and if you can help, in any way, then I appreciate that help in advance. So a cut and paste and then I'm off until later, possibly not returning until tomorrow. Pending Collapse or Golden Opportunity? News travels fast but propaganda travels faster when the criminals take over. Such is our fate when Liberty is forsaken, dropped like an old shoe, in favor of investments in lies. When the liars who invent the best lies are given the opportunity to fix their own pay rate, they don’t, they raise their pay instead, and how well does that work, and what can be expected from liars? So the question is asked, and not by me alone, how much longer can the investors in lies, and the investors in wars that are so good for the economy, how much longer can we, you know we, how much longer can we the people afford to keep on giving while the measurable benefits dry up, as the supply of ready victims are merely corpses rotting in the sun, who is going to be left to do the actual work? What happens when the supply of frauds, robbers, pedophiles, rapists, kidnappers, slave masters, extortionists, drug pushers, torturers, serial killers, and war makers, for fun and profit, all made legal, reaches that condition of oversupply? When is it enough? When is it no longer beneficial to pay those high rates for all that crime done by those in office? When do we no longer get paid anything in return? What happens after the fall? What happens when the demand for very high paid liars, in public office, hired to cover up all the other crimes, all crimes made legal, when all that peters out, what happens next? When this process reaches that point of collapse, when the inevitable result of the law of diminishing returns takes hold, and that beast won’t let go without an inspired return to a demand for honest effort: then what? Do we demand more of the same in a different suit, with a different flag, and another color of fraud money? Do we get a new song to sing the same old tune? What happens when everyone and their mom have joined in the fun, and profits, of making war ever so good for the economy, and there are no longer any hapless victims left who are footing the bill, paying the National Debt, on schedule, as they are told to do, even while the most effective tax evaders are giving themselves the highest pay rates for jobs done to a high degree of competitive excellence? Now what: punt? In fact, in reality, coming to a theater near you, what happens when the hired liars who have grown fat, stupid, greedy, foolish, and insane, finding their way into your church, as in Waco, or your home, as in the Vicky Weaver case, or your building, falling down around you, as in 911, for fun and profit, for war, for might making right, right in your life, and right now? Call 911, like the Branch Davidians? “They are shooting again, tell someone to call it off.” When does the pendulum swing too far into mass insanity, passing the point of no return, where those who produce anything worth stealing are outnumbered, and outgunned against those who make stealing legal, and like rats on a sinking ship the remaining survivors have nothing to eat but each other? When do those honest enough to admit the existence of responsibility take the time to look in the mirror and affect an accurate accounting? If done, if done well, is it remotely possible that the accounting process discovers opportunity instead of absolute abject belief in falsehood without question? Could there be, there in the mirror, a source of hope, of competitive invention, a spark of such incredible power as to cause within the observer acknowledgement of a reasonable path to take in avoidance of all the doom and gloom; is it remotely possible? Is there new light on the path that does not require the nailing of innocent people to crosses? Is there a way to avoid nailing anyone, guilty or not, to crosses, a way to avoid making torture legal, for fun, and for profit? No way Jose, you utopian dreamer, you fool, and you who defines the meaning of a conspiracy theorist? Why not consider the possible ramifications of a National Debt that becomes obviously unaffordable for anyone anywhere, and in that moment of clarity there is then a demand for a replacement, and at that moment of clarity, seeking that as yet mysterious supply to fit the demand, the observer considers reaching for a competitive option rather than the one option forced into use by the same known criminals? Why not? The same known liars, the same people, or even better liars, having the old worn out ones sent to the pasture, old ones, or new ones with new uniforms, or new symbols on their stationary, new flags, new versions of the same old thing, only this time the promise is going to pan out as advertised, this time, so forget about last time, this time the same old solution won’t result in the same old result, this time the final solution will work? Hurray, where is my new flag! Why not invent something competitive to compare to the one final solution this time? Instead of a single source of only one thing, how about running a competitive version up against the one final solution, this time? Instead of obey without question, this time, how about invention, and competition? When the door opens, when the old boss is collapsed and out of fashion, when the dollar in the form of a fraudulent Federal Reserve Note, with the National Debt Clock still ticking, is put to rest, discarded, collapsed in upon itself, then, at that moment, as the door is open, and before the new final solution to all our economic problems is ushered into place, during that window of opportunity, before then becomes now, before before becomes after, before the brain trust trusts in monopoly again, how about competition instead of monopoly? When that happens, that way, as unbelievable, as utopian, as dreamlike, as it may seem at first blush, what would happen then when competition offers many things instead of just offering one thing? When a Republic such as Utah offers investors options in the form of bank accounts where deposits of earnings are redeemable in Gold and Silver and that offering competes with whatever the new form of the final solution might be, then, as that competitor, in that form, offers an alternative to more National Debt based fraud money. At the same time a Republic like Alaska may offer a competitive edge with petroleum backed money for investors, and at the same time a Republic like California may make moves to back their offers to investors with a renewed Space Industry, and a growing Solar Panel industry, and an Electric Car industry, or who knows what may be offered from an independent Republic if one exists because The People demand one, or two, or 50, all nice and comfortable, and secure, in a mutually defensive, voluntary, association, or Federation. Imagine the possibilities? No, no, no, don’t throw me into that collapse, please; what would I do without high paid liars offering broken promises that never end? |
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bear Guest
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"Meanwhile I am cutting and pasting my first rough draft submission to the 1776 online magazine. I will need to look over, and fix, or edit, the rough version, and if you can help, in any way, then I appreciate that help in advance. So a cut and paste and then I'm off until later, possibly not returning until tomorrow." Joe, that is really neat about the 1776 online magazine. Earlier this afternoon I took a look at the link you gave me (after I had replied to the previous reply) I will take look at your submission as soon as possible. The very first thing I do when I have a spare moment. I hope tonight, but it maybe tomorrow morning. I am glad to help. Very exciting that you are submitting an article to 1776 magazine! ... |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Here is a start on editing. I want you to know that I have started. Here are the notes and the edited text: First paragraph: Added comma between: fast & but. Started new sentence after: their pay instead (I did this because the sentence is transitioning from a statement to a question.) Started new sentence/removed: And New Separated 2nd Paragraph: Started a new paragraph: after liars (I did this to focus on the question that is asked I am assuming that the question you are referring to is the question following the statement, not the questions preceding the statement.) Added colon: between alone & how (Also capitalized How) Removed comma between: lies & and (because the comma is only needed in a list or between two independent clauses) Italicized: we & we the people (for emphasis) Replace comma with ellipse between: sun & who Pending Collapse or Golden Opportunity? News travels fast, but propaganda travels faster when the criminals take over. Such is our fate when Liberty is forsaken, dropped like an old shoe, in favor of investments in lies. When the liars who invent the best lies are given the opportunity to fix their own pay rate, they don’t, they raise their pay instead. How well does that work, and what can be expected from liars? So the question is asked, and not by me alone: How much longer can the investors in lies and the investors in wars that are so good for the economy…how much longer can we, you know we, how much longer can we the people afford to keep on giving while the measurable benefits dry up, as the supply of ready victims are merely corpses rotting in the sun…who is going to be left to do the actual work? ----------------- It is 11:30 here and I have to be up early and taxi again tomorrow. I am hoping for time in the morning in between locations to do some more editing work. I will try to finish ASAP. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, "I was guilty of braking traffic laws..." We are subjects of brainwashing. Some of us are finding out how to dirty our brains back up. Note, even here, how language manages to make the bad guys into good guys and the good guys into bad guys as a function of how the words are scientifically chosen. Brains are dirty so they need to be washed by the good guys. If laws meant something other than crimes made legal then every guilty would be paying the same fine, every time, for speeding. If that is not even remotely possible, because of this or that reason, then why spend any time collecting those fines from only a few people who speed? How about this angle: If an insurance actuary were to find the greatest cause of human injury by other human beings would the concept of preventing that cause of human injury be the first thing on the list of laws to be enforced? 1. The willful orders to murder innocent people by the millions for the crime of living on a place where oil exists and the murderers desire control of that oil. 2. Accidents Can an accident be prevented by a third party? Can a crime be prevented by a third party? If there is no victim until someone demands a payment of money from an innocent person, then there was no victim until the innocent person had to pay the "traffic ticket." How much would it cost, out of the innocent victims pockets, to prevent the willful murder of millions of innocent victims for fun and profit, for oil and legal control of the one money? It costs less, out of pocket, for the innocent victims to prevent the willful murder of millions of innocent victims for fun and profit, because the way to prevent that is to stop paying Federal Income Tax through The Federal Reserve System, so that way to enforce that law, to prevent those most serious of crimes, is actually a money saver. Can car accidents be prevented by allowing innocent people, who have not harmed anyone, to randomly pay, out of pocket, a sum of earnings to a gag of highway robbers? 1. In every case where the Legal Criminals were no longer able to collect money from the innocent victims through fraud and extortion made legal, those crimes were prevented in that way. 2. In no case has the random payment of money worked to prevent accidents, in fact, the opposite may be as likely as the idea that punishment for risky behavior leads to less risky behavior. Cops hired by criminals to run confidence schemes on the side of the road. If instead of a flow of money flowing to the people who hire the Cops to run confidence schemes on the side of the road, there were tickets sent to competitive insurance companies, and your insurance rates go up, for each ticket, based upon increased risk, then that is an entirely different concept, and a concept that remains voluntary. If someone causing an accident is found to be guilty of causing an accident, then finding out a way to prevent that same thing happening again, could be done, but by who, by what process? Someone willfully committing a fraud, which is what is happening when COPS are hired to lie, so as to get money from innocent people, then that is a willful crime, not an accident. The COP may be as much a victim as the "speeder," because the actual willful fraud was perpetrated as far back, in this country, as 1788. Involuntary associations are code words for honest people so that honest people can identify the criminals who willfully create involuntary associations. We can't even speak to each other. Our language is inculpatory evidence proving a willful crime upon the innocent. How about this angle: If this land, and these roads, and the air we breath, is ours, not one person owning the roads, and not one group owning the roads, or the oxygen, then the word for that idea, for that concept, can be a handy word. What is the word for collective ownership? If oxygen is not collectively owned by everyone, each person having the equal power to breath it, then what power is at work to stop some of the people, some of the time, from breathing, owning, having, using, oxygen? What word is used to convey the process by which one person, or one group of people, willfully remove access to oxygen from one person or one group of people? Why is oxygen any different than land? So, does it make sense, in that light, to see the wisdom of a man made law that says that any human being has a right to travel across the land, as much a right to travel across the land as any other human being, as much a right to breath air as travel across the land, so long as doing so does not steal away the air from someone else, and so long as doing so does not steal away the land from someone else, and what is a road? What is your definition of a road? If you define a road as your property, exclusively yours, then anyone on it, without permission from you, is effectively stealing it away from you, which is the same thing as stealing away your oxygen, and therefore you have been injured by that trespasser, in the same way as someone stealing away the air you breath, in principle, if not actually causing you to pass out, and die, from lack of oxygen. If a criminal chokes you, throttles you by the throat, a little bit, leaving you brain damaged, but alive, then the principle is the same thing as someone removing you from access to the land you must have to survive on Earth. Which oxygen is yours exclusively? Which land is yours exclusively? Who, by what process, is there a determination made as to who is allowed access to which oxygen, and who is allowed access to which land? If someone stops you on the side of the road, commits a provable fraud upon you, recorded on video tape while the crime of fraud is perpetrated upon you, uploaded to the internet, witnesses are bearing witness to the crime in progress, true authorities who know the agreed upon laws are among the witnesses, and advice is freely given to the victim in the case at the time of the crime in progress, then, under those conditions, does the video now make sense? Someone stopping you, demanding from you a portion of your life, is someone committing a crime upon you, someone who claims to own you, claims to own the road, claims to own your life, and even if that person is mislead into a false belief that that is not a crime, it remains to be a crime, if English can convey accurate meaning. Even if the supposed laws supposedly authorizing the COP to stop you, and take from you, are honored by you, which to me is an error because I know where those laws come from, even if you honor those laws, the COP is, by those laws, perpetrating a crime upon you. Why do they go get a supervisor? They are misled. They are victim to the crime of fraud perpetrated by a LOWER authority. They are misled to look up to a higher authority when they are actually moving down to a lower authority when they go to find their LEADER who was the one committing the willful fraud, the lie, the twist, of voluntary association into involuntary association. If the "chain of command" goes all the way up to the Supreme Court, and at no time does any false authority confess guilt of fraud, claiming mistake, or whatnot, then it will be the Supreme Court that openly enforces a crime of fraud on the record. That is the point. The Legal Criminals MUST maintain the appearance of honorable, justifiable, agreeable, reasonable, authority, or lawful order, otherwise the fact that they are, at the TOP, nothing but criminals will be exposed to all the victims. See? The COP is connected to only a few people at the branches. The Supreme Court is connected to almost everyone, at the ROOT. IF the COP can get away with a crime, without anyone defending against it, that is a statistically large amount of crimes, because there are many COPS, and crime pays well by those numbers, as a "piece of the action" flows to the real criminals from all those branches. A penny here, a penny there, from each branch, flowing to the root. If one COP is successfully defended against, right there on the roadside, then the COP goes to find greener pastures, but the COP is no longer innocent at that point, now the COP has been shown true authority. The COP can no longer hid behind the lies of "doing good" and the COP now has to wrestle with failures to find the worst criminals and hold the worst criminals to account for such things as child sex slavery originating in Washington D.C., serial murder, originating in the same place, mass injury by willful poisoning of the oxygen supply, same source of crime POWER in Washington D.C., so on and so forth. The root, again, goes back to 1788 in this Country. I have babbled too long on this one thing, so I will now move on. "You know the guy they were looking for in the red stocking cap?" The criminals at WACO, and the criminals in New York during the ongoing 911 crimes, destroy inculpatory evidence. If there is a crime in progress the criminals can be known because their hands are red with blood and they are destroying the victims, removing the victims from existence, because the victims are forms of evidence, so that is a long way from someone not knowing if someone has committed a crime, for lack of evidence, since you, as a juror, have yet to see any evidence at all. Man made law has proven to be merely fines paid by convicted criminals, where there is an innocent victim, and man made law does work to make crime unaffordable for the criminals in that way, using that due process. Was Bill Clinton put on trial for the torture and murder at Waco? Was George W Bush put on trial for the massive murders perpetrated in the still ongoing crimes of 911? Those crimes are still in progress, so there are people right now hacking away, one of the hackers is named Barry Soetero, aka Osama Obama. When did "Presidents" start needing aliases? Your time. My time. We are here and now. 1788, the good name of George Washington was (is) a fraud in progress, since the man was a known despot: Generalisimo Washington ruled with an iron fist upon his subjects. "So, he will be proven guilty in a court of law. But something had to incriminate him. He must have been presumed guilty to be picked up by the Sheriff. How does that work?" I've written to you about the few cases I have personal experience in Trial by Jury American Style, which is comparable to my understanding of how the design of sortition is supposed to work as a means of putting the blinders on the lady holding the scales. Trial by Jury worked the way it worked in my case, and in my son's case, because my son on one case, and me in another case, were hand picked by the Union lawyers. My latest experience was such that both Union Lawyers rejected my presence in the Jury, while, as far as I could tell, the Union Judge wanted me to be on the Jury. I know, by these experiences, how due process words the way it works, I was there, and I was not merely a passive witness. My viewpoint added to the power being exerted. I was the law in one case. I was excluded from the law by Union Lawyers in another case. My son was the Law in his case, ensuring that innocent people are not abandoned, to the reach of his power, and his power was reason. What does reason mean when reason is used in the phrase "guilty beyond a reasonable doubt"? Reason does not exist on paper. Paper records reason as a human being was the source of reason, and paper records the event that was an example of reason. If you read an example of reason, yet you cannot know of reason, that does not make reason unreasonable as a fact, it merely suggests that either you are incapable of reason or the example is not a case of reason, so your example casts reasonable doubt as to that example of reason being a genuine, and not a counterfeit, example of reason. If I eat one of two apples, on that table, it is reasonable to conclude that there will then be 10 apples on that table, after I eat one of the two apples on that table. If I eat one of two apples on that table it is reasonable to conclude that there will be only 1 apple left on that table after I eat one of the two apples on that table, so long as other apples are not produced and placed on that table. If a man is currently perpetrating a crime in front of 12 reasonable people, people with eyes to see the crime in progress, ears to hear the crime in progress, then it is reasonable to conclude that those 12 people are witnesses to the crime in progress, and it is further reasonable to conclude that those witnesses are criminals themselves if they all work to give more innocent victims to that criminal, so as to supply that criminal with a steady supply of innocent victims so long as that criminal remains powerful enough to keep on torturing and murdering the steady stream of innocent victims provided to the criminal by those 12 fellow criminals. It is reasonable to conclude that 12 witnesses to a criminal perpetrating a crime in progress, are criminals themselves, if it is in their power to stop the crime, at no cost to themselves, such as a push of a button immobilizing the criminal, and instead of pushing the button all 12 witnesses sit and watch, eating popcorn, perhaps even cheering, clapping, applauding, waving flags. Tonight is another night of questions and answers offered by Frank O'Collins, the person you convict as a liar, and I agree but only if The Bible is, in fact, the word of God, which I don't know, but anyway, I add this to our conversation because Frank uses the word Nihilist. Do you know the meaning of the word Nihilist? I think the word means that a person can be in such a state of being that the person either has no moral conscience or that the person has a moral conscience but the person willfully destroys moral conscience in his own mind. In other words a person is either unable or refuses to judge between right and wrong as if there is no such thing as right or wrong. If there is no such thing as right or wrong, as far as my power of reason goes, then life itself is not good, or right, and therefore ending life is no different than bearing life. A murderer is no different on any scale of right or wrong, since there is no right, and there is no wrong, as parents: according to that type of reason. When the unreasonable is claimed to be reasonable, how could someone exemplify that process, and is it a due process, as if to say that everyone will be processed in this manner? If you wanted to remove the moral conscience of everyone alive, every human being, how would you go about accomplishing that goal? If you figured out a way to remove the moral conscience of every human being alive, and you, and your group of like minded people began to work effectively at doing so, would that be an example of a reasonable due process? Which steps would be necessary, along the way, to accomplish that goal? Beat children until they no longer have a working moral conscience? Make crime legal? What happened in this Country in 1788? "Yes, my goal is that you might see Jesus through the eyes of a child…a simple story. Is faith abject believe in falsehood? " Faith as far as I know for you is a treasure, a fortune, a vast improvement in life on Earth, but those are my words, not yours. I do not know your faith. I have, so far, no reasonable way of knowing your faith. It is your faith, for reasons that you know. Faith, by your definition, is not belief in falsehood, how could it be? It can't be, by your definition of faith, and an example of how that works may help. If, for example, I say that I believe that perception exists, and each time I work as hard as I can to expose my belief as being false, every single time, I fail to disprove my belief, then at this time, for me, I cannot know that my belief is false. I believe that which can be prove to me, even while I question that belief, every time, so far, my belief passes every test. How about this angle: If I willfully reject any evidence that tests my belief, and I willfully ignore the obvious reason for me to reject any evidence that tests my belief, then reason, if used, by me, instead of reason being discarded by me, would suggest that my belief is not a belief, it is a willful lie that I borrow, or invent, so as to destroy my own moral conscience. What is the source of reason? What is the source of moral conscience? If I listen to reason, and if I listen to moral conscience, where is the source of those powers over me? If I look for the source of power, and there is so far no way for me to perceive it, to focus attention on it, to measure it, at the source of it, then I cannot know it, I cannot know that source, so far, and therefore it, the source of what I decide to listen to, the source of reason that I decide to listen to, the source of moral conscience that I decide to listen to, remains to be a source that I CANNOT KNOW. Do I believe that there is a source of reason, and do I believe that there is a source or moral conscience? Is it reasonable to claim that there is no such source, that there is no such thing as a source of reason, and is it reasonable to claim that there is no such source of moral conscience? How does a human being become convinced in the need to destroy (or not listen to) reason, and moral conscience? Is reason not the same thing as moral conscience? If I knew, without any reasonable doubt, that The Bible was written by God, or The Devil, then that would be my condition of life at that time, a knowing, and where would I find that power, since I do not have that power now? I DO NOT KNOW. If you know, then you know, and if you don't know where you get that power to know, exactly, but you know better than I do, then it stands to reason that you can help me know what you know, eventually. I believe that you can help me know better, more specifically, more accurately, more precisely, with greater clarity, what is, and what is not, the source of reason, which to me is the same source as the source of moral conscience. If the goal is knowing better, in my view, I have to know where the source of reason and where the source of moral conscience is, and I can go there, and I can know better once I get there, or, again, me with my scales, I can move in that direction rather than moving on the opposite direction. A nihilist may claim that the way to move closer to reason is to move further away from moral conscience. I believe, so far, that that is not true. "So, my goal, my goal is that you might have eyes that see and ears that hear and seek as a little child. Yes, God knows where to find you, and He already has. Did he not send me to speak of Him?" English is problematic, this I can measure, and belief in what I can't measure is not required, not needed, not even useful, since belief can be confused with gambling, on an on, proving the point. The point being: English is problematic. I can trust in your belief as if it were my own until proven otherwise by reason, or moral conscience, as I listen, and listen, and listen, for information that comes from a source of information whereby things "ring true," or make sense, or reason out, or add up, or work out, as pieces fit, and the puzzle takes form, and light is shown in the dark room, and dragons turn out to be little, pathetic, men behind curtains. I can't know what you know, not yet, it is measurably not possible at this time, but not for lack of trying. God is a him? We went this way before, and again: English is problematic. Joe, God is righteous. God is holy. God is Just. God is a consuming fire. We are not. Because He is, all sin receives its just reward. What is the reward for sin? The lake of fire is the reward for sin. All sin will receive its reward there. God loves you Joe. That is why God took your reward upon Himself. It was the only way for justice to be served in the face of righteous holiness. I see little, or no, reason in arguing about such words, in English, where you offer me something I see as being routine brainwashing, carrot and stick, man made falsehoods designed to remove the moral conscience, the power of reason, from the innocent targeted victims. That is what I see in your words above, so there is a measurable problem where you are intending to help me and I see instead a stack of symbols arranged in such a way as to exemplify a road sign that leads people off a cliff to their doom. I've spoken about this analogy of a road sign before, so as to remove you from the viewpoint, and so as to allow us both to look at the road sign as it exists on that road. I do not see any need to argue. If you have a message, and the message intends to help me, then that message, in English, is working in the opposite direction on me, at this time. I can explain in great detail as to how I reason out that message, you offer to me, as I listen to whatever POWER is the POWER of reason, from wherever the POWER of reason comes from, whatever the source of the POWER of reason, I listen to it, I am keen to hear the message of reason, and what I hear, may be false, I may have the wrong source in mind, who knows? I don't know. So, which paper is the authority? The law code? Or the document that is to be produced so as not to be assumed guilty? Is it the law code written upon a piece of paper that sets itself up as judge and jury? Is that what you are trying to get me to see regarding the Bible? It is printed words on paper setting itself up as the authority? No, I don't think so, I think there are problems, including problems rooted in the English language, but many problems contributing to failures in reaching the goal of accurate communication. I tell my wife, for example, that your POWER to know this thing that may be called a Spiritual Connection to God, in English, is what it is, so you are not an example of a person claiming that the proof of fact that The Devil did not write the bible is ONLY the words saying so in The Bible. The proof of anything is not belief. Proof is proof. Again English appears to be problematic, and exemplary at the same time. In other words English exemplifies itself as a problem. How about a solution? If I ask two people the same question I can have competitive examples of the answers. Problem: Did the Devil write The Bible. 1. No, and I can prove it beyond any reasonable doubt, right here, on page such and such, right here in The Bible, there is the true answer. Next question. 2. I believe in Jesus Christ, and my belief occurred over time, this way, and that way, here and here, and I don't have absolute proof, and that is the point. For you the problem is solved. For me the problem is not solved. What about the person who answers with answer 1 above? I trust that you are not a person seized with what I call Absolute Abject Belief in Falsehood Without Question, because I trust that you are honest. You could be a complete fabrication of some very sophisticated computer program, for all I know. You could be an Angel from Hell, for all I know. I base my trust of you on that source, where I can't even find the source, of reason and moral conscience, which I think is the same source, and again English appears to be problematic, as your words continue to measure up as being someone who is, as I am, questioning. Questioning? Listening to reason? Listening to moral conscience? Is that not the precise opposite of Absolute Abject Belief in Falsehood Without Question? So you believe that you are possessed of something powerful, having something I do not have, a closer spiritual relationship with the son of God, and therefore a closer spiritual relationship with God, compared, side by side, with me. Congratulations, that is worth emulating, a fine example of human life, something exemplary, something I can work at becoming. Fair enough? I ask Jesus now. I don't just ask God. I don't just ask my old friend Hank, or my Dad, or my Mom now, or may Aunt Mary, or Nanny, or anyone, please, anyone, help me, please. I now ask Jesus too. So far I have not moved to the better place you have moved to but not for lack of trying, and if it is fair enough, then at some point we can go into greater detail concerning the reasons I think some of your words, in English, move in the wrong direction. I don't know. I may be precisely moving in the wrong direction. For now, it may be a good idea to move onto present matters concerning current information involving COPS and ROBBERS, here on Earth, and how better to know how to avoid all of it, or avoid as much of it as possible, while, at the same time, not abandoning the innocent victims currently being destroyed brutally by their tormentors if it is in someones power, on Earth, to do something, anything, to help those innocent people avoid their brutal tormentors. If I believe that it does help to publish words, even though we are using the problematic language known as English, I still think it helps the innocent victims avoid their brutal tormentors, to write, and publish, words as signs on the road. Which signs? I do this: 1. End the FED 2. End the IRS 3. Bring the Troops Home (look in the mirror) 4. Do so by July 4th, 2013. Start now, finish early. I may be working in the wrong direction. I think I am listening to reason. Where is the source of reason? Is there a way to focus our combined viewpoints? Where in The Bible does it suggest that Ending the FED is a good idea? No where? So I'm wrong? I can play the guitar instead of going in the wrong direction with my sign making? Is the Creator the authority? If the Creator is righteous, holy, and just is not what that Creator writes upon a piece of paper Righteous, Holy and Just as well? The Creator Himself took your wages of sin upon Himself to delivery you from the paycheck due each time the sin time clock is punched. So we may part ways. That can happen. I so not reason that out well. I reason that out as a sign on the road that is inaccurate at best. Is it worth the effort to accurately identify the source of my error in reasoning? If a criminal writes words upon a piece of paper, are those words then the transport of crime in progress? Satan has written all over God’s Creation, “mine, mine, mine.” But the final choice is yours, Joe, as God says, will you be mine instead? Will you come as a child and believe My Word? Ambiguity is not reasonable to me. Specifics are reasonable to me. Focus of attention to a fine point unto whatever is to be known, perceived, precisely, to me, is the road to reason, so that collection of words above, to me, are just so many words, in English, those words point in a general direction. If those words point to one specific collection of English symbols, known as The King James Version of The Bible, then there are specific challenges, questions, concerning English and King James and the specific people involved in the creation of English as a language, and the interpretation of other works that were interpreted and then published in that version of that book. If it is a good idea to look specifically at that English version of that one book, then are there things I am not supposed to look at, because you say that the person offering historical records involving the publishing of that book, in English, is a liar? Even if I agree to shoot the messenger, this guy named Frank, and he is now spirited off to the memory hole, the information he discovered, from other sources, remains to be either looked at, or spirited off into the memory hole. We, if you agree, we can just as easily discard any references to any sources of information, and we can discuss the concept of original sin, and human responsibility, and human accountability, based upon our own individual power to know what individual responsibility, and individual accountability means, with, or without the POWER of God working miracles. A list is what I mean to say: 1. We can discuss one on one, to compare our individual, separate, viewpoints as they exist, without reliance upon references written on paper. 2. We can discuss the relative merits of the words written on paper from various sources. 3. We can discuss the relative merits of the people who wrote the original copies of the words written on paper or written on the skin of murdered children. 4. We can discuss the relative merits of the people who translated the original copies of the words written on paper onto other paper. 5. We can discuss the relative merits of the people discovering words on papers, or words on the skins of murder children. 6. We can discuss methods of cooking meals. 7. We can't do all things at once. God has explained everything there and not one jot and not one tittle will pass away without being fulfilled. As far as you are concerned that is true. As far as I am concerned that is ambiguous to the point of meaninglessness. Between your perception and my perception on this specific thing, that quote just quoted, there is a gap, and the building of a foundation from which to then build a bridge of agreement between my perception, and your perception, is possible according to my belief. I know that the gap exists, and I don't have to rely upon belief to know that the gap exists, and I can offer much detail in English words, of my own invention, and much detail in English words from other sources, if I go down the road that ends at a gap, and I then work on building that specific bridge. What can I say in response to this: God has explained everything there and not one jot and not one tittle will pass away without being fulfilled. I don't know. So, I asked you to watch a children’s drama about Jesus. Hoping that maybe, those words there and those pictures there might give a glimmer of what I try to explain ever so poorly. While watching the video I could have stopped it, quoted from it, and worked in great detail to convey my perspective concerning what was specifically said, or specifically done, as a challenge to you. I challenge the concept of original sin, and the concept of human responsibility, and human accountability, with, or without miracles performed by God, Jesus, or anyone. Individual human thought, and individual human action is what it is and then there are other concerns concerning how those individual human thoughts and those individual human actions combine to form a power that is greater or lesser than the linear sum of each individual thought and action. I can go into great detail. To reply generally I can say, with confidence, that I do not know what you believe. If I do not know what you believe, then wherever I get my power of reason from, the right source, or the wrong source, I fail to reason, in any way, a belief based upon something I have no power to know. In fact, when I begin to reason out the concept of original sin, and the concept of individual responsibility, and the concept of individual accountability, and the concept of human connections to other humans, I find your words in English to be sources of potential trouble. I can go into great detail. I can say, many times, that I do not know, up until a time in which I can say, accurately, that I do know. There will be a day when a mark on the hand or forehead will be required to buy or sell. If one does not have that mark, they will be punished. That looks like a source of trouble to me, along the same lines I've been reasoning out, thinking, working on, that looks like a very misguided arrangement of English symbols, and I can go into great detail, or I can honestly say that I do not know what you believe in reference to those specific words in English. Getting rid of the opposition beforehand?. I see no mystery in reference to criminals, they all do the same things. There is no mystery. Criminals lie. Criminals threaten. Criminals are aggressively violent upon the innocent. How is that ever a mystery? A victim is victim to a lie? A victim is victim to a threat? A victim is victim to aggressive violence perpetrated by a criminal? What is the need for, the demand for, secrets? we will not take the mark Which mark? Do you have a social security number? Do you have a drivers license number? If you do, and it is strictly voluntary, then it is no different than someone wanting to save time by having a bar code voluntarily tattooed on their hand. Where is the victim of such a crime if it is strictly voluntary? If, on the other hand, your social security number is a way that the criminals tag you, and you are a victim, and the criminals then take from you because you are a thing according to them, and you are thing number such and such, then that is exactly that, no more, and no less. The mark, if it is criminal, if that is the problem, criminals mark their victims, is here, has been here, already. If the criminals grow more powerful, because the victims are working harder to have more things for the criminals to steal, then it does not take a prophet to realize what happens down that road. Patrick Henry spelled it out well enough. "But bear being a pig wants Joe to listen to all of them." Frank offers remedy. If Cooper does not, then that it is reasonable to know the difference, at least based upon the source form which my power of reason is gained. I started listening to Frank at the time he recorded his first phone call sessions dated as: 11/11/2010 09:00 PM EST Back then he used labels such as Jesuits, Khazarian Parasites, and The Roman Cult to aim the finger of guilt at those people in those groups as being the source of so much, or the greatest amount of, human misery on Earth. My words. Now Frank, jumping head to the present recordings, and the live phone messages, I've attended 2 now, now Frank uses the word Nihilists. Which words, which labels, are used by Cooper? Which person, which human being, is more powerful, at any given moment, than another human being? I can't write myself a check for as much money as everyone else combined and claim my check to be good, and get away with it. The people running The International Monetary Fund (not the label, not the legal fiction, the actual people) run The Federal Reserve, and The Dollar Hegemony, and The World Reserve Currency, and they can, someone can, some number of people can, agree to write that check, and they have wrote that check, and they are buying World War III. I can't buy World War III. Do I have the power to opt out of World War III? Do I have the power to help anyone opt out? The criminals employ deceit, threats, and violence. Have I ever lied to you? Have I ever threatened you? Have I ever caused you physical harm? I can turn that around. I trust that you have never lied to me, willfully, and even if some of the information that you offer to me happens not to be totally true, I have the power that I use to question information sufficient for me to have a power of defense against falsehood. It matters not if the falsehood arrives in by brain from the inventor of the lie or just a messenger transporting the lie. I must have some power, in me, to guard against lies. I trust that you have never threatened me. If your words convey a threat, whereby my failure to believe as you do will result in my end in a lake of fire, then to me that could be seen as a threat, and to you that information could be merely a fact, based upon your belief. To me it is something I just don't know, therefore it does not work as a threat, or a promise, it is merely ignorance on my part, and it is not willful ignorance since I am actively, willfully, working at knowing. I can ask Jesus right now. Tomorrow. I get the same answer. So far. I trust that you are incapable of doing me any physical harm so long as I am not attacking you or your family. The Golden rule is not merely words written in English. I am going to rest abit before answering your latest welcome reply which was separated from the first one because the forum wouldn't let you edit. It may be tomorrow. I am playing Mom Taxi all week long, and I am only home for a couple of hours this afternoon before I have to start driving again. The youngest has a 9pm baseball game tonight as well. I too, or me too, playing the part of taxi. Same boat on time too, I want to get more work done on The Daily Paul, someone is discussing a topic with me, and I have that new project to work on with the 1776 magazine. Your welcome perspective helps, please know that much. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I took this off the page for reasons that should have been obvious to me. Thanks for the work on the new project. You are teaching me well, and the work may pay off some day. Who knows? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, it is almost 5 now and I have been home for about 30 minutes today. I was not able to work as much on editing as I had wished. Here is what I have completed thus far: I still have a little more than a page to edit. I will continue unless I hear differently. But I am going to rest abit now and I have church tonight. First paragraph: Added comma between: fast & but. Started new sentence after: their pay instead (I did this because the sentence is transitioning from a statement to a question.) Started new sentence/removed: And New Separated 2nd Paragraph: Started a new paragraph: after liars (I did this to focus on the question that is asked I am assuming that the question you are referring to is the question following the statement, not the questions preceding the statement.) Added colon: between alone & how (Also capitalized How) Removed comma between: lies & and (because the comma is only needed in a list or between two independent clauses) Italicized: we & we the people (for emphasis) Replace comma with ellipse between: sun & who 3rd Paragraph: Changed word from: done to perpetrated (just because I didn’t think done sounded good.) 4th Paragraph: No Changes 5th Paragraph: Removed comma between: liars & in (this is an essential clause see http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/566/1/ ) Removed 3 commas and replaced with: Parenthesis & dash SOMETHING FOR YOU TO CONSIDER IN PHRASE: all crimes made legal (Consider removing the word all, since all may or may not be able to be quantified as 100%.) Removed words: when all that (to help sentence flow) Replaced comma with question mark between: out & what (Started new sentence and capitalized: What) Replaced question mark with colon between: Next & What Replaced colon with period between: effort & then (Started new sentence and capitalized Then) 6th Paragraph: Added WITH between: sing & the ---------------- Content with edits included: Pending Collapse or Golden Opportunity? News travels fast, but propaganda travels faster when the criminals take over. Such is our fate when Liberty is forsaken, dropped like an old shoe, in favor of investments in lies. When the liars who invent the best lies are given the opportunity to fix their own pay rate, they don’t, they raise their pay instead. How well does that work, and what can be expected from liars? So the question is asked, and not by me alone: How much longer can the investors in lies and the investors in wars that are so good for the economy…how much longer can we, you know we, how much longer can we the people afford to keep on giving while the measurable benefits dry up, as the supply of ready victims are merely corpses rotting in the sun…who is going to be left to do the actual work? What happens when the supply of frauds, robbers, pedophiles, rapists, kidnappers, slave masters, extortionists, drug pushers, torturers, serial killers, and war makers (for fun and profit, all made legal) reaches that condition of oversupply? When is it enough? When is it no longer beneficial to pay those high rates for all that crime perpetrated by those in office? When do we no longer get paid anything in return? What happens after the fall? What happens when the demand for very high paid liars in public office (hired to cover up all the other crimes - all crimes made legal) peters out? What happens next: when this process reaches that point of collapse, when the inevitable result of the law of diminishing returns takes hold, and that beast won’t let go without an inspired return to a demand for honest effort. Then what? Do we demand more of the same in a different suit, with a different flag, and another color of fraud money? Do we get a new song to sing with the same old tune? -------------------- |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I wonder if we can make a deal on this team we have in writing, as my thoughts are leaning toward a ghost writer name whereby neither of us take credit for our work. I don't know if that is agreeable, but it sounds agreeable as far as my part is concerned. How about a ghost name like this: Epictetus The idea is not to hide my name, or disguise me, the idea is first to acknowledge the fact that I am not the only contributor to the effort to write the message offered, another idea is to return to some sense of American history since it was traditional, I suppose that is the right word, traditional, or it was "in fashion" to use ancient names when speaking through newspapers in the effort to negotiate Liberty in early America. The other idea behind this specific Ghost name is to call attention to that specific name in history. Stocism was, in my way of speaking, for Liberty , or against Legal Crime, in fact, not only in words. In other words the Stoics were of the mind that you can't join them to beat them, you beat them by not being them. Does that make sense? I like your edit work so far, and I have some ideas for my own editing, but I will wait for you to finish edit work on the 1776 magazine submission. |
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bear Guest
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My notebook updated to Internet Explorer 10 and I am having fitts getting to certain websites and getting videos to play. I have very limited RAM...just thought I'd let you know of my technical difficulties as of late! Here is my thought on philosophy: Colossians 2:8 KJV Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. It matters not to me if you want to have a ghost name, but I don't want to have that ghost name, but you can have it. That does not matter to me. It does not matter to me that I have any name at all or any credit at all. So what I am saying is, "Go for it." and I will tag along but please do not make me be a stoic. I am a Christian. My allegiance is to the Lord Jesus Christ and the Written Word of God. And to me, Joe, that is the only writing that matters. The words in the Bible are not a man's words. They are the Very Word of God. OK so you can call yourself Epictetus and that is fine by me. --------------------- Here is what I have completed so far. I have to stop and rest before the evening round of activities hits. It looks like I have 1/2 a page left, but I am not ready to tackle it. First paragraph: Added comma between: fast & but. Started new sentence after: their pay instead (I did this because the sentence is transitioning from a statement to a question.) Started new sentence/removed: And New Separated 2nd Paragraph: Started a new paragraph: after liars (I did this to focus on the question that is asked I am assuming that the question you are referring to is the question following the statement, not the questions preceding the statement.) Added colon: between alone & how (Also capitalized How) Removed comma between: lies & and (because the comma is only needed in a list or between two independent clauses) Italicized: we & we the people (for emphasis) Replace comma with ellipse between: sun & who 3rd Paragraph: Changed word from: done to perpetrated (just because I didn’t think done sounded good.) 4th Paragraph: No Changes 5th Paragraph: Removed comma between: liars & in (this is an essential clause see http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/566/1/ ) Removed 3 commas and replaced with: Parenthesis & dash SOMETHING FOR YOU TO CONSIDER IN PHRASE: all crimes made legal (Consider removing the word all, since all may or may not be able to be quantified as 100%.) Removed words: when all that (to help sentence flow) Replaced comma with question mark between: out & what (Started new sentence and capitalized: What) Replaced question mark with colon between: Next & What Replaced colon with period between: effort & then (Started new sentence and capitalized Then) 6th Paragraph: Added WITH between: sing & the 7th Paragraph: JOE: I am considering the phrase: “of making war ever so good for the economy” and that it applies both to “the fun” and “the profits” so I am editing by removing commas between: fun & and / profits & of Replacing Comma with “and” between: bill & paying 8th Paragraph: No Changes 9th Paragraph Replaced comma with colon between: you & what Removed comma between: insane & find Changed finding to find and added semi colons between (added capitalization to “What” for new sentence) Replaced comma with semicolon between: Waco & or / case& or / (http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/566/1/ Use a semicolon to join elements of a series when individual items of the series already include commas.) Added ellipses in place of commas at the end of the paragraph. Joe, I have not made editing notes for the rest of the article to save time so I could get this part back to you. You can compare the paragraphs with the originals after paragraph 9. OK? Joe, I don’t understand the last part of this sentence: “No way Jose, you utopian dreamer, you fool, and you who defines the meaning of a conspiracy theorist?” Specifically: and you who defines the meaning of a conspiracy theorist? I also do not understand the question mark. Edited version so far: ---------------------------------------------- Pending Collapse or Golden Opportunity? News travels fast, but propaganda travels faster when the criminals take over. Such is our fate when Liberty is forsaken, dropped like an old shoe, in favor of investments in lies. When the liars who invent the best lies are given the opportunity to fix their own pay rate, they don’t, they raise their pay instead. How well does that work, and what can be expected from liars? So the question is asked, and not by me alone: How much longer can the investors in lies and the investors in wars that are so good for the economy…how much longer can we, you know we, how much longer can we the people afford to keep on giving while the measurable benefits dry up, as the supply of ready victims are merely corpses rotting in the sun…who is going to be left to do the actual work? What happens when the supply of frauds, robbers, pedophiles, rapists, kidnappers, slave masters, extortionists, drug pushers, torturers, serial killers, and war makers (for fun and profit, all made legal) reaches that condition of oversupply? When is it enough? When is it no longer beneficial to pay those high rates for all that crime perpetrated by those in office? When do we no longer get paid anything in return? What happens after the fall? What happens when the demand for very high paid liars in public office (hired to cover up all the other crimes - all crimes made legal) peters out? What happens next: when this process reaches that point of collapse, when the inevitable result of the law of diminishing returns takes hold, and that beast won’t let go without an inspired return to a demand for honest effort. Then what? Do we demand more of the same in a different suit, with a different flag, and another color of fraud money? Do we get a new song to sing with the same old tune? What happens when everyone and their mom have joined in the fun and profits of making war ever so good for the economy, and there are no longer any hapless victims left who are footing the bill and paying the National Debt, on schedule, as they are told to do, even while the most effective tax evaders are giving themselves the highest pay rates for jobs done to a high degree of competitive excellence? Now what: punt? In fact, in reality, coming to a theater near you: what happens when the hired liars who have grown fat, stupid, greedy, foolish, and insane find their way into your church, as in Waco; or your home, as in the Vicky Weaver case; or your building, falling down around you, as in 911…for fun and profit…for war and for might making right…right in your life, and right now? Call 911, like the Branch Davidians? “They are shooting again, tell someone to call it off.” When does the pendulum swing too far into mass insanity, passing the point of no return, where those who produce anything worth stealing are outnumbered and outgunned against those who make stealing legal, and like rats on a sinking ship, the remaining survivors have nothing to eat but each other? When do those honest enough to admit the existence of responsibility take the time to look in the mirror and affect an accurate accounting? If done, if done well, is it remotely possible that the accounting process discovers opportunity instead of absolute abject belief in falsehood without question? Could there be, there in the mirror, a source of hope, of competitive invention, a spark of such incredible power as to cause within the observer acknowledgement of a reasonable path to take in avoidance of all the doom and gloom; is it remotely possible? Is there new light on the path that does not require the nailing of innocent people to crosses? Is there a way to avoid nailing anyone, guilty or not, to crosses, a way to avoid making torture legal, for fun, and for profit? No way Jose, you utopian dreamer, you fool, and you who defines the meaning of a conspiracy theorist? |
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bear Guest
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JOE Here is the complete edited version. I cannot say that it is perfect. But I am tossing it back to you because you had said you had some ideas. I decided not to rest and finished it instead. We have a busy evening and another busy day tomorrow...next week will be a little slower...I think. Pending Collapse or Golden Opportunity? News travels fast, but propaganda travels faster when the criminals take over. Such is our fate when Liberty is forsaken, dropped like an old shoe, in favor of investments in lies. When the liars who invent the best lies are given the opportunity to fix their own pay rate, they don’t, they raise their pay instead. How well does that work, and what can be expected from liars? So the question is asked, and not by me alone: How much longer can the investors in lies and the investors in wars that are so good for the economy…how much longer can we, you know we, how much longer can we the people afford to keep on giving while the measurable benefits dry up, as the supply of ready victims are merely corpses rotting in the sun…who is going to be left to do the actual work? What happens when the supply of frauds, robbers, pedophiles, rapists, kidnappers, slave masters, extortionists, drug pushers, torturers, serial killers, and war makers (for fun and profit, all made legal) reaches that condition of oversupply? When is it enough? When is it no longer beneficial to pay those high rates for all that crime perpetrated by those in office? When do we no longer get paid anything in return? What happens after the fall? What happens when the demand for very high paid liars in public office (hired to cover up all the other crimes - all crimes made legal) peters out? What happens next: when this process reaches that point of collapse, when the inevitable result of the law of diminishing returns takes hold, and that beast won’t let go without an inspired return to a demand for honest effort. Then what? Do we demand more of the same in a different suit, with a different flag, and another color of fraud money? Do we get a new song to sing with the same old tune? What happens when everyone and their mom have joined in the fun and profits of making war ever so good for the economy, and there are no longer any hapless victims left who are footing the bill and paying the National Debt, on schedule, as they are told to do, even while the most effective tax evaders are giving themselves the highest pay rates for jobs done to a high degree of competitive excellence? Now what: punt? In fact, in reality, coming to a theater near you: what happens when the hired liars who have grown fat, stupid, greedy, foolish, and insane find their way into your church, as in Waco; or your home, as in the Vicky Weaver case; or your building, falling down around you, as in 911…for fun and profit…for war and for might making right…right in your life, and right now? Call 911, like the Branch Davidians? “They are shooting again, tell someone to call it off.” When does the pendulum swing too far into mass insanity, passing the point of no return, where those who produce anything worth stealing are outnumbered and outgunned against those who make stealing legal, and like rats on a sinking ship, the remaining survivors have nothing to eat but each other? When do those honest enough to admit the existence of responsibility take the time to look in the mirror and affect an accurate accounting? If done, if done well, is it remotely possible that the accounting process discovers opportunity instead of absolute abject belief in falsehood without question? Could there be, there in the mirror, a source of hope, of competitive invention, a spark of such incredible power as to cause within the observer acknowledgement of a reasonable path to take in avoidance of all the doom and gloom; is it remotely possible? Is there new light on the path that does not require the nailing of innocent people to crosses? Is there a way to avoid nailing anyone, guilty or not, to crosses, a way to avoid making torture legal, for fun, and for profit? No way Jose, you utopian dreamer, you fool, and you who defines the meaning of a conspiracy theorist? Why not consider the possible ramifications of a National Debt that becomes obviously unaffordable for anyone anywhere: in that moment of clarity, there is then a demand for a replacement; at that moment of clarity, seeking that as yet mysterious supply to fit the demand, the observer considers reaching for a competitive option rather than the one option forced into use by the same known criminals? Why not? The same known liars, the same people, or even better liars (having the old, worn-out ones sent to the pasture) old ones or new ones with new uniforms or new symbols on their stationary, new flags, new versions of the same old thing, only this time the promise is going to pan out as advertised. This time, so forget about last time, this time the same old solution won’t result in the same old result. This time the final solution will work? Hurray! Where is my new flag? Why not invent something competitive to compare to the one final solution this time? Instead of a single source of only one thing, how about running a competitive version up against the one final solution, this time? Instead of obey without question, this time, how about invention and competition? When the door opens, when the old boss is collapsed and out of fashion, when the dollar in the form of a fraudulent Federal Reserve Note (with the National Debt Clock still ticking) is put to rest, discarded, collapsed in upon itself, then, at that moment as the door is open, and before the new final solution to all our economic problems is ushered into place…during that window of opportunity before then becomes now…before before becomes after…before the brain trust trusts in monopoly again: how about competition instead of monopoly? When that happens, that way, as unbelievable, as utopian, as dreamlike as it may seem at first blush, what would happen then, when competition offers many things instead of just offering one thing? When a Republic, such as Utah, offers investors options in the form of bank accounts where deposits of earnings are redeemable in Gold and Silver, and that offering competes with whatever the new form of the final solution might be, then that competitor, in that form, offers an alternative to more National Debt-based, fraud money; then at the same time a Republic, like Alaska, may offer a competitive edge with petroleum backed money for investors; and then at the same time a Republic, like California, may make moves to back their offers to investors with a renewed Space Industry, a growing Solar Panel industry, and an Electric Car industry. Who knows what may be offered from an independent Republic if one exists because The People demand one --or two --or 50, all nice and comfortable and secure in a mutually defensive, voluntary association or Federation. Imagine the possibilities? No, no, no, don’t throw me into that collapse, please! What would I do without high paid liars offering broken promises that never end? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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"please do not make me be a stoic" bear, I don't know how many times I can repeat the concept of not joining, not me, I don't, it is not in me, I'm not a joiner, I don't believe as if turning on a switch that suddenly transports me into membership with believers, which goes for Christians, Mormons, Buddhists, Muslims, Branch Davidians, One Heaven, Two Heaven, Luciferian, Statist, Fascist, Communist, Socialist, Capitalist, Jewish, without reservation. I reserve reservation to not belong, or belong, only to that which I truly belong, or not belong to, as time goes by, and as I may occupied different spaces, and as I may displace whatever is where I will be then. Labels, labels, labels, and some power at work forcing people here and there, and am I that power? "please do not make me be a stoic" The concept of a Ghost Writer had to do with things offered, not things not offered, and at no time have I offered to make you anything, which would not be an offer, it would be making you be something against your will, which is something I am now suspect of desiring? Tongue in cheek? I stumbled upon another idea for another submission, and it was roughly written in a new Category and new Forum here on this Web Site. Thanks for the help on the Collapse or Opportunity submission, I can now work at finishing it up, let it hang out awhile, and then submit it as if it were worth submitting after some reflection. I've been shooting off my mouth so long, rambling at will, that the ideas flow better, but the writing projects are very rough - in need of your generous help in my opinion. Thanks again. |
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bear Guest
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Joe,
You make me laugh, Joe. I never thought of it that way. But what if your offer was the ghost name of Lucifer? Would that not be a label of some sort? Is not a Ghost Name taken from an historic person sorta like a label because the reputation of that person is imparted to that name into the mind of the person that reads that name? Like Mark Twain at the DP. Isn't that sort of a label? OK, I am home for a few minutes before my next road trip...I made four 40 mile round trips to the Walmart town up the road...160 miles going to town 20 miles up the road. Crazy. I will resume working on Joe Quotes. I hear we have an audience of expectant readers looking forward to a completed product! |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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I sent the final version. Preview may only work for me as I am logged in. |
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bear Guest
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I get a 404 page no longer exists message. Thank you though for trying to send me the link. Maybe I will be able to veiw it when published? |
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bear Guest
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JOE, bear, I took this off the page for reasons that should have been obvious to me. Thanks for the work on the new project. You are teaching me well, and the work may pay off some day. Who knows?I just went back to look for that information as I thought I remembered seeing something. I was wanting to see your submission. I have had explorer problems so I couldn't even get the 1776 home page to load. I think I may have things finally fixed. Anyways, I am going to do some bookwork now. The oldest is chomping at the bit for a game of Monopoly so I will have to eventually break for the game. The youngest is at camp and the oldest wants to know how many games of Monopoly we are going to get to play this week. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I took the information off this Forum because that cut and paste included my username and password to gain access to Submissions. I submitted the Collapse or Opportunity article and I have not received any response to that submission, as far as I know. I just sent this to those people: Team, I sent a submission, and I have uses for that submission. I use what I write on Forums. If there is a way I can link your site, where my submission is published, then I could link your site where my submission is published. Absent any information concerning your use of my words I see no need to continue submitting my words into what is to me a dead end at this point. In fact I will publish my submission to you as an example of how information travels in modern times. Here is where I find a use for my submission to you: http://www.dailypaul.com/291071/lindsey-williams-you-positively-must-get-out-of-paper That is at the moment a source of information that is ONE WAY communication. In other words, there are no responses, no discussion, no feedback, no effort to challenge, to improve upon, or to check, and to balance, that information. So I see a use for my submission to your Team. I will publish my submission to your Team, without a link to your On-Line Magazine, since at this point there is perceived by me an opportunity to challenge, improve, and offer productive information in the face of so much Dictatorial Information, and I can do so right at that point in the stream of information. I can delay my effort to publish my offering of a competitive perspective. I can do so because I prefer to link a Web Site with the potential to challenge the Dictatorial Norm. If you can't use my words, I can. Thanks Joe I have another submission already roughly written and I see no reason to continue sending my work to a place that does not offer feedback, at least on The Daily Paul Forum I get the occasional reply to my work. You exemplify such feedback, to my work, from my end, from your end it is a mutual benefit, it is two way communication, or equitable commerce, which is agreement, competition, adaptation, and it is not Monopoly, Dictation, One-Way communication. Someone else at The Daily Paul inspired me to offer a lot of information all arranged into neat order, and that person had offered a lot of information, and so there was again an example of how that works that way. Here: Unorthodox Methods of Discussion If the game Monopoly was combined with the game Risk what would the skills being developed be with that combination? Monopoly teaches the value of enforcing scarcity. Risk teaches the value of enforcing scarcity. Both involve the scarcity of land use. Does that make sense? |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 70 So whatever you do with the other counterfeit vote, the votes that won't be counted, is superfluous at best, and counterproductive in a measurable way. As you could have done something useful with the time you spend choosing and then actually voting in the National Election Psycho. Changed "votes" to singular; changed "As" to "since;" changed "spend" to "spent" and revised punctuation: Your vote of sending Federal Reserve Notes to the National Government is the actual vote that counts, it seems to me. So whatever you do with the other counterfeit vote (the vote that won't be counted) is superfluous, at best, and counterproductive, in a measurable way, since you could have done something useful with the time you spent choosing and then actually voting in the National Election Psycho. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 70 You are actually playing with psychopaths, and that is the fact of the matter in any way you may want to measure it. It ends up being participation in torture and mass murder made legal. Added comma: You are actually playing with psychopaths, and that is the fact of the matter, in any way you may want to measure it. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 70 To me there will be a judgment day, and on that day the vote you cast in Federal Reserve Notes sent to the National Legal Crime Cabal will count much more than your frivolous mark placed on an official sounding National Election computer screen, or card, or paper ballot, but they both will say the same thing. Changed comma to semicolon and removed "and." Also added comma after day. To me there will be a judgment day: on that day, the vote you cast in Federal Reserve Notes sent to the National Legal Crime Cabal will count much more than your frivolous mark placed on an official sounding National Election computer screen, or card, or paper ballot, but they both will say the same thing. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 71 You lend moral and material support to torture and mass murder made legal. And not just one person tortured once, legally, and not just one murder victim murdered once, since the scale of these crimes makes Hitler and the Nazi crimes pale in comparison. Since as you have been shown already, it is the same process that was used to finance both Hitler and Stalin; therefore, the body counts are accountable to those specific people who invent, produce, and maintain this THING, which is a process of lending moral and material support to that most egregious crime made legal CABAL that can be known by many names, such as The Dollar Hegemony, denominated in dollars, or the World Bank, or the World Reserve Currency Power, or The New World Order, or Legal Crime, whichever word accounts most accurately. Modified for readability: You lend moral and material support to torture and mass murder made legal (not just one person tortured once, legally -- and not just one murder victim murdered once) since the scale of these crimes makes Hitler and the Nazi crimes pale in comparison. You have been shown already that the same process was used to finance both Hitler and Stalin; therefore, the body counts are accountable to those specific people who invent, produce, and maintain this THING which is a process of lending moral and material support to that most egregious crime-made-legal CABAL that can be known by many names such as: The Dollar Hegemony (denominated in dollars), or the World Bank, or the World Reserve Currency Power, or The New World Order, or Legal Crime…whichever word accounts most accurately. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 71 Again, to me, your vote for Romney is pathetic compared to the flow of Federal Reserve Notes that flow from you, and all the other honest productive people, flowing to Legal Crime Central, so... Removed comma before and; changed comma after people to ... Again, to me, your vote for Romney is pathetic compared to the flow of Federal Reserve Notes that flow from you and all the other honest productive people…flowing to Legal Crime Central, so... |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 71 What is really important, now that we have spoken about the pathetic stuff? removed comma: What is really important now that we have spoken about the pathetic stuff? |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 72 I can't vote for Romney, I do not want that to haunt me for the slightest increment of time, never mind for eternity. Made into 2 sentences: I can't vote for Romney. I do not want that to haunt me for the slightest increment of time, never mind for eternity. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 72 If Ron Paul is on the ballot, I have a reason to vote because he may work toward ending The FED, the IRS, and bringing the troops home. modified as follows: If Ron Paul is on the ballot, I have a reason to vote because he may work toward ending The FED and the IRS as well as bringing the troops home. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 72 Evil is evil. Stop supporting it and it will be supported less, and how can that not be obvious, and accurately measurable? Modified as follows: Evil is evil. Stop supporting it, and it will be supported less. How can that not be obvious and accurately measurable? |
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bear Guest
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JOE This is confusing to me: "He seemed to listen." [Joe: Not a reference to Romney] ----------------------- I wonder if I should change it as follows: "The person I was talking to seemed to listen" |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 73 If we were farmers and we found out our soil was gaining aluminum, barium, and other things, and that the PH was turning acidic. Would hoping that it goes away do any good? Combined into single sentence as the first sentence seems incomplete to me: If we were farmers and we found out our soil was gaining aluminum, barium, and other things, and that the PH was turning acidic, would hoping that it goes away do any good? |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 73 I can't get far from the obvious solutions and I have my own competitive ideas as to how to accomplish those solutions. 1. End the FED 2. End the IRS 3. Bring the Troops Home Added comma and changed period to colon: I can't get far from the obvious solutions, and I have my own competitive ideas as to how to accomplish those solutions: 1. End the FED 2. End the IRS 3. Bring the Troops Home |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 73 "So, Joe, what can we do about it? How can we get enough American’s to wake up over night?" Removed apostrophe "So, Joe, what can we do about it? How can we get enough Americans to wake up over night?" |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 74 Liberty works one way (many competitive ways). Legal Crime works another way (obey or else). Changed parenthesis to colon: Liberty works one way: many competitive ways. Legal Crime works another way: obey or else. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 74 When the Friends of Liberty fight Legal Criminals the Legal Criminals are the offenders, and the Friends of Liberty are the Defenders, if it comes to that, and it has in the past, so this is not NEWS. added and removed comma: When the Friends of Liberty fight Legal Criminals, the Legal Criminals are the offenders and the Friends of Liberty are the Defenders, if it comes to that, and it has in the past, so this is not NEWS. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 74 In a dark room there will be a lot of stumbling around? Added comma: In a dark room, there will be a lot of stumbling around? |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 74 The buildings were losing money, so they had to be destroyed. The people who destroyed them made a profit, and the fact that they destroyed them with a lot of people in them was even more profitable for the criminals who destroyed them since they could then make money on the aggressive wars for profit that were launched by falsely blaming innocent people for the crime of destroying those building while people were still in 2 of them. The third building was evacuated. Broke into an additional sentence and pluralized building: The buildings were losing money, so they had to be destroyed. The people who destroyed them made a profit. The fact that they destroyed them with a lot of people in them was even more profitable for the criminals who destroyed them since they could then make money on the aggressive wars for profit that were launched by falsely blaming innocent people for the crime of destroying those buildings while people were still in 2 of them. The third building was evacuated. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 74 Afghanistan was on the list of places to destroy with aggressive war because of the opium that is grown in Afghanistan and because of the need to use the place to transport petroleum products, oil and natural gas, through it. Changed commas to parenthesis to alert the reader that a list of 3 items is not being introduced: Afghanistan was on the list of places to destroy with aggressive war because of the opium that is grown in Afghanistan and because of the need to use the place to transport petroleum products (oil and natural gas) through it. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 74 The demolition of those buildings on that day was a classic case of a False Flag operation. No different than dressing up as Indians, slaughtering White Settlers, blaming the slaughter of White Settlers on the neighboring Indians so as to slaughter the Indians and then take over control of the land that is occupied by the Indians. Modified as follows: The demolition of those buildings on that day was a classic case of a False Flag operation. No different than dressing up as Indians, slaughtering White Settlers, and blaming the slaughter of White Settlers on the neighboring Indians in order to slaughter the Indians to then take over control of the land that is occupied by the Indians. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 75 It is an unambiguous case of willful premeditated murder for profit. Added comma according to Rule 6 at http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/607/02/ : It is an unambiguous case of willful, premeditated murder for profit. |
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bear Guest
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7/1/13 page 75 If you were on a Jury, a real Jury not a counterfeit one, you could ask anyone whose profession is relevant to the case, and you could judge the case on professional evidence discovered during the case, and then actual people could be held accountable for those crimes. Added parenthesis: If you were on a Jury (a real Jury, not a counterfeit one), you could ask anyone whose profession is relevant to the case, and you could judge the case on professional evidence discovered during the case, and then actual people could be held accountable for those crimes. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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"The person I was talking to seemed to listen" bear, That looks a lot better. I remember having trouble with that message, so your improvement is very obvious to me. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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"Again, to me, your vote for Romney is pathetic compared to the flow of Federal Reserve Notes that flow from you and all the other honest productive people…flowing to Legal Crime Central, so..." I like that improvement. It flows. |
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bear Guest
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JOEIf the game Monopoly was combined with the game Risk what would the skills being developed be with that combination? I believe in my editing work yesterday, I came across the answer to that question: "No different than dressing up as Indians, slaughtering White Settlers, and blaming the slaughter of White Settlers on the neighboring Indians in order to slaughter the Indians to then take over control of the land that is occupied by the Indians." --Joe Kelley i.e. money interest combined with military interest used by Legal Criminals...except some of their crimes are not Legal, but very well covered up, as in dressed up in costume...and the innocent white settlers and the innocent native Indians pay the cost as they are made scarce so that a new crop of white settlers and marauders can be fostered and reaped for a scarce gain. -- bear And add lib words from Joe coming to the front of bear's memory: What if all the money sunk into scarcity was directed towards investments in abundance? OK Joe, now bear must get to work. I am sorry the 1776 thing didn't work out. But what I am not understanding is what difference does it make whether people talk back or make comments? Maybe seeds are planted. Maybe those seeds take hold and form new thought patterns in the readers. You may never personally know the benefit of your words left as seeds, but if people benefit, what difference does it make if it is one-way communication? Or maybe I am not understanding correctly. |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 76 “No faith is not earned. Ephesians 2: 8 - 9 (quoting so may not be perfect) “For by grace are ye saved THRU FAITH AND THAT NOT OF YOURSELVES, IT IS A GIFT OF GOD, NOT OF WORKS, LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST.” Faith is a gift. We will not stand in our own merit. It will all be of God. I will not be able to stand there in his presence and say, “Look what I have done to get here.” Joe the point is: I can't get there alone. I am without hope in this world without Christ.” That answer to that question is added to this book, because my ears can listen, but I am only one lost soul. [Joe: addition to original] Modified: bear: “No, faith is not earned, it is a gift: Ephesians 2: 8-9 (quoting so may not be perfect) For by grace are ye saved THRU FAITH AND THAT NOT OF YOURSELVES, IT IS A GIFT OF GOD, NOT OF WORKS, LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST. "Faith is a gift. We will not stand in our own merit. It will all be of God. I will not be able to stand there in is presence and say, ‘Look what I have done to get here.’ Joe the point is: I can't get there alone. I am without hope in this world without Christ.” (That answer to that question is added to this book, because my ears can listen, but I am only one lost soul. --Joe) |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 76 I don't know. I am not God. I have to question my own judgment, failure to do so is ludicrous, deceitful, threatening, and can place me in violent situations: if I am not careful enough to question my own judgment where and when I can still afford to do so in time. Broke into additional sentence: I don't know. I am not God. I have to question my own judgment. Failure to do so is ludicrous, deceitful, threatening, and can place me in violent situations: if I am not careful enough to question my own judgment where and when I can still afford to do so in time. |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 76 "I suppose jackals and piranhas yell fire…and thinking of it from your welcome explanation given by Solzhenitsyn, it is to silence competition whereby ectropy would exist?" Modified for readability: "I suppose jackals and piranhas yell fire…and thinking of it from your welcome explanation given by Solzhenitsyn, fire is yelled to silence competition whereby ectropy would exist?" |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,What if all the money sunk into scarcity was directed towards investments in abundance? OK Joe, now bear must get to work. Feedback is how I learn how to communicate both ways. How can I learn if I can't listen to feedback? What is the nature, the substance, and the form of the resistance to feedback? What blocks the flow of information? In the case of the 1776 Web Site, who knows, I don't, they stopped replying to me. As to the use of power to make power abundant there are obvious accurate measures is stark contrast to the opposite, once those filters, like sun glasses, are used when looking around. What is love? What is hate? |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 77 The problem with connectivity is such that destructive things can travel as well as productive things, and if someone were to confuse destructive things with productive things, they may BLAME the medium of exchange, because they fail to judge the stuff being transferred accurately. Removed comma before because: The problem with connectivity is such that destructive things can travel as well as productive things, and if someone were to confuse destructive things with productive things, they may BLAME the medium of exchange because they fail to judge the stuff being transferred accurately. |
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bear Guest
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What is love? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvgILBGcavQ or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pra8Rktk40I Feedback is how I learn how to communicate both ways. How can I learn if I can't listen to feedback? When does one teach? When does one learn? What is the goal? End the Fed & IRS and bring the troops home? What is the goal of the folks at 1776? |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 77 I keep repeating the same thing. "Society in every state is a blessing, but Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one: for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same miseries BY A GOVERNMENT, which we might expect in a country WITHOUT GOVERNMENT, our calamity is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer." Thomas Paine Changed period to colon and changed quotes to block quote: I keep repeating the same thing: Society in every state is a blessing, but Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one: for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same miseries BY A GOVERNMENT, which we might expect in a country WITHOUT GOVERNMENT, our calamity is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer. — Thomas Paine |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 77 When the people who are being destroyed by despotism (Legal Crime) wake up, they then stop seeking the virus as if the virus can cure them. added comma: When the people who are being destroyed by despotism (Legal Crime) wake up, they then stop seeking the virus, as if the virus can cure them. |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 77/78 Legal Criminals know this, and so they make sure that those ideas do not become current, those ideas do not gain currency. And instead of those ideas gaining currency, a virus called Falsehood is made current, gaining currency through such things as Television which is almost an ideal Medium of Exchange for Dictators (Legal Criminals). Modified as follows: Legal Criminals know this so they make sure that those ideas do not become current, and those ideas do not gain currency. Instead of those ideas gaining currency, a virus called Falsehood is made current, gaining currency through such things as Television, which is almost an ideal Medium of Exchange for Dictators (Legal Criminals). |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 78 When human beings stop seeking the virus, as if it was the cure, they will look back at this time and they will wonder, as we wonder about the people in Germany during the Nazi regime, "what were they thinking?" capitalized What When human beings stop seeking the virus, as if it was the cure, they will look back at this time and they will wonder, as we wonder about the people in Germany during the Nazi regime, "What were they thinking?" |
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bear Guest
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Joe"Josf, can you hear the lies?" That there makes me smile...Josf, is so patient with bear I wonder did you laugh when you read it the first time? bear wants to vote for Romney, and wonders if Josf can hear the lies! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaTB2Q3v6Zc I suppose I am getting off topic |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 79 "Balance is in order…I have a family…I just don’t have time even though I don't like what I see as injustice, or playing dirty." Removed comma: "Balance is in order…I have a family…I just don’t have time even though I don't like what I see as injustice or playing dirty." |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 79 I spent my life, my power, making rocks and sand for construction, for the most part, the productive physical part of my life. And what would I have done had I been more balanced, more productive, better, more connected with the concept of morality, productivity, spirituality? Added comma. Took out And: I spent my life, my power, making rocks and sand for construction, for the most part, the productive, physical part of my life. What would I have done had I been more balanced, more productive, better, more connected with the concept of morality, productivity, spirituality? |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 79 God only knows and I'm going to be clued in on Judgment Day? Added comma: God only knows, and I'm going to be clued in on Judgment Day? |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 79 To me the principle at work there: is the concept of any willful injury to anyone by anyone, is an injury to everyone. The innocent victim on the table being tortured right now is not happening in your kitchen. And the fact that it isn't happening in your kitchen is merely incidental. You are next. You are paying for that torture, so you are next, unless you hire on as the torturer, and even then you are only delaying your turn on the torture table. There will always be a more powerful criminal to take your place when the number of ready victims becomes scarce. modified punctuation as follows: To me, the principle at work there is the concept of any willful injury to anyone by anyone is an injury to everyone. The innocent victim on the table being tortured right now is not happening in your kitchen, and the fact that it isn't happening in your kitchen is merely incidental. You are next. You are paying for that torture, so you are next unless you hire on as the torturer, and even then you are only delaying your turn on the torture table. There will always be a more powerful criminal to take your place when the number of ready victims becomes scarce. |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 79 That is the Might makes Right scenario, cannibalism, we each eat each other until there are two of us left. Replaced commas with dashes: That is the Might makes Right scenario – cannibalism – we each eat each other until there are two of us left. |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 79 Yes if it concerns injuries to innocent people; no if it does not concern injuries to innocent people. Who is “we?” Made another sentence and moved question mark outside of quotes per: http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/577/03/ Yes, if it concerns injuries to innocent people. No, if it does not concern injuries to innocent people. Who is “we”? |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 80 Without morality, or spirituality (whatever word works best) the “Decide” part is directionless or will the decide part be directed by evil? moved commas and added italics: Without morality or spirituality (whatever word works best), the “Decide” part is directionless, or will the decide part be directed by evil? |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 80 To me this falls again into the category of two different worlds where you and I are targets because we produce more than we consume. And that is uncontroversial if there is a net sheet known as the Federal Tax "Liabilities," and our world is driven by equitable thoughts and actions, The Golden Rule, morality, spirituality, whatever word works best in any case in this type of productive world. Our world, where we have less at the start of the day and we have more at the end of the day, on average, over time, while the other world is Might making Right, or Falsehood, Lies, Threats, and Violence, taking and using what is taken to take more. So you can try to figure out from our world what their world is like, but seriously, it is another world. So you can, at best, guess, and you can borrow from other people: “Confessions of a Monopolist” by Frederic Clemson Howe, or “Confessions of an Economic Hit Man” by John Perkins, or “Money Masters.” Whatever, the pieces start fitting into an understandable viewpoint, but how far from your world of productivity is that world of destruction? modified: To me, this falls again into the category of two different worlds where you and I are targets because we produce more than we consume. That is uncontroversial if there is a net sheet known as the Federal Tax "Liabilities" and our world is driven by equitable thoughts and actions: The Golden Rule, morality, spirituality (whatever word works best in any case in this type of productive world). Our world, where we have less at the start of the day and we have more at the end of the day, on average, over time, while the other world is Might making Right or Falsehood, Lies, Threats, and Violence taking and using what is taken to take more. So you can try to figure out from our world what their world is like, but seriously, it is another world. So you can, at best, guess, and you can borrow from other people: Confessions of a Monopolist by Frederic Clemson Howe, or Confessions of an Economic Hit Man by John Perkins, or Money Masters, whatever, the pieces start fitting into an understandable viewpoint, but how far from your world of productivity is that world of destruction? |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 81 Are there false examples of Liberty being invented, produced, and maintained by Legal Criminals to divide and conquer those who would be effective at defending Liberty had the fake stuff not been in place to burn out defensive power as defensive power is thereby shunted, wasted, spent doing nothing or worse? added comma: Are there false examples of Liberty being invented, produced, and maintained by Legal Criminals to divide and conquer those who would be effective at defending Liberty had the fake stuff not been in place to burn out defensive power as defensive power is thereby shunted, wasted, spent doing nothing, or worse? |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 81 I don't think a Legal Criminal would ever allow such as thing as the Ross Perot thing to happen if it can be avoided. A baseline was set back when the National Debt was merely 4 Trillion, if I remember right, and now there is another ZERO added to that tally. Changed first as to a and added italics: I don't think a Legal Criminal would ever allow such a thing as the Ross Perot thing to happen if it can be avoided. A baseline was set back when the National Debt was merely 4 Trillion, if I remember right, and now there is another ZERO added to that tally. |
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bear Guest
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7/2/13 page 82 How is that not the same thing as curiosity? We do not see the same way, but I don't think the differences are of any great significance, not, for example, as different as us being compared with someone who employs deceit, threats of violence, and violence to get what they want from innocent victims. You know, voters in a National Election. Broke into another sentence: How is that not the same thing as curiosity? We do not see the same way, but I don't think the differences are of any great significance. Not, for example, as different as us being compared with someone who employs deceit, threats of violence, and violence to get what they want from innocent victims. You know, voters in a National Election. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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"I wonder did you laugh when you read it the first time? bear wants to vote for Romney, and wonders if Josf can hear the lies!" Humor may have found a way into my thinking at that point, it happens often enough, but I don't remember that specific exchange well enough to report accurately. I can say that often I cringe, or a similar feeling of repulsion, when my perception of life is invaded by very evil people, and it is to me an infection of my mind to have any sense of giving any of those high paid liars any credit for anything other than being high paid liars. Ron Paul, and too few other people, are exceptions to the rule that Monopoly Government (Legal Crime) is ruled, with few exceptions, by criminals. Romney makes my skin crawl, just like Clinton. G.W. Bush was comical, an obvious puppet, a frat boy out of his league, to me, more the source of comic relief. On the subject of songs I am currently working on this song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WW21rcHiVU0 |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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7/2/13 page 80 bear, I think you are doing the fine work that is required to make a book worth reading. I am following along on the improvements, and I found a possible additional improvement in this: To me, this falls again into the category of two different worlds where you and I are targets because we produce more than we consume. That is uncontroversial if there is a net sheet known as the Federal Tax "Liabilities" and our world is driven by equitable thoughts and actions: The Golden Rule, morality, spirituality (whatever word works best in any case in this type of productive world). To be more precise there is a problem I see here: That is uncontroversial if there is a net sheet known as the Federal Tax "Liabilities" and <------------- here It could be disconnected further so as not to confuse. Such as: To me, this falls again into the category of two different worlds where you and I are targets because we produce more than we consume. That "debt" based world is uncontroversial since there is a net sheet known as the Federal Tax "Liabilities" proving the fact. Our productive world, on the other hand, is driven by equitable thoughts and actions: The Golden Rule, morality, spirituality (whatever word works best in any case in this type of productive world). It could be arranged better, but I think that there was a problem with the flow of perspective when the two worlds collided in the sentence. |
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bear Guest
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Joe I have your note above. Thank you for providing me with the additional improvement. We are at Grandma's for the 4th and was too tired last nite to do any work. I will try to do some today. |
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bear Guest
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7/5/13 Page 80 Currently: To me, this falls again into the category of two different worlds where you and I are targets because we produce more than we consume. That "debt" based world is uncontroversial since there is a net sheet known as the Federal Tax "Liabilities" proving the fact. Our productive world, on the other hand, is driven by equitable thoughts and actions: The Golden Rule, morality, spirituality (whatever word works best in any case in this type of productive world). Offered Improvement by Joe: To me, this falls again into the category of two different worlds where you and I are targets because we produce more than we consume. That "debt" based world is uncontroversial since there is a net sheet known as the Federal Tax "Liabilities" proving the fact. Our productive world, on the other hand, is driven by equitable thoughts and actions: The Golden Rule, morality, spirituality (whatever word works best in any case in this type of productive world). bear building with Joe's improvement (shown with underline): To me, this falls again into the category of two different worlds where you and I are targets because we produce more than we consume. On one hand, the "debt" based world is uncontroversial since there is a net sheet known as the Federal Tax "Liabilities" proving that fact. Our productive world, on the other hand, is driven by equitable thoughts and actions: The Golden Rule, morality, spirituality (whatever word works best in any case in this type of productive world). |
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bear Guest
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7/5/13 Page 84 That is the name of the game, to gain at the expense of other people before other people can gain at your expense. changed comma to colon for emphasis: That is the name of the game: to gain at the expense of other people before other people can gain at your expense. |
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bear Guest
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7/5/13 Page 84 Might makes right (people driven by that mode of behavior) is a virus that consumes, like cancer, living beings. The entire human race operating on that basis of might making right will consume the entire human race rapidly, starting out slowly, but the pace of consumption, each person at each other's throat, quickens, and the end is a very rapid hell on earth with the last two people having a dire need to kill each other or die trying. Modified for readability: Might makes right (people driven by that mode of behavior) is a virus that consumes, like cancer, living beings. The entire human race operating on that basis of might making right will consume the entire human race, rapidly. Though starting out slowly, the pace of consumption, each person at each other's throat, quickens, and the end is a very rapid hell on earth with the last two people having a dire need to kill each other or die trying. |
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bear Guest
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7/5/13 Page 85 And then two people having similar goals, meet, and they then combined POWER to make less POWER into more POWER which is exponentially more POWERFUL due to division of labor, specialization, and economies of scale compared to one person alone and also compared to two people working separately. Removed comma and Changed combined to combine: And then two people having similar goals meet, and they then combine POWER to make less POWER into more POWER which is exponentially more POWERFUL due to division of labor, specialization, and economies of scale compared to one person alone and also compared to two people working separately. |
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bear Guest
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7/5/13 Page 85 One way makes power abundant and the other way destroys life on Earth. added comma: One way makes power abundant, and the other way destroys life on Earth. |
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bear Guest
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7/5/13 Page 85 If there are no immoral people connected in any way to the group of people who are cooperative, what happens to TOTAL POWER and what is likely to be the difference between the least powerful person and the most powerful person as measured by the scale of Purchasing Power whereby the POWER of deceit is not a factor, and the POWER of threats of violence is not a factor, and the POWER of violence upon the innocent productive people is not factor? Broke into 2 sentences: If there are no immoral people connected in any way to the group of people who are cooperative, what happens to TOTAL POWER? What is likely to be the difference between the least powerful person and the most powerful person as measured by the scale of Purchasing Power whereby the POWER of deceit is not a factor, and the POWER of threats of violence is not a factor, and the POWER of violence upon the innocent productive people is not factor? |
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bear Guest
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7/5/13 Page 85 Person A is X percent more POWERFUL than Person B, without the factor of ill gotten, criminal, means? Removed comma: Person A is X percent more POWERFUL than Person B without the factor of ill gotten, criminal, means? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, "To me, this falls again into the category of two different worlds where you and I are targets because we produce more than we consume. On one hand, the "debt" based world is uncontroversial since there is a net sheet known as the Federal Tax "Liabilities" proving that fact. Our productive world, on the other hand, is driven by equitable thoughts and actions: The Golden Rule, morality, spirituality (whatever word works best in any case in this type of productive world)." I approve of this message. Why do I think that is so funny? |
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bear Guest
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Joe,Why do I think that is so funny? Perhaps funny boy takes after you? Anyways, it made me smile. I am going to try to do a little work this afternoon. |
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bear Guest
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7/6/13 Page 86 If you want we can go through the math in the link provided to help illustrate the point and make the point relevant to this: added comma: If you want, we can go through the math in the link provided to help illustrate the point and make the point relevant to this: |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Do people find winning lottery tickets in the garbage can? |
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bear Guest
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7/6/13 Page 86 If you had millions of dollars handed to you from a lottery ticket you found in the garbage then you would be "lucky" and the grey area of how that much purchasing power became your interest, your concern, or came to be within your POWER to control, to invest, or spend, or save, or give away, would be illustrative of this point. Modified as follows: If you had millions of dollars handed to you from a lottery ticket you found in the garbage, then you would be "lucky." The grey area of how that much purchasing power became your interest, your concern, or came to be within your POWER to control, to invest, spend, save, or give away, would be illustrative of this point. |
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bear Guest
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7/6/13 Page 87 Had I gained control of many millions of units of purchasing power handed to me I'd build a house facing the sun, burmmed into the earth on three sides for insulation, Solar Panels, Windmills, two water wells, an electric fleet of cars to run as a taxi service, a large lot. added comma: Had I gained control of many millions of units of purchasing power handed to me, I'd build a house facing the sun, burmmed into the earth on three sides for insulation, Solar Panels, Windmills, two water wells, an electric fleet of cars to run as a taxi service, a large lot. |
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7/6/13 Page 87 I have no use for gold or silver and if I am no longer of any value to anyone, then I guess I'll be dumpster diving. added comma: I have no use for gold or silver, and if I am no longer of any value to anyone, then I guess I'll be dumpster diving. |
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7/6/13 Page 87 What is the point at which a person has so much "money" that they then have to start working, spending time and energy, keeping their money safe from the criminals? Modified as follows: What is the point at which a person has so much "money" that they then have to start working (spending time and energy) to keep their money safe from the criminals? |
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7/6/13 Page 87 Too many people have joined in the legal crime club, expecting to be handed something for nothing, and they have yet to find out the true cost of that decision, and when they finally get to judgment day, it will be too late to choose a moral path. Broke into 2 sentences: Too many people have joined in the legal crime club, expecting to be handed something for nothing. They have yet to find out the true cost of that decision, and when they finally get to judgment day, it will be too late to choose a moral path. |
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7/6/13 Page 87 If you buy one in so many years you can buy two and then in so many years you can buy four, and then sixteen. It is very long term investments, like buying a house, or buying a farm, or buying a productive business. modified as follows: If you buy one solar panel in so many years, you can buy two, and then in so many years you can buy four, and then sixteen…It is a very long term investment…like buying a house, or buying a farm, or buying a productive business. |
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7/6/13 Page 87 It is like an education. You buy a book, with your time spent reading it carefully, like the Bible I suppose, (there are very valuable things in the Bible) to help make life much richer. modified as follows: It is like an education. You buy a book, and with your time spent reading it carefully, you hope to help make life much richer. (Like the Bible I suppose, there are very valuable things in the Bible.) |
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7/6/13 Page 88 The principle is based upon having less power today and having more power tomorrow. On a very small scale or a very large scale power gaining slowly over a long period of time, or power gaining faster over a shorter time. modified as follows: The principle is based upon having less power today and having more power tomorrow: on a very small scale or a very large scale, power gaining slowly over a long period of time or power gaining faster over a shorter time. |
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7/6/13 Page 83 & 88 "If all the Trillions of Dollars Spent on keeping the Monopoly Money Fraud Power maintained, destroying so much in that effort, was spent only on Solar Panels, nothing else, and sold at cost, or "given" away, instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction: there would be how much production measurable as electricity and whatever was made with electricity? Modified as follows: "If all the Trillions of Dollars Spent on keeping the Monopoly Money Fraud Power maintained (destroying so much in that effort) was spent only on Solar Panels, nothing else, and sold at cost or "given" away -- instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction -- there would be how much production measurable as electricity and whatever was made with electricity? |
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7/6/13 Page 83 & 88 How much would electricity cost if every bomb, missile, military base overseas, solider, food, clothing, supplies shipped overseas, was turned back in time, all the way back to the decision to invade Pennsylvania by Washington in 1794, and instead of that investment in maintaining the Money Monopoly Fraud business, all that POWER was exclusively spent on making Solar Panels, how much would electricity cost per Kilowatt/Hour now? Modified as follows: How much would electricity cost if every bomb, missile, military base overseas, solider, food, clothing, supplies shipped overseas, was turned back in time…all the way back to the decision to invade Pennsylvania by Washington in 1794…and instead of that investment in maintaining the Money Monopoly Fraud business, what if all that POWER was exclusively spent on making Solar Panels? ow much would electricity cost per Kilowatt/Hour now? |
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7/6/13 Page 83 & 88 What would the world be like if no one ever had to work another minute to pay for transportation fuel, home heating fuel, and every single business that requires fuel, POWER, no longer had to add that cost to the price of what they sell? Modified as follows: What would the world be like if no one ever had to work another minute to pay for transportation fuel or home heating fuel and if every single business that requires fuel (POWER) no longer had to add that cost to the price of what they sell? |
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7/6/13 Page 83 & 88 What if, instead of spending all that POWER on destroying things to keep the Money Monopoly Fraud Power secure, was instead spent on making more POWER out of less POWER?” —Joe Modified as follows: What if instead of spending all that POWER on destroying things to keep the Money Monopoly Fraud Power secure, POWER was instead spent on making more POWER out of less POWER?” —Joe |
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7/6/13 Page 89 In that case DOLLARS are being sold. Dollars are being sold, and sold short. You have dollars, you don't want them, you sell them short, you bet on the dollars becoming worthless. I think that is the general idea of selling short. Made into single paragraph joined by colon: In that case DOLLARS are being sold. Dollars are being sold, and sold short: you have dollars, you don't want them, you sell them short, you bet on the dollars becoming worthless. I think that is the general idea of selling short. |
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7/6/13 Page 89 Ohhhhhhh, I need money. What? I need money. Here have some gold. Noooooooooo I need money. Here have some silver. Noooooooooooo I need money. Here have some Solar Panels. Noooooooooooo I need money. Here have some worthless green paper with numbers printed on it. HORRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAA! I have MONEY! What? modified by adding quotes and some commas: “Ohhhhhhh, I need money.” “What?” “I need money.” “Here, have some gold.” “Noooooooooo, I need money.” “Here, have some silver.” “Noooooooooooo, I need money.” “Here, have some Solar Panels.” “Noooooooooooo, I need money.” “Here, have some worthless green paper with numbers printed on it.” “HORRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAA! I have MONEY!” “What?” |
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7/6/13 Page 90 The story was told and I don't know how true it was, and it concerned a 3 Term Presidency for Obama, so I don't put much weight in it. added a comma and changed and to but: The story was told, and I don't know how true it was, but it concerned a 3 Term Presidency for Obama, so I don't put much weight in it. |
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7/6/13 Page 90 I do know that the Central Bankers (Legal Criminals) cause small booms and small busts on a schedule to keep the victims guessing. While the general trend for America is BUST; while the general trend for Asia is BOOM. modified as follows: I do know that the Central Bankers (Legal Criminals) cause small booms and small busts -- on a schedule -- to keep the victims guessing: the general trend for America is BUST…while the general trend for Asia is BOOM. |
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7/7/13 Page 90 So an Oil Shale boom in U.S.A. Inc. (LLC) sounds perfectly reasonable, a few years of counterfeit economic growth, throw in a lot of false advertisements on the Major brainwashing networks, and people feel better, feel safe, and the wars appear to be distant, and the TSA Gestapo may be backed off too, who knows? Broke into 2 sentences: So an Oil Shale boom in U.S.A. Inc. (LLC) sounds perfectly reasonable, a few years of counterfeit economic growth, throw in a lot of false advertisements on the Major brainwashing networks, and people feel better, feel safe, and the wars appear to be distant, and the TSA Gestapo may be backed off too. Who knows? |
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7/7/13 Page 91 You call a Solar Panel company, they say yes, and you now have Solar Panels on your house, and you pay less per month for the same electricity. Added quotes: You call a Solar Panel company: They say, “Yes,” and you now have Solar Panels on your house, and you pay less per month for the same electricity. |
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7/7/13 Page 92 I think that one of the reasons why a World War is necessary, and America has to be gutted, taken down, is the new age of FREE ENERGY, which is not FREE ENERGY, it is Cost-Less-Power. removed comma: I think that one of the reasons why a World War is necessary and America has to be gutted, taken down, is the new age of FREE ENERGY, which is not FREE ENERGY, it is Cost-Less-Power. |
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7/7/13 Page 92 That is the tune. They, or we, know that we are aiding, contributing, making, causing, driving, escalating, fueling disaster, betting on disaster, but we do it anyway, because we are going to win, relatively speaking, and we have a lot of money to keep safe, so we are finding how to keep a lot of money safe - If we have a lot of money. removed comma before because: That is the tune. They, or we, know that we are aiding, contributing, making, causing, driving, escalating, fueling disaster, betting on disaster, but we do it anyway because we are going to win, relatively speaking, and we have a lot of money to keep safe, so we are finding how to keep a lot of money safe - If we have a lot of money. |
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7/7/13 Page 93 About 50% of the population, it seems to me, roughly, are duped into thinking that they too are among the rich, when in fact they are merely expendable game pieces, doing useful things. Things needed to keep the Money Monopoly Fraud oiled up. Modified as follows: About 50% of the population, it seems to me, roughly, are duped into thinking that they too are among the rich. When in fact, they are merely expendable game pieces doing useful things…things needed to keep the Money Monopoly Fraud oiled up. |
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7/7/13 Page 93 Person A is paid some 16,000 Federal Reserve Notes, I'm not sure if I remember the number right, for playing cards at the local Army base most of the time for a month while they are out in the desert, and then it is "show time," and they pretend to be Iraqi citizens, and the Troops pretend to be "spreading democracy" on them. Replaced a set of commas with parenthesis Person A is paid some 16,000 Federal Reserve Notes (I'm not sure if I remember the number right) for playing cards at the local Army base most of the time for a month while they are out in the desert, and then it is "show time," and they pretend to be Iraqi citizens, and the Troops pretend to be "spreading democracy" on them. |
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7/7/13 Page 93 So...you have someone joining them, everyone has joined ‘em. If you use dollars, you are a member of the Union, but the level of "interest" is interesting. Changed punctuation as follows: So...you have someone joining them. Everyone has joined ‘em…if you use dollars, you are a member of the Union, but the level of "interest" is interesting. |
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7/7/13 Page 94 "How about that for a chapter title: If you can’t beat them join them and then discuss how joining them actually ruins power/abundance?" added commas and quotes: "How about that for a chapter title: 'If you can’t beat them, join them,’ and then discuss how joining them actually ruins power/abundance?" |
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7/7/13 Page 94 A next step is to pick a pamphlet size, a size of the paper, which makes me think, since I have regular letter paper printers, so that will be a possible determining factor. modified as follows: A next step is to pick a pamphlet size, a size of the paper, which makes me think that since I have regular letter paper printers, that will be a possible determining factor. |
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7/7/13 Page 94 JOE, could you please look at this as I think that I have re punctuated in order to keep the meaning as you intended...i.e. genuine democracy which is called mob rule by the counterfeiters. AS WAS: You have explained, right there, that which is genuine "democracy" or "mob rule" as the counterfeiters are apt to call it. changed to: You have explained, right there, that which is genuine "democracy" (or "mob rule" as the counterfeiters are apt to call it). |
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7/7/13 Page 94 "I do though want to maintain value of money. That does not mean that I want to play a market or buy and sell. It would only mean that if I have some money I might want to put it into something that would retain value." Corrected punctuation as follows: "I do, though, want to maintain value of money. That does not mean that I want to play a market or buy and sell. It would only mean that, if I have some money, I might want to put it into something that would retain value." |
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7/7/13 Page 94 All that talk about investing in Gold and Silver is talk that is of interest to people who have a lot of accumulated wealth. And my question to anyone with enough wealth to inspire an interest in finding a safe place for it is: how did you get all that power when power is so scarce these days? modified as follows: All that talk about investing in Gold and Silver is talk that is of interest to people who have a lot of accumulated wealth. My question to anyone with enough wealth to inspire an interest in finding a safe place for it is, “How did you get all that power when power is so scarce these days?” |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, AS WAS: You have explained, right there, that which is genuine "democracy" or "mob rule" as the counterfeiters are apt to call it. changed to: You have explained, right there, that which is genuine "democracy" (or "mob rule" as the counterfeiters are apt to call it). The change is an improvement to me. The genuine democracy is voluntary, and the counterfeit version of democracy is involuntary, or in other words there is a free market version in Liberty and there is a criminal version. How much would electricity cost if every bomb, missile, military base overseas, solider, food, clothing, supplies shipped overseas, was turned back in time, all the way back to the decision to invade Pennsylvania by Washington in 1794, and instead of that investment in maintaining the Money Monopoly Fraud business, all that POWER was exclusively spent on making Solar Panels, how much would electricity cost per Kilowatt/Hour now? Modified as follows: How much would electricity cost if every bomb, missile, military base overseas, solider, food, clothing, supplies shipped overseas, was turned back in time…all the way back to the decision to invade Pennsylvania by Washington in 1794…and instead of that investment in maintaining the Money Monopoly Fraud business, what if all that POWER was exclusively spent on making Solar Panels? ow much would electricity cost per Kilowatt/Hour now? I don't know if the typo is only a Forum typo or a typo in the book word file, the sentence is improved (in my opinion) otherwise. "If all the Trillions of Dollars Spent on keeping the Monopoly Money Fraud Power maintained (destroying so much in that effort) was spent only on Solar Panels, nothing else, and sold at cost or "given" away -- instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction -- there would be how much production measurable as electricity and whatever was made with electricity? I want to know why double dashes are used instead of triple periods or parenthesis or comas or single dashes. 1. "given" away -- instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction -- there would 2. "given" away...instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction...there would 3. "given" away (instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction) there would 4. "given" away, instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction, there would 5. "given" away - instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction - there would Is that the first incidence of using -- ? I saw improvements in some long sentences with ... replacing comas. Some of these grammar improvements I am picking up on, but the two dashes are new enough for me to ask for clarification or a link, please. I hope all is well in bear world. It is like an education. You buy a book, with your time spent reading it carefully, like the Bible I suppose, (there are very valuable things in the Bible) to help make life much richer. modified as follows: It is like an education. You buy a book, and with your time spent reading it carefully, you hope to help make life much richer. (Like the Bible I suppose, there are very valuable things in the Bible.) I wonder about the need for parenthesis with the long sentence divided into two smaller sentences? If you buy one solar panel in so many years, you can buy two, and then in so many years you can buy four, and then sixteen…It is a very long term investment…like buying a house, or buying a farm, or buying a productive business. Is "...It" supposed to be capitalized? I see you are now working on this, and I know it is very tiring work for me, so I hope you are not suffering through it too much. If you want I can take the file and work on it awhile. I can try to use your routine corrections as far as I know at this point. Joe, Do people find winning lottery tickets in the garbage can? bear, I don't know, but that sounds like a minor increase in the odds of winning, since the odds of winning are very high, and then adding the odds of finding a lottery ticket in the garbage is even more "lucky" with even higher odds against winning. |
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7/7/13 Page 95 Someone has to be financing the Military Industrial Money Monopoly Complex other than my tax payments, and I don't get anything in return, I don't even get the Social Security I thought was an insurance policy taken out on my behalf in the event that I got sick, which is what happened. And I went all the way to a judge, and the judge said, basically, don't call us we will call you. Modified as follows: Someone has to be financing the Military Industrial Money Monopoly Complex other than my tax payments, and I don't get anything in return. I don't even get the Social Security I thought was an insurance policy taken out on my behalf in the event that I got sick. Which is what happened, and I went all the way to a judge, and the judge said, basically: Don't call us, we will call you. |
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7/7/13 Page 95 Not the troops, at least not the low level troops, which would be what: anyone Colonel or Captain rank or lower? modified as follows: Not the troops, at least not the low level troops…which would be what…anyone Colonel or Captain rank or lower? |
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7/7/13 Page 95 Get a house in the country, build it half under-ground, burmmed on three sides, facing south; get a bunch of Solar Panels, a fleet of Electric Cars; hire drivers to taxi and sell the cars. What is the problem? modified as follows: Get a house in the country, build it half under-ground, burmmed on three sides, facing south; get a bunch of Solar Panels and a fleet of Electric Cars; hire drivers to taxi and sell the cars. What is the problem? |
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7/7/13 Page 95 I hear that the soil is now deteriorating, being contaminated with aluminum and barium for some strange, inexplicable, mysterious, reason. removed comma before reason: I hear that the soil is now deteriorating, being contaminated with aluminum and barium for some strange, inexplicable, mysterious reason. |
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7/7/13 Page 96 It does not have to be either/or and that is the point, each moral person IS responsible, and each moral person, by definition, pays their own costs, going on their own authority, not mine. broke into 2 sentences: It does not have to be either/or, and that is the point. Each moral person IS responsible, and each moral person, by definition, pays their own costs, going on their own authority, not mine. |
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7/8/13 Page 96 "So my $100 just sits turning into less and less as each day goes by. What should I do?" added comma: "So my $100 just sits, turning into less and less as each day goes by. What should I do?" |
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7/8/13 Page 96 Again, and I think the passage that goes "give unto Caesar that which is Caesar's" applies. You are not even in the game, so those concerns (how much you can make money make money) do not apply, not unless you figure out how to supply a demand. added quotes for readability: Again, and I think the passage that goes "give unto Caesar that which is Caesar's" applies. You are not even in the game, so those concerns (how much you can make money “make money”) do not apply, not unless you figure out how to supply a demand. |
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7/8/13 Page 96 I think that there will be a demand for the information you are uncovering. So an investment now may actually be a book and the accumulation of knowledge required to sell the book. But that makes sense to me in the context of my present situation, along the same lines as learning how to work as a Common Law Lawyer or run for office. modified as follows (put back some of the commas you original had and I think it works better the way you had it as one long sentence )I think that there will be a demand for the information you are uncovering, so an investment now may actually be a book and the accumulation of knowledge required to sell the book, but that makes sense to me, in the context of my present situation, along the same lines as learning how to work as a Common Law Lawyer or run for office. |
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7/8/13 Page 96 Tomato jars is the same thing. Replaced is with are: Tomato jars are the same thing. |
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7/8/13 Page 96 You have scarce power in knowing better as to how to make more power out of less power, so what is the best investment of your scarce power now? Removed as to: You have scarce power in knowing better how to make more power out of less power, so what is the best investment of your scarce power now? |
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7/8/13 Page 97 I think that the most important power required, stored in your mind, is knowing that a fork in the road may arrive too soon and the right way has to be taken because the wrong way is too costly. And by that I mean that a person can become their own worst enemy if they are not prepared mentally for very challenging situations where doing the wrong thing may appear to be an easy way out, including doing nothing. Added that and removed And: I think that the most important power required, stored in your mind, is knowing that a fork in the road may arrive too soon and that the right way has to be taken because the wrong way is too costly. By that I mean that a person can become their own worst enemy if they are not prepared mentally for very challenging situations where doing the wrong thing may appear to be an easy way out, including doing nothing. |
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7/8/13 Page 98 You are invited to listen in as Joe sets bear straight on what is tax and what is voting and what possibilities might constitute paying or not paying taxes. bear is amazed as Joe can take a single word or phrase or question and dissect the concept into many different possibilities. bear laughs reading Joe’s words, “I'm not buying the premise of the question - at all.” bear never imagined that such a question would not be bought! If Joe were a fish, he would be colossal indeed, as he never seems to swallow hook, line, and sinker! bear didn’t even imagine that a bait and switch routine was offered. I think that is partly what intrigues bear when dialoging with Joe, as simple questions are asked, one never knows what multi-faceted, educational reply will return! added commas: You are invited to listen in as Joe sets bear straight on what is tax, and what is voting, and what possibilities might constitute paying or not paying taxes. bear is amazed as Joe can take a single word, or phrase, or question and dissect the concept into many different possibilities. bear laughs reading Joe’s words, “I'm not buying the premise of the question - at all.” bear never imagined that such a question would not be bought! If Joe were a fish, he would be colossal indeed, as he never seems to swallow hook, line, and sinker! bear didn’t even imagine that a bait and switch routine was offered. I think that is partly what intrigues bear when dialoging with Joe, as simple questions are asked, one never knows what multi-faceted, educational reply will return! JOE, I miss this: "I think that is partly what intrigues bear when dialoging with Joe, as simple questions are asked, one never knows what multi-faceted, educational reply will return!" I know times change and we find ourselves in different places these days, but I sincerely miss those precious spoons offered to me. I even hoped today that all that I had woken up to was maybe just a mistake, but reading the exchange in this comment reminds me that things are not as I once thought they were. But I sure wish I still enjoyed that "pie in the sky" that I thought I was living under. I guess it is a different kind of pie, perhaps a cow pie as it seems in this dialog you remind me that crap rolls downhill. I hope all is well with you and yours. I will hit page 100 soon! |
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7/8/13 Page 98 These symbols in English were arranged and published as currency, verbal currency, equitably transferred on the Forum called The Daily Paul, over a span of many months. Since then, and credited to bear’s diligent help, I’ve made major breakthroughs in thinking – I think. Added italics: These symbols in English were arranged and published as currency, verbal currency, equitably transferred on the Forum called The Daily Paul, over a span of many months. Since then, and credited to bear’s diligent help, I’ve made major breakthroughs in thinking – I think. |
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7/8/13 Page 99 Person A is a victim if Person A is forced to pay those taxes or pay taxes of a different nature such as being forced to go to the Gulag, be raped, beaten, or murdered, or just spending "time out" of Liberty watching television. added colon: Person A is a victim if Person A is forced to pay those taxes or pay taxes of a different nature such as: being forced to go to the Gulag, be raped, beaten, or murdered, or just spending "time out" of Liberty watching television. |
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7/8/13 Page 99 But any outward communication that may signal to other people that questions are being asked internally, may, fearfully and terribly, cause that person tons of stress so internal power is spent destroying the internal power to judge right from wrong. modified as follows: But any outward communication that may signal to other people that questions are being asked internally, may fearfully and terribly cause that person tons of stress, so internal power is spent destroying the internal power to judge right from wrong. |
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7/8/13 Page 99 Person C, yet again altogether different, pretends to pay taxes while keeping two sets of books: one set of books to remain in business, the other to fool the fellow criminals. One set of books is to balance the income and costs, while knowing the nature of the game to do unto other people before they have a chance to do unto me. And so the idea is to cheat and steal. And that is an investment. Pretending to pay taxes, while creating and employing every conceivable loop hole; at the same time promoting the concept of forcing other people, less inclined to "join ‘em," to pay "their fair share" or else. Do as I say, not as I do, but don’t let the cat out of the bag. modified as follows: Person C, yet again altogether different, pretends to pay taxes while keeping two sets of books. One set of books to remain in business, the other to fool the fellow criminals. One set of books is to balance the income and costs (while knowing the nature of the game is to do unto other people before they have a chance to do unto me). So the idea is to cheat and steal, and that is an investment: pretending to pay taxes while creating and employing every conceivable loop hole, and at the same time promoting the concept of forcing other people, less inclined to "join ‘em," to pay "their fair share" or else. Do as I say, not as I do, but don’t let the cat out of the bag. |
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7/8/13 Page 100 If from cradle to grave a person like Ben Bernanke, a typical welfare mama, or papa, who knows these days, but typical welfare baby anyway, draining the productive capacity of those who actually produce, does not pay taxes. Ben baby does not pay taxes. Then the poster boy of welfare, Ben baby, is on the receiving end of the extortion racket. So they don't pay taxes, but do they vote? modified as follows: If from cradle to grave, a person like Ben Bernanke, a typical welfare mama, or papa (who knows these days, but typical welfare baby anyway) draining the productive capacity of those who actually produce, does not pay taxes…Ben baby does not pay taxes…then the poster boy of welfare -- Ben baby -- is on the receiving end of the extortion racket: so they don't pay taxes, but do they vote? |
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7/8/13 Page 100 People who don't work for dollars, but are paid in some way, somewhere in America, avoiding any transfers of earnings by never allowing the hooks of The Dollar Hegemony to sink in, vote? Or do they vote? Added Do and italicized they: Do people who don't work for dollars, but are paid in some way, somewhere in America, avoiding any transfers of earnings by never allowing the hooks of The Dollar Hegemony to sink in, vote? Or do they vote? |
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7/8/13 Page 100 If you can offer up an example of what you mean by the term non tax payer, a person with a name, then it can be understood better what your question intends to answer - with an accurate answer. added italics: If you can offer up an example of what you mean by the term non tax payer, a person with a name, then it can be understood better what your question intends to answer - with an accurate answer. |
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7/8/13 Page 100 "Society in every state is a blessing, but Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one: for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same miseries BY A GOVERNMENT, which we might expect in a country WITHOUT GOVERNMENT, our calamity is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer." changed to block quote: Society in every state is a blessing, but Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one: for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same miseries BY A GOVERNMENT, which we might expect in a country WITHOUT GOVERNMENT, our calamity is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer. |
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7/8/13 Page 101 If Ben Franklin or you, or anyone, views a person doing bad things and your conclusion is that the person needs religion, then you mean something specific, not just a word. moved commas: If Ben Franklin, or you, or anyone views a person doing bad things and your conclusion is that the person needs religion, then you mean something specific, not just a word. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I had missed your message from 7/7 about dashes and will reply later today/tonight. I have a day with the Amish and my youngest has baseball tonite. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Thanks for the notes. I will keep monitoring this web site. I hope all is well in your life too. All is well here. Thanks |
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bear Guest
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JOE, I have some downtime at doc with Amish so I am able to answer sooner than later Regarding dashes: http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/566/1/ : "Dash Dashes are used to set off or emphasize the content enclosed within dashes or the content that follows a dash. Dashes place more emphasis on this content than parentheses...Use a dash to set off an appositive phrase that already includes commas. An appositive is a word that adds explanatory or clarifying information to the noun that precedes it." Here is an explanation as to why I am using double dashes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dash#Rendering_dashes_on_computers : "Typewriters and early computers have traditionally had only a limited character set, often having no key that produces a dash. In consequence, it became common to substitute the nearest available punctuation mark or symbol. Em dashes are often represented in British usage by a single hyphen-minus surrounded by spaces, or in American usage by two hyphen-minuses surrounded by spaces." (also if you look to the beginning of the wiki article (at the top of the page) there is more explanation on dashes. If you look at the owl punctuation link above you will see that they use dashes like this-with the information linked, no space. I do not like that look. I like this - better; and better than that I like -- most. But Joe, what do you like? If you look at the wiki article there are codes that make long dashes, but I do not know how to do that. I noticed that you are able to do that with you write: —Joe you have a longer dash. I do not know how to do that without copying your long dash: — I could go back and replace -- with — if you like that better, or eve with—if you like the attached look better, or if you prefer no dashes at all, I can put in ... or parenthesis. I think it was just the feeling I had with the information, punctuation has some rules but also it has some wiggle room. And lots of wiggle room if you prefer Let me know what you think. I want it to be pleasing to you your eye! PS, I googled https://www.google.com/search?q=punctuation+dash&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a but the wiki link is what I went with after I had checked the owl link to begin with. I did not look at the other google offers. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, continuing with dash info using quotes to the specific information now (previous reply was more general) "If all the Trillions of Dollars Spent on keeping the Monopoly Money Fraud Power maintained (destroying so much in that effort) was spent only on Solar Panels, nothing else, and sold at cost or "given" away -- instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction -- there would be how much production measurable as electricity and whatever was made with electricity? I used the double dash in the paragraph "If all the Trillions of Dollars Spent on keeping the Monopoly Money Fraud Power maintained (destroying so much in that effort) was spent only on Solar Panels, nothing else, and sold at cost or "given" away -- instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction -- there would be how much production measurable as electricity and whatever was made with electricity? because I wanting a distinct and very pronounced call-out of "INSTEAD OF ALL THAT ACTUAL, MEASURABLE, DESTRUCTION." I didn't use () because to me information inside () seems more incidental to the meaning of the paragraph. Kinda like sub-information. When I use ... I am kinda thinking more like a long pause linking information together. Kinda like a quick daydream. Not exactly a daydream, I don't know what words to use. So -- to me is like : except that the information being highlighted is enclosed between the set of dashes -- info -- . (hitting reply now so I don't lose this but am going to open back up and continue.) Is that the first incidence of using -- ? I did a quick search on Joe Quotes and found this: Also used here on page 71: "You lend moral and material support to torture and mass murder made legal (not just one person tortured once, legally -- and not just one murder victim murdered once) since the scale of these crimes makes Hitler and the Nazi crimes pale in comparison. " (however, it did not use them as a set, and that may be incorrect, I need to double check) page 76 "(That answer to that question is added to this book, because my ears can listen, but I am only one lost soul. --Joe)" (That one probably needs changed to one of your long dashes.) page 83 "If all the Trillions of Dollars Spent on keeping the Monopoly Money Fraud Power maintained (destroying so much in that effort) was spent only on Solar Panels, nothing else, and sold at cost or "given" away -- instead of all that actual, measurable, destruction -- there would be how much production measurable as electricity and whatever was made with electricity?" page 90 "I do know that the Central Bankers (Legal Criminals) cause small booms and small busts -- on a schedule -- to keep the victims guessing: the general trend for America is BUST…while the general trend for Asia is BOOM." page 100 "If from cradle to grave, a person like Ben Bernanke, a typical welfare mama, or papa (who knows these days, but typical welfare baby anyway) draining the productive capacity of those who actually produce, does not pay taxes…Ben baby does not pay taxes…then the poster boy of welfare -- Ben baby -- is on the receiving end of the extortion racket: so they don't pay taxes, but do they vote?" --------------------------------- So, it looks to me like it is something that I recently started doing. It also looks like I am doing that in some places because the sentences are extra long and it helps with readability. Just let me know what you prefer. I can easily replace these instances with something more preferable to Joe, as that would be preferable to bear too |
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bear Guest
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JOE Thank you for noting How much would electricity cost if every bomb, missile, military base overseas, solider, food, clothing, supplies shipped overseas, was turned back in time, all the way back to the decision to invade Pennsylvania by Washington in 1794, and instead of that investment in maintaining the Money Monopoly Fraud business, all that POWER was exclusively spent on making Solar Panels, how much would electricity cost per Kilowatt/Hour now? I checked and the typo is on the forum, but I really thought I was going to find it in the document because I normally do a straight cut and paste from the document to the forum, but I must have missed, or changed something at the last minute...of course, I can't remember which or why, but I am glad you are watching! It could have easily have been left that way in the word doc. |
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bear Guest
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joe, have to run now will looking into the following when I return It is like an education. You buy a book, with your time spent reading it carefully, like the Bible I suppose, (there are very valuable things in the Bible) to help make life much richer. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, regarding:It is like an education. You buy a book, with your time spent reading it carefully, like the Bible I suppose, (there are very valuable things in the Bible) to help make life much richer. I can take parenthesis out to read: It is like an education. You buy a book, and with your time spent reading it carefully, you hope to help make life much richer. Like the Bible I suppose, there are very valuable things in the Bible. or: It is like an education. You buy a book, and with your time spent reading it carefully, you hope to help make life much richer....like the Bible I suppose, there are very valuable things in the Bible. (I may have been minimizing your speaking of the Bible in my mind when I put it in parenthesis. I was hearing it more of an afterthought so I stuck parenthesis around it.) Just let me know how you want it done |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, "But Joe, what do you like?" I like this: If from cradle to grave, a person like Ben Bernanke, a typical welfare mama, or papa (who knows these days, but typical welfare baby anyway) draining the productive capacity of those who actually produce, does not pay taxes…Ben baby does not pay taxes…then the poster boy of welfare -- Ben baby -- is on the receiving end of the extortion racket: so they don't pay taxes, but do they vote? A big problem I have is inconsistency in my own state of mind (or body, or both) when reading small sections of the book. Now that I see the second incident of using those double dashes it looks consistent, or better, or more user friendly, or more effective at transferring the message intact. I like that sentence that way. I also read another sentence that struck me as a very good improvement. I'll find it: I think that the most important power required, stored in your mind, is knowing that a fork in the road may arrive too soon and that the right way has to be taken because the wrong way is too costly. By that I mean that a person can become their own worst enemy if they are not prepared mentally for very challenging situations where doing the wrong thing may appear to be an easy way out, including doing nothing. I really like the use of the "By that I mean..." beginning of a new sentence, which replaces my overuse of and, and, and, and, so that the message is now very rich with ideas, such as the strength of competitive explanation (looking at one thing from many angles) instead of merely repeating the same thing. "I think it was just the feeling I had with the information, punctuation has some rules but also it has some wiggle room. And lots of wiggle room if you prefer" Explanations for future use (assuming I can remember) are one thing, but the other question I had is now answered, your improvements, including the double dashes, aid the accurate message flow. Please keep your improvements already done, and if you have any new ideas please don't hesitate to try them out. "because I wanting a distinct and very pronounced call-out of "INSTEAD OF ALL THAT ACTUAL, MEASURABLE, DESTRUCTION." I didn't use () because to me information inside () seems more incidental to the meaning of the paragraph. Kinda like sub-information. When I use ... I am kinda thinking more like a long pause linking information together. Kinda like a quick daydream. Not exactly a daydream, I don't know what words to use. So -- to me is like : except that the information being highlighted is enclosed between the set of dashes -- info -- . (hitting reply now so I don't lose this but am going to open back up and continue.)" That is the work of an artist, in my view, and it is inspiring for me to hear how you have such an intense interest in the things that you do, so I'm wondering now how well the food is growing in the garden. Do you shop for seeds that are not genetically modified? Is it odd to even ask such a question? So, it looks to me like it is something that I recently started doing. It also looks like I am doing that in some places because the sentences are extra long and it helps with readability. Just let me know what you prefer. I can easily replace these instances with something more preferable to Joe, as that would be preferable to bear too I write much, a lot of writing each day, relatively speaking, so your help works out to be help I can use, experiment on, currently. It may take hold -- the help may take hold -- in time (or it may fade away) as the World Turns. "It is like an education. You buy a book, and with your time spent reading it carefully, you hope to help make life much richer....like the Bible I suppose, there are very valuable things in the Bible." That works best, it actually adds the idea that your influence works on me, and not in a small way, but a way that is mysterious, unknown, or not easy to believe. Thanks again. |
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bear Guest
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Thank you, Joe, your words were an encouragement to me. Am taking the youngest to grandma's while the oldest is at camp. Hopefully I will get some work done. I don't feel as tired as I did last week. The garden is growing. We are enjoying fresh cucumbers and squash. Got some fresh tomatoes from the Amish. I bought all my seedlings from the Amish this year. I am not sure what source of seed they use. My garden is smallish so I don't use much in the way of seed unless I am planting beans or peas. This year I bought heirloom tomato seedlings from the Amish, so I know they are not GMO. In the past I have purchased squash from somewhere (maybe not Amish, because I used to not just buy from them). The next year some of the squash reappeared (from seed) so I let it grow. The vegetables that were born were squatty and the size of a quarter and should have been like a cucumber. I didn't realize that would happen until it happened. Same way with alot of the flowers nowadays. They are made so they don't make seed and so you have to buy new each year after the winter freeze as far as annuals go. (Perennials winter over.) Anyways, I am sure that is more than you wanted to know. I think I noticed I missed a comma in one of the rewrites that you liked. I will fix it later and let you know how it should have been after I looked at it better (if it is still what I think I read). I am in a hurry to get lunch and out the door at the moment. I am glad you are able to write alot each day. That is nice. |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 88 It is like an education. You buy a book, and with your time spent reading it carefully, you hope to help make life much richer. (Like the Bible I suppose, there are very valuable things in the Bible.) modified per our discussion (I like it this way too): It is like an education. You buy a book, and with your time spent reading it carefully, you hope to help make life much richer…like the Bible I suppose, there are very valuable things in the Bible. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I was looking into a rule regarding capitalization after ellipsis and before I had to run and did not come up with anything then. I think to be consistent, and perhaps to take the easy way out, I will remove capitalization following this ellipsis. (I had capitalized it because it was starting a new sentence, probably was not the right thing to do. I will do a search and make sure I haven't done that other places )If you buy one solar panel in so many years, you can buy two, and then in so many years you can buy four, and then sixteen…It is a very long term investment…like buying a house, or buying a farm, or buying a productive business. |
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bear Guest
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Joe Regarding: I see you are now working on this, and I know it is very tiring work for me, so I hope you are not suffering through it too much. If you want I can take the file and work on it awhile. I can try to use your routine corrections as far as I know at this point. I want to do what you want to do. I am happy to continue working, and I do not mind. If you want to take a stab at it, I do not mind. I do not want to stifle your creativity by doing the editing myself. Your work here: I write much, a lot of writing each day, relatively speaking, so your help works out to be help I can use, experiment on, currently. It may take hold -- the help may take hold -- in time (or it may fade away) as the World Turns. Looks fabulous to me. A very nice and interesting use of punctuation. So, you tell me. Do you want to work with Joe Quotes abit? Your punctuation may be much richer than mine as you know exactly what is in your mind, or you can wait till I finish and improve the product after I have finished. I am good with whatever you want to do. I'll keep working unless you tell me otherwise. Earlier I said I thought I missed a comma:
I went back and looked. It looked good to me this time. |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 102 Christian Religion, the moral things, were the thoughts and actions employed by many of those so called Founding Fathers, the honest ones, and on the other hand are the counterfeit versions of moral things, like campaign promises told in The Federalist Papers, to be broken of course, were false claims, moral things falsified by people in that same group called Founding Fathers. So confusing thoughts and deeds with the names of thoughts and deeds, such as Christianity, is risky, in my opinion. Modified as follows: Christian Religion, the moral things, were the thoughts and actions employed by many of those so called Founding Fathers, the honest ones. On the other hand are the counterfeit versions of moral things: like campaign promises told in The Federalist Papers…promises to be broken of course…false claims…moral things falsified by people in that same group called Founding Fathers. So confusing thoughts and deeds with the names of thoughts and deeds, such as Christianity, is risky, in my opinion. |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 102 We have gone over this before, since Christianity was the false front cover story for such things as the Crusades and the Inquisition, which are hardly well representative of moral things. modified as follows: We went over this before when discussing Christianity as the false-front cover story for such things as the Crusades and the Inquisition, which are hardly well representative of moral things. |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 102 As to your conversations with other people whereby you and the other person are speaking as if the National Level Crime Spree is legitimate in any sense of the word: I don't do that, so it has nothing to do with me, so I'll be a wet blanket in that party you are having with that person. Broke into 2 sentences: As to your conversations with other people whereby you and the other person are speaking as if the National Level Crime Spree is legitimate in any sense of the word: I don't do that. It has nothing to do with me, so I'll be a wet blanket in that party you are having with that person. |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 103 Not at all: I'm not the one dictating to other people what they can do with their power since I know better. People have power, and one of the powers people have is the power to employ their power - without my help. Made the dash double, since that what I have done earlier: Not at all: I'm not the one dictating to other people what they can do with their power since I know better. People have power, and one of the powers people have is the power to employ their power -- without my help. |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 103 Government is often confused with crime made legal. I don't do that. So you think I do, every single time. Why? Changed So to but: Government is often confused with crime made legal. I don't do that, but you think I do, every single time. Why? |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 103 I think that murder is murder and if I had the power to help other people then I'd help them avoid becoming murdered and becoming murderers. So had I that POWER to help them govern that way, would I hold back? modified as follows: I think that murder is murder, and if I had the power to help other people, then I'd help them avoid becoming murdered and becoming murderers. So if I that POWER to help them govern that way, would I hold back? |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 103 I'd help them self-govern a way to avoid being murdered or being murderers. Added in: I'd help them self-govern in a way to avoid being murdered or being murderers. |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 103 Video: [Joe: generously offered by bear to Joe] Modified as follows: Video [generously offered by bear to Joe]: |
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bear Guest
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7/13/13 page 103 Nice, very nice, link to Ron Paul - thanks a million – in that link are precious ideas well communicated by Ron Paul. modified as follows: Nice! Very nice link to Ron Paul -- thanks a million -- in that link are precious ideas well communicated by Ron Paul. |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 104 So, if you are moral, human, a person with a conscience, then the deliberate, willful, murder of babies is a self-governing thing first, then a family thing, then a religious thing. Why would there ever be a demand for a city ordinance, let alone a state law, let alone a supposed "National" law, or a Global Law? modified as follows: So if you are moral, human, a person with a conscience, then the deliberate willful murder of babies is a self-governing thing first, then a family thing, and then a religious thing. Why would there ever be a demand for a city ordinance, let alone a state law, let alone a supposed "National" law, or a Global Law? |
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bear Guest
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7/12/13 page 104 They may actually eat babies like Alex Jones reports. added comma and changed the word like to as (to separate eating babies from like Alex Jones to ensure that the word reports is noted in the mind of the reader: to make sure the reader does not confuse Alex Jones as the person who eats babies). They may actually eat babies, as Alex Jones reports. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, You work is helping me learn punctuation so I prefer that you continue. So, you tell me. Do you want to work with Joe Quotes abit? Your punctuation may be much richer than mine as you know exactly what is in your mind, or you can wait till I finish and improve the product after I have finished. At whatever pace works best for you, it is the pace that works for me, and if you get to the point where it is too much work, then that would be a time when you have reached your limit of generosity on this work which helps me. If you can keep working on it, then I can keep learning by your example. |
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bear Guest
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JoeAt whatever pace works best for you, it is the pace that works for me, and if you get to the point where it is too much work, then that would be a time when you have reached your limit of generosity on this work which helps me. If you can keep working on it, then I can keep learning by your example. Thank you, your words help me as I work towards the goal of finishing. I have learned to pick up the book and work when I have downtime which seems to be very limited this summer. So, I will work a little while tonight until I need to stop. This new med I take a night makes me tired and ready to sleep, but it also provides me with energy for the next day. It works out well because I used to have to take benedryl at nite to ward of the prozac insomnia, now I take the new med instead of the benedryl and it seems to be a perfect balance, so far. I am thankful. |
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bear Guest
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7/14/13 page 105 Joe, please check out the note below in the information about the change in case I made an error in judgement. Then you have a State, or mini-Democratic Federal Government, where the State is employed to secure Liberty against large armies of criminals, and if one State isn't big enough to fend off the very large army of criminals, then maybe 13 Separate States can manage to throw out the largest criminal army on the planet. That actually happened under The Articles of Confederation. Changed commas to parenthesis to help with readability of long sentence and added the word will to focus back on the action of the previous paragraph. If this isn't correct, please tell me. Preceding paragraph followed by edited paragraph: It isn't any business of the Federal Employees to dabble in local murders of babies or Churches full of people in Waco. They are hired to deal with very large criminal armies, and if they can't do that right, then fire them. Then you will have a State (or mini-Democratic Federal Government) where the State is employed to secure Liberty against large armies of criminals, and if one State isn't big enough to fend off the very large army of criminals, then maybe 13 Separate States can manage to throw out the largest criminal army on the planet. That actually happened under The Articles of Confederation. |
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bear Guest
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7/14/13 page 105 Why is it a concern of anyone hired at the State level or even the Federal level, or even the World level, if a single woman is somehow convinced that it is a good idea to murder a baby? moved commas: Why is it a concern of anyone hired at the State level, or even the Federal level, or even the World level if a single woman is somehow convinced that it is a good idea to murder a baby? |
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bear Guest
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7/14/13 page 106 Common sense, sure, I get that too. It isn't about pushing babies in front of you on the conveyor going into the meat grinder, so as to buy another day of terrible and miserable life on earth. It is about life being precious enough to preserve and reproduce, to increase the quality and lower the cost, for eternity, or at least another minute. edited as follows: Common sense, sure, I get that too. It isn't about pushing babies in front of you on the conveyor going into the meat grinder so as to buy another day of terrible and miserable life on earth. It is about life being precious enough to preserve and reproduce, to increase the quality and lower the cost for eternity, or at least another minute. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Looks great to me there: 7/14/13 page 105 Joe, please check out the note below in the information about the change in case I made an error in judgement. |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 106 I thought we covered this, but maybe not, as my view is such that there is a willful effort by those in POWER to destroy the will to live in their victims. This is hand and hand in harmony with destroying POWER so that the victims do not have the POWER to resist. A basic human POWER is to preserve the species, to ensure that human life goes on, and that common sense is being eroded, being destroyed on purpose. edited as follows (also note that hand and hand is hand IN hand) I thought we covered this, but maybe not. My view is such that there is a willful effort by those in POWER to destroy the will to live in their victims. This goes hand in hand in harmony with destroying POWER so that the victims do not have the POWER to resist. A basic human POWER is to preserve the species, to ensure that human life goes on. That common sense is being eroded and being destroyed on purpose. |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 106 Depression probably hits women more than men because women are designed better at nurturing babies, which is a stronger POWER to preserve human life compared to men. So...the effort to destroy that drive, in many ways, very scientifically perfected methods, to destroy that drive to live as individuals, and that drive to perpetuate the species, probably hits women much harder than men. Edited as follows: Depression probably hits women more than men because women are designed better at nurturing babies, which is a stronger POWER to preserve human life when compared to men. So...the effort to destroy that drive in many ways, very scientifically perfected methods to destroy that drive to live as individuals, and that drive to perpetuate the species, probably hits women much harder than men. |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 106 Joe, tell me what you think about the way I changed the hyphens in man made and criminal man. I don't know if it looks too goofy, but I wanted to link the word man to criminal, and I may be coloring too far outside the lines. (I also want to say that I just went back and edited this comment to you to put a comma before "and I may." I have been wanting to tell you, and this may be the way to do it, that I understand while I am editing that you were speaking to me conversationally as we discussed back and forth and sometimes, punctuation is not on the front burner...as I am now noting that I had not correctly punctuated this present request I have made of you to check my hyphens. I remember when I first started discussing with you. I used to go back and check and check my comments to you to make sure they were perfect in spelling and perfect in punctuation. As we continued to discuss, I became less and less concerned about my writing perfection and more concerned with the words I was receiving from you and the discussion at hand.) It is not natural, it is man-made, criminal man-made, unnatural destruction of the will to live, and the will to perpetuate the species. It is easy to see once you know how it works. Modified as follows: It is not natural. It is man-made, criminal-man made, unnatural destruction of the will to live, and the will to perpetuate the species. It is easy to see once you know how it works. |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 106 So...absent that Legal Crime culture, all those lies, and all that torture, and all that murder for 200 years, at least: absent that, would it not make sense that more people would care a little more if someone they knew was contemplating the murder of a baby? Modified as follows: So...absent that Legal Crime culture -- all those lies, all that torture, and all that murder for 200 years, at least -- absent that: would it not make sense that more people would care a little more if someone they knew was contemplating the murder of a baby? |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 106 Let's dress the kids that we didn't abort up in uniforms and see if they can lower our gas prices? War costs can be paid by the children I failed to abort since war is good for my economy? added italics Let's dress the kids that we didn't abort up in uniforms and see if they can lower our gas prices? War costs can be paid by the children I failed to abort since war is good for my economy? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, wrote: I don't know if it looks too goofy That looks perfect. criminal-man made If you have extra free time check this out: Bill Black Gresham's Dynmanic Blood on their hands = criminal-man We can discuss and manage to find agreement with a high degree of effectiveness compared to many competitive examples of effort to do the same. Why? |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 107 "Thus, liberty is dependent upon protecting life while it is that same jeopardizing of liberty resulting in despotism that causes the demise of life." Say what??????????????????Joe, does that sentence or the new sentence even make any sense at all? I don't even know what in the world I think I thought I knew??? ...I now ask myself, does jeopardizing liberty result in despotism or is it despotism that causes liberty to be jeopardized? Can such a novice as me even make such a claim? I think I was trying to say in too many words what Ron Paul said in just a few: If we don't protect life we cannot protect liberty (or something like that). "Thus, liberty is dependent upon protecting life, and it is the jeopardizing of that same liberty which results in despotism causing the demise of life." |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 107 bear is at a place I was - not long ago - and I truly fear for her as there were extreme feelings of horror to endure on this path of realizing a more accurate perception of current political economy; bear does have the advantage of a safe place. changed dashes from single to double for consistency. And if we choose to go with single dashes, that is fine by me. You already had these single dashes before I started with the double dashes... bear is at a place I was -- not long ago -- and I truly fear for her as there were extreme feelings of horror to endure on this path of realizing a more accurate perception of current political economy; bear does have the advantage of a safe place. |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 107 Joe, could you please verify whether the word between Master and Slave should be OF or OR. In your original comment it was written OF (Master of Slave): http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2861226%5D Sometime along the way it was changed to OR (Master or Slave). So, I just want to be sure the correct word is in place. (I was looking to see if there was a question mark following the statement in the original comment when I noticed the change from OF to OR. |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 107/108 Changed lengthy (Solzhenitsyn)32 quote from using quote marks to block quote format. |
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bear Guest
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7/15/13 page 108 It does not always, not necessarily, openly throttle the throat, more often it demands from its subjects only an oath of allegiance to falsehood, only complicity in falsehood. (Solzhenitsyn)32 Changed placement of the footnote number: It does not always, not necessarily, openly throttle the throat, more often it demands from its subjects only an oath of allegiance to falsehood, only complicity in falsehood.32 (Solzhenitsyn) |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I am not Ron Paul. With your help my words are easier to read: "Thus, liberty is dependent upon protecting life, and it is the jeopardizing of that same liberty which results in despotism causing the demise of life." It should be Master or Slave. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, you are not bear either...those words were mine...those words that were not easy to read and made no sense to bear. bear, At least when you go back and read your own words you can understand them. I couldn't even understand my own words. Those unintelligible words were bear words, not Joe words. And so after trying to understand my own words I ask: can I even make the claim made in that new sentence I offer? I started listening to Bill Black Gresham's Dynmanic last night. I was not listening with my full attention as I was drifting off to sleep. I will try today to listen better. The information was interesting as well as too much to accept, though it is said to be true. I am not discounting that it is true, it is just so hard for me to grasp why some people can be so unfair, evil, and self-serving. As I stood in line behind a gal who was on WIC taking about 15 minutes trying to match all of her State Checks with her items and having the walmart clerk have to go back and exchange items, I felt dispise and pity mixed. Dispise because Jeff works multiple jobs to provide for his own family as well as hers. Pity because she is in the situation she is in. It is hard. People like us in the middle...lower middle...struggle to to make ends meet and work harder and extra to provide for ourselves without taking stolen handouts while those that Bill Black talks about make the rules that make it harder for us to work harder to provide for ourselves and also force us to provide for someone who is not provided for when they could easily do it themselves as they charge people 2 and 3 times interest of the cost of a home and mess around with gas prices at whim. This section of the book that I am working on matches Bill Black's words well. As a matter of fact, you have been telling me what Bill Black is saying without the gory details. Why do we find agreement? Is the evidence not around us? One just has to have eyes to see and ears that will accept? And now I turn to God's Word. The evidence is all around us: Psalm 19:1 KJV The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork . Romans 1:20 KJV For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen , being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Human kind is without excuse to know God. The evidence is all around us. The verse preceding that last offering - 19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them;1 Corinthians 3:11 KJV For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid , which is Jesus Christ. Peter is not the cornerstone or the foundation of the church. The Lord Jesus Christ is. That was a bait and switch routine performed by counterfeiters. Why does anyone continue to reject the cornerstone which is The Lord Jesus Christ? Why did the keep the Word of God locked away in a language the people could not read for themselves? Why do the bankers make rules that excuse themselves as long as they are 5 years out from a felony conviction? Why did Martha Stewart go to prison for insider trading while a 5 year from conviction felon was given headship? Why does a man sit in the white house who calls himself Barack Obama when his birth name is Barry Soretoro? Why does he not have to provide a true birth certificate and my own husband had to pay hundreds of dollars to get a "real" birth certificate because the one he used all of his life was no longer good enough? Because: Romans 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them. They take pleasure in evil and those who do evil. And I suppose it is a great pleasure to do evil to those who are as lambs. Jesus said this: Matthew 10:16 KJV Behold , I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. What is wisdom?
Jesus was talking about the Old Testament. The Old Testament told of Him. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am handing you a spoon labeled Martin/Zimmerman. I haven't kept up with the trial. I remember when the shooting happened. Now the trial has happened and Zimmerman has been found not guilty from what I understand. I was sad yesterday when we went to Kansas City for a Dr. appt. The black people who had been smiling every since Obama was elected in 2008 mostly appeared to be sad, just by the look on their faces. Even though I do not like the president's policies, I was kinda happy for the black people who were happy the morning after the election. They seemed to be able to hold their heads higher and just looked plain happy (to me). Anyways the black folks I ran into yesterday did not look happy at all. No smiles. That is a bear take. I don't know if Joe saw the same thing or not, there in that land of California. Don't white people shoot black people every day? Don't black people shoot white people every day? Don't people shoot people every day? Why is this different? Do you remember the black man in Texas who was drug to his death behind a pickup truck by some evil white men? It seems to me that there was not near the publicity of that event as this Zimmerman event. What do you think is going on, politically with all of this, if I may draw from Joe's take on life. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 109 JOE, I need some help with this phrase from the quote below before I work on punctuation:worked for and then had ready victims From here: Alexander Hamilton, connected too well to the British that was supposedly defeated in The Revolution, worked for and then had ready victims in what was then a Consolidated Government after The Federalist Papers (campaign promises made to be broken) Sold We The People a False Front, where The Articles of Confederation worked well enough to aid in The Revolution, but did not work well enough for a Banking Monopoly to take hold, so Alexander Hamilton, and his ilk, got their National Debt. ------------------- I am trying to figure out how the word ready is relating to the word victims. Are they a) "ready victims" (immediately available) or b) "victims that are ready" (prepared for immediate use) http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ready Thanks! |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 109 National Debt was being falsely advertised as National Credit, where in reality the seeds were planted to create victims who are led to believe that the victims are borrowing money from Central Bankers when in fact the Central Bankers are borrowing money from the victims, and the victims are then given the bill for everything the Central Bankers buy, and they buy wars. modified as follows: National Debt was being falsely advertised as National Credit. When in reality, the seeds were planted to create victims who are led to believe that the victims are borrowing money from Central Bankers. When in fact, the Central Bankers are borrowing money from the victims, and the victims are then given the bill for everything the Central Bankers buy: and they buy wars. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 109 They buy wars so as to consume all the power they can't steal, so as to keep their victims powerless to fight back. Modified as follows: They buy wars to consume all the power they can't steal, so as to keep their victims too powerless to fight back. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 109 "Society in every state is a blessing, but Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one: for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same miseries BY A GOVERNMENT, which we might expect in a country WITHOUT GOVERNMENT, our calamity is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer."33 Changed to block quote:
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 110 They say that you have to borrow from them, when in fact they are borrowing from you, or in their own words: The Good Faith and Credit of the American People Broke into 2 sentences: They say that you have to borrow from them. When in fact, they are borrowing from you, or in their own words: The Good Faith and Credit of the American People |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 110 They don't mean themselves. They mean the Honest Productive People who actually start out in the day with less power and through their cooperative and productive work there is enough extra power at the end of the day to constitute something worth stealing. modified as follows: They don't mean themselves. They mean the Honest Productive People who actually start out in the day with less power and through their cooperative and productive work, there is enough extra power at the end of the day to constitute something worth stealing. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, now I really need your help...with the dashes/hyphens or whatever they are called. I think you have used - often in your writing, and then I started with the -- bit. From what I remember ready a style should be chosen and stuck with. I am inclined at this day and hour to change the 18 or so -- to - . I don't know why I started using the -- and didn't even consider that you had already been using - . So, do you care if I change the -- I started making to - ? |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 111 and 117 on 7/24/13 "If by "government" the user of the word means "them" and not "us" then how can it be "our" government?" added commas: "If by "government," the user of the word means "them" and not "us," then how can it be "our" government?" —Joe |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 111 Point Bear bear eavesdrops and learns as Joe has a conversation with another Friend of Liberty regarding a Grandchild performing in a debate. Added another sentence: Point Bear bear eavesdrops and learns as Joe has a conversation with another Friend of Liberty regarding a Grandchild performing in a debate. Come along and take a listen! |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 111 In order to set the stage up for my answer I think it may be a good idea to define what I mean by my sympathy applied to the young person in question. I had a father who would be physically ill when he observed other people who were ill and I call that empathy. And I call that empathy only because I need a stronger word than sympathy because I am not like my father was. I am only capable of imagining what someone else is feeling. I don't myself feel bad when someone else is feeling bad. modified as follows: In order to set the stage up for my answer, I think it may be a good idea to define what I mean by my sympathy applied to the young person in question. I had a father who would be physically ill when he observed other people who were ill, and I call that empathy. I call that empathy only because I need a stronger word than sympathy because I am not like my father was, I am only capable of imagining what someone else is feeling. I don't myself feel bad when someone else is feeling bad. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 111/112 I participated in very few public speaking events, and as a child having been uprooted enough times to become very shy, or other things occurring whereby a fear grew in me of contact with many people who may have their attention aimed at me. And those fears, I can say without reservation, can be crippling to someone who may have information that is worth communicating. modified as follows: I participated in very few public speaking events. Having been uprooted enough times to become very shy or having other things occur as a child, a fear grew in me of contact with many people who may have their attention aimed at me. Those fears, I can say without reservation, can be crippling to someone who may have information that is worth communicating. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 112 I spoke to the voters assembled on a few occasions, and I did so without stumbling over my words, and afterwards there were some occasions whereby people shook my hand and thanked me for having made the effort. Changed whereby to when: I spoke to the voters assembled on a few occasions, and I did so without stumbling over my words, and afterwards there were some occasions when people shook my hand and thanked me for having made the effort. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 112 I was the Libertarian voice during one official Congressional debate. I went alone to it, at my own expense. The incumbent did not attend at my expense too. Modified as follows (Just for interesting reading): I was the Libertarian voice during one official Congressional debate. I went alone to it…at my own expense. The incumbent did not attend…at my expense, too. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 112 It amazes me, as you may never know, that I "ran for congress," in part because of Ron Paul's example. That was the past me, and I can be sympathetic there too. Past me, is not the current me. I've slayed many dragons since. Modified as follows: It amazes me, as you may never know, that I "ran for congress," in part because of Ron Paul's example. That was the past me, and I can be sympathetic there too, as the past me is not the current me. I've slayed many dragons since. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 112 Joe, I need help here: I purchased the ballot access, with my own earnings, for the most part, because of Waco. Regarding "for the most part": Did you purchase the ballot access with your own earnings for the most part? Or did you do that for the most part because of Waco? After I know your intent I can punctuate accordingly. Thanks! |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 112 I did not mince words; I did not play the games; I did not blame THINGS for the actions of people; and I did not lose the election (it was stolen; they are all stolen with few exceptions). modified as follows: I did not mince words, I did not play the games, I did not blame THINGS for the actions of people, and I did not lose the election. (It was stolen - they are all stolen - with few exceptions.) |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 113 I said that we are here to make sure that we do not abandon an innocent victim, and to make sure that an innocent person is not injured by us. I was excused. Added quotes and broke into 2nd paragraph: I said, “We are here to make sure that we do not abandon an innocent victim, and to make sure that an innocent person is not injured by us.” I was excused. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 113 If your grandchild does not acknowledge the significance of the lie whereby people share the lie, whereby THINGS are held accountable for the actions of people, then to me, that is a very poor, weak, and powerless position to be in, and I can sympathize. Modified as follows: If your grandchild does not acknowledge the significance of the lie, whereby people share the lie, that THINGS are held accountable for the actions of people, then to me that is a very poor, weak, and powerless position to be in, and I can sympathize. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 113 I don't know who the remnant is. I can't, but I know that we exist. If by remnant I can refer to an author named Albert J. Nock, in reference to those who refuse to "join 'em" because we won't claim that we can't "beat 'em," or some other shared lie - perhaps many of us are the silent remnant, not yet ready to stick our necks out very far. Not willing to be counted so overtly, in public, for various reasons, not just for fear, or even concern, or self-preservation. Modified as follows: I don't know who the remnant is, I can't, but I know that we exist - if by remnant, I can refer to author Albert J. Nock in reference to those who refuse to "join 'em" because we won't claim that we can't "beat 'em," or some other shared lie. Perhaps many of us are the silent remnant…not yet ready to stick our necks out very far…not willing to be counted so overtly, in public, for various reasons…not just for fear, or even concern, or self-preservation. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 113 / 114 Your grandchild may be setting a fine example if it does not get too hot, and if he does not wither, and if he does not become like the pod people. One of them, I mean, without any ambiguity - become a person who shares the lie that THINGS are accountable for the actions of people. modified as follows: Your grandchild may be setting a fine example, if it does not get too hot, if he does not wither, and if he does not become like the pod people - one of them, I mean, without any ambiguity - one of those people who share the lie that THINGS are accountable for the actions of people. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 114 The propaganda machine, a case in point, includes all the spaces between all the ears, and I know my parents were infected; one still is infected. The lies run very deep. modified as follows Joe, if you do not like this modification, just let me know and I will change it back. The propaganda machine, a case in point, includes all the spaces between all the ears, and I know my parents were infected. The lies run very deep. |
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bear Guest
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7/18/13 Page 114 Without prejudice is a very interesting term. A new one on me, worth understanding - it seems to me - and possibly connected intimately to this line of thinking: making THINGS accountable for the actions of people = prejudice. Changed on me to for me Without prejudice is a very interesting term. A new one for me, worth understanding - it seems to me - and possibly connected intimately to this line of thinking: making THINGS accountable for the actions of people = prejudice. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, There is a reason for the corporate leader to be of a certain outward appearance so as to enable the campaign promises to hold power over the targeted victims. The criminals do not discriminate to a greater degree the divisions of race, sex, age, religion. The criminals discriminate to a greater degree the division of POWER. Those who make things worth stealing are those targeted by criminals. That is a bear take. I don't know if Joe saw the same thing or not, there in that land of California. It is not Left versus Right. Look here: Division Are you divided? Do you divide based upon left versus right? Does the message inspire you to be on the right fighting against the left? That message in that video, on "network" television (Monopoly) cannot be Black against White in harmony with the show trial of the month. Do you "feel" inspired to discredit jurors in Trial by Jury? Do you "feel" inspired to discredit Trial by Jury as an effective form of self-government (a competitive definition of democracy or socialism)? If you feel sad for other people then to me the obvious result of the intended message is lost on you. the false message does not work on you, instead of the false message working on you, because you know better, is that you still see from a generous soul, and you are not inspired to act aggressively toward innocent people. The Legal Criminals are not as powerful over some people, perhaps very many people, as they once were in my estimate. You exemplify one of those people. How many people does it take to avoid World War III? War (World War III) is the reset button on the human social computer. As far as I am concerned, having my own way of communicating with other people, I see many more black people in this town now compared to 1973 (or so) when I moved here to Barstow. I was possessed of the idea that now, after the Zimmerman verdict (so called), there are more black people willing to look me in the eye, when passing, and more are generously offering welcome greetings: in passing. I don't get out much, but when I do my eyes normally go for eye contact with everyone I see, when I'm alone, and less wandering when I am not alone, since I will then be occupied with familiar human contact. Criminals are possessed of a desire to gain "at the expense" of a targeted victim. You don't do that, I don't do that, not unless the aggressive attack is in some way perceived as defensive, and the aggressive attack is strictly verbal, and the aggressive attack is strictly factual to our own sense of reason, and the aggressive attack is strictly absent any intended physical injury to anyone. If we are like mother bears then we volunteer to step in between the bear cubs and those POWERS that aim to injure those bear cubs. That is to me the moral thing to do, for many reasons, and since we are imperfect, we make honest mistakes. The criminals willfully target bear cubs so as to injure the bear cubs for fun and profit at the expense of the bear cubs or at the expense of anyone who has something worth stealing. I woke up this morning with a greater appreciation for the lessons you teach, and not just you teaching these lessons, since Jesus teaches these lessons, and many other people like you, and like Jesus, teach these lessons. Which ones? If no one produces anything worth stealing, I'm asking, are there any thieves? That is an odd way for me to communicate, being who I am, the concept of generosity. What do you think is going on, politically with all of this, if I may draw from Joe's take on life. The objective is to discredit any POWER (such as Trial by Jury or individual defensive thoughts and actions, or neighborhood watch organizations or just plain old common sense) that can be used by the targets to avoid being victims. When the targeted victims are polarized as one voluntary union of honest, productive, generous, people, they can then defend themselves, each one, with or without help from anyone else, against criminals. When the leadership that leads is TRUE, what happens? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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a) "ready victims" (immediately available) or b) "victims that are ready" (prepared for immediate use) I think both apply in fact, and I cannot judge who is more responsible in any case of crime: the criminal or the victim. Babies, being innocent, being undeveloped examples of the human being, are immediately available, for criminals. Baby food? Someone who has collected a vast store of riches is not so often a ready victim who is immediately available for a criminal to victimize. Often is the case where the criminals expend a lot of the power they steal in the work required to prepare victims for immediate use. These things I know and so the sentence, if I remember right, was intending to communicate both viewpoints at the same time. Does that make any sense? They buy wars so as to consume all the power they can't steal, so as to keep their victims powerless to fight back. Modified as follows: They buy wars to consume all the power they can't steal, so as to keep their victims too powerless to fight back. There may be (coincidentally or not) another case of intending to convey challenges to the reader, to make the reader think about the word POWERLESS. I am not without power, if I were I'd be dead. I am less powerful compared to the criminals who perpetrate crime upon me. So my sentences are a product of my intentions, and your help helps greatly in bridging the gap between what I intend to say, and what the reader may, or may not, get. Your work appears to me to be of great value to me. I've told you about the English Writing Course of Study I paid for, so as to allow me to learn to write well, and the teacher supplied something that was powerless compared to what you supply. Does that exemplify something worth knowing? They buy wars so as to consume all the power they can't steal, so as to keep their victims powerless to fight back. Modified as follows: They buy wars to consume all the power they can't steal, so as to keep their victims too powerless to fight back. I am not so inclined to step back from something that appeared to add richness to the writing. I can offer a deal where you keep going without stepping back on this one thing, and the next time you feel like double dashes, try to zero in precisely on why you want double dashes. Another option is to zero in on each use of double dashes already done, but again that is going backwards in my view, which is not as competitive, to me, as going forward. You started changing to double dashes, I saw an initial problem, then I saw a richness in at least one sentence, an improvement, so that can be retraced by me, if possible, or you can go on with more editing and in any case where there is an inspiration to question the use of dash, double dash, comma, or three dots, or parenthesis, at that point, that time, that place, zero in on the question, and start a list. Like here: Dash or Double? I can learn to write better, you can learn to edit better, anyone reading our work can learn, or there are other, better, things to do with our time. Our time is not one thing, you have your time, I have mine, so our time is a convenience of using less words instead of using more words to say the same thing. I can learn to write better, you can learn to edit better, anyone reading our work can learn, or there are other, better, things to do with your time, my time, and anyone else who has time. I am in confession mode at this time. I want to confess to you that I have, in the past, stated that I, me, this Joe Kelley person, does not have, in my words, a "pony in that show," and the reference has to do with competitive religions, and the reference has to do specifically with the information offered by Frank O'Collins, where that information includes a religious viewpoint. I am confessing a move from having no pony in that show to me having, in some measure, stepped into the ring, and rather than write a whole lot of text, I can point you to the Talkshoe Phone Conferences (or whatever) whereby I am not making it a regular event on my schedule. Here: Episode 135 Time 1:23:20 is the time where I call Frank for the first time. I don't want to discredit anyone other than myself where my own viewpoint is false, and so I hope you can understand that context, and if you feel like being even more generous, then you can help me understand my own errors in this specific exchange between me and Frank, or, on the other hand, if you care not to be involved, then that is fine too. I am merely offering another measure of me, so you know better instead of knowing worse. Episode 136 52:50 The pony I have in the show of religion is unclear in my own mind, hence the confession to you now, letting you know that I am not willfully intending to discredit any other people or any other religious beliefs, rather, I am intending to know better, if that is at all possible, as to what is, or is not, true. Does that make sense in this context? Back to work: I purchased the ballot access, with my own earnings, for the most part, because of Waco. Regarding "for the most part": Did you purchase the ballot access with your own earnings for the most part? Or did you do that for the most part because of Waco? After I know your intent I can punctuate accordingly. Thanks! My intent there is to convey the importance of Waco on me, as the cause of my thoughts and actions contained within the "run for congress" events. I can see how that sentence is confusing, and I am interested in knowing how you fix it. The propaganda machine, a case in point, includes all the spaces between all the ears, and I know my parents were infected; one still is infected. The lies run very deep. modified as follows Joe, if you do not like this modification, just let me know and I will change it back. The propaganda machine, a case in point, includes all the spaces between all the ears, and I know my parents were infected. The lies run very deep. That is correct. Thanks. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, regarding this: --------------------------------------- I am in confession mode at this time. I want to confess to you that I have, in the past, stated that I, me, this Joe Kelley person, does not have, in my words, a "pony in that show," and the reference has to do with competitive religions, and the reference has to do specifically with the information offered by Frank O'Collins, where that information includes a religious viewpoint. I am confessing a move from having no pony in that show to me having, in some measure, stepped into the ring, and rather than write a whole lot of text, I can point you to the Talkshoe Phone Conferences (or whatever) whereby I am not making it a regular event on my schedule. Here: Episode 135 Time 1:23:20 is the time where I call Frank for the first time. I don't want to discredit anyone other than myself where my own viewpoint is false, and so I hope you can understand that context, and if you feel like being even more generous, then you can help me understand my own errors in this specific exchange between me and Frank, or, on the other hand, if you care not to be involved, then that is fine too. I am merely offering another measure of me, so you know better instead of knowing worse. Episode 136 52:50 The pony I have in the show of religion is unclear in my own mind, hence the confession to you now, letting you know that I am not willfully intending to discredit any other people or any other religious beliefs, rather, I am intending to know better, if that is at all possible, as to what is, or is not, true. Does that make sense in this context? ---------------------------------- What fault do you want me to find in your words to Frank? I cannot find anything wrong with your exchange in regards to words. I can only find error in seeking contact with the Creator outside of the path given in the Bible. I can find error in Frank's words. I didn't see any error in your words. I can see error in reaching out to a self proclaimed Divine Creator in human flesh (as I think that I what I understood Frank to call himself in reference to the follow up to your discussion with him in the first link) for spiritual guidance. There is no 3rd Testament or 3rd Contract with the Creator initiated by man. The Old Testament Contract was in initiated by God. The New Testament Fulfillment was initiated by God. On the Cross, Jesus said, "It is Finished." He is the Fulfillment of the Contract. If I am understanding Frank correctly, I hear him say that he makes a contact with the Divine Creator and that he is the divine creator. Josf, that sounds exactly like Lucifer: Isaiah 4:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning ! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! 13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. 15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. Jesus said these words: Matt 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo , here is Christ, or there; believe it not. 24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25 Behold , I have told you before . 26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold , he is in the desert; go not forth : behold , he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be . Joe, there is no other name given under heaven among men whereby we must be saved. There is one mediator between God and man and that is Jesus Christ. I think you will enjoy Paul talking about the Unknown God in Athens: http://www.biblestudytools.com/kjv/acts/passage.aspx?q=acts+17:15-33 I was surprised Sunday when Jeff preached from this passage and I read on a little and found the words that We are the Offspring of God. So I am in a quandary as I consider that some of are children of God and some are children of the Devil. But there in Acts Paul says we are all the offspring of God. So, I am confessing that I may need to do some studying to understand the implications of the original languages in that regard. Also confessing that I thought Frank's last name was O'Connor, and I was wrong. It is O'Collins. I must clean house tomorrow and will leave bookwork til I have free time again. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, My fault in my words has to do with me not having (as I said in the past) a "pony in the show" in the who has the most accurate understanding of God contest. I am now asking question of Frank that put my interests in a place where I may form a more accurate belief of religion compared to my past and present belief in religion. So my fault has to do with my communications with you being what they were, on the subject of competitive viewpoints in religion, and my viewpoints that may become something other than what they were, or are, and so I see a potential for being untrue to my past words in this regard. I think that your viewpoint of Frank's viewpoint is not accurate. I don't need to go into details, but I can if asked. I can see error in reaching out to a self proclaimed Divine Creator in human flesh (as I think that I what I understood Frank to call himself in reference to the follow up to your discussion with him in the first link) for spiritual guidance. The actual words by Frank can be quoted for references. I think that the idea Frank offers has to do with every aware human being not just Frank. The idea, if I understand it, is that we are all trusted with life and therefore we are all trusted with the power to create, and therefore we are all in that connection divine creators creating by way of that power trusted into our care. At least that is where I am at so far in the reading on Trusts and Estates, and here is where I find much of my interest in Frank's work concerning how bad things are now, and how things got this bad by way of the actions of people he calls nihilists. Trusts and Estates are part of the Real Estate Business, so called, so that brings the information into regular home usage, and so I can now develop my own basis of language, based upon principles concerning the exchange of Real Estate. Estates, it turns out, are principally a secondary to, or a creation from, Trusts. Estates appear to be the beginning of Legal Crime in the exchange of land use among the human beings. That may be more detail than appropriate in this specific forum topic, but we two are able to communicate without rigorous reliance upon protocol, so I trust that you will forgive my elaboration here. The Old Testament Contract was in initiated by God. The New Testament Fulfillment was initiated by God. On the Cross, Jesus said, "It is Finished." He is the Fulfillment of the Contract. I wanted to keep you posted on my dealings with Frank, since you are connected to me, and since I value your trust, and since I want to earn your trust, so I try to be up front in this area of religious belief. I may go places in my perceptions of religion as the contact with Frank may change my direction somewhat, so your navigation skills may also be beneficial to me. I don't know these things, but I am not too afraid to look to see what some other people may believe. One thing Frank does question about people who are Christians is a possible contradiction concerning what is believed or what is not believed in The Bible; concerning contradictions that may appear when Christ says this, and it means this, and then somewhere else in The Bible someone else says that, and it means that, and the two things are contradictory, and does the True Christian put more weight into what Christ says and not as much weight in the viewpoint that contradicts what Christ says? Those are my words not Frank's, and what I find very important is the fact that I can speak to Frank, and ask my own questions. I can't ask Christ questions. I can't ask Josiah Warren questions. I can't ask Alex Jones questions. I can't even ask Ron Paul questions, I tried, seriously tried, without success, or with limited success. I can ask you questions, and you generously offer answers. That is an indirect way of asking Christ questions, but you then point me to The Bible, and you tell me that is where you get your answers. But your answers are yours, not The Bible, you translate, generously, to me, without deceit. How valuable is that, and so I may be asking, some day, questions directed at Frank, concerning what he thinks Jesus said about this or that, and in particular I may go into the places where I have a contention with what is written in the Bible. Original sin is a concept that I find to be very contentious for example. I find the concept of someone being tortured and murdered for my sins to be a contentious idea, for another example, and we have spoken about that, but I have not put my "pony in that show" at this point, or I may not care to resolve things such as those things, having no real interest in doing so, while, or especially while, there are so many other questions I have concerning the work on Political Economy done by Frank up to this point. Matt 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo , here is Christ, or there; believe it not. 24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25 Behold , I have told you before . 26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold , he is in the desert; go not forth : behold , he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be . Those words apply very well to Alexander Hamilton and Ben Bernanke. To me those words do not apply to Frank. Frank may be acting from false belief, but to me it is obvious that Frank is not inventing falsehoods. Your measure of Frank appears to be such that you think Frank is dishonest. I see the opposite, and if Frank is dishonest then it can be demonstrated that Frank is dishonest, without having to rely upon belief. A dishonest person will produce lies, whereby the lies can be proven as lies, and that is routine to a point that is reasonably evident, or self-evident, in the form of inculpatory evidence. A fabricator of lies cannot admit mistake without having their lies which cover up their false authority over their victims exposed, and that is the point being pointed out by Frank concerning the false authorities that have taken over the power of government in our current world. If Frank is misled by information that he believes to be true then he is no different than any other man or woman walking the earth, and that is according to your belief as far as I understand it. Frank is no different in principle, perhaps different in degree, but who judges any case with any authority? "There is one mediator between God and man and that is Jesus Christ." Frank, as far as I can tell, has dealt with contentions in Christian religion far more than I ever want to, and again he appears to find use in the concept of asking people questions concerning their belief in The Bible and the idea that there are contentions concerning what is written in The Bible between what Christ says and what other people say. I think that Frank identifies true Christians, as he understands the concept, to be those who put more weight in the words of Christ when there is a contention, and I think Frank puts less weight (of trust?) in people who side with words that contend with what Christ says. I can be wrong. I don't know. "I must clean house tomorrow and will leave bookwork til I have free time again." Thanks for taking the time to answer my current confession, which may not appear to be one, as your viewpoint remains to be very valuable to me. |
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bear Guest
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Joe,So my fault has to do with my communications with you being what they were, on the subject of competitive viewpoints in religion, and my viewpoints that may become something other than what they were, or are, and so I see a potential for being untrue to my past words in this regard. Thanks for being up front with your thoughts on the topic of religion. In regards to my comment: I can see error in reaching out to a self proclaimed Divine Creator in human flesh (as I think that I what I understood Frank to call himself in reference to the follow up to your discussion with him in the first link) for spiritual guidance. http://recordings.talkshoe.com/TC-90342/TS-764245.mp3 - Direct quote from Frank at about 1:33: ...how incredible it is to be a man in this form to be The Divine Creator in this form... You define his words as meaning: The idea, if I understand it, is that we are all trusted with life and therefore we are all trusted with the power to create, and therefore we are all in that connection divine creators creating by way of that power trusted into our care. That is contrary to the Word of God. John 1 says that Jesus is The Divine Creator: 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made . 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men...14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. People have the ability to pro-create, but not to create. People cannot even decide for certain that they will pro-create. People have no power to do so. People cannot speak the world or life into existence. Frank has no power to create life. Only THE DIVINE CREATOR WHO IS JESUS CHRIST CAN CREATE LIFE. People cannot even produce a seed from nothing. A single person by themselves cannot even create pro-create. What exactly does the word divine mean? -------------------- Frank, as far as I can tell, has dealt with contentions in Christian religion far more than I ever want to, and again he appears to find use in the concept of asking people questions concerning their belief in The Bible and the idea that there are contentions concerning what is written in The Bible between what Christ says and what other people say. I think that Frank identifies true Christians, as he understands the concept, to be those who put more weight in the words of Christ when there is a contention, and I think Frank puts less weight (of trust?) in people who side with words that contend with what Christ says. The Bible is a book of harmony. You understand harmony from your understanding of music? What contentions exist between Jesus and the rest of the Bible? Jesus said to study the scriptures because they are they that speak of him. The Bible is about the Lord Jesus Christ from start to finish. Your measure of Frank appears to be such that you think Frank is dishonest. I think this of anyone who denies the Lord Jesus Christ as the Promised Messiah of God: 2 John 1:7 KJV For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. And I think it is one thing to deny the Lord Jesus Christ personally, and I think it is another thing to lead other people astray. Frank is opposed to Christ and Frank is leading other people to be opposed to Christ. I realize my words are strong. I see the opposite, and if Frank is dishonest then it can be demonstrated that Frank is dishonest, without having to rely upon belief. A dishonest person will produce lies, whereby the lies can be proven as lies, and that is routine to a point that is reasonably evident, or self-evident, in the form of inculpatory evidence. Frank produces words contrary to the Word of God; therefore, Frank produces lies. Those words apply very well to Alexander Hamilton and Ben Bernanke. To me those words do not apply to Frank. Frank may be acting from false belief, but to me it is obvious that Frank is not inventing falsehoods. What? Frank has invented a false religion that spits in the face of the Lord Jesus Christ and makes his sacrificial death which is the atonement for sin null and void. There is no 3rd Testament or additional Contract between God and man. Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled , we shall be saved by his life. 11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement. 12 Wherefore , as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned. Which leads me to ask, what do you mean by original sin? The first time I even heard that term was in 1993 when I was watching the Three Musketeers movie. The term "original sin" is not in the Bible. What does it mean? I can be wrong. I can be wrong too. That is why we have the Written Word of God, the Bible and we are supposed to study it so that we can know and understand the truth. Satan is a liar and the father of lies. I think maybe you were given a lie when you were 10 in regards to trying to get God and the Devil to quit fighting. God does not wrestle with evil. We do. Estates appear to be the beginning of Legal Crime in the exchange of land use among the human beings. Here is a land purchase: http://www.biblestudytools.com/audio-bible/kjv/genesis/23.html You can listen to it if you like. I really don't even know what an estate is. Scott has been sick and I have been unable to do work, but will hopefully start tonight. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Hi bear,What exactly does the word divine mean? When I hear words written, or spoken, by you or Frank, I think I can understand what you or Frank means, and if I can't, then I can ask. When you define the meanings of words for Frank, then I have a problem with taking your version of what Frank says as an authority over what Frank says. This is basically my problem with literal meaning of words in any form whatsoever. The meaning requires an aware being reading the words. Which aware being has the authority to officially determine the meaning of words? Divine means whatever any aware being can become aware of the meaning of that word within the power of that being in time and place. If you ask me, then I can say that the word divine means a matter of fact. Divine means perfect perception of actual reality. Divine means that having the power of perfect perception of actual reality is a power that gains access to all other power if access to all other power is possible in actual reality. Since I do not have access to perfect perception of actual reality, in my view, I am not divine. I think that Frank is saying that our power is only limited by our present condition and it is our gift from God to be as powerful as God in due time, assuming that is what we want, and assuming we are willing to do what is necessary to reach for that goal. I know, for a fact, that I have a lot of trouble speaking for other people, whereby my ideas of what other people think are more often wrong, more often full of error, and less often less full of error, and I base that estimate of my power to know what other people think on actual trial and error, and I don't base that estimate of my power to know what other people think on baseless assumption. What contentions exist between Jesus and the rest of the Bible? I plan on attending talks with Frank each Wednesday. If the above question is worth asking, then it is worth asking Frank, since my personal contentions with what I consider to be contradictions in The Bible are already on the table. Example: The concept of someone other than me being punished for my wrong doing is counter to my own understanding of reality. If there are contradictions between what Jesus says and what someone else says in the King James version of The Bible, to be specific, then Frank may be able to point those out, since it is my idea (perhaps wrong) that Frank knows of these things. Please understand my viewpoint here on this point of actual words in The King James version of The Bible being what they are, where those words exist on their own, and then, on the other hand, there can be an observer who observes those words, you can observe those words, I can observe those words, and Frank can observe those words. If the words here contradict the words there, then that happens with, or without, someone observing the contradiction. An example would be an example. I don't have one. Who knows of one? I don't. I can imagine that there is a possible contradiction, but without having the actual words printed in an actual King James version of The Bible, in front of me, my imagination constitutes a contention. You wrote: What contentions exist between Jesus and the rest of the Bible? I don't know how to answer that question. Jesus is not available for questioning, not to me. Is there a contradiction written into the King James version of The Bible whereby words attributed to Jesus say something to the effective of "go left" and another person is attributed as having said "go right," and that would be an example of a contradiction written, in print, into a version of The Bible, such as a copy of The King James version of The Bible. I am working at being specific, so as to zero in on something specific, so as not to fall victim to error associated with ambiguity, such as often is the case where there is miscommunication. What contentions exist between Jesus and the rest of the Bible? I may not understand the meaning of the word "contentions," so I work at clarifying the meaning of the question. Frank is opposed to Christ and Frank is leading other people to be opposed to Christ. I realize my words are strong. I think that your words could be backed up with actual inculpatory evidence proving the charge of guilt. In the first place you do not share the same understanding of who is Jesus Christ. While your leader is your leader, a being of significance to you, known to you, as you can accurately identify this being as being Jesus Christ, the same being is not the being known to Frank, as far as I can tell. You are, in that respect, blaming Frank for opposing a being that Frank does not even know, perhaps, and the Jesus Christ that Frank does know, may be altogether a different being, so your accusations are in that way an error of misidentification. Your claim of guilt concerns someone you know being someone that Frank opposes, when it appears obvious to me that Frank does not even know the someone that you know. If Frank does not know the someone you know, how can Frank oppose someone he does not even know? As far as I know Frank has tried to find as much information as he can about a Jesus Christ, and his efforts have uncovered enough information for Frank to form an opinion about a person who he considers to be Jesus Christ. Is the person Frank knows as Jesus Christ the same Jesus Christ as the person you know as Jesus Christ? If it is not the same person, then your charge of guilt is an obvious case of misidentification. If you do not oppose John Doe, and then you find out that Henry Smith does opposed John Doe, is it not important to see which John Doe is opposed by Henry Smith? Also, it seems to me, your claim of opposition, charged against Frank, could be specific as to how Frank opposes a Jesus Christ, once it was found out, if it can be found out, which Jesus Christ Frank opposes. Frank produces words contrary to the Word of God; therefore, Frank produces lies. And we are all liars. So the concept of being specific here, is worth something to me, compared to the concept of being ambiguous. Your belief in knowing precisely what is, and what is not, the Word of God is not a power shared by everyone, and therefore the fact that you are right, and those who don't share what you believe are wrong, does not make other people liars, they are merely wrong, and here again, as if this cannot ever be understood, there is the concept of willful deception compared to merely being wrong. If you prefer not to acknowledge the difference between being willfully deceptive and merely being wrong, then I can accept that, so long as I know that is your preference. What? Frank has invented a false religion that spits in the face of the Lord Jesus Christ and makes his sacrificial death which is the atonement for sin null and void. Here are words that appear to be self-contradictory to me. I can be wrong. I can assure you that I am not being willfully deceptive, if you can acknowledge the difference, then please acknowledge the difference between being willfully deceptive and merely being wrong. I may be wrong in my thinking that your words just quoted are self-contradictory. If the Jesus Christ you know did do as you say, then no one can nullify what Jesus Christ did, and no one can void what Jesus Christ did, but your words claim that someone "makes his sacrificial death which is the atonement for sin null and void." If Frank believes in a religion that is not the religion that you believe then there are many possibilities that can explain the differences in your respective beliefs. 1. Your belief is absolutely true (not likely) 2. Frank's belief is absolute true (not likely) 3. Your belief is more accurate by a significant, demonstrable, measure compared to Frank's belief. 4. Frank's belief is more accurate by a significant, demonstrable, measure compared to your belief. 5. You are both sharing the same belief and you don't even know it. 6. I don't understand the meaning of belief. 7. Possibilities explaining the differences that are well beyond my understanding. 8. You are honest and truthful when you claim that Frank is a liar. 9. Frank is a liar 10. You are merely mistaken when you claim that Frank is a liar. 11. Frank is merely mistaken, he is not willfully lying. Which leads me to ask, what do you mean by original sin? The first time I even heard that term was in 1993 when I was watching the Three Musketeers movie. The term "original sin" is not in the Bible. What does it mean? I'm not sure what it means. If it is not in the Bible you believe in, then the actual words may be a reference to other words that are in the Bible you believe in. My idea about the words offered by Frank, so far as I understand them, concerning the concept of original sin, is such that there is a criminal deception that is routinely perpetrated by criminals, whereby criminals blame everyone for the crimes that the criminals perpetrate. So far as I understand the idea, therefore, the term original sin is equal to prejudice or collective punishment. In other words the idea is to blame the victims for being victims. A criminal mind, from what I gather, will rationalize the harm that the criminal does to the victims that the criminal targets. The criminal claims that the victims deserve to be harmed by the criminal. That is what I think is meant by the term original sin. If such a thing as original sin does not exist in the Bible that you believe in, then Frank may be talking about some other Bible, some other words, or I may be misunderstanding what Franks means when Frank refers to original sin. I can ask Frank questions on Wednesdays. So far as I have exchanged words with Frank, my use of the concept of original sin is meant to be collective punishment/prejudice/criminal falsehoods covering up crimes upon the innocent. I think maybe you were given a lie when you were 10 in regards to trying to get God and the Devil to quit fighting. God does not wrestle with evil. We do. Here we go again, it seems to me, moving back to the point where I feel as if I have to assure you that I do not think that I am the God that you believe in. It is not within my POWER to mediate the struggle between all good and all evil, so sure, at the age of 10, my imagination was creating (or not creating if I am incapable of creating anything) error in perspective. At the age of 10 I could have understood the true meaning of the words in The Bible as it was being taught to me by Sunday School teachers. I did not. At that time I had a problem with a guy dying for my sins. What was so horrible about me, at age 10, whereby a human being was tortured and murdered? Why do these people say that I have to eat the flesh of Jesus and drink the blood of Jesus? Those problems persist in my thinking, to this day, so I may invent, or be possessed by, errors in perspective because I refuse to understand the truth about a human, or not really human, sacrifice, done for me. My reaction then, and now, is no thanks. Please don't sacrifice Jesus for me, I don't deserve it. It was already done for you, it is said, and I say no, not for me, again, I do not deserve it, and I do not want it, and please don't ever sacrifice anyone else for me, please. I listened to the trade of silver currency, or money, for use of land used then to bury a woman named Sarah. Apparently the person named Abraham felt that the person named Ephron had somehow earned the four hundred shekels of silver. Frank offers information that traces the enforcement of exclusive use of the land to a few specific people, at the expense of many people. I am finding the same routine played out over and over again so I see recognizable patterns of behavior that are now predictable acts perpetrated by criminals as if criminals are all reading from the same script, or as if criminals are all driven by the same force. If you are dead set at convicting Frank as a willful liar, then that is how you will be, as you decide to be that way. If, on the other hand, it is acknowledge by you that Frank can be, as I am, merely prone to error in perspective, then that is your choice. I am in no position to judge which belief, yours, or Frank's, or my own unspecific belief, is more accurate. I do know that perception exists. I believe, specifically, that God is a word that can work to label the power that creates everything. Beyond that, my belief is unspecific unless I work to make it more specific. I can belief, or not believe, that Jesus Christ died for my sins, depending upon current thoughts, at any given time, but the concept is so foreign to my sense of morality that I'd prefer that no one is ever tortured and murdered on my account, ever. Since my goal is to help, now that I am not holding down a real job, when I can help, and much of my help involves the Real Estate business, so it is interesting, and potentially beneficial, for me to learn the history of Trusts, Estates, and those who claim to own the land. I trust that your children, and you, are in good hands. |
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bear Guest
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Joe When I think of the term original sin, I think of this verse: Romans 5:12 KJV Wherefore , as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned : We sin because Adam sinned. It is in our nature to do so. Every single person alive has done something wrong at some point in time. I do not eat and drink the blood of Jesus. Ie eat and drink unleavened bread and juice of grapes. It is done to remember what Jesus CHOSE to do for us. At any time Jesus could have ended the process HE CHOSE to go thru. He CHOSE to go thru that process because He LOVES YOU, JOE T. KELLEY. As far as the King James Bible, it was the politically correct Bible removing all the notations in the margins of the Geneva Bible which pointed to the Pope and Church of Rome as the Anti-Christ/False Prophet. The Geneva Bible is the Bible that was brought over on the Mayflower. There is history of the English Bible here: http://www.greatsite.com/timeline-english-bible-history/ original king james intro: http://www.genevabible.org/files/Original_1611_King_James_Version.pdf Here are comparisons of early English Bibles, word for word: http://www.genevabible.org/files/Geneva_Bible/6_Version_Comparison.pdf Here are words that appear to be self-contradictory to me. I can be wrong. I can assure you that I am not being willfully deceptive, if you can acknowledge the difference, then please acknowledge the difference between being willfully deceptive and merely being wrong. You are right Joe, Frank cannot nullify or void what Jesus Christ did on the cross. You are very good with your words. What I should have said is that Frank has laid out a 3rd testament, a 3rd contract, a 3rd covenant which does not depend upon the Work of Christ to reconcile man to God. Hebrews 10:29 KJV Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye , shall he be thought worthy , who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified , an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? The Bible says this about Jesus Christ: Hebrews 13:8 KJV Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever. The Bible is the record of the promised Messiah, the Lord Jesus Christ who came, and the Lord Jesus Christ who is to come. There is no other revelation. There is no other covenant. There is no other way to the Creator God, but thru the Cross on which the Creator God hung and bleed and died. But that is not the end, Jesus Christ conquered death and rose again from the grave and comes and lives inside of those who place their trust in Him for the forgiveness of sin. He does not live inside of us thru the bread and the wine, but thru faith in Him for the forgiveness of sin. Frank cannot make a contract between good and evil. He cannot call a truce. He has no standing. You will do what you will do. I think I will do bookwork as I am weary to explain the Gospel of Christ any better. However, I do say that I think that if you would read the Bible, and I don't care which version you read, you may get the big picture. I think that you speak of that which you do not know, and I don't know how to make you know except that you have to search the scriptures yourself, and you have to let God be God, and if God says that He is going to be tortured and murdered on your behalf so that you might be purchased you from the death of sin, then that is the way it is. And I suppose that is child like faith. Divine means that having the power of perfect perception of actual reality is a power that gains access to all other power if access to all other power is possible in actual reality. assuming that is what we want, and assuming we are willing to do what is necessary to reach for that goal. Titus 3:5 KJV Not by works of righteousness which we have done , but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; The only thing required is Faith...Childlike faith. There will be a time when we have perfect perception, and that will be when we see Him. I John 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be : but we know that, when he shall appear , we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is ... 23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. 24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us. But I do not know that we will be as powerful as God, or that we will be God, but I know that we cannot even imagine what God has in store for us: Isaiah 64:4 KJV For since the beginning of the world men have not heard , nor perceived by the ear , neither hath the eye seen , O God, beside thee, what he hath prepared for him that waiteth for him. Referring back to Isaiah: 1 Corinthians 2:9 KJV But as it is written , Eye hath not seen , nor ear heard , neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. -------------- Here is another instance of a man named Abraham and the use of land: http://www.biblestudytools.com/audio-bible/kjv/genesis/13.html but money is not exchanged. I have rambled. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, you ask:When the leadership that leads is TRUE, what happens? What happens is in Revelation chapter 21 http://www.biblestudytools.com/audio-bible/kjv/revelation/21.html Before that time comes, this happens: 2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. Jesus said these words:John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. Josf, Satan was not able to keep The Word of God locked into Latin away from the common people for ever. But now that we have the Word of God in our own language, Satan casts doubt as to whether the Bible really is in deed, The Word of God. I am not asking you to believe what teachers teach you, I am asking you to find an English copy of the Bible and read it. (I am assuming English is the only language you speak and comprehend.) I am asking you to believe the words in the Bible. Those words were written by the Holy Spirit of God as men were directed to write. http://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Matthew%2022:29 |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Thanks for taking the time to reply. I am returning to a method of replying whereby I stop reading and I reply before continuing. I stopped here: We sin because Adam sinned. It is in our nature to do so. Every single person alive has done something wrong at some point in time. I do not eat and drink the blood of Jesus. Ie eat and drink unleavened bread and juice of grapes. It is done to remember what Jesus CHOSE to do for us. At any time Jesus could have ended the process HE CHOSE to go thru. He CHOSE to go thru that process because He LOVES YOU, JOE T. KELLEY. My point earlier, and even earlier than that, and now my point is, and probably my point will continue to be, that you know (or believe) what you know (or believe) and that is not the same thing as what I know (or believe) or what anyone else knows (or believes, including what Frank knows (or believes) so we may be speaking about apples and you may be speaking about oranges, and until such time as we know the same thing, we don't know the same thing. I find that viewpoint, being my own viewpoint, to be something I know (or something I believe), and it makes sense to me, in that context. I don't claim to know that what you know is not true. You are the one claiming to know that what Frank says is a lie, and my question earlier had to do with the difference between a willful lie and merely a case of mistaken identity, such as a person like Frank not knowing (or believing) what you know (or believe) about the person you know (or believe) to be Jesus Christ. If Frank says things about specific people, or people in general, and his claims of facts concerning those specific people, or those people in general, are not supported by any measures of information that Frank things, believes, or knows to be true, from his viewpoint, as if Frank is willfully distorting the information, or Frank is willfully fabricating false information, then that is what Frank does, and when such things can be shown to me, beyond a reasonable doubt, then I can form my opinion based upon that measure of that information. To me you have a unique quality of translating the words in the Bible you believe in, and to me your unique translations are not the actual words that you say are the words that are true. Your unique translations, to me, sound reasonable, while the actual words in the Bible you believe in do not sound reasonable to me, and there have been, and can be, examples provided. Here are comparisons of early English Bibles, word for word: Here are before me now two comparative studies of the origins of specific versions of Bibles. If there are two version then there is not one version. Which version do I believe in? What POWER could possibly be affecting me to choose one version over another version? What POWER could direct me to put more weight into the information found, or fabricated, whereby that information finds its way to me from many source, through Frank, to me? What POWER could direct me to put more weight into the links you provide to me? To me the information Frank offers concerning the history of The English Language is information that places a very clear picture into view as if my view of human existence has been incomprehensible by relative comparative judgement, by me, now that the history of the English language, that I know, or I believe, includes the information discovered by, or fabricated by, Frank. A language that works best for criminals, to me, a language the works best for Legal Criminals, to me, will be the language used by Legal Criminals, as language is a form of currency, like money is a form of currency, so it stands to reason, to me, that English is like Legal Monopoly Money, as English is another example of inculpatory evidence proving that Legal Criminals have been busy, and all one has to do to find those criminals is to follow that money, and in this case the money in question is called English, back to the source of it, and the source of English, is by the information offered by Frank, the same types of criminals, the criminals who have names, the criminals who lived on Earth, and the routine of crime remains to be the same routine. Lie So the claim that Frank is a liar, compared to what I see as the true liars, to me, is misplaced. You know Jesus Christ as you know Jesus Christ. I do not know the same Jesus Christ and apparently Frank does not know the same Jesus Christ too. I am not lying. I am willfully being honest. I do not know the Jesus Christ that you know, how could I? You can claim all day and night that I refuse to know the Jesus Christ that you know, and if it makes you feel better to make that claim, then that may be what you do, but your claim is based on what evidence? To me it is impossible for me, at this time, to accept the idea that the God I know to be the God I know to be, is capable of torture and murder, and that is the message I get from the words in The Bible. The words you offer, as a translation of the words in The Bible are different, significantly different, than the words in The Bible, so your words make significantly more sense to me, at least your words open the door to a possibility that I might some day know the Jesus Christ you know, but those are your words, not the words in The Bible. Examples can be provided again. I opened the links you offer for Translations and I see English. I can ask Frank for a specific example of evidence that he believes to be inculpatory evidence that proves, to Frank, where fabrications of false information have occurred during the history of printing The Bible form the original text into English. I can ask Frank for information specific to such things as original sin, as he uses the term, and the concept of human sacrifice, or this event that you know to be Jesus Christ dying for human sins, for reasons that you know, reasons that you try to explain, but reasons that I think your words are better at explaining, while I think that the words in The Bible are at best ambiguous, and at worst the words in The Bible are fabrications as Frank's information (which could be fabrications themselves) indicates. I can be very specific when asking Frank for specific references concerning specific words written in the original texts as those words were then translated into other languages with the final translation being done in the English language, and again, and here I can be specific, I have been specific already with my linking specific pages offered by Frank on this web page of mine, where I link where Frank publishes the history of the creation of the English language. It make much sense to me that the Legal Criminals are fully capable of inventing, producing, and maintaining forms of currency that work to their exclusive advantage. Looking further down the link on The Original 1611 King James Version I can't tell what those words mean, when I zoom in the words may as well be Greek. I have to go at this point the Network is not Net Working at Work. |
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bear Guest
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JoeHere are before me now two comparative studies of the origins of specific versions of Bibles. If there are two version then there is not one version. The point is that the versions are basically the same. Joe, the New Testament was originally written in Greek. You can ask 3 different people to translate a bunch of Greek and you may get idiosyncrasies in the 3 different translations. They are not VERSIONS, they are TRANSLATIONS. Ask you Russian friend...he has to explain words that he knows in Russian by using several English words sometimes. Sometimes he means one thing and it is hard for me to comprehend exactly what he means. So the point is that the King James "Version" is a TRANSLATION that was done and authorized by King James. In the link http://www.genevabible.org/files/Geneva_Bible/6_Version_Comparison.pdf on page 3 you will find an outline or the English Bible Translation Timeline (I have copied it below but it may be easier to read on that site): Short Chronology This information is nicely explained on this website http://www.greatsite.com/timeline-english-bible-history/ which also includes a more detailed timeline. The point of knowing Christ Jesus the Lord is not me knowing him as something and you knowing him as something else and Frank knowing him as something else. The point is to know and understand the Bible and from there Jesus Christ is known. The Bible is reveals the Lord Jesus Christ so that we all might know Him AS HE IS. He is not a figment of an imagination to be known or made up. I point you to the Bible because it is the only way to know. I point you to an English Bible because it is the only language you know. If you know German I could point you to Martin Luther's Bible which he TRANSLATED from the Hebrew and Greek into German. That is the Bible used by the Amish. They still know German. The point is to have the WORD OF GOD in your own language so that you are not dependent upon any man or priest or government to tell you what God says. The Roman Church kept the Bible locked away in the Latin language and only the clergy could read and understand it. They could make up whatever they wanted to to make the people do what ever they wanted the people to do such as eat and drink the body and blood in order to get to heaven, or to pay indulgences in order to get sins forgiven or get family out of Purgatory (a place that is non-existent in the Bible). God does not require the payment of money or the drinking of and eating of the blood and flesh of Jesus. God requires faith in the death of Christ as atonement for sin. Faith is individual and no one can have faith or get you faith. You alone are responsible to have or not to have faith. Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God. So, that is why I say read the Bible, an English Bible that has been Translated from the Original Hebrew and Greek (the same way that you are depending on Surgi to translate Russian history into English for his book). Here is some hearing for you http://www.biblestudytools.com/kjv/2-peter/1-audio.html Even "religious" people argue about what "version" of the Bible to use. It is a distraction. Looking further down the link on The Original 1611 King James Version I can't tell what those words mean, when I zoom in the words may as well be Greek. Joe, that is because in Old English the letter s was written as f and the letter u was written with a v. I can read it all either. That is another reason for modern "versions" or translations. We don't read Old English. The words thee and thou are confusing enough for some folks, much less trying to trade letters in and out of works so that they make sense. I can't read all of the introduction to that original 1611 Bible, because I don't have a modern translation of the introduction, but the introduction isn't part of the Bible. Those pages are all about how the King of England authorized scholars to translate the Bible into the English Language. (I remember reading Patrick Henry's work opposing the constitution. I had a hard time understanding early American English.) (Let me also add, that if people in China wanted to read Frank's covenant, but didn't know English, what good would it be to them. Maybe they could get someone in China to translate it for them. Would the end product still be Frank's covenant if the translator was doing an honest job? What if 3 translators were doing an honest job, would every single word in Chinese be exactly the same? No, when it takes multiple words to explain a single English word the different translators may choose different Chinese words to accomplish the explanation. What if Surgi were to translate Frank's work, would he translate it the same way another Russian person using exactly the same Russian words to replace the English words? Would the words still be Frank's, but in a different language? Would the intent and content and covenant still be the same if Surgi were to do an honest job at the translation? What if multiple people worked together to make the translation into Russian. Would it maybe be a little better translation? What if the translator had an ulterior motive? Would that not become evident when comparing it to multiple translations done by different people? The point of me offering the link of the multiple English translations together was that the author of that link set out to find out the differences between the translations and found very few here are his words as found on his page 2: I began this study as a skeptic, expecting to discover significant differences between these early translations and the King James. I happily found that there are no differences in the major points of faith, but there are many subtle differences in meaning and many passages are much easier to understand in one version than in another. I found no one version that seemed to be the best in every instance, each one has its strengths and weaknesses. Now I am going to do bookwork, or I will not get bookwork done...and that was exactly what I was starting when I was trying to pick up where I left off and found your words: [quote[So my sentences are a product of my intentions, and your help helps greatly in bridging the gap between what I intend to say, and what the reader may, or may not, get. Your work appears to me to be of great value to me. I've told you about the English Writing Course of Study I paid for, so as to allow me to learn to write well, and the teacher supplied something that was powerless compared to what you supply. Does that exemplify something worth knowing? So, I ask: Which version of Joe Quotes is Joe Quotes? Should we change the title? bear's Thoughts on Joe Quotes? Or bear's Editing of Joe quotes? Or, is Joe Quotes Joe's Quotes? To me that is just like the Bible. It was written in a language other than English and several "bears" have given us the Bible from Hebrew and Greek to English. And then another bear says, hey, I think we should add a word here to make it easier to understand. Hey you know we use "u" now instead of "v" and we use "s" now instead of "f" how about it if I fix those words so you can read them more easily. Oh, and that passage I gave you to listen too...Peter was talking about his tabernacle...he was refering to his earthly body. Did you get that Joe? I know that because I am used to reading those words (King James Translation): 2 Peter 1:13 Yea, I think it meet, as long as I am in this tabernacle, to stir you up by putting you in remembrance; 14 Knowing that shortly I must put off this my tabernacle, even as our Lord Jesus Christ hath shewed me or would these words be better for you (http://www.biblestudytools.com/bbe/2-peter/passage.aspx?q=2-peter+1:13-14) (Basic English Translation): 13 And it seems right to me, as long as I am in this tent of flesh, to keep your minds awake by working on your memory; 14 For I am conscious that in a short time I will have to put off this tent of flesh, as our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me. , or would these words be better for you http://www.biblestudytools.com/gnt/2-peter/passage.aspx?q=2-peter+1:13-14 (Good News Translation): 13 I think it only right for me to stir up your memory of these matters as long as I am still alive. 14 I know that I shall soon put off this mortal body, as our Lord Jesus Christ plainly told me. or we could go back to Wycliff in 1300's and get this http://www.biblestudytools.com/wyc/2-peter/passage.aspx?q=2-peter+1:13-14 (which I find difficult even though I am familiar with King James English): 13 Forsooth I deem justly [Forsooth I deem just], as long as I am in this tabernacle, to raise you in admonishing; 14 and I am certain, that the putting away [for the putting off] of my tabernacle is swift, by this that our Lord Jesus Christ hath showed to me. See what I mean jelly bean? Or you can sew buttons on your underwear...and I remember there was something that I thought was mean when you said it to mean and now I can't even remember what it was, but it was another one of those things that you used to say when you were a child and you meant it as funny. After you explained it I thought it was funny too. Do you remember what it was? Oh ya, Guess what? Chicken Butt...but did you know, Joe, that I thought you were really saying Guess what? Chicken Crap, and not the nice word Crap, but the SH word. See Joe, we both speak english, but we are from 2 different families and we use words and jokes differently. I never in my life heard Chicken Butt from my father, but I did hear Chicken SH and it wasn't put nicely. Soooo, as far as versions go, I hope the water is more clear. Now, I hope I will do bookwork. |
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bear Guest
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7/23/13 page 109 Alexander Hamilton, connected too well to the British that was supposedly defeated in The Revolution, worked for and then had ready victims in what was then a Consolidated Government after The Federalist Papers (campaign promises made to be broken) Sold We The People a False Front, where The Articles of Confederation worked well enough to aid in The Revolution, but did not work well enough for a Banking Monopoly to take hold, so Alexander Hamilton, and his ilk, got their National Debt. Considering discussion here: a) "ready victims" (immediately available) modified as follows for readability (Joe, if this is not readable, please say so as I may have gotten carried away trying to make it too readable. It took me nearly an hour of tweaking. Can you imagine how the translators of the Bible felt? (I wonder what they would think about the words "carried away" and "tweaking"): Alexander Hamilton (connected too well to the British that were supposedly defeated in The Revolution) worked for and then had ready victims in what was then a CONSOLIDATED GOVERNMENT after The Federalist Papers (campaign promises MADE to be broken) SOLD to “We The People” A FALSE FRONT (The Articles of Confederation worked well enough to aid in The Revolution, but did not work well enough for a BANKING MONOPOLY to take hold). So, Alexander Hamilton and his ilk got their NATIONAL DEBT. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I skipped ahead to this: They are not VERSIONS, they are TRANSLATIONS. I meant this: you may get idiosyncrasies in the 3 different translations If you have an issue with my word choices, as you appear to have here, I can be less ambiguous and I can be more precise with my word choices as I am now trying to explain. I meant that there are more than one translations (I chose the word versions), which was an intent by me to acknowledge the fact that "you may get idiosyncrasies in the 3 different translations," and therefore the message in one may not be the same message in another. They are not VERSIONS, they are TRANSLATIONS. Now you are using capital letters to highlight something. What are you intending to highlight? I've done wrong? I am going to go back to where I left off in the first new reply I have yet to read. Frank cannot make a contract between good and evil. He cannot call a truce. He has no standing. Actually Frank has done so, according to Frank. You claim, as if factually, that Frank cannot do so, when in fact, Frank has done so, and then there is the separate measure of what exactly is done by Frank, whereby the words are left behind and the actual actions stand as being what the actual actions are in fact. I am not Frank, so I don't actually know what Frank has done, other than reading the words, and listening to his words, and so I know what I read, and I know what I hear, so you can claim what you claim, and I can know that you claim what you claim, because I can read your words too. What actually happens? If Frank says that there is significance to the Roman Pontiff resigning, then I am less able to understand what that means, if my perspective is compared to Frank's perspective concerning what he measures as the fight between good and evil. You believe what you believe. Frank believes what Frank believes. I seek to know better, and my power to believe is, to me, power less, and often counter productive. You will do what you will do. I think I will do bookwork as I am weary to explain the Gospel of Christ any better. However, I do say that I think that if you would read the Bible, and I don't care which version you read, you may get the big picture. I think that you speak of that which you do not know, and I don't know how to make you know except that you have to search the scriptures yourself, and you have to let God be God, and if God says that He is going to be tortured and murdered on your behalf so that you might be purchased you from the death of sin, then that is the way it is. And I suppose that is child like faith. The many Translations of The Bible say different things, and much of what I've already read is ambiguous, or beyond my understanding as to what the intended meaning is in those ambiguous words. As far as child like faith, there is what appears to be a contradiction, since I've heard a Translation that makes the claim that childlike things are to be left behind. I may be mistaken as to such an intended meaning, of course. I am not, nor do I pretend to be, nor have I ever claimed to be, an authority concerning any Translation of The Bible. I also do not claim to be an authority concerning what God says. The only thing required is Faith...Childlike faith. There will be a time when we have perfect perception, and that will be when we see Him. That is good news for those in that group. I am happy for those in that group. My current understanding is such that I am not in that group, unless told otherwise. But I do not know that we will be as powerful as God, or that we will be God, but I know that we cannot even imagine what God has in store for us: That appears to be another contradiction, but I understand that it is more than likely that the contradiction is a product of my error in perspective. If I do not believe, as I'm told that I must believe, despite every attempt to believe, then I am told that I don't go to heaven. Is that true or not? Is that imagined into being and therefore not true, or is that the type of thing that is set in stone, non-negotiable, factual, real, known to be my fate, beyond doubt, and therefore having nothing to do with the power to imagine what may, or many not, be my fate? We, you say, will have perfect perception. That can be imagined by me, and when I imagine that, I imagine God. I am told that failing to do what I can't do reduces me to some lesser fate than what you get for your ability to believe? You get perfect perception. I get the lake of fire? I get from Genesis 13 a message that sounds like God subsidy, so what do I know? I know enough not to claim knowledge of the word of God, as my ability to demonstrate such authority is not merely weak, it appears to be demonstrably absent. If I imagine God, a perfection of perception, then I imagine a power capable of avoiding resort to torture and murder, especially regarding human children, so much for my childlike dreams? I am asking you to find an English copy of the Bible and read it. I read parts, and I get God subsidy. I get ambiguous words that convey either no meaning to me, or the meaning is anything I may care to make of it, since the meaning is ambiguously conveyed to me, and again, sure, the fault is all mine, but that is the current state of my being in relation to any specific translation (that is not a version) of any Bible. As to the actual, real, word of God, your claim of authority as to knowing what the actual, real, word of God could be demonstrated in fact. You say this, and you say that, and that, according to you, is the Word of God, and as far as I am concerned, that could be true, factual, real, or that could not be true, factual, and real. I don't believe it is true, factual, or really the Word of God because I can't, and no matter how many times I keep asking, you keep repeating the same suggestions, and so I read, and what do I get? God subsidy. God pays favorites. If that is God, it is not the God I know, it is not the God I believe, for the same reasons already stated. God aught to be able to figure a way out of playing favorites. I am asking you to believe the words in the Bible. Which words? I believe that to fear God is to hate evil. Those words I get, and I get those words loud and clear. I do not believe the slaughter of babies was done by God to accomplish some nebulous goal. I do not believe that the torture and slaughter of Jesus Christ was done to excuse my sins, or some other wording that appears to mean the same thing, as if I am being blamed for Jesus Christ being tortured and murdered. I don't believe such thing, it makes no sense, and if there is a God that is going to torture and murder more people because I'm not obeying words written in English, whereby I have to forgo my sense of reason, and I have to blindly follow orders, without question, that appear to be unreasonable, then I have a problem with that God. That God, to me, sounds much more like what I can conjure up as being The Devil. I do not claim to be an authority on what God is, or is not, according to anyone else but me. God to me is real, and real nice, a power to perfectly perceive everything to such a degree of power as to then be able to create things and those things created then are able to create things of beauty, like songs, like paintings, and even beautiful things like happiness. So, sure, I am all set to get thrown in the Lake of Fire and that happens despite your best efforts to encourage me to believe, by reading an English Translation of The Bible. I've read. I've read before you ever knew me. I get the same reaction each time. The words are ambiguous, or the words are specifically abhorrent to my sense of reason. Childlike faith? I did that at age 10. I've told you already. My childlike faith was not signing onto the concept of some guy being tortured and murdered for me. There has to be a more Godly way to deal with human beings, it seemed to me then, and it still seems to me now. Sure, again, sure, I'm all wrong, send me off to the Lake of Fire, that is how it is, until who knows, I don't. I am not disbelieving, so that aught to be understood, if by now it is not been made clear. Those words were written by the Holy Spirit of God as men were directed to write. Written in Greek? English language, apparently, is like Federal Reserve Notes, as far as my understanding goes currently, and that fits the Big Picture, since that could easily explain the lack of capacity to convey meaning with those English words arranged in those ways in those Translations (not versions). The point is that the versions are basically the same. Joe, the New Testament was originally written in Greek. I can ask Frank as to specific words in specific original texts and what is added or subtracted concerning specific things. I have been thinking about this all day, and I was reminded of a specific example already stumbled upon by me in Frank's writing, and the example concerned the message contained in the parable about the son who took an inheritance from his father, spent it all on having fun, and then returned to the father broke. I forgot the names of the people in the parable. If it is Frank's contention that the words are fiction, then that is based upon his viewpoint. If it is your contention that the words are true, then that is based upon your viewpoint. If other people have similar viewpoints then those are their viewpoints. If the Greek words (or Latin, or Hebrew, or whatever) of the original documents mean this, or that, and the English words meant this for awhile, and then that for awhile, then there can be a comparison done from original meaning to translated meaning, and in that example I remember it was Frank's claim that words were added to the message that were words never in the original message. The point is to know and understand the Bible and from there Jesus Christ is known. If you say the words in The Bible are true accounts of real things, such as the example I remembered about the story you had already shown to me, about the father and the son who wasted all that money, then that is your claim, based upon your belief, and it may be true, or not true, as far as I know. Frank says that words were added to that story, which he calls the words a parable, I think that is what he says, I can check. Frank may be wrong too. How do I know? I can know, eventually, by actually getting the actual document written in the original form, and then I can see if Frank is correct, where there are words added, to make the story different in specific ways, not ambiguous ways, specific ways, where someone, sometime, changes the message from the original to something different. If that can be demonstrated as true, then your claim of the Word of God being the English Translation would require that the additional words added to the original copies were added by God, through whoever did the edit work. That can be true too. I don't know. The Bible is reveals the Lord Jesus Christ so that we all might know Him AS HE IS. He is not a figment of an imagination to be known or made up. I don't know anyone who claims that Jesus Christ was made up. I have read enough of Frank's work that proves to me that Frank believes that Jesus Christ was a human being. Much in The Bible is not about Jesus Christ, and now we are back to Frank's contention concerning Christians who may, or may not, put more weight into words in the Bible quoting Jesus Christ where there may be contentions (or contradictions) with words quoted from other people. I could add that to the list of things I can ask Frank, if I run out of specific things I want to speak to Frank about concerning my power perspective relating to political economy. I point you to the Bible because it is the only way to know. The message I get from those words are such that I would need to find the original documents and I would need to translate the words myself, since I do not trust the English language versions now that I understand the history of English, at least as far as the information offered by Frank is concerned. Counterfeit Language makes sense to me. English is a counterfeit language. I point you to an English Bible because it is the only language you know. If you know German I could point you to Martin Luther's Bible which he TRANSLATED from the Hebrew and Greek into German. That is the Bible used by the Amish. They still know German. If I have to learn a new language then directly going to the original documents, to me, makes the most sense, and that is what Frank appears to have done. You can claim, all day, that I believe in what Frank says, which is not true, if that is what you are going to do, or if that is what you are already doing. The information offered by Frank is significant information for reasons that I can explain, such as the history of English, and such as the example of that specific parable concerning the father and son where the son wastes all that money. The point is to have the WORD OF GOD in your own language so that you are not dependent upon any man or priest or government to tell you what God says. That is odd, because that is the point I am pointing out to you, when I do not trust the many translations done by the many men, priests, and employees of so called government. God requires faith in the death of Christ as atonement for sin. That is a very good point of contention I have right now. What is the original meaning of the word "atonement" and "sin"? What is the original words, any sentence, any paragraph, any quote by Jesus Christ saying, that God requires faith in the death of Christ as atonement for sin? That sounds like a very good way that I can briefly put the question to Frank. You alone are responsible to have or not to have faith. Here again I am seeing contradiction. If I ask and there is no answer, then I am unable to respond, I have no ability to respond, there is no faith within my power to respond. I lack that ability. If I lack that ability, then the faith has to arrive from an external power, and why not? Why does God not simply give faith to me? If you are sent to me to help me, then I should find the original text and get the word of God from the mouths of the people God used to speak to man, if that is at all true, what you say is true. So then, there is Frank, out of nowhere, and he just happens to have done all that study work, finding the original documents, and doing the manual translations himself? Is that how God answers me? Am I to act childlike again, in this case, like I acted when I was a child at age 10? So, that is why I say read the Bible, an English Bible that has been Translated from the Original Hebrew and Greek (the same way that you are depending on Surgi to translate Russian history into English for his book). There is English again. You use the word "depend," and I am supposed to agree that I depend upon Sergey for accurate information? I do no such thing. From nothing there is now a version of Russian History, which can be called a translation of Russian History, and it is far more competitive to me compared to no translations. I do not depend upon it, as if to say that I would reject any competitive offer of another translation, and then I have two from which to compare one to the other looking for similarities, looking for contradictions, and it is often the case, but not always the case, where one is demonstrably more accurate, and therefore better, than the other one. Here is a few possible tests in view. 1. A parable or news report concerning a son and a father and a lot of money spent on having a good time. 2. A claim that can be traced back to actual words written in original documents concerning that which God requires, without misunderstanding, and without ambiguity. Even "religious" people argue about what "version" of the Bible to use. It is a distraction. So now you say that those words are for me, for my hearing, as if I don't know that these arguments over who knows, who is the greater authority, over what God did or did not say, is a diversion? Those pages are all about how the King of England authorized scholars to translate the Bible into the English Language. (I remember reading Patrick Henry's work opposing the constitution. I had a hard time understanding early American English.) What is the full measure of that King? I have my measure of Patrick Henry, which I base upon his words and deeds, as far as it is possible to trust the origin of the words and deeds having been attributed to Patrick Henry. We can cut past a lot of words concerning our differences in religious belief, it seems to me, if it is possible to trace back the original message in the original document that claims to say that God requires this or that such as your claim as you make that claim earlier in this discussion. (Let me also add, that if people in China wanted to read Frank's covenant, but didn't know English, what good would it be to them. Maybe they could get someone in China to translate it for them. Here is where my thinking has been with Frank and his work. To me the effort to hold the Roman Cult to account is limited in scope, since it is my understanding that the most powerful humans are now creating World War III. The supposed Westernization of China, for example, indicates to me that these most powerful of human beings, whatever names they hide behind, are gaining power in China, and they are not using Uniform Commercial Code, or Nohide Law, or Admiralty Law in China, or are they? That may be a key point? Does the "westernization" of China actually mean that Admiralty Law is now being enforced in China? Would the end product still be Frank's covenant if the translator was doing an honest job? I can't see Frank's ideas working for the average Joe. Compared to Trial by Jury, as explained in the Essay by Lysander Spooner, the work done by Frank is much too complex, unusable, for most people, and that does not make it unusable for all people. Those who voluntarily need complex associations find ways to find agreement, so Frank's work might help them. I don't know. The idea Frank has is similar to mine in that there has to be something replacing Legal Crime, something to work toward, or Legal Crime will be the Default. I see much more value in moving forward to a Democratic Federated Republic, with Trial by Jury based upon sortition, such as the example already set with The Articles of Confederation. It was an example of Free Market Government, complete with Free Market Money (whiskey when the Gold was driven out by fraud money). But Frank may be much more pessimistic than I am, so he may be thinking in terms of having total collapse, and then a necessity of building everything back up from ashes. He wants to get a head start, so do I, but that does not mean that I agree with the specific methods. I see getting rid of The FED, and doing so by inventing, producing, and maintaining competitive Legal Monies, at State levels (republics), or even County, City, Town, Company, Family, or Individual levels. It was Josiah Warren who proved that individual are fully capable of being their own central bankers. Would the words still be Frank's, but in a different language? Would the intent and content and covenant still be the same if Surgi were to do an honest job at the translation? What if multiple people worked together to make the translation into Russian. Would it maybe be a little better translation? I don't think that you get the point offered by Frank. Frank does not claim to be the leader of anyone; other than to lead by example, and to offer, voluntarily, the advice that each individual person has to become their own competent leader themselves. Here is where I have a problem with Frank, again, since his example sets the bar way too high, or if high is the wrong word, then the word I want to use, the word I can repeat, is too complex. Frank sets a too complex example. But the point is not complex. The point is that each person has to develop their own level of competence in defending their own existence while they are human beings in this thing we call reality, and that has to be done because, according to Frank, the system is evil. That is another contention I have with Frank, since I do not blame the system, I think it is much more important to hold the actual people who are evil accountable for the actual evil that they perpetrate. Again, to me, that can be attributable to my own error in understanding the message intended by Frank. What if the translator had an ulterior motive? Would that not become evident when comparing it to multiple translations done by different people? If I ask Frank if he knows of any messages in the original documents claimed to be written by people who were directed by God, those original documents that constituted The Bible, I ask Frank, if in those original documents does he know of any words that actually convey the requirements made by God in reference to your claim, then I can get an answer, and I can then have, possibly, a specific document, I can then have the original symbols in the original language, and I can have the actual meanings of those original symbols, perhaps. Is that stretching things too far? I began this study as a skeptic, expecting to discover significant differences between these early translations and the King James. I happily found that there are no differences in the major points of faith, but there are many subtle differences in meaning and many passages are much easier to understand in one version than in another. I found no one version that seemed to be the best in every instance, each one has its strengths and weaknesses. Case closed? To me there are specific things worthy of greater care in study to find the original message intended by God, if such a message does exist. Example: God requires faith in the death of Christ as atonement for sin. What is the original arrangement of symbols that leads to that message right there in those English words? I can ask Frank tomorrow, to see if he can offer a competitive answer. Did you get that Joe? Please excuse my failure to get that, in this case, I can't remember Peter and a tabernacle. My son just called and said "be outside in 2 minutes," as the Real Estate Agents are rushed today, and I am asked to go help look at a house. |
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modified as follows for readability (Joe, if this is not readable, please say so as I may have gotten carried away trying to make it too readable. It took me nearly an hour of tweaking. Can you imagine how the translators of the Bible felt? (I wonder what they would think about the words "carried away" and "tweaking"): Alexander Hamilton (connected too well to the British that were supposedly defeated in The Revolution) worked for and then had ready victims in what was then a CONSOLIDATED GOVERNMENT after The Federalist Papers (campaign promises MADE to be broken) SOLD to “We The People” A FALSE FRONT (The Articles of Confederation worked well enough to aid in The Revolution, but did not work well enough for a BANKING MONOPOLY to take hold). So, Alexander Hamilton and his ilk got their NATIONAL DEBT. bear, That is easily understood by me, easy to read, an improvement from the original. If there is intent to improve accuracy then the power to do so is at least directed toward reaching that goal, and that can be compared, reasonably, to any attempt made by anyone, at any time, whereby the power of will is employed to reach the goal of deceiving targeted people who are targeted for some reason. I am going to charge into an area of view that you may not, at first, understand. I've warned you in the past about things that I have witnessed on my path through this process of setting aside what I call the Monopoly viewpoint, and picking up pieces of the puzzle that improve, by way of comparative study, intentionally more accurate viewpoint - of anything. Anything. I've learned this habit in many ways, including the work required to fix mechanical things. If I have earned a title in life then my title could be mechanic. My title earned could be Heavy Equipment Operator. Example: My brother borrowed my other brother's tractor to level some ground in preparation for a fence. He tried to level the ground, he made it worse instead, he asked for my help. It has been over 5 years, easy, since I've operated any heavy equipment. I get in the machine and I doubt my ability to operate this machine. I've never operated this specific type of machine, and not this machine specifically. Problem: ground is not level. Solution: create a solution. Try this, try this, try this, try this, which works better? Go with that which works better, let go that which does not work better. Get off the machine, my brother says thanks, what do I owe you, he asks. I say nothing, I like to help. Which viewpoint works better, specifically, and what is the goal? I must know better, even if I no longer want to know better. Being alive can be a problem, and the only solution that works is knowing better. The warning I want to charge into is such that really horrible things become acutely, intimately, known. I've warned you about that, at least I have tried to warn you about that, and so this is not an easy path to take, if you are going down the same path I went down, the same path I am traveling, down, or level, or up, or whatever actual direction I am going, despite my willful goal of reaching for a more accurate perspective: knowing better. Were I am going is where I will go because I want to know better. You may not understand now, you may never understand, but I am going to warn you, for future reference, about rewards and punishments. I will not be your helpful friend, able to give you credit, and thank you, for things that do not appear to me as helping me. I would be false to myself, and it would be counterfeit gratitude in that case. What I am saying is that this path is not often rewarding, and very difficult in fact, when dealing with other people who are not yet able to see what you see. True or not. There are old sayings that ring true, and these old sayings ring true even when I, personally, am wrong, the saying still rings true. If you speak the truth have a foot in the stirrup. Long and torturous (relatively speaking) is the road where words are offered honestly, without care in considering the possible costs, because error in perspective is ubiquitous. Example: This is an event that I may have reported to you already. In this room were assembled many people who were gathering in reaction to current events that included Waco and subsequent NEWS about The Militia Movement, so called. I was listening to speakers, and the speaker spoke words that were fashionable but false, concerning the concept of government. I do not remember the actual words. I raised my hand from the back of the room, the speaker allowed me to speak, and my words were simple and to the point. In unison the whole room turned their heads to me shouting the word "no" at me. I was not aware of it, specifically, at the time, but the friend who was with me, the same guy who helped me get on the Congressional Ballot, told me what happened. It hurts. It hurts worse when those I love express to me words that kill me, because I speak the truth. Example: While my mother was dying we talked, and I babbled on, and on, and on, about Chem trails, and Legal Crime, and often was the case that my mother would ask questions as if seeking to validate my viewpoint, to which I responded with references, and studies, and books, and quotes, and my own measures such as my Joe's Law measure, on and on. I thought, during those times, that my mother was listening, and at least entertaining the information as being possibly valid. We even shared some things, such as a skepticism concerning the official story about the Kennedy murders, by Legal Criminals. Anyway, one day, and she may have been slipping at that point, having suffered long with lack of oxygen up to that point, and she turns to me while I was speaking, on and on, as I sometimes do, and she interrupts me, and with a look of what looks like revulsion, she ask incredulously: "You don't really believe that...do you...Joe." Not a question mark, really, it was a charge, a conviction, a sentence, and punishment all rolled up into one sentence. Eyes roll. People whisper. I get those looks. People learn not to talk to me. Years, decades, a long time, a road traveled, and lessons learned along the way. You understand this, I trust, because you travel a similar road, perhaps not the same viewpoint, but a similar viewpoint. How is this for a quote? "Truth, like gold, is to be obtained not by its growth, but by washing away from it all that is not gold." Leo Tolstoy The reward for seeking the goal of improved perspective, to me, is life: when I no longer want life I can go the other way. |
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JoeI will not be your helpful friend, able to give you credit, and thank you, for things that do not appear to me as helping me. I would be false to myself, and it would be counterfeit gratitude in that case. What I am saying is that this path is not often rewarding, and very difficult in fact, when dealing with other people who are not yet able to see what you see. A helpful friend is honest. Honest to themselves and honest to their friends. An unhelpful friend is dishonest. Dishonest to themselves and dishonest to their friends. Dishonesty can come in the form of trying to soften the truth or to avoid hurting another person because the truth may be too damaging to the friendship. I prefer an honest friend. Truth spoken in love is friendship. Truth spoken in hate is not honest. I trust that you will speak the truth in love. I am not talking of a romantic love, I am speaking of a love every human should have for their fellow human: Brotherly Love. Truth spoken in brotherly love is helpful. I too try as hard as I may, to speak the truth to you in brotherly love. At the point you ask me not to speak truth, I will stop. That too would be out of brotherly love: Kindness and Respect for your boundaries. I think helpful friendship can exist with boundaries. However, then there are boundaries, so the friendship does not accomplish all that it may. I think that some people cannot exist with the damage honesty brings to their perception of reality. I understand much more than I understood when you first began to help me see. I still at times have a hard time accepting that the reality I once perceived never even existed. I think that people who cannot exist with the damage that the truth brings in a way are like people who are physically traumatized and protective shock takes over the physical body to preserve the internal organs so that live can be prolonged. I think some comas work in that fashion as well. There are also times that doctors put people into comas thru medicines so that the body can work on healing itself. Joe, the reality of Legal Crime and the softness that most Americans have been brought up in clash. Your mom had hard times, but she did not see the physical slaughter of her family. She did not see her children starve to death. For the most part, life in America is good. We have plenty to eat and modern conveniences. Rarely do we face wondering where the next morsel of bread will come from. There are people in Haiti, children...families, who are lucky to have one small meal a day. So, it was hard for your mom to really understand all that you understand. She was dealing with her life slipping away. It is hard to wake up even when health exists. It was hard for her to even comprehend that you could believe the things that you believe. My mom for the most part does not want to hear it. It is too much. It is much easier to exist in the perception of the goodness and abundance that does exist instead of the abundance that could exist. It is more comforting to believe that votes count and that elected, paid, officials care and want to do good for the people they represent. I remember when looking at the trails in the sky brought horror to me. It was too much. I remember when you showed me the Economic Hit Man. The horror of what people do for money to other people and countries was too much. I remember when I saw Gadhafi murdered for public viewing. It was too much. Truth was too much. It hurt too much to know the truth and to have my pie in the sky perception shattered into a million pieces. It doesn't hurt so much now. My pop knows. He was a soldier in Korea like your dad. All he had to say to me was, "I don't know what can be done about it." I still have a hard time with the Pilger information. Perhaps it is too much. Perhaps I rather believe that it is one-sided reporting. Perhaps I think that legal criminals within our country have destroyed our country by doing evil things to other countries so that we will easily be turned upon ourselves and then be overrun be the ilk of the legal criminals existing in other countries. Perhaps I would rather believe that Pilger is being used to turn us upon ourselves so that we can easily be turned. That one side of my perception. Perhaps it is too much for me to divide the patriotism that has been ingrained in me to accept that "our country" has been so evil. I understand that it is not "out country" that has done anything. I understand that it is specific evil people in our country who have done specific evil things. But I also have been taught that the Communists will rewrite our history so that we do have a foundation to stand upon. I am not seeing red. I am stating something that I have been taught. So it is hard to sort truth and error when error has been mixed with truth and accepted for one's whole life. "We" funded Japan. "We" paid to have those Batan Death March Soldiers walk that road to their death and torture. I will not tell the widow in our town that information. She is 90+. What good would that information do other than to crush her? Joe, I perceive that you hate the God that I love. That does not make me unhappy with your friendship. It makes me know that I have not explained well enough. There is so much I want to say. Or did you mean something different when you said you would not be my helpful friend? ... |
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bear, I think that you and I are able to communicate well once again. We are not able to see a common viewpoint, as if one could exist, but we are able to find some of the commonalities. In other words no to this: Or did you mean something different when you said you would not be my helpful friend? I hope I can continue to help to the limits that are agreeable. |
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Joe "I hope I can continue to help to the limits that are agreeable" And what are the limits/boundaries? Have you ever thought of doing free-lance tractor work? As in not for a company, but for individuals who would like to hire and individual? You know here in the country (as opposed to city) those individuals exist...without bonds and without insurance...I suppose one has to be careful which individuals they are hired by...should an accident occur...who would be responsible? ... |
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7/24/13 page 112I purchased the ballot access, with my own earnings, for the most part, because of Waco. Per our discussion the sentence was modified as follows: I purchased the ballot access (with my own earnings) for the most part because of Waco. |
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7/24/13 Page 114 Principle lies are like bases of operations, like Central Banks, where the ancillary sat-elites grow (exponentially) from the root, like weeds, perhaps, persist, or like ants persisting until sugar and boric acid employs the army to deliver the solution to the queen - if you know what I mean. Modified for readability: Principle lies are like bases of operations, like Central Banks, where the ancillary sat-elites grow exponentially from the root. Like weeds, perhaps, persist...or like ants persisting until sugar and boric acid employs the army to deliver the solution to the queen - if you know what I mean. |
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7/24/13 Page 114 If all the information is couched in the language whereby the lie of making THINGS accountable for the actions of people, which so far that appears to be the truth, unfortunately, then it is WIN/WIN for the Legal Criminals. And that remains to be my POINT that I think ought to be acknowledged. Modified as follows: If all the information is couched in the language whereby the lie of “making THINGS accountable for the actions of people,” (which so far appears to be the truth, unfortunately) then it is WIN/WIN for the Legal Criminals. That remains to be my POINT, which I think ought to be acknowledged. |
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7/24/13 Page 115 Respectfully, I disagree. If the making of THINGS accountable for the deeds of people remains intact, then the Trojan Horse is in the gate, and the virus will consume everything soon enough. And I may be a nutcase after all, but that is how I see it, again, due diligence. So long as I have thrown my hat in this ring. Modified as follows: Respectfully, I disagree. If the “making of THINGS accountable for the deeds of people” remains intact, then the Trojan Horse is in the gate, and the virus will consume everything soon enough. I may be a nutcase after all, but that is how I see it - again, due diligence - as long as I have thrown my hat in this ring. |
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7/24/13 Page 115 VERBS: "our government operates". modified by removing the word VERBS and italicized to show as a quote: "our government operates" |
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7/24/13 Page 115 The genuine article, and not the counterfeit version, is a convenience, a use of language whereby the speaker does not list all the names of all the people who share the thoughts and actions specific to the SET of people being referenced with the word "government." Modified as follows: The genuine article, not the counterfeit version, is a convenience: a use of language whereby the speaker does not list all the names of all the people who share the thoughts and actions specific to the SET of people being referenced with the word "government." |
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7/24/13 Page 115 If the speaker is employing the genuine truth of the matter, whereby "our government operates" then there is a list of names that constitute "our government." Modified as follows: If the speaker is employing the genuine truth of the matter whereby "our government operates," then there is a list of names that constitute "our government." |
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7/24/13 Page 116 I don't know. But I have an interest in knowing, because as stated, failure to reach back to the roots of the infection is a set-up for failure in this adventure, this animated contest of freedom: yes or no? moved comma to after because: I don't know. But I have an interest in knowing because, as stated, failure to reach back to the roots of the infection is a set-up for failure in this adventure, this animated contest of freedom: yes or no? |
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7/24/13 Page 116 1. Failing to acknowledge the fact that I still, during weak moments, think in terms of holding THINGS accountable for actions done by people, is very bad for me as that weakness lends way too much moral, and then eventually material, support to very bad people. 2. Never mind, nothing worth noting here, insignificant stuff, and irrelevant. modified as follows:
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7/24/13 Page 116/117 1. Language is being used to convey a known SET of people contained in the word "government," which is ours. And those people do this, and those people do that, so those people in that SET are accountable, responsible, because THINGS are not responsible, and THINGS are not accountable, such as "government." 2. Government did it. modified as follows
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7/24/13 Page 117 I don't think so. I can sympathize, and I can offer a word of advice. Slay that dragon if it exists in your mind, please. I think you may eventually see the significance of my concern, sharing it, if you will. Modified as follows: I don't think so. I can sympathize, and I can offer a word of advice:
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7/24/13 Page 118 Joe, let me know what you think about this. In context (abundant examples): Fill in the blank. Modified as follows: In context (abundant examples): |
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7/24/13 Page 118/119 I'm a creep too, sure, I get that too, and I may be stepping over the line of decorum. Sure, I get that. I spoil the fun, plopping tortured bodies onto every kitchen table, figuratively, party pooper. Here comes the torture and mass murder guy. Bodies all over me, 8 by 10 glossies, arms, legs, severed heads. Modified: I'm a creep too, sure. I get that too, and I may be stepping over the line of decorum. Sure, I get that. I spoil the fun - plopping tortured bodies onto every kitchen table, figuratively - party pooper... “Here comes the torture and mass murder guy.” Bodies all over me…8 by 10 glossies…arms, legs, severed heads. |
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7/24/13 Page 119 It, not ambiguously it, but specifically it, the dragon of which I speak, is in the headlights because I am shining light on it. If it does not exist in your world: thank God, and thanks for avoiding it. Thanks for not lending it any moral or material support. Modified: It, not ambiguously it, but specifically it, "the dragon" of which I speak, is in the headlights because I am shining light on it. If it does not exist in your world, thank God and thanks for avoiding it. Thanks for not lending it any moral or material support. |
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7/24/13 Page 119 A dragon or not? Insignificant, superfluous, fecal matter or a word to the wise worthy of note, if it exists, and if it exists, then, can it be rendered powerless? Modified: A dragon or not? Insignificant, superfluous, fecal matter? Or a word to the wise worthy of note, if it exists, and if it exists, then, can it be rendered powerless? |
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7/24/13 Page 119 If so, then to me, good things are bound to happen like this: "It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." Henry Ford Modified: If so, then to me, good things are bound to happen - like this: "It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." —Henry Ford |
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7/24/13 Page 120 If Rand Paul can be infected, whereby Dad is not, if that is the case, and I can't know, then it seems to me, the Dragon is worthy of note, and that is my point. Modified: If Rand Paul can be infected whereby Dad is not, if that is the case, and I can't know, then it seems to me the Dragon is worthy of note, and that is my point. |
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7/24/13 Page 120 Joe, see note below The Dragon is in darkness, not in the light; so laughter, fun, profits, and good things are happening all around, even while the Dragon works in our sleep - for now - and even while our earnings flow to specific people who are now torturing and mass murdering innocent victims. Joe, in addition to punctuation, I took a little extra artistic liberty in the last line by moving the word "now" to the end as " - right now." If you do not like it, just let me know. The Dragon is in darkness - not in the light - so laughter, fun, profits, and good things are happening - all around - even while the Dragon works in our sleep - for now - and even while our earnings flow to specific people who are torturing and mass murdering innocent victims - right now. |
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7/24/13 Page 120 They scream bloody murder, some people take time to listen, and some people want more. Modified: They scream bloody murder - some people take time to listen, and some people want more. |
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7/24/13 Page 120 It may be a good idea to slay that Dragon if it is infecting you, or your grandson. italicized it: It may be a good idea to slay that Dragon if it is infecting you or your grandson. |
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7/24/13 Page 120 That is not all that I am saying, but I am saying that much, because I think that that specific point is relevant to your grandson stepping into the battle where that Dragon sleeps. Modified: That is not all that I am saying, but I am saying that much because I think that specific point is relevant to your grandson stepping into the battle where that Dragon sleeps. |
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Yipee!!! Look where I am now: Joe’s Law and Joe Slaw both take time to understand. One is hot and spicy with radishes, or so I hear…the other…provides a key to abundance. The recipe for Joe’s Law is shared below. If you want the recipe for Joe Slaw, you will have to ask Joe. Joe’s Law is used here to prove the point that the American public needs to create and begin using competitive forms of currency. And the thought came to mind that it might be fun to add the recipe for Joe's Slaw somewhere at the end of the book...maybe a tribute to funny boy? (It seems to me that you discussed one time a table conversation about Joe's Law and Joe Slaw instigated by your son.) What do you think Joe? A surprise for the reader? Or would that be too frivolous when such important news is being spread? Anyways, when changing my quotes to the different smaller font, and in the process of right justifying the margins with the use of a paragraph return at the end of each paragraph, we may end up with a little space. Do you remember off the top of your head what the page count is that the printer quoted? I used to remember, but have forgotten for some reason. Right now we have 168 pages and I still have pages left to edit. Was it 174? |
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7/24/13 Page 121 Discussion JOE, I wonder if the word "Discussion" is correct to start this section in the book since this is actually an article you authored, and does not include discussion. Should we remove/replace the word? Or do you think the word is fitting because you welcome discussion? |
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7/24/13 Page 121 Watch Video: The Fight for Liberty:37 removed 2nd colon: Watch Video: The Fight for Liberty37 |
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7/24/13 Page 121 Many people may not understand the power struggle being fought as in that link as Ron Paul spearheads defensive action against the offenses perpetrated by the group of people known collectively as The FED. Modified: Many people may not understand the power struggle being fought as captured in that link where Ron Paul spearheads defensive action against the offenses perpetrated by the group of people collectively known as “The FED.” |
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7/24/13 Page 122 That is one sentence in English. It is an explanation of Political Economy and it can be used to answer the types of questions tabled in the link where Ron Paul is fighting against Legal Crime. Added comma: That is one sentence in English. It is an explanation of Political Economy, and it can be used to answer the types of questions tabled in the link where Ron Paul is fighting against Legal Crime. |
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7/24/13 Page 122 The FED produces Legal Purchasing Power and therefore the question asked is a question concerning the legal license to produce Legal Purchasing Power. added semicolon and comma: The FED produces Legal Purchasing Power; and therefore, the question asked is a question concerning the legal license to produce Legal Purchasing Power. |
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7/24/13 Page 122 Purchasing Power is Purchasing Power with or without the legal license. Purchasing Power is the Power to Purchase and that is an accurately measurable fact. Added comma: Purchasing Power is Purchasing Power with or without the legal license. Purchasing Power is the Power to Purchase, and that is an accurately measurable fact. |
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7/24/13 Page 122 First listen to the question asked and then listen to a rephrasing of the question so as to make sense of the question in such a way as to allow for a reasonable answer (removing ambiguity): 1a. Do you think that The FED SHOULD be abolished? 1b. Do you think that the single license to produce legal purchasing power should be abolished? Mmodified (removed the word listen because the reader cannot listen to the 2nd question. Also matched words and numbering for easy reading): First, the question asked. Then second, the question rephrased to make sense of the question in such a way to allow for a reasonable answer (removing ambiguity).
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7/24/13 Page 122 The reader may be confused even more after reading the revision of the original question, until the reader now uses the revision in conjunction with Joe's Law as such: Modified: The reader may be even more confused after reading the revision of the original question...that is until the reader uses the revision in conjunction with Joe's Law as such: |
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7/24/13 Page 122 Power produced into oversupply reduces the price of power while legal purchasing power increases because power reduces the cost of production. Italicized legal: Power produced into oversupply reduces the price of power while legal purchasing power increases because power reduces the cost of production. |
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7/24/13 Page 123 Do you think that there is a difference between regular purchasing power and legal purchasing power? And if you don't think there is a difference between regular purchasing power and legal purchasing power, then it may be a good idea to figure out if there is a difference. Added italics and removed the word "And": Do you think that there is a difference between regular purchasing power and legal purchasing power? If you don't think there is a difference between regular purchasing power and legal purchasing power, then it may be a good idea to figure out if there is a difference. |
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7/24/13 Page 123 Take away all the false window dressing, or pull back the curtain that hides the Wizard of Oz, and what is the accurate, indisputable, answer to those questions? Modified: Take away all the false window dressing, or pull back the curtain that hides the Wizard of Oz…what is the accurate, indisputable answer to those questions? |
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bear Guest
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7/24/13 Page 123 If it were not counterfeit, then The FED would be producing wealth. Actual wealth, actual power to purchase, and they would not need an army of liars, an army of thieves, and an army of victims to enforce the value of it, as their money would be as valuable with, or without, the army backing it up. Modified: If it were not counterfeit, then The FED would be producing wealth…actual wealth…actual power to purchase. They would not need an army of liars, an army of thieves, and an army of victims to enforce the value of their “money,” as it would be as valuable with or without the army backing it up. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 124 The FED does not produce wealth. Therefore, the things that The FED does produce is something other than wealth. Changed is to are: The FED does not produce wealth. Therefore, the things that The FED does produce are something other than wealth. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 124 & 125 & 128 1b. Do you think that the single license to produce legal purchasing power should be abolished? Renumbered according to earlier modification:
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 124 If all the victims knew better they would stop being victims, they would not wait, and they would suddenly, and irrevocably, choose a more powerful option. added comma after better: If all the victims knew better, they would stop being victims, they would not wait, and they would suddenly, and irrevocably, choose a more powerful option. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 125 "It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." Henry Ford Modified: "It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." —Henry Ford |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 125 Instead of hearings, and even instead of court cases, the former victims would be inventing, producing, and employing forms of competitive purchasing power rather than being forced by effective deceit, and instead of being forced by effective threats of violence, and instead of being forced by effective violence targeting the competitors, into the use of the one Counterfeit Money Produced by The FED. Removed comma before into: Instead of hearings, and even instead of court cases, the former victims would be inventing, producing, and employing forms of competitive purchasing power rather than being forced by effective deceit, and instead of being forced by effective threats of violence, and instead of being forced by effective violence targeting the competitors into the use of the one Counterfeit Money Produced by The FED. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 125 In the effort to remove even a shadow of doubt as to the right answer to that question I offer Joe's Law: added comma: In the effort to remove even a shadow of doubt as to the right answer to that question, I offer Joe's Law: |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 125 Counterfeit power does not actually produce power. So The FED is actually consuming power, not producing it. With each lie, which is each unit of counterfeit money, and each purchase that they alone make when they make money for nothing, and then spend the money they made for nothing but lying: consumes. If they “loan” money, that is a purchase, as they purchase a borrower. That is called fraud. modified: Counterfeit power does not actually produce power, but consumes power. So The FED is actually consuming power, not producing it. With each lie -- which is each unit of counterfeit money -- and with each purchase that they alone make when they make money for nothing, and then when they spend the money they make for nothing but lying, that is consumption. When they “loan” money that is a purchase, as they actually purchase the borrower. That is called fraud. JOE, I want to scream. They are buying us with fake money. The horror. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 125 Productive Power Produced into oversupply reduces the price of power... added italics: Productive Power Produced into oversupply reduces the price of power... |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 126 When Productive Power is Produced into oversupply and then the price of power is reduced it is not a result of Counterfeiters Purchasing Borrowers Fraudulently. modified: When Productive Power is produced into oversupply and the price of power is reduced, it is not a result of Counterfeiters Purchasing Borrowers Fraudulently. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 126 That means: So much wealth being produced by so many productive people that the limits of abundance of wealth is allowed to happen instead of limits placed on the production of productive power being enforced by criminals who profit by using the power they steal to eliminate all competition (monopoly fraud business). Modified: That means: So much wealth being produced by so many productive people that the limits of abundance of wealth is allowed to happen INSTEAD of limits being placed on the production of productive power and being enforced by criminals who profit by using the power they steal to eliminate all competition (monopoly fraud business). |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 126 Productive Power Produced into oversupply reduces the price of Productive Power... Added Italics: Productive Power Produced into oversupply reduces the price of [l]Productive[/l] Power... |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 126 That means: As more and more people are free to compete in the work that does effectively produce more wealth, more things of value, more actual value, more actual productive power, as more and more production is produced... The result of all that "economy" is a reduction in the price of all that "economy," as fewer people have nothing and more people have plenty. The stuff of value goes down in price, as a matter of fact, in reality. Added "then" and joined ellipse That means: As more and more people are free to compete in the work that does effectively produce more wealth, more things of value, more actual value, more actual productive power, as more and more production is produced…then the result of all that "economy" is a reduction in the price of all that "economy," as fewer people have nothing and more people have plenty. The stuff of value goes down in price, as a matter of fact, in reality. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 126 That is called monetary appreciation (gaining power) or deflation (gaining power). Two words for the same thing. Modified: That is called monetary appreciation (gaining power) or deflation (gaining power) - two words for the same thing. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I think I remember that money should not be made scarce and that we could use rocks for money. Now I am reading this on page 127 and I am not understanding: If there is a finite unchanging amount of Legal Money then that same, steady, known, finite, and accurately accounted for supply of that exact amount of money, without increase or decrease in that finite supply of money, gains purchasing power as Productive Power increases to a condition of oversupply, and meanwhile the price of Productive Power decreases. Do you have time to help me understand? |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 127 If there is a finite unchanging amount of Legal Money then that same, steady, known, finite, and accurately accounted for supply of that exact amount of money, without increase or decrease in that finite supply of money, gains purchasing power as Productive Power increases to a condition of oversupply, and meanwhile the price of Productive Power decreases. added comma before "then" and removed comma before "and" and added parenthesis for readability: If there is a finite unchanging amount of Legal Money, then that same, steady, known, finite and accurately accounted for supply of that exact amount of money (without increase or decrease in that finite supply of money) gains purchasing power as Productive Power increases to a condition of oversupply, and meanwhile the price of Productive Power decreases. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 127 More power (more wealth) = lower prices of power (wealth) and more things to buy with the same money means less money required to get one of the many things. Lower prices of wealth and the same amount of money to buy that wealth, and each dollar can then buy more wealth, since the price of wealth goes down. Same amount of total money in use, more stuff to buy = more purchasing power per unit of money: Where 1 dollar could only buy 1 thing; now there are 2 things at lower prices, so 1 dollar now buys 2 things. Modified: More power (more wealth) = lower prices of power (wealth). In other words: more things to buy with the same money means less money required to get one of the many things. In other words: lower prices of wealth with the same amount of money to buy that wealth means that each dollar can buy more wealth, since the price of wealth goes down. In other words: the same amount of total money in use and more stuff to buy means more purchasing power per unit of money. In other words: where one dollar could only buy one thing; now there are two things available at lower prices, so one dollar can now buy two things. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 127 If there is no legal money then there are no “taxes” (extortion payments) required to enforce that one money, and no demand to pay “taxes,” and therefore there is no connection between LAW and MONEY, but the Economic Law (without the political part) still applies. Joe, can you make sure I did not change the meaning of your intent while I was working toward readability for bear people. If there is no legal money, then there are no “taxes” (extortion payments) required to enforce that one money, so then there is no demand to pay “taxes.” Therefore, there is no more connection between LAW and MONEY; however, Economic Law (without political interference) still naturally applies. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 127 Joe, this sentence follows on the heals of the post above. I am thinking it would be interesting to elaborate more with an additional sentence about the insertion of political law into economic law, which leads me to ask: Can political law ever be inserted into economics in a way which is productive? Or does political law always need to be detached from economics? Is there such a thing as political law where crime is not made legal? Here is the sentence that I am asking for elaboration on. Or is that outside the scope of this section of the book? Economic Law remains true with or without Political LAW |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 128 People either believe in the lie, are led by such falsehoods, or they know better. Removed comma and added "and": People either believe in the lie and are led by such falsehoods, or they know better. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, The concept here is possibly understandable from a mathematical viewpoint involving a constant in place of a variable. The idea is to see how other variables work when the Legal Money Unit is held constant, and this is to me the most telling part of Joe's Law, because the Fraud of Legal Money works because the victims assume (wrongly) that the source of the Power of Legal Money are honest people and therefore those honest people actually try to keep the Legal Unit Value of Money Constant. Look at it this way: Productive power produced into oversupply does, in fact, reduce the price that anyone, anywhere, can charge for productive power. Take any form of productive power and realize how that works. I like electricity as the example that works the best, but you can pick anything. You can pick knowledge as the form of productive power produced to a point where knowledge is everywhere in abundance. Everyone knows everything and therefore no one can get anyone else to pay for knowledge since knowledge is everywhere. I like electricity because it is easier to measure in fact. One kilowatt/hour of electricity is exactly one kilowatt/hour of electricity always. One unit of knowledge is always one unit of knowledge too, I suppose, but see if you can get out a hand held measuring device and measure up one Unit of Knowledge. You may find one Unit of Knowledge and I may get out my measuring device and find that your measuring device does not measure the same Unit of Knowledge in the same way as mine. It would be difficult to find out which measuring device was more accurate, yours, or mine. So instead of knowledge being abundant the idea is to see what happens to the price of electricity if electricity is produced into abundance, so abundant is the supply of electricity made that it is as abundant as the current supply of lies from politicians, or even better, the current supply of oxygen is as abundant as the current supply of electricity on Earth: in our hypothetical example of POWER abundance (independence). I know this is a long way around the answer to the question, but I think it is a competitive way to answer the question. So now, there are relatively inexpensive units of electricity produced everywhere, you can get a unit of electricity as easy as breathing in. You can breath in now. How much does it cost to breath in right now? Who sends you a bill for each breath you take? No one. Not yet anyway. So electricity reaches that level of abundance, to answer the question, this is how the question is answered, you now consume electricity at the same rate of monetary cost to you as you currently pay for each breath, which is nothing. Electricity is so abundant now, in this answer to your question, that you do not have to pay another penny, or nickle, or dime, or quarter, or Federal Reserve Note for any more electricity that you use, just like you now pay for each breath you take. Power produced into oversupply reduces the price of power. That part is now abundantly clear, as if knowledge was abundant? Costless knowledge? How much do I charge you for this knowledge? Nothing. Same deal. It does not cost anything? Wrong. The idea is to understand the UNIT of measure. Which unit of measure? Power produced into oversupply reduces the price of power WHILE purchasing power increases. How much is one Unit of Purchasing Power? Is the measure of one Unit of Purchasing Power constant? No, the unit is currently not constant, so the Joe's Law perspective has to MAKE that unit constant so as to MAKE sense of how political economy actually works. If the Legal Criminals at The Federal Reserve are MAKING the Legal Unit of Purchasing Power decrease rapidly (what else do they do?), then the rate of production has to increase rapidly just to keep up with the rate at which the Legal Criminals are reducing the Purchasing Power of the Legal Unit of Monopoly Money. So, to make things very much simpler, the idea is to imagine that there are no Legal Criminals working feverishly to reduce the Purchasing Power of a Unit of Legal Money, and therefore the Purchasing Power of a single Unit of Legal Money is constant, always the same thing, as if One Unit of Legal Money is equal to One Kilowatt/hour of Electricity. Back to the scenario of abundant Electricity, where no one pays anyone for any more electricity, which is the same cost per person for each breath of air currently (with some exceptions such as people buying oxygen because some people suffer bad health) so what then happens to that constant unit of value known as Legal Monopoly Money or Purchasing Power when no one is paying any more Legal Money for Electricity? The answer must be obvious, or you fail to understand how Political Economy works. The answer is such that the Constant Unit of Legal Money buys more as Electricity becomes abundant and as the price of electricity reaches zero. Purchasing Power (of one constant unit of Legal Money) increases. Like this: Electricity (power) produced into oversupply reduces the price of electricity (power) while the same "dollar" buys more. The same dollar buys more. That does not mean that a different dollar buys more, and therefore there is your answer, if I understood the question. The dollar has to be assumed to be of a constant supply, or quantity, which is proportional to the value of that unit of Purchasing Power. The process in view is called POWER. Not Energy. Not Force. Not Mass. Not Motion. Not Velocity. The concept in view is POWER. Which POWER? Purchasing Power. Why does Purchasing Power increase when Electricity (Power) is produced into oversupply? Because the price of electricity reaches zero, just like the price of oxygen (before the Legal Criminals destroy that too), just like the price of the air we breath is currently no cost paid by us to anyone (except when the Legal Criminals decide to tax each breath), just like now where air is priceless, electricity can become priceless too, and because everything that is produced is made less costly when productive power, or electricity, is employed to make things, because POWER reduces the cost of production. Which power? We can go right back to the power of knowledge. Make the power of knowledge abundant and is it likely that people will work to make productive power abundant, or will many very knowledgeable people be sending all they produced to criminals who then make everyone suffer? |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 128 Joe, I don't understand the "with or without" part of added to Joe's Law. In the way I am thinking extortion inverts Joe's Law resulting in entropy instead of ectropy when economic law is allowed its natural course without interference of fraud. Productive Power Produced into oversupply reduces the price of Productive Power WHILE Purchasing Power INCREASES with, or without anyone, anywhere, enforcing any extortion (“tax”) payments of any kind with any money of any kind. Can you help me understand? |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 128 If prices go down the same amount of money buys more, and that is also a fact, but there is one more thing to note. Added comma and colon: If prices go down, the same amount of money buys more, and that is also a fact, but there is one more thing to note: |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, 7/25/13 Page 128 Joe, I don't understand the "with or without" part of added to Joe's Law. In the way I am thinking extortion inverts Joe's Law resulting in entropy instead of ectropy when economic law is allowed its natural course without interference of fraud. Productive Power Produced into oversupply reduces the price of Productive Power WHILE Purchasing Power INCREASES with, or without anyone, anywhere, enforcing any extortion (“tax”) payments of any kind with any money of any kind. Can you help me understand? I may be able to help. Productive power can be invested toward making more productive power, but if that does happen, the Legal Criminals will no longer have destructive power. Does that sound right? |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 128 Only the frauds and their victims choose to believe in life without cost, sometimes known as a "something for nothing" scheme, or Pyramid Scheme. Modified: Only the frauds and their victims choose to believe in life without cost, sometimes known as a "something for nothing" or “Pyramid” Scheme. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 128 Buying into such things as "something for nothing," or Pyramid, or Ponzi, schemes may be a very good investment for the Legal Criminals because the Legal Criminals reap all the rewards while the victims pay all the costs. Removed removed 1st "or" and comma after Ponzi: Buying into such things as "something for nothing," Pyramid, or Ponzi schemes may be a very good investment for the Legal Criminals because the Legal Criminals reap all the rewards while the victims pay all the costs. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 128 There is a way to reduce the costs of production and that way is to store (by producing more than consumed), or save, or hold in reserve, surplus Productive Power. And the only way to store Productive Power is to make more of it than the amount of it that is consumed during the process of Production. Modified: by removing 1st or and comma after "reserve." Also italicized "it" for readability: There is a way to reduce the costs of production, and that way is to store (by producing more than consumed), save, or hold in reserve surplus Productive Power. The only way to store Productive Power is to make more of it than the amount of it that is consumed during the process of Production. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 128 Leaving even the shadow of doubt behind, the reader can know better as to the actual answer to the question asked. changed period to colon: Leaving even the shadow of doubt behind, the reader can know better as to the actual answer to the question asked: |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 128/129 Even the benefactors of such a Ponzi, or something for nothing, or Pyramid, scheme lose. It is unquestionable, irrefutable, and a natural fact, that everyone loses because the process of using Productive Power in the work of stealing Productive Power is the same process in nature when a parasite feeds upon a host and the parasite reproduces while the host is bled into a state of anemia, unable to reproduce. And the number of parasites increase while the host grows weaker, until the end result is a dead host, and the end result includes many parasites consuming each other, or some parasites finding another host to feed upon. modified: Even the benefactors of such a Ponzi, something for nothing, or Pyramid scheme lose. It is unquestionable, irrefutable, and a natural fact that everyone loses because the process of using Productive Power in the work of stealing Productive Power is the same process in nature when a parasite feeds upon a host and the parasite reproduces while the host is bled into a state of anemia, unable to reproduce. Meanwhile, the number of parasites increases while the host grows weaker until the end result is a dead host…and the end result includes many parasites consuming each other…some parasites find another host to feed upon. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 129 It is a race to the bottom, so why let the Legal Criminals keep score: they cook the books? modified: It is a race to the bottom, so why let the Legal Criminals keep score when they cook the books? |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 129 The only possible winners are the few who know better and the few who have a ready supply of new hosts to consume as these few parasites migrate from country to country each century that goes by while each host is consumed in turn. modified: The only possible winners are the few who know better and the few who have a ready supply of new hosts to consume as these few parasites migrate from country to country…each century that goes by…while each host is consumed…in turn. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 129 America is almost bled dry, and the parasites on the “top” of that pyramid scheme are moving to China, when the measuring device is "The Dollar," when that dollar is produced by those Legal Criminals. modified: America is almost bled dry. The parasites on the “top” of that pyramid scheme are moving to China when the measuring device is "The Dollar," and that dollar is produced by those Legal Criminals. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 129 The parasites on “top” of that pyramid scheme will dump The Dollar Hegemony on their exclusive schedule, and you won't be getting the memo, and they will be moving their parasitic behinds to China, where they are now very busy booming that new host. removed comma before "where": The parasites on “top” of that pyramid scheme will dump The Dollar Hegemony on their exclusive schedule, and you won't be getting the memo, and they will be moving their parasitic behinds to China where they are now very busy booming that new host. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Economic Law remains true with or without Political LAW I don't know if my answers are meeting the demand here, but I am inclined to keep typing. When I use the word economic I mean to link that word with the concept of measurable or physical reality and when I use the word political I mean to link that word with the concept of psychological reality or that which is measurable as thinking, or perception, or will power. So the will power (political law) intends to make the political law true, better, more accurate, more beneficial, or whatever the will power intends, but the "proof is in the pudding" as the actual fact of being true plays out in time. Example: Economic Law may be such that the boy who thinks he can fly is the boy (or girl) who uses a bed sheet as a cape and then intends to fly off the roof but fails to do so breaking a leg instead. Economic Law remains true with or without Political LAW The same result happens if the boy merely stumbles off the roof. Economic Law, or physical Law happens, even if the people think it won't happen. Economic Law, or physical law, happens even if the people call what happens something other than the words that normally are used to convey what happens. Hi, I am here to help you, give me all that you produce, and I will use all that you produce to help you even more. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 129 America, as a corporation, is being raided, and well documented in fact, by the Legal Criminal’s own cooked books reporting the paper trail anyone can follow to find the perpetrators red (green) handed. Broke into 2nd sentence: America, as a corporation, is being raided. Well documented, in fact, by the Legal Criminal’s own cooked books reporting the paper trail anyone can follow to find the perpetrators red (green) handed. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 129 America is on the bust cycle and all Americans, fellow parasites, and fellow net producers (those honest people who actually do produce more than they consume) alike, those not "leaving it," those "loving it" for its capacity to afford honest production, or for its capacity to connect to those who do produce (and feed off of that capacity) alike, everyone, in America, is on the schedule to lose World War III. modified as follows: America is on the bust cycle. All Americans: fellow parasites, fellow net producers (those honest people who actually do produce more than they consume) - alike; those not "leaving it," but those "loving it" for its capacity to afford honest production or for its capacity to connect to those who do produce (and feed off of that capacity) - alike; everyone IN America is on the schedule to lose World War III. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 129/130 Those who fraudulently take power here in America are using their power to wipe us out, maneuver us into a World War that we will lose because that is how the War Mongers, the War Profiteers, do business, and Americans who still "believe" in the lies will be led into that slaughter as cannon fodder. modified: Those who fraudulently take power here in America are using their power to wipe us out…to maneuver us into a World War that we will lose…because that is how the War Mongers, the War Profiteers, do business, and Americans who still "believe" in the lies will be led into that slaughter as cannon fodder. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 130 End The FED by inventing, producing, and employing productive power, or money, accurate money in competition with the fraudulent stuff, and they, those parasites, will either consume themselves, find another host somewhere else (very bad for the new host for sure), or they will be forced to depend upon charity, or they too will learn how to produce real wealth honestly. And then they too will join the true Friends of Liberty because then, in our time, crime won't pay so well, it won't be legal anymore. modified: End The FED by inventing, producing, and employing productive power, or money, accurate money in competition with the fraudulent stuff. And they, those parasites, will either consume themselves, or find another host somewhere else (very bad for the new host for sure), or they will be forced to depend upon charity, or they too will learn how to produce real wealth honestly. And then they too will join the true Friends of Liberty because then, in our time, crime won't pay so well. It won't be legal anymore. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 131 This narrative could continue to book length since the subject matter can be personalized in many ways not limited to a quick look at the contents of your wallet, savings account, bank statement, or stack of bills: all denominated in fraud notes. Modified: This narrative could continue to book length since the subject matter can be personalized in many ways: not limited to a quick look at the contents of your wallet, savings account, bank statement, or stack of bills - all denominated in fraud notes. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 131 "Hi, I am John, please have a seat." John extends his hand while meeting Jean Patricia Harmon half way between John's desk and the lobby. Jean had been waiting anxiously for 12 minutes and was aware of the previous customer leaving, so she, being next, got up and met John. "I am Jean, but please call me Pat." Jean minimizes the hand shake business and proceeds to the chair set in front of the desk ahead of John. Following, John asks, "Pat: for Patricia?" John rounds the desk sitting down after Pat takes her seat. Modified: "Hi, I’m John. Please have a seat." John extends his hand while meeting Jean Patricia Harmon halfway between his desk and the lobby. Jean had been waiting anxiously for twelve minutes and was aware of the previous customer leaving, so she, being next, got up and met John. "I am Jean, but please call me Pat." Jean minimizes the handshake business and proceeds to the chair set in front of the desk ahead of John. Following behind, John asks, "Pat: for Patricia?" John rounds the desk sitting down after Pat takes her seat. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 131 "Yes, my middle name, and my mother’s name too. My father's mother, that is my grandmother on my father's side, was Jean, and somehow Pat stuck." Modified: "Yes, my middle name, and my mother’s name too. My father's mother, that is my grandmother on my father's side, was Jean. And somehow Pat stuck." |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 131 Silence for a moment, John not sure how to respond, and Pat nervous, but not showing the condition. John is a young man in his 20s, and Pat is closer to 50 than she cares to be measured by the number of times the Earth goes around the sun. Modified: Silence for a moment…John not sure how to respond…and Pat nervous, but not showing the condition. John is a young man in his twenties, and Pat is closer to fifty than she cares to be measured by the number of times the Earth goes around the sun. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 132 "What can I do for you Mrs… Pat...?" Modified: "What can I do for you Mrs.…Pat...?" |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 132 "Thanks Mrs. Harmon, and are you here for our Product 1, Product 2? That is my job these days, at this desk, I'm sure you have read the signs on the way in." Modified by beaking into additional sentence: "Thanks Mrs. Harmon, and are you here for our Product 1, Product 2? That is my job these days, at this desk. I'm sure you have read the signs on the way in." |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 132 "I am here to help." Modified: "I'm here to help." |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 132 Pat unfolds the list from a folder prepared for the occasion. She moves down the list, obviously considering but rejecting the first page, turning to page 2. Pat asks, "For Product 2, what if the person's business fails? If the person borrows on their own good faith and credit and they fail for some reason, maybe not even their own fault, how will the loan be paid back? Does it matter if the loan cannot be paid back?" Modified: Pat unfolds the list from a folder prepared for the occasion. She moves down the list…obviously considering, but rejecting the first page…turning to the second page, she asks, "For Product 2, what if the person's business fails? If the person borrows on their own good faith and credit, and they fail for some reason - maybe not even their own fault - how will the loan be paid back? Does it matter if the loan cannot be paid back?" |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 132 John: "The thing that most people may not understand concerns the difference between the concept of "public" and "private" jurisdictions in law. This applies to your question and this has been explained to me by my trainers. These products are limited by law as to how much profit the bank can make as in the term not-for-profit may suggest. If you are familiar with the term…" modified: John answers, "The thing that most people may not understand concerns the difference between the concept of "public" and "private" jurisdictions in law. This applies to your question, and this has been explained to me by my trainers. These products are limited by law as to how much profit the bank can make as in the term not-for-profit may suggest. If you are familiar with the term…" |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 132/133 Joe, I have modified punctuation, but am having trouble with the meaning of this phrase, for my own understanding: "again we are in that sense not-for-profit, but in the sense of not-for-unlimited-profit." For some reason it sounds to me like it is FOR unlimited profit. I am sure it is just my mind playing tricks on me, but can you read it to make sure you understand it? Pat appears to be even more confused but John presses on with a more rapid cadence to his speech, as if he is now in a hurry to get a point across, to reach a desired goal. "In short: we repossess the items purchased with Product 1 and Product 2, a house in the first case, a Solar Panel Array, Electric Car, or Modular Green House Unit, in any case, and it is a net loss, but according to statistical calculation the Bank will always net a profit, to cover costs, up to the government limit - again we are in that sense not-for-profit, but in the sense of not-for-unlimited-profit. If you can understand that concept then we can move on. If you have more questions on that concept there are illustrations I can use to help you understand how it works the way it works.” Modified: Pat appears to be even more confused, but John presses on with a more rapid cadence to his speech, as if he is now in a hurry to get a point across - to reach a desired goal. "In short, we repossess the items purchased with Product 1 and Product 2: a house in the first case, a Solar Panel Array, Electric Car, or Modular Green House Unit, in any case, and it is a net loss. But according to statistical calculation, the Bank will always net a profit to cover costs up to the government limit - again we are in that sense not-for-profit, but in the sense of not-for-unlimited-profit. If you can understand that concept, we can move on. If you have more questions on that concept there are illustrations I can use to help you understand how it works the way it works.” |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 133 Pat begins to speak but John politely raises his hand and continues. "Mrs. Harmon, in any event please understand, that there is no shame, to me, as someone growing up in this new system, our new realities, here in America, for errors made by people who try to start a new Power Independence business, yet they fail. There will be errors, and the calculations we make to cover those errors are insured against loss too. How many times did Edison try to find the right filament for the first light bulb, and how many of us, even now, profit from light bulbs?" Modified: Pat begins to speak, but John politely raises his hand and continues. "Mrs. Harmon, in any event please understand that there is no shame. To me, as someone growing up in this new system, our new realities here in America, there is no shame for errors made by people who try to start a new Power Independence business, and yet they fail. There will be errors, and the calculations we make to cover those errors are insured against loss too. How many times did Edison try to find the right filament for the first light bulb, and how many of us, even now, profit from light bulbs?" |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 133 Pat is taken aback some by the young man presuming to know so much, but she recovers composure, and returns to the list of questions, looking at them, and then formulates a reply to the last answer provided by John. "Many, as I am aware, very many attempts to find the right filament. So, as with Product 1, there is also the matter of Credit Score?" Modified: Pat is taken aback some by the young man presuming to know so much, but she recovers composure and returns to the list of questions. Looking at them, she formulates a reply, "Many, as I am aware…very many attempts to find the right filament. So, with Product 2 as with Product 1, there is also the matter of Credit Score?" |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 133 7/26 took apostrophe out of monopolist's John reassures and confirms. "Yes, and we have gone through that sufficiently in training, as Legal Banking Interest is not the same thing as usury, again along the concept of not-for-unlimited-profit. The concept of Legal Banking Interest is a method of insuring against loss that is charged to a person who has proven to be prone to error, over time." John adds, “We bankers are no longer monopolist’s, as everyone knows by now.” Modified: John reassures and confirms, "Yes, and we have gone through that sufficiently in training. Legal Banking Interest is not the same thing as usury, again along the concept of not-for-unlimited-profit. The concept of Legal Banking Interest is a method of insuring against loss that is charged to a person who has proven to be prone to error, over time." John adds, “We bankers are no longer monopolists, as everyone knows by now.” |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 133 Pat adds, "Ok, so that failure is a higher insurance fee charged to that person who has failed, but isn't that going to shame the person who fails? Really, John, would you not feel shame?" Modified: "OK, so that failure results in a higher insurance fee charged to that person who has failed, but isn't that going to shame the person who fails? Really, John, would you not feel shame?" Pat asks curiously. |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 134 Closing Point Joe The teacher is the student and the teacher, so the student is the teacher and the student. If you do not know why: keep looking and listen more carefully. I did and found this: The First Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Church at Corinth: Corinthians 13 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. Closing point bear As on many occasions, bear asks Joe to watch or listen to something. In this case it was the Book of Romans.40 bear hopes that he will have eyes to see and ears to hear. Joe replies: Modified by adding some line spacing and punctuation/word changes: Closing Point Joe The teacher is the student and the teacher, so the student is the teacher and the student. If you do not know why: keep looking and listen more carefully. I did and found this: The First Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Church at Corinth, Chapter 13: “Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.” Closing point bear As on many occasions, bear asks Joe to watch or listen to something. In this case it was the Book of Romans.40 bear hopes that he will have eyes to see and ears to hear, and Joe replies: — Joe |
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bear Guest
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7/25/13 Page 135 7/26 made work load a single word. Let the light in. Let accurate information flow. Stop obeying the false orders that demand obedience to the work load required to construct a world of ignorance, lies, violence, and the perpetual destruction of innocence, or all life on Earth. Removed last comma: Let the light in. Let accurate information flow. Stop obeying the false orders that demand obedience to the workload required to construct a world of ignorance, lies, violence, and the perpetual destruction of innocence or all life on Earth. |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 135 See the facts, show the facts, listen to the facts, speak of the facts, refine your vision through competitive comparisons with other like-minded people who no longer settle for perpetual victimization, and accurately discriminate the vital difference between “good enough for government work” and self-governing, self-evident, roads IN Liberty. Modified: See the facts - show the facts - listen to the facts - speak of the facts. Refine your vision through competitive comparisons with other like-minded people who no longer settle for perpetual victimization. Accurately discriminate the vital difference between “good enough for government work” and self-governing, self-evident, roads IN Liberty. |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 135/136 In the remaining pages my efforts to offer a competitively accurate viewpoint continues along the lines of using the power available, consuming that power in productive investments, so as to end the day with more power than that which existed before the individual sets out in the day to earn their way through life. Modified: In the remaining pages, my efforts to offer a competitively accurate viewpoint continues along the lines of using the power available and consuming that power in productive investments so as to end the day with more power than that which existed before the individual sets out in the day to earn their way through life. |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 136 Knowledge works this way, like stepping stones, a place to stand, a place to go, a way to move from before to after, and simultaneously moving from worse, getting away from that stick, while moving toward better; to grasp, and realize, the carrot; which is a carrot you grow your way, because carrots will grow, and there is no need to crush other people along the way, because power can be abundant, and because power does not have to be scarce. Modified: Knowledge works this way, like stepping stones: a place to stand, a place to go, a way to move from before to after, and simultaneously moving away from worse (getting away from that stick) while moving toward better. To grasp and realize the carrot, which is a carrot you grow your way, because carrots will grow, and that there is no need to crush other people along the way because power can be abundant - because power does not have to be scarce. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Joe, I have modified punctuation, but am having trouble with the meaning of this phrase, for my own understanding: "again we are in that sense not-for-profit, but in the sense of not-for-unlimited-profit." For some reason it sounds to me like it is FOR unlimited profit. I am sure it is just my mind playing tricks on me, but can you read it to make sure you understand it? I see the concept of Public and Private as Legal Crime origins, for the most part, but there may be a genuine Free Market version in Liberty having to do with the concept of highest and best use. I have not worked the thinking of this out in my own words, but I can work on it now. As to the edit work you have done, it looks right to me. Highest and best use can be compared in a possible illustrative example whereby one person may claim exclusive ownership to all the land on Earth. That person may then charge everyone else a fee for renting any portion of all the land on Earth. That can be seen as unlimited profit. If the single owner of all the land on Earth limited the profit flowing from everyone else to himself on the basis of cost to the land then everyone who rented land would pay into a FUND for use of the land and the only time that the POWER in the FUND was released, or spent, would be in cases where the user of the land did not return the land to, at least, the original condition that the land was in before the renter began using the land. Of course all of those types of judgments require actual people finding agreement as to what is, or what is not, highest and best use, or what is, or is not, returning the land back to the original condition. Suppose a renter builds a Nuclear Power Plant in Japan, for example, and suppose the renter of the land stored very lethal radioactive waste up in the roof of the Power Planet, and suppose the roof blew off the Power Planet. That is a clear case of lowest and worse use as measurable by all the tortured and murdered people who were willfully tortured and murdered for a profit. Suppose, instead, it is merely a water well in the desert, and the owner claiming ownership auctions water to the highest bidder each time the owner sells some water out of that well that is owned by that one person, and suppose that person put toxic substances like fluoride in that water, and that person does not tell the people who buy water that the water is poisoned. Highest and best use? My highest and best use idea is a function of the Power Law, since a competitive highest and best use example can be compared to another highest and best use as a function of how quickly the FUND increases in POWER To Purchase. This may not be easy to understand, as I may be failing once again to employ English Language to the highest and best use at this time. How about this angle: If everyone were to employ Equitable Commerce as explained by Josiah Warren then the concept of having a PUBLIC FUND would be many small PRIVATE FUNDS instead of one big PUBLIC FUND, since there would be no mechanism by which POWER is collectivized from the many producers to the one monopoly COLLECTION AGENCY. The PUBLIC FUND, in equitable commerce, is SURPLUS WEALTH that remains in the exclusive control of those who produce SURPLUS WEALTH and none of the SURPLUS WEALTH flows to a LEGAL CRIME Collective Collection Agency, to then be distributed according to the whims of the Legal Criminals who inevitably spend that FUND on war, or crushing competition, or in the necessary expenses required to steal more from everyone so as to keep the flow going from everyone into the one FUND. The LIMIT in Legal Crime is only limited by how powerful deception, threats, and violence is, as those POWERS work on inspiring the targeted victims to pay into the False FUND. The moral LIMIT is measurable as the absence of willful employment of POWER used to commit crimes from behind false government or crimes out in the open for all to see clearly as crimes. I don't know if that answers the question. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am thinking about this this afternoon with more fresh mind than I had when I was working at it yesterday. I am wondering if the phrase:But according to statistical calculation, the Bank will always net a profit to cover costs up to the government limit - again we are in that sense not-for-profit, but in the sense of not-for-unlimited-profit. Still doesn't make sense to me. It still seems to me like the sentence reads that the bank is in not-for-profit AND not-for-unlimited profit (even though "but" is used. I wonder what you think about this: But according to statistical calculation, the Bank will always net a profit to cover costs up to the government limit - again we are in that sense not-for-profit, but not in the sense of unlimited profit. I changed the wording avert "but" What do you think? |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 136 As much power as is earned by as many earners as may exist at any time can be employed into investments that create more power, instead of having that same power stolen by criminals with badges, and then that stolen power supply is then consumed to steal more; that need not be happening any more. Modified: As much power as is earned, by as many earners as may exist at any time, can be employed into investments that create more power - instead of having that same power stolen by criminals with badges, and then that stolen power supply is consumed to steal more. That need not be happening any more. |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 136 That is stone to stand on. Knowing the nature of power in simple terms is powerful. Knowing power to be either investments in creating more power or destruction wielded by criminals: is a place to stand, and from that place you can see the fork in the road. Which path ends up with abundance? Which path ends up with extinction or worse? Modified: That is stone to stand on. Knowing the nature of power in simple terms is powerful. Knowing power to be either investments in creating more power or destruction wielded by criminals is a place to stand, and from that place, you can see the fork in the road. Which path ends up with abundance? Which path ends up with extinction or worse? |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 136 Simple examples of how productive power works are abundant to anyone caring to look, like looking at a farm on the side of the road while driving in a car on a highway, or looking down from an airplane, seeing a farm, a simple farm, where less power is made into more power. Modified: Simple examples of how productive power works are abundant to anyone caring to look. Like looking at a farm on the side of the road while driving in a car on a highway, or looking down from an airplane, seeing a farm, a simple farm, where less power is made into more power. |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 136 Who knows these things, these simple facts, and who does not know these simple facts? Look at the farmer and see if the farmer pays someone to help the farmer destroy crops. Who does such things, and does so willfully, with their power to do so? To end the day with less, on purpose, for fun and profit, to end the day with less than what exists at the start of the day, and for what? For who? Modified: Who knows these things, these simple facts, and who does not know these simple facts? Look at the farmer, and see if the farmer pays someone to help the farmer destroy crops. Who does such things, and does so willfully with their power to do so? To end the day with less, on purpose, for fun and profit, to end the day with less than what existed at the start of the day, and for what? For who? |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 137 I’ve done the measuring, and from that work I’ve invented Joe’s Law to be repeated in the next single sentence, and offered again, and offered competitively: Modified: I have done the measuring, and from that work I invented Joe’s Law to be repeated in the next single sentence, and offered again, and offered competitively: |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 138 Take as many earners as there are on the planet earth and allow them to find their own individual ways to accomplish the task of creating more power out of less power instead of paying people to destroy things and what do you think can happen, and why won’t you access simple math, if you have any doubts concerning the true measure of what really happens in Liberty? Modified: Take as many earners as there are on the planet earth, and allow them to find their own individual ways to accomplish the task of creating more power out of less power instead of paying people to destroy things. What do you think can happen, and why won’t you access simple math, if you have any doubts concerning the true measure of what really happens in Liberty? |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 138 Following this diatribe, this offering, this Giant Wall of Text just above this word right here, here, will be examples of my Liberty Day Challenge effort, and it is more information cut and pasted from the many sound bites currently traveling around the Earth; as competition overpowers monopoly in our time. I hope that this turns out to be powerful stuff. Modified: Following this diatribe, this offering, this Giant Wall of Text just above this word right here, here, will be examples of my Liberty Day Challenge effort. It is more information cut and pasted from the many sound bites currently traveling around the Earth…as competition overpowers monopoly in our time. I hope that this turns out to be powerful stuff. |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 138 The concept of The Liberty Day Challenge, as a sampling of what can be done, things that can be done by a certain date, was invented from this notion of deciding to make power abundant, instead of settling for never having enough power to do anything worth doing. The concept is such that enough people may yet realize, in time, which things can be done, on a short list, and those things can be done by a certain day. Modified: The concept of The Liberty Day Challenge as a sampling of what can be done, things that can be done by a certain date, was invented from this notion of deciding to make power abundant instead of settling for never having enough power to do anything worth doing. The concept is such that enough people may yet realize, in time, which things can be done on a short list, and those things can be done by a certain day. |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 141 The Convention who made it intended to destroy our free government by, or they neaver would have spent 4 Months in making such an inexpliset thing." Added sic for quoted misspellings: "The Convention who made it intended to destroy our free government by, or they neaver [sic] would have spent 4 Months in making such an inexpliset [sic] thing." |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,I changed the wording avert "but" What do you think? I see that the word but is either/or. It is either not-for-profit or it is for unlimited profit? Either/or? I think it is the point that is worth pointing out, so which is it? Is it not-for-profit in a strict sense that there is no transfer of power at all, ever, in any way, whereby the power is never allowed to flow inequitably in any way ever? I think in terms of scales. On one end of the scale is when, and where, everyone has their own personal Central Bank such as the actual proof offered by Josiah Warren in Equitable Commerce. On the other end of the scale is something like a Federal Reserve Fraud combined with an Internal Revenue Service Extortion Racket whereby everything that can be stolen from those who produce things worth stealing is stolen and the thieves use the loot to steal more. The sentence can certainly be improved to explain the fact that there is a scale and on one end of the scale is the concept of not-for-profit and on the other end of the scale is unlimited profit. I can try to make a competitive version. But according to statistical calculation, the Bank will always net a profit to cover costs up to the government limit - again we are in that sense not-for-profit, but not in the sense of unlimited profit. I see the following: But according to statistical calculation, the Bank will always net a profit to cover costs. That is a guarantee. Above and beyond the covering of costs there is a margin of profits that is likely, almost assured, so long as the Bank remains competitive and efficiently run. There is a point at which the franchise can reach a condition called usury, because of the government label, which works like a monopoly, so the idea is to cut off the profit margin at a reasonable limit. or But according to statistical calculation, the Bank will always net a profit to cover costs up to the government limit. We are in that sense not-for-profit, but (the franchise) is not allowed to consume all the competitors by an initial capacity to expend reserves such as the practice of dumping, which is exemplified by the High School Drug Dealer giving away the product, so as to then create a market, and corner that market, so as then to have no competition, and then jack up the price to that which the market will bear. That was the problem with the single Legal Money Supplier in the past. Now there are safeguards in place to alert the people as to the dangers of allowing the criminals to take over the power of government. |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 144 I am going to try to address this mess from three angles of view, so as to pincer the lies so often parroted Added colon: I am going to try to address this mess from three angles of view, so as to pincer the lies so often parroted: |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 144 3. The People, in a democratic, voluntary government are the ultimate sovereigns both factually in a physical form and legally in a psychological form, which means that no one in a democratic, voluntary, government has a right to give any other Sovereign any rights - or take them away. Modified: 3. The People in a democratic, voluntary government are the ultimate sovereigns. Both factually in a physical form and legally in a psychological form, which means that no one in a democratic, voluntary, government has a right to give any other Sovereign any rights - or take them away. |
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bear Guest
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7/26/13 Page 146 If you join all the other criminals, claiming as they do, that one person has the right to disarm, and render powerless, an innocent person. Modified: If you join all the other criminals claiming, as they do, that one person has the right to disarm, and render powerless, an innocent person. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I have your note for a competitive wording. I am going to call it a nite. But I want to make sure that you check the questions I had on page 27 and following. Once all of those are ironed out, I can do one of 2 things. I can send the book back to you, or read it thru again. Which would you prefer? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, "Joe, I have your note for a competitive wording. I am going to call it a nite. But I want to make sure that you check the questions I had on page 27 and following. Once all of those are ironed out, I can do one of 2 things. I can send the book back to you, or read it thru again. Which would you prefer?" I prefer that you are satisfied with having done a fine job, certainly above and beyond the call of duty from my viewpoint. If it sounds good to you I prefer that you sent it back to me and allow me the chance to go through it with at least an open channel to tax you further on possible questions I may find in the newest finished version. Back to page 27: 7/24/13 Page 118 Joe, let me know what you think about this. In context (abundant examples): Fill in the blank. Modified as follows: In context (abundant examples): That looks good to me. Someone may get a pen and fill in the blank. Joe, in addition to punctuation, I took a little extra artistic liberty in the last line by moving the word "now" to the end as " - right now." If you do not like it, just let me know. The Dragon is in darkness - not in the light - so laughter, fun, profits, and good things are happening - all around - even while the Dragon works in our sleep - for now - and even while our earnings flow to specific people who are torturing and mass murdering innocent victims - right now. That is very good in my view. I will be away from the computer a few days, my nephew has something planned. Thanks |
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bear Guest
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Joe, let me know when you will have time with the computer, and then I will send back. If I have down time in the next couple of days, I will read through quickly. I am sure there are still occasions where I missed things because sometimes when I go back and look at my editing I see something I missed and then I make an editing note on that same comment and add a new date and the new edit. Yesterday I noted that I left work load as 2 words when I worked as one. In my way of thinking, if words that are able are merged, it will be easier on the reader to get to the meaning of a long sentence faster. Also, I want to make sure you saw my note here: http://www.power-independence.com/forum/view_post.php?post_id=6483 It includes something that came to mind for you to think about as a possible addition to the book. |
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bear Guest
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7/27/13 Page 121 Removed the word Discussion after point counterpoint since this was a post and not a discussion. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I returned from my nephew's event and I can say that life is moving along with or without my input. I can say that my viewpoint is often changing with few things that are constant. I do appreciate much of your help in having competitive viewpoints available for comparison. We went to Lake Isabelle for white water rafting, camping, and impromptu cooperative association. I was the old guy among the next generation, and I had things thought I'd like to share. Leadership becomes counterfeit at times when the older examples are no longer able to adapt, so the actual concept of leadership is that power to adapt in whatever form the expression of leadership becomes. I don't get out much, where my part of life is part of a group, so the stark contrast of fitting into a group compared to my routine solitude inspired to thoughts on leadership. It might be important to say that my immediate family is as if we are one, over the time span of reproducing our two kids we have a way of interacting that is routine, so that is what I mean by my solitude: relative to a larger group of less familiar people. I was rambling there, so excuse the diversion from book work please. As to the introduction of a Joe's Slaw recipe idea I have a quick look at the page count marked on this forum. Quantity: 25 Trim size: 5 1/2 X 8 1/2 Page count:174 Text: Prints black on 50# white paperstock Cover: 4-color process on 12pt. C1S with gloss UV Binding: Perfect I am all for adding new things, even starting a new book. A problem I have is in actually doing the work. Here is where the solution to doing the actual work was solved with our idea to move toward a book by merely assembling discussions. The work was already done. My thinking is to not add anything more until we both agree with the book being finished and I am almost ready to send the book to the printer. So if there is now a need for more pages to get to the number 174, then that recipe could fill that in. I had this other idea too, concerning the sales of printed copies. The idea was to have a page in the back somewhere as the sale of the book copy is recorded, and this idea is to test how commerce works. If I place a recording page of book sales on the back, with a name of the person selling, fill in the blank, a name of the person buying, and the sale price, and the sale date blank areas to fill in, then I was thinking I could sell each book for 100.00. It might be a hard sell. If the next person could sell the book for 90.00, then that person ends up with a 10.00 book. On and on. The idea may not gain currency. Yesterday I noted that I left work load as 2 words when I worked as one. In my way of thinking, if words that are able are merged, it will be easier on the reader to get to the meaning of a long sentence faster. The idea may be in your blood, since that is how German Language works, from what I have been told. I like the idea. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Groups...social events...ugh. That is just the way I am. I manage, but I prefer solitude as well. I have thru my life tried to stretch in those area and change who I am, but in these years after having cancer and kids I have decided not to push myself to be what everyone else is, but just to be me, who I am. Still, I look at people having fun together and wonder why it doesn't work for me and still have that longing, but it is all ok now. I think I am an introvert even though I put on a good face. I live in an extrovert's world. I kinda think that the extrovert's world is what exist because as an introvert, I'd prefer a cave to a world. I think that is why I like my time with the Amish. Nothing is ever said that makes me feel on edge. When one is a pastor's wife, there is almost always something said. I don't think on purpose for the most part, but there is always a problem to fix or something put on my plate that really, I don't have control over. So, I have rambled. I remember rafting trips. But they were more like tire inner-tube floats down the Guadalupe River and rapids were far and few in between. Jon is sick now. Scott finally got well on Thurs and Jon began a fever on Saturday so I am being nurse again this week. Jeff has been in China for a week with some travel to Texas on both ends. He will be home this morning. I had hoped to go back thru the book, but the sick kids decided we should watch cupcake wars and since we don't have pay TV the reruns on my notebook became the center of attention. So, I am returning the book this morning. I remembered this time to update the table of contents. I didn't take a good look at the Index page, but other than that I have gone thru paragraph by paragraph as you have seen the modifications I have made on your forum. The only thing that I think I have left undone is at the top of page 133. The words are highlighted in yellow and still have to do with "not for unlimited profit." You had given me some suggested words, but I am going to leave it up to you as to which words to put in because my thick head is not wrapping around the concept so well. Not the concept of the bank. I think I understand that well enough, but the concept of the words associated and explaining the bank. (And I would also like to say, I don't personally care for the government cap on profit. I would prefer a free market where the government keeps its fat nose out of things (I realize I am speaking of the government as a thing doing action, I am using the single word government to cover whatever list of people exists at whatever time who would manage such things.) I think when government begins to set caps, they then need a band of enforcers to ensure the caps are met which then spirals out of control as criminals are instinctively drawn to that system and would begin to corrupt it. I think as Steven Pearl Andrews spoke that all things should be individual and as simple as possible, I think that was the jist of his words in Science of Society (if I even remember the correct name of his publication, but it is the one where he speaks of groups breaking down smaller and smaller and smaller and used Martin Luther as an example). But, I am getting off into a discussion that I wasn't trying to start. I am just saying that I want you to insert whatever words you want on page 133. I think everything else is done. However, I did not go back thru to check on combining words into single words and Jeff will be home today and I want to concentrate on on home things for awhile, so I am sending you the book. If you want, I can still read the book and send you words that I think need to be joined if I come across any. But as for now....Joe Quotes is in your court! I remember you mentioning the $100 book sale with each person then reducing the price by $10. I never answered because I think it is hard to pry $100 out of anyone and so is $90 and so is $80 and so is $70 etc, and putting the camel on the back of the buyer to resell the book to recoup their money at a charge of $10 for reading the book and reselling it. I am not a sales person and I don't like to ask anyone to do anything for me so I wouldn't do it that way. I am the type of person that would buy $10 books for $100 at $10 a piece and then give the books away...because that is easier on my psychi ( don't know how to spell that word right now). I will send an email now with the book attacked. Just let me know if you still want me to read and send you changes to make as described above and also let me know that you know you need to look at page 133. It is nice to get out into nature even if it includes a group I still want to move on some acreage so that I can be in nature without the group I want the boys to run and explore without a meth house on the corner...even though it has now been abandoned and all the furniture is strewn around the front yard...it will be easy enough for the boys to find a meth house on their own, which I hope never happens to them....as if it happens to someone...it is more like someone makes it happen to themselves when choices are made. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Thanks for the hard work. I stopped reading at this point: (And I would also like to say, I don't personally care for the government cap on profit. I would prefer a free market where the government keeps its fat nose out of things (I realize I am speaking of the government as a thing doing action, I am using the single word government to cover whatever list of people exists at whatever time who would manage such things.) The actual force forcing a cap on the rate of profits is competition, which is the actual force in Free Markets, if we can share the same meanings of words, which is probably not the case. If you still think of government in terms of a group of people who act exactly like criminals, then I too have a problem with any crimes done by those criminals. If, on the other hand, there is a governing principle called competition, then the consumers will choose better instead of worse (more accurate, and more powerful money) and that includes lower cost (which is the true meaning of profit - from the smelly end of the profit stick), so I don't know if I can explain that better with the opportunity now before me in that part of the book. That was, in fact, the idea behind the Play Acting offer of having a Free Market Government Contract Employee Selling Product 1 and Product 2 loans to a hypothetical consumer: to ask and answer these types of questions. You decided not to play along in the Play Acting offered to you, which is fine, some ideas just don't gain currency. The Product 1 and Product 2 idea has to do with a return to a Democratic Federated Republic by some means made available, offers, offers made from some people to some other people, to take it, or leave it, with no other force forcing the offer than those forces that work in Free Markets, whereby there is a demand (an obvious demand here is defensive government, or "legal," money), as people demand defense (legal) and people demand a way to pay for it (money), and so which is the Legal Money now? Can the Legal Money be improved upon? A. No B. Yes How, if yes? Run a competition to see which Legal Money is the Free Market winner in competition with all the other Free Market offers? If that sounds like positive directions, then how can that ball start rolling down that hill? Product 1 and Product 2. If it does not gain currency, does that mean that the victims love being victims, and the victims always demand the highest quality criminals at the lowest cost to the victims? 1. Yes 2. No 3. Who cares If the answer is no, the victims are only made into victims by way of lies that the victims end up believing, then what would the victims demand if they were not victims to the One Legal Money Fraud and Extortion Racket currently having cornered the Market, and effectively driving out any competition anywhere in the Free Market of Defensive Government and the Money required to pay for it? Product 1 and Product 2 intends to get the ball built, and start it rolling down the hill, and as soon as a higher quality and lower cost option is produced, on the market, and available to anyone, then that proves the legitimacy of Free Markets. When anyone claims that Product 1 and Product 2 means, as if I mean it to mean, another example of Legal Crime, then I've failed to communicate, and I've failed to sell the offer to that person. That person, in the Play Acting Scenario, says no thanks, and walks off. That person still uses Legal Fraud and Extortion Money? Is that not a choice for Un-Free Markets in fact? I think when government begins to set caps, they then need a band of enforcers to ensure the caps are met which then spirals out of control as criminals are instinctively drawn to that system and would begin to corrupt it. I think as Steven Pearl Andrews spoke that all things should be individual and as simple as possible, I think that was the jist of his words in Science of Society (if I even remember the correct name of his publication, but it is the one where he speaks of groups breaking down smaller and smaller and smaller and used Martin Luther as an example). Again the word government is used. Which one? The one working now (criminal) or one such as the one that worked as a Free Market Government in between 1776 and 1788? If both are confused as if there is only one then who benefits from that confusion since there are 2 not 1 and one is Free Markets defended, while the other is Crime that is enforced by destroying all competition? As far as as simple as possible is concerned, again, the voluntary association works to keep things only as complicated as any defender (juror) can understand if the idea is to use government to defend so called property rights. Whose concern is it if 100 people write up a very complicated contract that governs their association so long as their association isn't another version of organized crime? If those 100 people over-complicate their voluntary agreement, who does it benefit? Why would they willfully make it too complicated for their own purposes? If they are willfully making it too complicated for the targeted victims, and it becomes too complicated for themselves, then how can there be any authority, anywhere, in any case of disagreement? The fear you have here, it seems to me, is a fear of criminals who take over the concept of government and that is clearly another case of crime made legal or Legal Crime. Why confuse Legal Crime with any alternative methods of defending against any crime? But, I am getting off into a discussion that I wasn't trying to start. I am just saying that I want you to insert whatever words you want on page 133. I think everything else is done. However, I did not go back thru to check on combining words into single words and Jeff will be home today and I want to concentrate on on home things for awhile, so I am sending you the book. I don't mean to suggest that you have to continue any discussion at all. I hope that all is well in your life, and I trust that you can find a way to make life better if a way exists. If you want, I can still read the book and send you words that I think need to be joined if I come across any. But as for now....Joe Quotes is in your court! I will work at getting this in print at this point. I may get 100 copies made, and fall back into the concept of having a prototype working as one. If there are demands for improvements, then that process can work that way. I really think that you have gone above and beyond any call of duty produced by me, in any way, so thanks again. This has been a valuable experience to me so far, and who knows what may happen with an actual book on an actual market. Just let me know if you still want me to read and send you changes to make as described above and also let me know that you know you need to look at page 133. OK thanks again. |
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bear Guest
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Joe,You decided not to play along in the Play Acting offered to you, which is fine, some ideas just don't gain currency. It is not that I decided not to or that I did not want to, but that I didn't know how to play. I needed instructions - some guidance. I know that may be unimaginable to you since you have family that is artistic. I suppose that if I had just been bear and asked questions, then we could have changed my name to Jean. Or I could have pretended that I was bear while answering to Jean. I have been listening to G. Edward Griffin again. In the 60's he spoke of the conspiracy of history. He sure was polished. Wonder where he came from? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pz4PXuykXdE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-Tk4zraz-Q Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASbmBsE7mU0 and Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVQQCbL6Xy0 Those were old videos. It makes me wonder where government is today and why. I also read this at the JBS site: http://www.jbs.org/terrorism/u-s-funded-anti-morsi-activists-terrorist-advocacy-with-foreign-aid One recipient of U.S. “democracy” aid, former Egyptian police Colonel and Supreme Court Justice Omar Afifi Soliman, posted the following advice to opponents of Morsi on this Facebook page, according to Mekay's report published on Al Jazeera-English: "Make a road bump with a broken palm tree to stop the buses going into Cairo, and drench the road around it with gas and diesel. When the bus slows down for the bump, set it all ablaze so it will burn down with all the passengers inside.… God bless," Soliman's Facebook post last month read. In late May he instructed, "Behead those who control power, water and gas utilities." All posts on Soliman's Facebook page from the past year have been removed since publication of Mekay's report. Mekay noted in his investigative exposé that Soliman has been on the federal payroll since 2009, and continues to receive taxpayer funding: I think the reason the US funded Mao was because Someone in the US government sent a communist to be with Chiang Kai-shek...of course I cannot remember the details, but maybe, just maybe the reason Wall street funded Hitler and the Bolsheviks was because Communist People had already infiltrated the US government. Maybe we cannot call the government our government because it is a communist government which is a collectivist government. He said that Communists use the word Socialist. I am back at square one. Why do we even need banks at all? Why don't individuals just borrow money from individuals? I don't mean to suggest that you have to continue any discussion at all. I hope that all is well in your life, and I trust that you can find a way to make life better if a way exists. I didn't mean to suggest I don't want to discuss. I was just trying to say I was trying to give you the book and not divert your time into dialoging. Your last reply is full of a bunch of questions that would be interesting to answer, but I am too busy talking instead of listening. I also think discussing the Griffin videos would be interesting but it would take many hours for you to listen to all the links I gave you. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I wanted to blast through the book and send it to the printer, but your heavy lifting (work) inspires a competitive offering of similar work (not an easy path), and here is the first example: Page vii: I remember that moment and thinking: That picture of those two men seems odd. Does it make sense to change the thoughts from regular text to italics or some other "thinking" symbolization? As to the use of the term "communist" and "collectivist" and "socialist" to help the criminals hide that they are criminals is a battle that we keep repeating, so I can give up and I can merely ask you which label, today, do you want to help cover up the crimes done by the criminals? |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, When I did editing at this end, I frequently referred to information at this site http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/566/01/ : These are the guidelines I used for italics from that site: Italics Underlining and Italics are often used interchangeably. Before word-processing programs were widely available, writers would underline certain words to indicate to publishers to italicize whatever was underlined. Although the general trend has been moving toward italicizing instead of underlining, you should remain consistent with your choice throughout your paper. To be safe, you could check with your teacher to find out which he/she prefers. Italicize the titles of magazines, books, newspapers, academic journals, films, television shows, long poems, plays of three or more acts, operas, musical albums, works of art, websites, and individual trains, planes, or ships. Time Romeo and Juliet by William Shakespeare The Metamorphosis of Narcissus by Salvador Dali Amazon.com Titanic Italicize foreign words. Semper fi, the motto of the U.S. Marine Corps, means "always faithful." Italicize a word or phrase to add emphasis. The truth is of utmost concern! Italicize a word when referring to that word. The word justice is often misunderstood and therefore misused. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Having said that, I think you should take artistic liberty, and if it looks good to you, then do it, as long as it is adjusted only to the point of creativity and not beyond that point where creativity begins to destroy the end product by overworking it. I don't think those are the exact words you used to explain that to me, your explanation was better, but hopefully you will know I am talking about what you told me. Most of all, have fun with it! As to the use of the term "communist" and "collectivist" and "socialist" to help the criminals hide that they are criminals is a battle that we keep repeating, so I can give up and I can merely ask you which label, today, do you want to help cover up the crimes done by the criminals? The criminals call themselves those terms. Some communists hide that they are communists until it become fashionable to be communist. If they call themselves those terms is it not wise to know what those terms entail so one can fight that type of criminal? Murderers, rapists, robbers (with or without badge) do certain deeds. I suppose I would rather run into a robber than a rapist, and a rapist rather than a murderer. If faced with the 3 at once, I'd take care of the murderer first, then the rapist, then the robber, even though they all wear the label criminal. We frequently speak of extortion and robbery done by those with a badge and done to us. In a communist country where everything is supposedly owned by everyone, if you get out of line, they simply reassign your benefits to someone more worthy and demote you. Perhaps a teacher uses a Bible to teach literature. Perhaps the students complain. Perhaps the teacher is no longer murdered but is made to suffer economically. And because the "people" own all things commonly, then that teacher cannot in their own initiative jump-start their livelihood because the market is not free. You and I could loose everything for the things we have written in your book if we were in a communist country. So far in this terrible land of America, we can write whatever we want, but we are probably being put on some type of list. When the communists in our country have enough power, we may be expropriated. Because I happen to think that the government people that we speak against are those communist individuals who have taken control. And I am not saying that those people originated in the USSR, either. That group of communists, as well as the Chinese group of communists may have been home grown on US soil. Who knows. Or maybe some other country. Who knows. But those criminals use utopian thinking people to gain power, like the Fabian Socialists who joined the Bolsheviks but become disillusioned and parted ways. I think it is a good idea to know what kind of criminals lurk behind those cloaks and know what kind of dagger they hold. And I don't know why you never want to call out the communists for what kind of criminals they are. Why do terms always have to be generalized? The communist hippies in the 60's were grown by communists with a plan, and that plan was to incorporate economic criminal socialism which is extortion until we the people became so week and we the people in government became so unproductive and counterproductive that we the people will raise the communist banner ourselves. So when we the people own everything, no one but the party elite will control the assets and we will not dare step out of line. Right now we pay is taxes, then we will pay with the ability to receive income. So we need to end the fed, the irs and bring our troops home, and be sure that we are on the right side of the fight to do so. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,The criminals call themselves those terms. Some communists hide that they are communists until it become fashionable to be communist. If they call themselves those terms is it not wise to know what those terms entail so one can fight that type of criminal? The criminals also call themselves capitalists, conservatives, Christians, and any term that appeals to the targeted victims so as to cover up the fact that crime is never appealing to the targeted victims. So...again...we go over this battle each time, and if my question remains my question then the answer appears to be that you will use whichever word the criminals use to cover up their crimes, and if that word is communist, then you will use that word, and if that word is capitalist, here is my question again, will you use that word too? Why pick only some words as the words you will use as the word you use to help hide the criminals? The battle between you and I on this subject returns to my focus each time you use both communist and socialist as your choice of words you choose when you help the criminals hide their crimes, because, as you say now, they, the criminals, use those words. The reason I have this battle return to my focus is the fact that the communists of the most common, collective, authority (false) wrote, in their Communist Manifesto, that they, the self proclaimed authorities on Communism, repudiated socialism. We go over this each time, and that is OK by me, I will offer my viewpoint on labeling the criminals each time. You use their false words. I question the use of their false words; each time I have my power to question false words working for me. Murderers, rapists, robbers (with or without badge) do certain deeds. I suppose I would rather run into a robber than a rapist, and a rapist rather than a murderer. If faced with the 3 at once, I'd take care of the murderer first, then the rapist, then the robber, even though they all wear the label criminal. I think it is important to be reasonable as your words above report, and report accurately in my view. How does that reason in your words above reason our our current battle over labels used to label criminals? The robbers, rapists, and murderers who rob, rape, and murder the most in this country call themselves Capitalists, Conservatives, Christians, or Communists, Socialists, Republicans, Democrats, Central Bankers, Authorities, Federal Employees, or whichever label works best on the targeted victims, so, your words are speaking about criminals with criminal labels that are labels that are accurate labels whereby the accurate label describes what the criminal actually does to the victim. That is a good point to point out, and that is the point I am trying to point out in my battle with you on this subject of false or accurate labels. "Murderers, rapists, robbers (with or without badge) do certain deeds. I suppose I would rather run into a robber than a rapist, and a rapist rather than a murderer. If faced with the 3 at once, I'd take care of the murderer first, then the rapist, then the robber, even though they all wear the label criminal. " If the murderer called him, or her, self a Conservative Capitalist Christian and the robber called him, or her, self a Communist Collectivist Atheist, how then do you handle the triage? I cringe when I hear an otherwise valuable reporter such as Edward G Griffin use the word collectivist. The concept of defense against very well organized groups of large armies of criminals was explained in a simple document called The Declaration of Independence. The document didn't say that we are all alone, we are all on our own, and it is every man, or woman, for him, or her, self. What happens when one person adds their power to another person so as to then have a collective sum total of power. Edward G Griffin contradicts himself because he uses the labels picked out by the criminals. That is why the criminals pick out the word Christian. Why do people use the word Anarchy? I cringe at the use of these words that become powerful misdirections like signs on the road that tell the reader to speed up and go faster to heaven as the hill then drops off to a cliff and a horrible, torturous, long suffering death. Misuse the word Christian, Collectivist, Capitalist, Socialist, Government, and what is likely to happen when the victims finally realize their fate and the victims then, finally, begin to mount an effective defense? They won't look for the words of Jesus Christ for help, because of the misuse of the label? They won't look for cooperative, organized, combining, or collectivizing of their individual powers of defense because of the misuse of the label? Which labels are never misused? What is Liberty? What is a Liberal? In a communist country where everything is supposedly owned by everyone, if you get out of line, they simply reassign your benefits to someone more worthy and demote you. The lie is the same lie. In this country we are supposed to own our own property. Who says so? If I own my own property then the term, in English, is allodial. It is beneficial to know how the lie works upon the victims in another country, such as I had a friend in Brazil who began to question my thinking on how political economy works, so I am in a position to explain to him how his system works as crime made legal. He is in the upper class in Brazil, so he is "capitalist" so called. I can explain how that works, but will he listen to me? The answer is no. Those who have an interest in the system working the way the system works will not want to know that their version of the system is merely the same system with different labels. The owners of everything are the most powerful group of criminals and they claim ownership of everything including people. If you want to win in their game then you have to play by their rules, and if you play well, you go up the ladder, and if you do not play well, then you go down the ladder, and the ladder is a series of steps that are graduated in the one Legal Money System of measuring the ladder. There is an education, very costly, for the upper class, and an even higher cost education for the class above that one. I think that was well reported by John Taylor Gatto in the link you found, and the link you so generously offered to me. There is a money system for the upper class, and it is expensive as well, what do you need to do to get the power to write checks for as much money as everyone else combined? Why do I fall into the same trap? I should say, to be accurate, that there is a very expensive education system, and a very expensive money system used for the lower class that are the legal criminals. The almost costly education system and the almost costly money system is for people in liberty where we exist, as best we can, in the upper class, the elite of human beings. In a communist country where everything is supposedly owned by everyone, if you get out of line, they simply reassign your benefits to someone more worthy and demote you. Perhaps a teacher uses a Bible to teach literature. Perhaps the students complain. Perhaps the teacher is no longer murdered but is made to suffer economically. As soon as I read that I think about the Churchgoers in Waco, and I remember a published copy of a legal document that ordered all Mormons to be killed. I think it was a Utah State Dictate. Again, if the system is in your home, then it is not as easy to see how it may be a criminal system, so you have an advantage when looking at the same system working in another country. They use different labels. It is the same system. The differences include the fact that this country was a refugee camp for runaway slaves from all those older organized crime areas, so the number of Liberty minded people per capita here may have been higher from 1700 on up to 1900 and then the abuse of Television managed to bring everyone World Wide on the same page, more or less, all as blindly obedient as the next target. And because the "people" own all things commonly, I cut that off. Why does that type of wording, that type of thinking ever become your words, and your thoughts, since it is patently absurd to give any credit to such thinking. The reading I've done of Russian thinking is such that no one actually believed the lies told by the organized crime bosses that ran things in Russia. Everyone knew that the place was run by the worst criminals Russia could produce. So who "believes" the "official" lies of everyone owning everything equally like oxygen for example? Sure, at first glance, you can see problems in other places, whereby the people in those other places are doing bad things, but when do you start believing any of the lies used by the criminals upon the victims? And because the "people" own all things commonly, then that teacher cannot in their own initiative jump-start their livelihood because the market is not free. Many Russians and Chinese, at this point, may be well ahead of you and I in understanding how best to teach our children as to what is very wrong with the false authorities in our countries. We have yet to go through the worst of it, if We The People don't collect up our individual defensive power into a collective effort to defend against where this absolute despotism, this Legal Crime, is rapidly accelerating in the former Voluntary Union of States. This is part of my theory concerning why the most powerful evil human beings on this planet are having such a hard time getting World War III off on schedule. Perhaps the POWER to force all those Chinese people and all those Russian people into armed conflict is no longer as POWERFUL as it was when World War II went off on schedule. Maybe the average Chinese and Russian father and mother is figuring out ways to teach their children better instead of worse. I make sure that I tell my daughter that her Public School book on Political Economy is all lies, but she is very independent minded, so who knows? You and I could loose everything for the things we have written in your book if we were in a communist country. You may find an improved viewpoint as you look deeper into what goes on in other countries compared to what goes on in this country. The idea that America is free compared to other countries is based upon specific things that have happened in the past and now things are going the other way rapidly. You use the word communist as if there was some accuracy to the meaning of the term. People are now fleeing this country to find sanctuary in other countries because there is threat of torture and murder for those who disclose inculpatory information that challenges the power of those who are in power. Those who are in power are in power World Wide. Communism means anything under the sun, and so does capitalism. When the meaning is forced upon one person by another person then the meaning is the same meaning as crime. When the meaning is strictly voluntary among everyone, and no one forces the meaning on anyone, then the meaning, by that strict boundary, is not criminal. Capitalism means anything under the sun, with the same obvious qualifications of how the meaning transfers from one person to another person. If the meaning is strictly voluntary, without fraud, without threat of torture and murder, and without torture and murder being used to transfer the meaning, then the meaning is an offer in a free market of ideas. So far in this terrible land of America, we can write whatever we want, but we are probably being put on some type of list. That is not true in many ways. The freedom to speak is limited by many things by many people in many places, and the true authority as to what is morally right or morally wrong to say, shout, print, report, or document is subject to human judgement in all cases whereby humans are judging. Shouting fire in a crowded theater where there is no fire is often judged to be morally wrong as many people may be injured by that "freedom of speech". Who says this is a terrible land? I just went to Lake Isabelle. The land does not look terrible. The criminals running the money monopoly, World Wide, run the criminals running the false Federal government, and now those criminals are torturing and murdering people who threaten their power. Two examples: Bradly Manning Adam Kokesh There are many more examples. Why are some of the disobedient slaves tortured and murdered faster compared to other disobedient slaves in this country where there is so much power to produce paradise on earth? I think you explained how that works in your own words: Murderers, rapists, robbers (with or without badge) do certain deeds. I suppose I would rather run into a robber than a rapist, and a rapist rather than a murderer. If faced with the 3 at once, I'd take care of the murderer first, then the rapist, then the robber, even though they all wear the label criminal. The legal criminals can buy anything that can be purchased with fraudulent money, so they can buy almost anything. Sometimes they can't buy silence if an individual refuses to be silent. So which information is more powerful? If you have a method of economy in defense against harm, so does everyone else, everyone with a working human brain, and so your value judgements work for you the way that your value judgments work. You defend against the murderer first. The Legal Criminals defend against which threat to their power first? To me the obvious is made obvious in time as the Legal Criminals act. The Legal Criminals, for example, went to Waco to defend their turf. What was so threatening about a bunch of people in a church? Why torture and murder all those people in that church? Why not offer them huge sums of money to get back in line? Why is Bradly Manning tortured severely and Adam Kokesh is by comparison merely suffering inconvenience? I think you may want to rethink the whole book idea if you are operating under a delusion concerning what the Legal Criminals will do when someone threatens them. If I send this book out, and it is on the market, then there is a possibility, however remote, that the book will gain currency. What do you think happens when information threatens the power of those in power? When the communists in our country have enough power, we may be expropriated. Yes, I don't know what you have been drinking, or smoking, but your words suggest to me that you are not seeing clearly. The so called "communists" already have the power to write themselves checks for as much money as everyone else combined and they are currently buying World War III. What do you mean when you use the word "expropriated"? Those so called "communists" already "expropriated" all those people in that church in Waco. Because I happen to think that the government people that we speak against are those communist individuals who have taken control. You are safer, I suppose, in your delusion, as to what they are, and who they are, in fact, without the false labels. I may not be as safe and secure since my viewpoint may be more accurate. Does that make any sense to you? If I am not misdirected by the kangaroo labels then any effort on my part in defense is added to a more effective defense against the actual criminals; so the actual criminals are then able to view me as a higher threat, while you are still busy chasing your own tail? That works fine for me. But those criminals use utopian thinking people to gain power, like the Fabian Socialists who joined the Bolsheviks but become disillusioned and parted ways. I think it is a good idea to know what kind of criminals lurk behind those cloaks and know what kind of dagger they hold. Works fine for me. Whatever you can do to make sense of things, to be powerful internally, in defense, makes sense to me. If you now equate the worst human beings ever to be merely better at handling the same dagger as the so called Fabian Socialists then that is your way of judgement. I don't know what you think is, or is not, a Fabian Socialist. I don't know what you think is, or is not, Utopian thinking. Example: Private ownership versus utopian collective ownership. Who owns air? So, by my imagination, I can take your words as an attack upon me, as I am quite possibly a utopian thinker, a person who thinks that air is collectively owned by everyone, and therefore I am a socialist, I have that dagger in my hand, and I may be misled by other utopian, collectivist, communist, socialist, thinkers who are better able to stab people with that dagger behind that cloak? While all that is going on I am realizing that the air is what it is, and it does what it does, even if I don't understand how it works among the human beings here in earth. I think accurately as to how air is owned collectively, as far as I know at this point in time. The next step, to me, is to apply that understanding of how air is owned collectively to the concept of owning land. Private ownership is such that a portion of air is consumed by a single human being and that is measurable in fact. What happens if a criminal claims ownership of all the air? Why call the criminal a socialist? Why claim that the criminal is a utopian thinker? If the criminal claims ownership of all the air while the criminal claims that everyone owns the air equally, then the criminal confesses a lie with those contradictory claims, so why call the criminal, who openly defines the meaning of crime anything other than a criminal? Does the human being willfully create the falsehood of claiming private, exclusive, ownership of all the air at the same time that the same human being claims the opposite claim that everyone equally owns the air? Is that a willful lie or does that person merely read from the script handed to that person? And I don't know why you never want to call out the communists for what kind of criminals they are. And I don't know why that my wanting to call the criminals out for the crimes they perpetrate is somehow dependent upon attaching the false label used by the criminal to the criminal. Marx and Engles can, or cannot, exemplify what is accurately knowable as The Communists? What crimes did they perpetrate? I want to call out those communists for what kind of criminals they are if at all possible. Now your words are rendered no longer true. And I don't know why you never want to call out the communists for what kind of criminals they are. To me those words were false when I read them. Now to be very clear, those words are false from this moment on. Someone who claims that something is owned by them, privately, exclusively, and at the same time that same someone claims that the same thing owned by them, privately, exclusively, is owned by everyone, equally, confesses a falsehood, in their own words. Just making a claim, such as that private/public claim, which is false on its face, is just a claim, and not necessarily a crime. Why do terms always have to be generalized? If I am guilty of some error, then having the specific error shown, in no uncertain terms, would be nice, as it would help me in my want of not repeating such errors. The specific lie that appears to work for all the Legal Criminals is not a generalization, it is a claim of exclusive ownership they claim, and they enforce, while they also claim that everything is owned by everyone equally. They know it is a lie, as the concept of exclusive ownership is possibly an effective distortion of reality, as far as I know, there is only use, or present use, or control, or power to use, power to control, power to have in hand, power to be in a place, at a time, whereby someone else is not powerful enough to replace you in that place at that time. They, the Legal Criminals, know that their whole Private/Public charade is a well maintained fraud whereby they stay in power over their targets and the lie works well at dividing the targets apart and fighting each other over this nebulous fiction of Private or Public OWNERSHIP. If the targets are allowed to agree upon who uses this, or that, without resorting to deception, threats, and violence as a means of gaining power over each other, then the targets may grow very powerfully defensive against any criminal anywhere. When no one wants more lies, who will be able to make a living offering better lies? How much more specific can I get when offering what I consider to be a reasonable answer to the crime problem? The communist hippies in the 60's were grown by communists with a plan, and that plan was to incorporate economic criminal socialism which is extortion until we the people became so week and we the people in government became so unproductive and counterproductive that we the people will raise the communist banner ourselves. If I go in prophecy mode, which I don't like to do, since I am not good at it, my vision of the future does not include me, or anyone I know, raising a specific banner. Right now the banner, so called, is called The American Flag, waved currently by those who rally around what I call Legal Crime. Your words appear to suggest that a new flag will be waved by some people here in America. I don't see it. I am often wrong. If the world does not shift on it's axis and everyone is beset with a whole new arrangement of new problems requiring new solutions, or if there is no meteor hitting the earth, having similar consequences, or if there is no major escalation of War consuming many more lives and much more productive power, then I can see a time when China gains control of the Legal Money Hegemony and I can see many people working to get on the good side of the new Money Changers, paying off the National Debt, paying payments to China, and at that point there may be more people waving Chinese flags. So, in that way, I can see where your words may agree with my own sense of prophecy. I would not call that communism since I know that it is merely Legal Crime whereby the most powerful human beings take over control of the one Legal Money. If the flag waved by the flag wavers is red, white, and blue, or just red, or just blue, or red today, and blue tomorrow, then that is the flag waved by the flag wavers. If I give up, then I can wave the white flag, and then my masters can order me to wave whatever flag they want me to wave, and I can do so without question, since I gave up. So when we the people own everything, no one but the party elite will control the assets and we will not dare step out of line. Right now we pay is taxes, then we will pay with the ability to receive income. Joining the party elite is an option not offered by you in that offering of words. I just sent a check to the IRS, doing so at the direction of my wife, who is earning an income, and so I help her by doing what she thinks will keep us alive, happy, and productive. I know that the payment is an extortion fee. All those words of discredit you use against nebulous communists are words that account for ourselves, you and I, and those who exploit our lack of power, the same discredit is accountable to us, right now. We are in a boat, to use a fabrication of fiction as an illustration, and the label you attach to the boat can be anything you want, so long as I know what actually constitutes this boat. This boat is a planet. There is enough power on this planet for everyone currently alive on this planet to live well. I am, in that last sentence, guilty of utopian thoughts. I could be sentenced to a tenner in the gulag for such a crime, and it won't make any difference to me if the criminals pointing the finger at me wave a red or blue flag. So we need to end the fed, the irs and bring our troops home, and be sure that we are on the right side of the fight to do so. Yes, the criminals who can be called communists created the FED and the IRS, and they own the troops privately, exclusively, to the extent that those troops are ordered to enforce that Legal Monopoly Money Power of fraud and extortion made legal, and the Troops obey, well enough, to effect that enforcement currently. By tomorrow morning the revolution could be over, and a new day dawns without the shadow of "communism" (or whatever name you want to use) in force. To me there can be hope, real hope, not self delusion. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Yes, the criminals who can be called communists created the FED and the IRS, and they own the troops privately, exclusively, to the extent that those troops are ordered to enforce that Legal Monopoly Money Power of fraud and extortion made legal, and the Troops obey, well enough, to effect that enforcement currently. Are you saying that the communist criminals did all those things? Or are you saying that to make fun of me as in: "who can be called"? There is enough power on this planet for everyone currently alive on this planet to live well. I am, in that last sentence, guilty of utopian thoughts. I agree with that as well. Not that you are guilty of utopian thoughts, but that there is enough power on the planet for everyone chow currently lives on this planet, as well as all those to be born on this planet," to live well. I think the planet was created that why. However, I do not think it is possible as long as all people everywhere refuse to live righteously. In my view living righteously means to love God and to love one another and in doing so God and others are put ahead of ourselves and then there would be no crime because as soon as I put you ahead of me, you put me ahead of you without dagger in hand. Joe, so what I think I have heard in your reply is that Communism, Socialism and Collectivism are not dirty words any more than Christian is a dirty word. And then I reply, those using Christian to hide themselves as criminals are not Christians (followers of The Lord Jesus Christ). So are you saying to me that those who use the word Communist for themselves, are criminals are not communists? Can one follow the writings of Max and Engels without perpetrating crime? And I want to know, why does air even have to be owned? Joe, thank you for answering me. You words helped me. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,to make fun of me There is no fun in this to me. The time period, as far as I know, for the creation of The FED and the IRS (1913) is well after the invention of the word "communist" as a cover for criminals, so it is as good a word as "capitalist" to be worn by any of those criminals at that time. I have a copy of the book by The Creature from Jekyll Island and I can look in that book to see if any of those criminals claimed to be "communist" or "capitalist" or "socialist" or whatever, so as to be more accurate and less capable of sounding as if I am making fun of you. Joe, so what I think I have heard in your reply is that Communism, Socialism and Collectivism are not dirty words any more than Christian is a dirty word. At least you ask for clarification which is more than most people do when assumptions are made as to what my word choices intend to convey. If entomology is useful then the origins of words can mean something to whoever uses entomology. You use the term "dirty word" and I am reminded again of the sign analogy. There is a sign on a road before a blind hill and the sign can be very accurate as the sign says something like "Caution Danger Ahead" or the sign can be a "dirty word" in stark contrast to the accurate sign as the "dirty word" might be a sign that reads "Free Money Ahead, hurry it won't last." In the illustration the idea is to point out how there is a possible motive associated with the construction of the sign, and in this case there is a bridge that is no longer spanning a sudden change of elevation which will be certain death for anyone in a hurry to get the free money. So the motive for selecting the words "Caution Danger Ahead" is a motive that is not "dirty," and the motive of selecting the words "Free Money Ahead, hurry it won't last," is by that comparison more along the lines of "dirty," but only in the eyes of someone who cherishes life as being something of value. Someone who cherishes the witnessing of people plummeting to a horrible and torturous and painful death at their hands, and as a result of something they willfully do, so as to cause that death, having much fun in the fruits of their labor, reaching for that goal, may not see the "dirt" as "dirt". And then I reply, those using Christian to hide themselves as criminals are not Christians (followers of The Lord Jesus Christ). So that works for you that way. When I say criminals abusing words that are chosen to hide their actual crimes are apt to use any word, not just Christian, suddenly your own judgement used well enough for the word Christian is no longer applicable to the alternate word? They are not Christians. OK, I agree, they are criminals. Then you say they are communists, because they say they are communists. Well, bear, they said they were Christians, so what happened to your reasoning when the word changed from one you like to one you don't like? What is it, contained in the word, that you don't like? Back to the illustration offered to you, more than once, going back to a traveler on the road, and the sign before the hill, where the hill hides a certain death down a hole to living hell, there is no meaning in the word Christian to anyone not familiar with any words ever spoken by a person (or God) named Jesus Christ, so the sign has to fit the intended readers of the sign. If the sign says "Caution Danger Ahead," but the sign is not written in English, instead the sign is written in Chinese, then as far as the reader who can't read Chinese is concerned, the sign can't accomplish the intended goal, can it? The sign that says "capitalist" in China is the same meaning as the sign that says "communist" in America when the idea is to cause a specific thought and action into the targeted reader of the sign. If the sign says "Christian" in Afghanistan (I suppose), then the sign may have the same intended meaning as a sign the says "Muslim" in America. In other words, if you ask a survivor of a drone attack upon his, or her, family in Afghanistan if "Christian" is a dirty word, is it possible that you will get the same answer as if you ask a survivor, such as a widow, of an American soldier killed in Afghanistan, if the word "Muslim" is a dirty word? Can one follow the writings of Max and Engels without perpetrating crime? Again there is a sign on the road and you are asking me if a reader of those words, following those words, will result in no crime perpetrated by that person following those words on that sign on that road. Here is where it may be important to return to the concept of the power of will. Does the person in question know that the words describe a method of perpetrating a crime? If the answer is yes, yes, yes, the person desires to perpetrate a crime, finds words that describe how to perpetrate a crime, and the criminals follows the description, word for word, as to the perpetrating of that willful, premeditated, crime, and how can that ever be anything other than a crime, unless the words were false, and the actions resulted in no crime, or the person wanted to perpetrate a crime, but the person failed to actually reach the goal, despite having instructions that are effective methods of perpetrating crimes? If the answer is no, no, no, the person does not desire any crimes perpetrated on anyone, but the person reading the criminal instruction manual is stupid, or powerless against effective fraud, then the person is not guilty of willful, premeditated, crime. Which is more dangerous, the willful criminal or the person desiring to help other people, being misdirected, and as a result of following criminal instructions the misdirected person perpetrates crimes unwillingly? If your question suggests that Marx or Engles, or both, are well meaning good people, who tried to construct a method that can be used to help people, but their utopian dreams are mistakes that they make in logic, and reason, then such a suggestion, if that is what you are suggesting, is beyond reason to me. As far as I know Marx started out as a reasonable writer of philosophy, ran into trouble, and was paid very well by the Legal Criminals in power at that time, the Wall Street Gang, to lie, on purpose, so as to get World War I and II going on schedule, since there was a need to change the sign on the Legal Money Monopoly Power, to change it from The Bank of England to a new, fresh, false advertizement called The Federal Reserve, and/or, The World Bank, or, take your pick, The Dollar Hegemony. So, to me, Marx and Engles were merely criminals, only criminals, paid to be criminals for a price, and the denomination at that time was either U.S. Dollars or English pounds, but convertible to any of the Fraud and Extortion monies then dumped on what would otherwise be a free money market. Willful, premeditated, crimes perpetrated by those criminals as they wrote the false advertisement called The Communist Manifesto, which is probably an adaptation of the earlier crime perpetrated by The false Federalists with what was not called The Federalist Manifesto, but could have been, or could be now called that word choice, but was not called that word choice then, it was called The Federalist Papers, which were false promises of good things coming, willful deceptions, fraud, open fraud, perpetrated willfully by criminals, as those criminals define the meaning of crime by their actions, and by their false words. Communist Manifesto = The Federalist Papers Why would one be any better or worse than the other when both reach for, and gain, the same power? Can one follow the writings of Max and Engels without perpetrating crime? Can anyone follow the writing of Hamilton and Madison without perpetrating crime? The answer is answered by those who are duped into a false belief that those words are not meant to be crimes, or by those who know that those words are meant to be crimes. The proof is proven when the heads of the victims start rolling. Why call it anything other than crime? Who benefits? And I want to know, why does air even have to be owned? Back to the sign on the road, before the hill, before the drop to a torturous death, and on the sign is one word only, and that word is "owned". What is the intended meaning of the word on the sign, on the road, as people travel down the road? If the word means the same thing as exclusive use then each breath proves how accurate the word is in fact. If the word means that one person, or one group of special people, claim ownership of all the air, then I smell a rat. Who claims ownership of all the land? I sit on a portion of land right now. How is that not the same thing as me owning this portion of land right now, and how is that not the same as me breathing the air that I breath right now? Does the word ownership mean that I have exclusive power to breath the air I breath, and be alive on earth where I am at any given moment? I think that the idea offered is a place to start, not a demand or claim of absolute authority that cannot be questioned by anyone ever. Joe, thank you for answering me. You words helped me. Thank you. I gain by our discussions which are rare things, scarce things, valuable things, useful exchanges of viewpoints, moving hopefully toward more accurate perceptions, and gaining in that way the power required to improve the standard of living and reducing the cost of living; while avoiding any willful involuntary passing on of costs. Book work is put aside for good reason when discussion is possible. Now back to work. I am changing the size of the text from 12 to 14 where your words are published in a font called Angsana. I can't read the size 12 font without much effort or glasses while I have no trouble reading the words published sized 10 New Times Roman (my words). Size 14 Angsana is still smaller in actual size compared to size 10 New Times Roman. |
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bear Guest
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Joe,I am changing the size of the text from 12 to 14 where your words are published in a font called Angsana. I can't read the size 12 font without much effort or glasses while I have no trouble reading the words published sized 10 New Times Roman (my words). I hate that I have sent the book back to you with "busy" work to be done. I think you can change all of that font size at one time though by highlighting a paragraph of the Angsana font and then at the right side of your screen (at the top) in the editing segment of the toolbar click on Select then on the drop down click on All Text with the Similar Formatting Then all the Angsana will be automatically highlighted in a few seconds and then just change the font size. ----------------------- Joe, why do the JBS people and the G. Edward Griffin videos not call out Hamilton and Madison and the Federalist papers? It seems I just want to find one enemy, but there are many as the criminals morph and worm their way in. Do you think the criminals used US and the Soviet fronts to play the good cop bad cop routine? Did you know that we (the United States, the criminals in power in The united States) left the Yugoslavian Nationalists high and dry after calling them out on the Voice of America (or some radio program, I can't remember if that is the right name) and telling them that we would help them and then once they got brave enough to help themselves we didn't help them. We sent them a planeload of powdered milk. I am saying we, but you know what I mean. I know you and I didn't do that. But then again, our tax dollars were used to do that. It seems to me that the criminals have used the United States to identify opposition to Communism and then the Communist Criminals crush that opposition while "the good cops" withdraw support. Did you know that Chiang Kai-shek was told to have a collision government with Mao and when he would not do so his ammunition supply was stopped. --------------------- You are safer, I suppose, in your delusion, as to what they are, and who they are, in fact, without the false labels. I may not be as safe and secure since my viewpoint may be more accurate. Does that make any sense to you? If is just that everytime, I think I finally understand, I see something new. William Cooper was busy calling out the Masons as the culprits, not the only culprits, but he was highlighting them in his Mystery Babylon series. So, then I was seeing/understanding the "spiritual" war or the spiritual energy the the legal criminals use. Now the last couple of days I have been listening to Griffin and JBS videos and they are busy talking about Soviet Subversion. They seem to use Soviet and Communist interchangeably. Do you think they are the same thing? Griffin, I think also talked about the Lawyers Guild. Do you know about them? I just want to see everything at once plainly, but I think I remember you telling me that we will probably never know the name of the worse criminal (and that we probably would rather not look to close because of the disgusting evil deeds surrounding that/those person(s).) You have also told me that they knock each other off as they try to gain the most power. You seem to point mostly to the money side of the enemy. Did you know the olympics generate money into the US economy when the hosting country begins to ramp up for the event? It seems to me that maybe the foreign aid that we give out comes back in part as purchases from US companies. Do you know about that? I think I am pretty naive. I have toilet paper vision. But Joe, sometimes when you try to help me see the big picture it makes me wonder why you seem to knee jerk when I use certain labels for certain criminals. I don't know what you think is, or is not, a Fabian Socialist. I don't know either, I was just parroting what I heard in a video. So, by my imagination, I can take your words as an attack upon me, as I am quite possibly a utopian thinker, a person who thinks that air is collectively owned by everyone, and therefore I am a socialist, I have that dagger in my hand, and I may be misled by other utopian, collectivist, communist, socialist, thinkers who are better able to stab people with that dagger behind that cloak? I think the appropriate view of air ownership is this: Psalms 24:1 1 The earth is the LORD'S, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein Maybe people should quit trying to own things? Jesus said this in Luke 3: 10 And the people asked him, saying, What shall we do then? 11 He [Jesus] answereth and saith unto them, He that hath two coats, let him impart to him that hath none; and he that hath meat, let him do likewise. Joe, I have more than 2 coats, there are people who have none. I have plenty of meat, there are people who have none. I say that I am a follower of the Lord Jesus Christ. I do not follow those words because if I did, my closet would not be bulging with choices, even if my choices came from Walmart. There are people with no choices. Sure, I give to others, but I give lots to myself. I wonder, how that concept of only having what the day requires works with this: Romans 12:21 KJV Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good. What if all who had plenty gave willingly to those who had none, could that action in any way end the fed, end the irs and bring the troops home? What if people were satisfied with food and clothes, and that only to the extent to meet the need? Perhaps the IRS would have nothing to tax. In that same passage in Luke 3, Jesus said this to too: 14 And the soldiers likewise demanded of him [Jesus], saying, And what shall we do? And he said unto them, Do violence to no man, neither accuse any falsely; and be content with your wages. What if the soldiers had followed that direction? Jesus would not have been beaten and put on cross? I am a utopian dreamer. [too?] |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Please don't despair or whatever word is accurate on this font size stuff. I am actually having much to be grateful for as the book appears to be of an artful quality as it is returned compared to what it was when it left my sphere of influence. I will do as instructed to reduce the heavy lifting (key presses) required to normalize symbol sizes. Seriously, the book is taking shape as a work of art in my opinion. I mean that from a perspective where art does not have to make sense, it just is what it is, it has an artful quality to it, something that is beyond measure by scale or dimension. At this moment my brother Jack is dealing with the loss of his wife, this is the same guy that sent me the 100 dollars to help me move the book further toward publishing. The relationship he had with his wife is now ended, and the 2 children, both adults now, are so far managing, as far as I can tell. The book may be worth something to him, at this point, or worth less to him, and I can't know yet. Jack has always been the artist in the family. If he approves of the book, once it finds its way to print and then into his hands, I can have more angles of view with which to evaluate the fruits of our combined labor. So this book has outlived my mother and my sister-in-law. It is something that can be a real book some day, God willing, and if it is art, as I think it is, then it is well worth doing as far as my understanding of value is concerned. Thanks |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am very sorry for your brother and his family. My sister is in the process of loosing her husband to kidney cancer. The time is drawing near for them. I hurt for them because they are hurting even though they have courage. Another death for your brother to deal with so soon after the loss of your mother. My words fail me as I erase what I have written as if I can know the depths of what anyone else feels. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Loss or cost can be shared or not, and it can also be increased. My daughter was for a time close to a friend who has just lost her mother. This story becomes very bad with the latest news. The mother is lost in the sense that she went for a walk and did not return, and this not completely unexpected because the mother was suffering from depression, which is something familiar to a lot of women; a lot of mothers. She may have relapsed into extreme mental illness and the family is well aware of that possibility. More than a week has gone by already. My wife and I tried printing and posting fliers locally, whereby people who are called transients, those who are willfully homeless, or whatever, wander: near a local soup kitchen type business. I can't really rap my head around the position that the family is in, not knowing the full extent of the woman's condition. I know that she is a small, kind, frail, sweet, little woman that is very shy and polite, caring, when I've met her, which was not often. She has, I've heard, a turbulent side to her. This is not like, I've said to myself, and my wife, like losing your keys. The news became very bad when the Sheriff (government), so called, limits their power of will to "help," by targeting the family as suspects and zeroing in on the daughter. I do not know the full story, as if I were present during any exchanges in the matter, but to me the proof of Legal Crime is undeniable at this point, as the number of people joining the so called government for good reasons dwindle and as those who are employing the apparatus for personal gain at the expense of innocent people increase. When keys don't want to be found, they can't actually find ways to hide, they don't wander off, and more often then not they show up exactly where they were put after they were no longer needed at that time. Our niece who works at a Las Vegas Hospital offered avenues by which hospitals could be called and alerted, to look out for this and that specific type of person that typically ends up in a hospital. My reasoning for relaying this information includes the concept of confession, of being powerless, knowing that someone closer will inspired more thoughts and actions geared toward knowing better as to where and how the loved one is managing in whatever conditions that may exist in the vastness of unknowing. I don't know how I will manage in similar conditions, but seriously, why do you think the so called Sheriff would limit the investigation to suspicion that the family members, and in particular the mirror imagine of the mother, a very frail looking teenage girl, somehow perpetrated a crime? This is a lot to dump onto someone else, and my aim is not to unload the trouble. I think it may be a good idea to realize, better, who the authorities are; in fact. In other words it makes sense that someone claiming to be an authority is no such thing until that person can produce the evidence in fact. Now your words return to me, and I can repeat them, and I can claim to understand, in my own way, what you are trying to say. My words fail me as I erase what I have written as if I can know the depths of what anyone else feels. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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I went through the book once. There were a few things I changed, having found a missing letter in one case. I changed the size of the bear words to 16 for greater balance. Page numbers now total 174 because of the larger front. I think I can probably go through the book one more time, and then I think it will be ready for printing, but I can ask for your help one more time, at your say so, to send it back to you for a final check before the offer of artwork is sent to the printer. Will you agree to look at the book one more time? |
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bear Guest
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Yes, Joe,Will you agree to look at the book one more time? but, I might not be as fast as you are, but I will do my best. Is there any way to find another page to add Joe's Slaw? If not, is there any room on the last page of the index page? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I see that you are on the forum, which is making me smile, and I don't know why. Please have as good an evening as is humanly possible. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, When I open the document at my end the page count shows to be 175. Does it say 174 or 175 at your end? While you are looking, can you look at bear words. I am thinking there is too much space between each line. I would like to change line spacing to be exactly 16 points. That moves the lines closer together and makes bear words look more like spacing of Joe words. I think maybe when the font was smaller it didn't look so out of place, but now I am thinking it would be better for bear word lines be closer together. Is that OK with you? If so, it will probably change the page count to 173 (That is by doing the change globally, but I haven't checked each page yet to see how the document re-paginated.)What say ye? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I counted the pages not numbered and added that to the page numbering. I sure could have miscounted. I think you are right about the bear words spacing: in need of fixing. I did not know how to fix it, and I thought it might be fixed with some final format process. Some words show up far apart in some sentences and other words are close together as if the formatting process is automatically adjusting sentence or paragraph length. If you can figure out how to normalize all of those things then there may be room for a recipe. Did you have a copy of a Joe's Slaw recipe already saved? I can write another one if needed. |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, The page count shows up in the bottom left corner of the screen when I am in Word 2010. It shows in something called the status bar which is a light blue bar that goes across the bottom of the Word file. I don't know if it one has to turn it on, or if that bar is always present. When I right click on the bar a menu titled "customize status bar" comes up. I notices that my page number and word count options are checked. Anyways, that is how I know the page count of the documents. It says "page 1 of 175" if I am on the very first unnumbered page, or if I am on the very last page of the document is says "page 175 of 175," or whatever page I happen to be on it gives that page number and then the total page count. --------------------- I don't have a saved copy of Joe's Slaw, so if you can send it, I can figure a place for it and if you want it moved from where I include it, we can then move it. Also, when I was talking about the line spacing, I was speaking of the actual space between the word lines as in: single space or double space. I wasn't speaking of the space between words. That is automatically controlled by the right margin justification feature which makes all the lines of words end at exactly the same margin. However, I am thinking about changing bear word size to 15 which may help make the words not be spread out so much. Since I changed the spacing between the lines the 16 size appears larger than Joe Words. Anyways, I will mess with formatting a little, and then send the doc back to you to let you see if you like the looks of the font size/spacing, then when I have your OK, I will start reading and making corrections if I should find any more. Does that sound OK? I smiled when I saw I made you smile. Smiles are contagious. They are easily exchanged at Walmart, and I notices that nowadays we are all so busy in our own little rushed worlds that we no longer smile at one another, as in saying, "Hi." I notice it brightens peoples faces when I give them a smile. A very free and easy thing to do when I remember. I read a book one time that said to sing and be happy when doing housework as it affects the children in a positive way. I am grumpy sometimes instead. ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I saw only size 14 or 16 for bear words, 15 sounds right. I can type out Joe's Slaw here and then cut and paste form here to the word file? Is that better or do you want me to send a one page word file through e-mail? Joe's Slaw Ingredients Cabbage Red Cabbage Celery Carrots Onion Red Onion Cucumbers Radishes Garlic Habanero peppers Jalapeno peppers Mayonnaise Red wine vinegar Olive oil Ground black pepper Ground sea salt Red pepper Preparation I don't have a set ratio measured out for any ingredients. Half a Cabbage head sliced against the grain to produce thin and long pieces for both regular and red cabbage. Cut around the heart in the center and end up with a square of cabbage heart discarded. Handfuls of cabbage are placed in one of two large mixing bowls. Vinegar is poured onto cabbage in the bowl to start soaking. Carrots are shaved into long and thin shavings with a peeler and I have yet to put in too many carrots, it takes awhile to shave a big pile of carrots. Handfuls of carrots can be thrown into the second bowl and a handful of cabbage can be thrown on top of each handful of carrot shavings. Radishes are cut in halves or fourths depending upon the size of the individual radish. I buy two batches of fresh radishes, but I don't use the entire second batch. Ilike to eat a radish as a snack, so the extra goes in a plastic sandwich bag. The size of the pile of radishes is about the size of the pile of celery and the size of the pile of cucumber pieces which are cut lengthwise in quarters and then cut into cucumber cubes. Piles of radishes, cucumbers, celery, and a small pile of finely diced onion or thin sliced stringy onion, are hand mixed from bowl to bowl. Half full bowls are then sprinkled with sea salt, black pepper, red pepper, diced up garlic, habanero, and jalapeno peppers. A large blob of mayonnaise is put in each bowl and some olive oil. More hand mixing. I use glass bowls with plastic tops and everything fits in one large bowl: refrigerate. Comments I have yet to fail to eat the whole bowl myself, sometimes transferring the remains into a smaller bowl, and so far the fresh crunchy ingredients do not sit long enough to become soggy. The mixture does appear to become radioactive as the odor will fill the room and seep out of the skin as perspiration after consumption. I use plenty of garlic to keep the vampires away. Joe's Slaw breath is not conducive to romantic encounters with the significant other. Often, but not always, I add mixtures of hot sauces in a serving bowl and I drink the excess liquid. Unlike my mom's Coleslaw mine is not merely moist. Yes smiles are powerful messages that are supplied to fill a demand. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, crying is contagious too?I have yet to fail to eat the whole bowl myself, sometimes transferring the remains into a smaller bowl, and so far the fresh crunchy ingredients do not sit long enough to become soggy. The mixture does appear to become radioactive as the odor will fill the room and seep out of the skin as perspiration after consumption. I use plenty of garlic to keep the vampires away. Joe's Slaw breath is not conducive to romantic encounters with the significant other. Often, but not always, I add mixtures of hot sauces in a serving bowl and I drink the excess liquid. Unlike my mom's Coleslaw mine is not merely moist. I am dying laughing here. OK on a serious note, I love it! Your typing right here on your forum is sufficient. I'll cut and paste to the book after you take a look per the formatting notes below. Yes, word only shows even font sizes, but one can type the font size they wish, such as 15 in the font size area and hit enter and the text (assuming the text has already been highlighted) will change to the custom size. If my memory serves me right one can even put in 15.5, but I don't have the document open to check my memory at the moment. I now in the process of sending the doc back. I made the following format modifications: changed bear words to size 15 as well as exactly 15pt line spacing. I would like you to look at the first two chapters page by page as I have made some format changes that I will do throughout if you like the appearance. Removed a return under the Joe quote and also added ~ ~ ~ beneath the quote at the top as well as before bear quotes to show the discussion moving along as you answer to bear words. ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Replied in e-mail |
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bear Guest
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Joe, do you want me to make editing notes here on your forum? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Yes, if you think the editing is instructive. I read them, but I don't know if they sink in after reading the first time. |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, I wasn't so concerned about punctuation changes or editing correct, but that I may make changes that you might like to know about. (some of these things have shouted at me each time I have edited, but for some reason this time around I feel the need to change them.) I have not done a complete read yet, these items jumped out as I was working on formatting text: ---------------- This section always seemed a little awkward to me, and I also found that there was an error when I went to make it more readable as I had declared the second link a video. from: Watch Video: Storm Clouds Gathering4 Watch Video: The Natural Rights Foundation5 (bear links) "Will you see what you think of the video…less than 15 minutes." to: "Will you see what you think of the video…less than 15 minutes :"Storm Clouds Gathering4 from The Natural Rights Foundation.5 ----------------- Each time I read this I wanted GW's name added, but didn't do it till this time around. So this is a modification to Joe Words. from: “Either you are with us or you are with the terrorists”6 to: “Either you are with us or you are with the terrorists”6 —George W. Bush ------------------ This change was just because the original seemed awkward: from: “To me it is like you telling me, ‘I don’t care what color the Republicans say they are. I say they are blue. They were blue and they are blue. I don’t care if everyone else now says they are red because they changed from blue to red. Don’t you dare call them red! They are blue.’ “And I say, ‘When a rose changes colors it is time to take note and change words.’” to: “To me it is like you telling me:
--------------------- I added The Lord Jesus Christ here because I wanted to be clear Whom I was speaking about. from: It is this God Who has all power, and it is His Son, Who can set you free, so that you can be: Free indeed. to: It is this God Who has all power, and it is His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, Who can set you free, so that you can be: Free Indeed! --------------- So, I am not so worried about talking to you about benign punctuation changes or error corrections, but am more concerned that you know when I am making textual modifications. What do you think? Should I let you know about these types of changes, or would you pick them up yourself when you do a reread after I have finished? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am hoping you also see the information in the post above this one. Do you have an understanding of whether the first page of the book submission should be blank? I am uncertain of this and we are starting the first page as the title page. But when you open a book, the title page is on the right side, not the left. Do you understand what I am taking about? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Changes look good. I agree that the Title page should be on the right. In my copy of The Science of Society there is a blank first page on both sides, and a blank page on the next page (first side of page 2), then there is a photo of Stephen Pearl Andrews on the back side of page 2, then there is a the Title page on the first side of page 3. I think it is a good idea to leave the first page blank on both sides, and then the title page starting on the first side or front side of page 2. Does that sound right? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Call me crazy, but I am not liking the bear font anymore. It seems to look just like the italics of Times New Roman. It is kind of bothering me. Does it bother you? Thank you for info on Title page. I'll format accordingly. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Since the font is bothering you, it can, eventually, bother me. My suggestion is to change the font to a few other (less bothersome) types and save those edited versions with another file name. Then have as close to actual size examples shown side by side on your computer screen to see if you can better understand what constitutes the cause of bother. I thought it was very well done to have differences in font for the different people offering words. I did not pay much attention to how those words appeared in context of my feelings at the time. I really think you are finding talent in writing and editing. |
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bear Guest
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Thanks Joe, To be a little more transparent, it was bothering me last time around, but I did not say anything because we had already agreed on that font and I didn't want to be too picky. (And it almost appeared to me that the font was not the same as when I chose it while I was in the process of editing after I chose it - sometimes I think I am crazy )I looked for a few fonts then to make a new suggestion and it seemed to hard to find a new one. But this time, I think I can. The editing is going smoothly. I am already on page 36 out of 174. And I have already done formatting changes throughout the whole document and have re-paginated the first few pages to give blanks in the appropriate places. I do think that after I finish reading, I will read again, as some of the punctuation changes I made last time seem clunky, so I am making some changes, and I want to go back thru and see if they seem clunky a 2nd time around. Does that sound OK to you? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, That sounds very good. |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, I have a question (imagine that). Regarding this: 1. "If one is forced into a collective situation, as far as I can understand, they are no longer sovereign." Number 1 is my sentence. Number 2 is your modification to my sentence. This is my question: Are criminals the only people who will force other people into involuntary situations? I am asking this because when you say: “If one [victim] is [willfully] forced [by a criminal to make the victim less powerful, so as to make the criminal more powerful]..." It makes me wonder, Do you think people should be forced into situations for their own good in order to make them more powerful? I ask this question because number 2 leaves that option. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I don't have the answers, since I don't know, but my thinking is that the answer in this case is yes. It makes me wonder, Do you think people should be forced into situations for their own good in order to make them more powerful? I ask this question because number 2 leaves that option. If a lie, threat, or even a relatively harmless act of violence is willfully perpetrated by an individual upon another individual or upon more than one other individual so as to save the target of the lie, threat, or violence from certain, torturous, and horrible death, then that can be exemplified precisely that way in reality or in theory. Now take that example of how a lie, or a threat, or violence, is used that way, and compare it to another example of the same thing. Now see all those examples of those lies, threats, and all those examples of relatively harmless violence as a competition to see, by some relative measure, which was the least harmful, and which example resulted in the actual reaching of the goal to save human beings from the most certain torturous and horrible death. Now take the one exemplary example of all those examples that stands out as the least harmful willfully employed example done by someone to cause the result of the greatest good, and there, then, is an example to be compared with the opposite, or the counterfeit, good use of tools. The lie does not do it. The threat does not do it. The violent act does not do it. A willful person commits a crime. What is the routine tools used by criminals? 1. Lies 2. Threats 3. Violence Are there any other tools used by criminals? Who blames the lie? Who blames the threat? Who blames the violence? How is any of those human actions among humans measured as being either good or bad for one at the hands (and mind) of the other, and is the measure accurate? A good person will tend to ask, honestly, if their thoughts and actions cause injury to another person, and a good person will tend to trust that the answer is true, and then a good person would, it seems to me, stop repeating the thoughts and actions that harm someone else, or my question is: Why ask that question if not to help the victims of injury avoid further injury? The other angle I immediately begin thinking about once I read your generous question had to do with the degree at which the transfers of power flow from one person to another person. That sets me off on the competitive scale building of examples of those degrees at which power flows from one person to another person. I do that, as a routine, so as to get a larger pictures of each example of interaction among people. A petty criminal who seeks to gain at the expense of someone else, by lying, by threatening, and by petty examples of violence, for example, can be compared to the examples provided by Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Mao Tse-tung, Pol Pot, and the people who payed them to get started on their paths of crime made legal. When does crime cease to be of any significance in our human existence? I think a good way to find out is to stop paying the worst criminals the most power. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, If I refuse to eat, I will loose power. Should someone then force me to eat? Should a group take over and force me to eat? Should I be declared not of sound mind so that someone, anyone who cares, could force me to eat? Is that act of force part of Liberty? I think on a small scale, but if the answer is yes, the scale of affect could become very large. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, My answer is yes in some cases and no in other cases, to be determined by me, God willing, if such a thing is on my path through this life stuff. Could you refuse to act to save your lived ones in such a case as you describe? Do I understand the question? |
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bear Guest
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Hmm, Joe, you boil it down to someone besides myself, my loved ones. No, I could not watch them starve themselves and not try to do something. I would want to intervene. I would want to help them. First, I would want to know why they didn't want to eat, and then I would proceed from that answer to try to get help. Yes and no. That is a good answer for me. It would depend. But what I was thinking more of is whether someone in a white coat should show up uninvited and take matters out of the individual's hands as well as that of the family. In regards to collectivism, I want to know if people can be collected even if they don't want to be collected. Even if it is done so with out lies and threats or violence. Like what if someone decides that everyone should live in cities, because that is what is "best" for people and for the environment and for commerce etc. Should people be forced to live where they do not want to live? What if someone lives on flood land, and they do not want to move, but they are forced to move because "the government" (a list of people) has decided that they will buy up all the flood land that surrounds rivers and then put in a damn so the water can be controlled for the collective good. What about the people who are forced off of their land for the collective good? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I miss having my cousin Mike, and my distant friend Sergey offer their viewpoints to me, but I appreciate yours by that relative absence. Your viewpoint is very valuable to me, it stays with me. Between the time of reading, replying, and now, concerning your recent question I had a qualification realized in my mind concerning my reply to your recent question. I can get to that qualification after awhile. "But what I was thinking more of is whether someone in a white coat should show up uninvited and take matters out of the individual's hands as well as that of the family." That is the trigger to me, or the litmus test, the autonomous, healthy, trustworthy, productive, exchanges are either voluntary or involuntary. Your question, and my answer, deals with someone who is no longer autonomous, healthy, productive, and the exchange with someone who is, presumably you, or I, or whoever needs an answer, and needs an answer in time, and the two are not connected equitably by that definition. Person A is going to die without help. Person B is powerful enough to help, with one qualification, and the qualification is that the person who is almost powerful enough to help the helpless is ignorant concerning the least destructive path, which is the most beneficial path, required to reach the goal of helping. The power that is absent is the power of knowledge, understanding, wisdom, or whatever words work to connect the person needing the information to the information needed. So the words you now offer here: "But what I was thinking more of is whether someone in a white coat should show up uninvited and take matters out of the individual's hands as well as that of the family." Those words introduce another individual into the exchange, and my mind here is connecting to information I was offered in a First Responder Class, or First Aid Class, and the warning offered that may be relevant to your words is the warning that says look before you leap in a situation where there is someone injured, obviously, and your first reaction is to rush in (where "fools" fear to tread) and by doing so you become the next victim. Perhaps there is an open electric circuit and the first person down is followed by the next person down, the next, and the next, until the electric power is all used up in injuring people, so the next person arriving on the scene is safe. So the connection I make here is the introduction to another person is not always going to be helpful. What do they offer? If they offer the final solution when there is time to consider other possibilities, such as your insistence upon knowing better, compared to knowing worse, then their offer is not help, is it? Do they bring a piece of paper that claims that they are the only source of help available to anyone ever? Do they bring a badge that claims that it is either their help or no help, ever, and if you dare question the offer you will be the next one needing help? Does this all sound familiar by now, as if a routine, or business cycle is working the way it works when people are led down the wrong path? The qualification that I had, hit me, in my thinking, in between the time you offer the question and now, was a qualification that you reinforce with your latest response, and the qualification is such that my admission of seeing good use in lies, and good use in threats, and good use in violence, to save someone in need, is not automatically a choice to go and get those tools first. The first thing to do is to look at the situation from at least one more competitive angel of view to compare that extra viewpoint to the one viewpoint that may first appear into view. If time runs out, and there are no other options, there is only time for a small, almost harmless, lie, which will reasonably save the helpless person, then why not use that lie for that purpose in that dire situation? Would a reasonable person, under those specific conditions only, only those specific conditions, take the lie solution off the shelf, taking that tool off the tool belt, and if so, for what reason? A. Small lie and the helpless person lives and recuperates and becomes healthy again. B. Helpless person can't be helped in that specific situation because a lie is not going to be used by the person in that position where only that lie is left as the last resort to help that person in need. Words I write can be claims of ideas that are not mine, and I think that experience proves to me that there is a need to be specific concerning what I do mean with the words I choose. In regards to collectivism, I want to know if people can be collected even if they don't want to be collected. Even if it is done so with out lies and threats or violence. With your help I can try on the shoes of other people. I can say to myself, do I really understand what is meant by the person who chooses those words? I have to say, at this point, no. No, I do not really know what is meant, but I can ask for clarification. If you can give me a specific example of what goes on in the mind that drives the action that is then called "collectivism," then I can see what you mean by that example. Describe to me, please, what happens when "people can be collected if they don't want to be collected, even if it is done so with out lies and threats or violence." The word slaves comes to my mind. A criminal gives himself, or herself, the authority to create slaves out of other people, and I can call that Legal Crime. The criminal then looks for and finds a slave, another one, and then 10 slaves, or 100, or 3 billion. No lies. No threats. No violence. The criminal figures out how to enslave billions without lies, threats, or violence. Is it possible? I think it is possible. Take away free will, physically, with poison for one example, and what will happen to those living beings that have no power to choose? What is fluoride doing in the water? What is mercury doing in the supposed inoculations? How long would it take in years, or revolutions around the sun, for the plan to work, if the plan was to remove free will from the targeted victims? What if one of the victims chooses not to be a victim? Is that, then, the inspiration to pick up the tool of falsehood, or threats, or violence? Is it the fact that a victim may choose not to be a victim the cause that causes the criminal to reach for standardized, routine, tools used by criminals? 1. Lies 2. Threats 3. Violence 4. Other things useful when seeking the goal of gaining power from the innocent victims. Are we speaking about willful criminals? Are we speaking about people who are led down a path of crime despite their desire to help people? Are we speaking about innocent people who are not willful criminals? Like what if someone decides that everyone should live in cities, because that is what is "best" for people and for the environment and for commerce etc. Should people be forced to live where they do not want to live? There is a phenomenon that can be called political economy. There is a genuine version of it. There is also a counterfeit version of political economy. It may be a good idea to know the difference. The genuine article is such that honest, productive, independent, careful, human beings can produce much more when those people harmonize, and cooperate, and access division of labor, specialization, and economies of scale. If transportation is costly then close proximity reduces that costly expense. What are cities? If the Legal Criminals can move the slaves closer together, then the Legal Criminals have less transporting expenses while the power is being sucked out of the slaves. Since our human condition is now such that a small group of people can survive almost anywhere, having abundant power from the sun converted to useable electric power, and easy to store surpluses of abundant power, in hydrogen, or many other storage mediums, there is no longer as much utility in close proximity, or cities, as once there was in human history. If the genuine utility of a city (close proximity) no longer exists, or is of much less value (political economy) then why are there so many people still fenced into cities? Which powers are at work, if not genuine ones, that are working to keep people caged into cages? What if someone lives on flood land, and they do not want to move, but they are forced to move because "the government" (a list of people) has decided that they will buy up all the flood land that surrounds rivers and then put in a damn so the water can be controlled for the collective good. What about the people who are forced off of their land for the collective good? I want the answer, do you? Are you willing to do the work? Boil the situation down to the best, honest, productive, moral, voluntary, live preserving situation that you can imagine, or borrow my viewpoint. A bunch of people voluntarily assemble to reach the goal of producing a man-made lake, dam, and power generator, whereby the goal is to then have electric power run like water, to then be used to reduce the costs of making food, clothing, and shelter, and other life sustaining things. One person is already found on an almost ideal spot for the project in mind. Is it one mind? No, you have already offered an important qualification in your question, as there are many people on a list who are volunteering to work together to reach the shared goal in mind. Dam Dam Dam If not for that one person. Does that one person refuse to make best use the land, despite careful efforts to inform the person of all the benefits that can be realized that far exceeds the current use of that land by that one person? I don't know. Your question is lacking specifics. The Dam project could move to another location? The Dam project could be delayed until the one hold-out is no longer holding out by natural causes, or by some other, peaceful, means? If the project is truly a productive venture of vast proportions, huge savings in power costs, and each voluntary member of the collective mind set on that Dam project will reap powerful rewards, then why does the one person hold-out? I'd ask the one hold-out, perhaps I was wrong, perhaps the one hold-out is actually using the land better than anyone else could. The exercise in building a hypothetical example here can be expanded upon, as the GANG with the collective mind set, set to build a Dam, may be starving to death and the cost of traveling to a possible better location could be measured in human deaths. The exercise in building a hypothetical example here could involve a single well of water in the desert and the one hold-out refuses to give up any water despite having abundant water in this hypothetical case imagined by me, and offered to you. An example where one person has only as much as needed for one person, and then other people claiming ownership of that scarce supply of only enough power for that one person, is not the same question. If that becomes the question, then my answer to that "what to do when there is an abundance of scarcity" is answered by a real world example in the form of a few people on a boat: Men against the Sea |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, Thank you for your reply. You have given me much to think about and I expect to reply back tomorrow. I picked wild black berries this morning and spent most of the afternoon sleeping it off. It was so nice to be out and to feel good enough to be out but I still tire easily. I am on page 50 something of the first read of Joe Quotes, and that is where my questions regarding for the good of a person or collective good of a person came from. It is amazing as I go back thru the new eyes I read with as new questions form that had not occurred to me earlier. I appreciate your perspective and your willingness to take the time to answer bear questions. I have to take the boys to get free physicals this evening as they are now of that age in their sports endeavors. The free physicals come at an expense of inconvenience for me because they are 30 minutes up the road, start at 6 and Jeff would like me to be back at 7 for church, and I don't know how many people will be in line. Time will tell, and free saves us $40. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I am merely letting you know that I read your last, welcome, words. |
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bear Guest
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Thanks Joe, Time told that I did make it back by 7 and that there was also a line. All went well and I was able to do some bookwork during the wait. I am on page 67 right now and have a blackberry pie in the oven. I am going to do book work till bed I am tired and then tomorrow I will make a reply. I have been thinking about a phrase that you used in the book: Authority of man upon man is a lie. What does that mean? Is there any valid authority? Should there be police, and in my mind I am not talking about criminals with badges. I am talking about regular people who have a job that includes a badge, a gun, and a car, and who use those tools in a way that keeps the peace. Didn't they used to be called Peace Officers before they were called Police Officers, before they were called Cops, before they were called Pigs? And I have no idea what they are called today. Is there such a thing as yielded authority where people who choose to live in a certain place abide by rules or laws and those given authority to enforce laws have a lawful and good job as long as they follow the rules and are not above the rules? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, These words: Do they bring a piece of paper that claims that they are the only source of help available to anyone ever? that you provided give clarity to the powers at work in the situation of someone showing up in a white coat to "help." But these word: The first thing to do is to look at the situation from at least one more competitive angel of view to compare that extra viewpoint to the one viewpoint that may first appear into view. If time runs out, and there are no other options, there is only time for a small, almost harmless, lie, which will reasonably save the helpless person, then why not use that lie for that purpose in that dire situation? Would a reasonable person, under those specific conditions only, only those specific conditions, take the lie solution off the shelf, taking that tool off the tool belt, and if so, for what reason? cause me caution. I don't carry a lie of any sort as a tool. I think the habit of creating a small lie that may appear harmless for the greater good is rationale that can lead to big lies that may appear harmless for self good. I think that lying of any sort is something that can take on a life of its own as one small harmless lie grows as each new lie is used to cover that small lie as lie pile up one upon another. I think that creating lies creates a liar. I think that when a mind begins to form lies that it becomes easier and easier to lie and soon lies just spill out for the "benefit" of the moment. I think that perhaps the liar can begin to live in those lies as if they are truth causing reality to change for that individual while those around that individual live in a different reality resulting from the lies of the liar. I think a lie as a tool is a tool that should never find its way upon the tool belt. I think truth is the belt that holds tools: Ephesians 6:14 KJV Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; So, whether or not the person in need is rationale and sane, I do not believe that a lie should be used. If the project is truly a productive venture of vast proportions, huge savings in power costs, and each voluntary member of the collective mind set on that Dam project will reap powerful rewards, then why does the one person hold-out? Maybe the person just wants to live on the land. Maybe that land had been passed down generation to generation. The person lives there and is not out of malice prohibiting a Dam project. The person just wants to live where they have lived all of their life and they have a farm and their children will work the farm after they die. It is family property. The person is happy to share the water with those who are thirsty, but does not want to leave the land. In that situation, even if compensation is given for the land, I do not believe the people who want to build a dam have the right to take the persons land if the land is not for sale. Is that right? OK, I asked you another bear question last night in the comment above this one I am on page 75 now. I am hoping to get a lot of book work done today. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Thanks for the update and I would like to know whose pies are better between you and your blackberry pie and my daughter's apple pie. I am not one to judge since I am not much on pies, but my daughter is often given much thanks for the good work she does with apples, flour, and a rolling pin. On the question of true authority, which is the context of my words, I think that we all know the answer instinctively, or naturally, or intuitively, so long as our genetic make-up is not injured, destroyed, or mutated, but words that describe that which works naturally are not easy, for reasons that may become obvious. The authority of man upon man is a lie. That means, in context, that the origin of law is not found inside a man, since the authority of law is found in the origin of what made man, and all that man encounters through life, or the almighty, or the creator, or whatever power is the source of power that is the origin of creation. I see that as being true. A man can claim to know true authority, and it is possible that the claim being made is true, but the fact that it is true makes it true authority, not the fact that one man, or woman, knows the true authority. What is an example of true authority? I can claim to know that voluntary agreements constitute true authority among those individuals of mankind that agree. My proof of the fact that this is true authority is such that anyone asked if they are forced by any man to agree proves, if the answer is no (I was not forced), and if the answer is true (the person was not forced into "agreement"), that the authority in question was not a man forcing authority upon a man. In other words, if someone disagrees with the concept of true authority being expressed as agreement, do they do so because they are not forced to do so by another man, and therefore it is an agreement, not a disagreement with the concept? I'm asking. In other words, you don't have to agree with true authority, because true authority does not require your agreement, nor does true authority require (human) enforcement. True authority is proven as human agreement each time people agree. The liars may claim that an agreement between two human beings to combine their power to injure another human being proves that agreement is NOT true authority, but that is another lie, since the victim, being a victim, by that definition, does not agree, so the liars are offering an example of counterfeit agreement as an example of an agreement, which is routine for criminals. I think your help is helping me find what I mean, right here, as true authority is Liberty, as it exists in peace, and if there is going to be any force applied to intervene in between a criminal and a victim, that is another subject. That is defense against crime. 1. True authority (criminals do not agree with it, proven by their willful crimes) 2. Humans agreeing to find ways to avoid crime. One is not the other thing, is it? My words: Authority of man upon man is a lie. Your response: "Is there any valid authority?" Ask everyone you know to find anyone who says no to the following example of how true authority works. Your loved ones, which is potentially everyone, but I am making this personal to bring it into our living rooms, or onto our kitchen tables like delicious pies... Your loved one is cornered and a criminal is about to end the life of your loved one, and someone else, who we can call Person A, arrives in time to shout the word "NO!" The criminal thinks better of ending the life of your loved one, and the criminal scampers off, back into the darkness, or who knows, that criminal may have been scared straight, and that criminal may run into the light. If you find someone claiming that person A is not an example of someone expressing true authority, then there may be reasons for such a claim being made by a person we can now call Person B. Person B may say something along the lines of your loved one deserving what they should have gotten (murdered), and therefore Person A was taking the law in his own hands, which is a crime, on and on. I say that there may be more than one Person B, and there may be more than one Person A, and there may be many people who would just watch as the criminal ends the life of your loved one in any case whatsoever. I know what I would do, since I've been in at least one similar situation. There is a power at work driving me to act lawfully, in my opinion, and the power is built into my being, given to me, thankfully. What horror exists in the depths of ignorance, apathy, or criminality? I think I can claim to know, since I've been in at least one situation where I've failed to act right, or lawfully, or in defense of innocence. I can claim that true law defends innocence, but who would agree with me? Should there be police, and in my mind I am not talking about criminals with badges. To me the question of individual people specializing in being in the right place at the right time to help innocent people avoid being victims to criminals is an obviously good investment in scarce power, since so much power is destroyed with each crime perpetrated by each criminal upon each innocent victim. Those who specialize in a free market scenario (Liberty) are those who are best at it, those who charge the least for it, and therefore the specialists who specialize in being in the right place at the right time to intervene, to stop, to say "NO!," to run off the criminals, to make crime pay less, in Liberty (free market competition), are best at it, rather than the case where the criminals take over, and the criminals make their crimes pay very well. So, yes, I agree, certainly, to anyone claiming of the need to invest in specialists who intervene in the middle of a crime in progress. The example, on a local, individual, single, crime in progress, between two people, one criminal, and one victim, is asked for, and offered, in the case of Person A. I asked for an example, and I offered one. That pales in comparison, competitively, to the concept of investing in a defensive power large enough to intervene in the unfortunate event of having a very large criminal army invading, destroying, raping, pillaging. and occupying a place where Liberty may be allowing people to live and let live otherwise. So I now offer a scale. One criminal, acting alone, one victim at a time victimized by the one lone gunman, the lone serial killer, and the obvious, agreeable, need to invest in such a specialization as having someone powerful enough to make that type of crime pay less. Currently there is a case here where a mom with a history of thinking problems has gone missing. The family is seeking donations since the "police" are worse than having no "police," as the "police" will work to make money from the family, by accusing, arresting, and punishing a member of the family, if the "police" can't find easier prey. That is the sorry truth, in real time. I am not up on the whole story, as to any reasons, or lack of reason, for the mom to walk away, if that is what she did, willfully. I am only offering that scenario as a case of "how to pay for" defense against crime. The family is gaining the funds needed to hire a private investigator, at this point. That is the fine, local, door to door, individual, detail of power being invested into things that can be called crime prevention, or law, or authority. The true authority is missing? The dad has to stop working long enough to start acting in a truly authoritative way, driven to do so by forces that I can only imagine. I can go on and on with this local stuff. But that is only local stuff. The Declaration of Independence is a man made declaration declared by the victims in response to crimes perpetrated by organized criminals whose power was, at the time, immense. Is the Declaration of Independence an expression of true authority? I can claim that it is, but who agrees with me? How many Person B types, who claim that the Declaration of Independence is not an expression of true authority, as they may claim that Might makes Right, or some other claim meaning the same thing? I am not saying that my claim is true authority, but it is a competitive, high quality, and low cost claim compared to the opposition offered by Person B. I prefer those who agree with the idea that it is our duty, as human beings, to intervene in between criminals and victims so as to make crime pay less, even when the criminals are very well organized and very powerful. I am talking about regular people who have a job that includes a badge, a gun, and a car, and who use those tools in a way that keeps the peace. Didn't they used to be called Peace Officers before they were called Police Officers, before they were called Cops, before they were called Pigs? And I have no idea what they are called today. Even now, even after the criminals have taken over for over 200 years, here in America, there are still more good, true authorities, among us compared to those who are not, if the measure of dead corpses floating down rivers is a rough way to measure such things. The Civil War (lie) comes to mind. How do you tell the good one's from the bad ones? How do you tell the genuine specialists in true authority from the counterfeit versions who specialize in crime made legal? Ask one if they think that any person who can say NO to crime aught to say NO when saying NO can end a crime in progress. Can I, merely me, deputize myself, or do I need permission sir? Can I take the law into my own hands or not, sir? Ask one if The Declaration of Independence is true authority, whereby it is the duty of those under criminal governments to disconnect from such crimes in progress, and while you are at it, ask that person if they know that The Constitution makes rebellion against the law, and is therefore a criminal government in fact. If the answer to the question about The Declaration of Independence is affirmative concerning the duty of the people to disconnect from criminals governments, then The Constitution has to be, by that reasoning, a criminal government, since The Constitution outlaws "insurrection," which is rebellion, which is exactly what the criminals call those who refuse to be victim to criminal governments. Is there such a thing as yielded authority where people who choose to live in a certain place abide by rules or laws and those given authority to enforce laws have a lawful and good job as long as they follow the rules and are not above the rules? Here is the test of a person's understanding of true authority in my view. If someone claims that a rule is true authority and their claim is then made by them that the rule only applies to other people, but the rule does not apply to themselves, then, in that case, to me, you have accurately identified a criminal. The criminals do not often make such claims in the open. Not on the local level. Not personally face to face. A criminal is not going to accost you and say that it is the rule that you have to obey this law while I do not have to obey this law, because no such requirement of camouflage is needed while both of you know, precisely, that the criminal is busy making you a victim right there on the spot. However, the campaign, the promises, of ever better things, if only you sign on the bottom line, if only you agree, if only you buy, this or that, the bounty you will know, the paradise you will realize, will be, if only you agree, are legion, and it is called false advertizement. The rule of might makes right is the same rule as Caveat Emptor, is it not? Do onto others before they have a chance to do onto you? It is the rule shared by all the criminals? It is the one rule that everyone uses universally? Kill or be killed? If you do not agree, then what? Failing to agree results in what? Friendship? I can't claim to be an authority over anything unspecified. But I can claim, offer, and ask for, friendship. If I am rejected, there is no crime in my mind, I can merely work at a more competitive offer, but if the form of rejection arrives as being my injury, a broken leg, broken knee caps, a steady draining of my earnings, then I think I know that I have found criminals. I can offer. Do you at least know what is not authority, beyond a reasonable doubt? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I left a reply above your last reply. I am hoping you see it. This: I can offer. Do you at least know what is not authority, beyond a reasonable doubt? It seems to me that anyone with a gun who says, "Come out with your hands up, or I will shoot," has a reasonable amount of self imposed authority being imposed upon the person who is supposed to come out with the hands up. Authority can be good or evil? Authority is a tool? It depends on whether the black hat or the white hat is using authority? So, what is not authority? My guess is it is someone who does not have the power to back up their authority. Now the black hat may be a false authority, but still, the black hat has the might to force in an authoritarian way without regard of the person being forced. So I am wondering, perhaps the question needs to be asked whether one should submit to the might of a false authority in order to preserve one's own life and that of their loved ones. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I have been invited for lunch, so I'm out for awhile. I did not see your post before my last one (timing?), and I have a few things to think about in reference to your offers of ideas. I can nail things down to a more exact wording to remove more ambiguities that tend to work against the concept of accurate transfers of my viewpoints. We can't agree on which page we are on when we are on two different pages. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am on page 84 out of 174...I know that is not what you are talking about, I am just trying to be funny. I also sent you and email forwarding some information I received from Ron Paul regarding his Ron Paul Channel. He promises to provide news without the lies on is channel. |
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bear Guest
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Joe,Sorry to bother you again, but I am struck by this:It is a form of insurance or bonding, but the idea isn't to nurture competition. The idea is to create an insurance policy against competition. The words: nurture competition are beautiful words when viewing political economy. Nurturing competition goes hand in hand with Joe's Law? Oh, and on the pie. I have to say, this is the best pie I have made in the last 2 weeks, and I have made 3. I am not so good with crust, but I think I found one that I really, really like and that I will stick with for now on. It is called oil pastry (made with cooking oil instead of solids like crisco or butter) and it is as easy as pie to make! Jeff left me a smiley face and thank you on the sticky note attached to the foil. I bet your daughter's apple pie is always good! My last peach pie was not in the oven long enough so the crust was a little gummy. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am leaving you all kinds of notes. I am sorry if I am being a pest. But I want to know what this means:Afghanistan was on the list of places to destroy with aggressive war because of the opium that is grown in Afghanistan and because of the need to use the place to transport petroleum products (oil and natural gas) through it. a. Do they need to destroy Afghanistan because the poppy fields are in the way of transporting petroleum products? or b. Are the poppy fields a problem because of poppy field competition between the criminals? I am not very smart about these things. I am on page 90 now! |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, a. Do they need to destroy Afghanistan because the poppy fields are in the way of transporting petroleum products? or b. Are the poppy fields a problem because of poppy field competition between the criminals? The most powerful people had crops in Afghanistan grown for their exclusive profit. The crop was Opium. Then Russia invaded Afghanistan. Then the U.S. part of the most powerful people financed "The Taliban" (you know the guy named Osama Bin Laden?) and once "The Taliban" drove out the Russians those same people destroyed the Opium Crops. In other words the "Strong Man" employee named Osama Bin Laden was no longer following orders and so the employers (the most powerful among us or The New World Order, or The Dollar Hegemony, or whatever label you want to use to label the most powerful among us), so, the employers of "The Taliban" had in their hands a bad apple in their eyes, so they had to get rid of "The Taliban" so as to regrow their cash crop of Opium in Afghanistan. The pipeline angle is well reported by Pepe Escobar who can be found easily. One example Pepe Escobar also appears on The Alex Jones Show. Nurturing competition goes hand in hand with Joe's Law? That is somewhat incomplete, so the reader has to assume the unsaid, which is to say that competition is not to be confused with criminal competition. Competition to see who can produce higher value at lower cost is the competition that is meant in those words. Competition to see who can destroy whom, first, is not the competition that is meant in those words. You are no longer confusing one with the other, so the words are making sense now? My last peach pie was not in the oven long enough so the crust was a little gummy. Competition can be you competing with your past self, when it is understood that the idea is not to destroy your past self? I also sent you and email forwarding some information I received from Ron Paul regarding his Ron Paul Channel. He promises to provide news without the lies on is channel. I thought that I was on that e-mail list from that source already, perhaps not, I can check junk mail, and I can thank you for the connection as it looks good so far. So I am wondering, perhaps the question needs to be asked whether one should submit to the might of a false authority in order to preserve one's own life and that of their loved ones. Earlier you had claimed (offered) your reasoning for rejecting the use of lies, on principle, despite my effort to show specific cases where there may be good reasons for going against good principles. Now you do that same thing? Maybe the person just wants to live on the land. That answer was anticipated, so I already ratcheted up the situation to a higher threat level, a clearer, and a more present, danger. The owner (so called) has the only source of water, in a desert, and many people, a billion or 10, does the number really matter? A billion, or 10, people arrive at the guarded fence and propose a deal of some kind. The owner has a better use for the water. The billion, or 10, people die for lack of water. Highest and best use, as I understand it, is reasonable. I may not be able to convey my viewpoint in English. Please have fun as you can, it is contagious. |
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bear Guest
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Joe I have listened to Pepe about 4 times now. Just about the time I understand what he is talking about it seems like he moves to a new subject. I understand the summary is that the US wants full spectrum dominance. Why did Russia invade Afghanistan in the first place? I remember listening to a radio program back in the late 70's/early 80's. There was a man from Afghanistan speaking. He said there was a meeting between Afghanistan leaders and Russian leaders and the Russians opened fire and killed the Afghanistan people they were meeting with. Have you ever heard anything about that? I was probably still in high school are just out so I wasn't really paying that much attention. But the fact that the people were shot during a meeting stuck with me because it bothered me. Do you know about that? From Pepe's report I understood that the US lured Russia into Afghanistan during the Carter years. But I still don't understand why. Then Russia invaded Afghanistan. Listening to Pepe made my head hurt. It was almost like reading Joe a year ago when I had read and re-read to understand. This world dominance stuff is like a shell game. Do you know why Russia went to Afghanistan in the first place? It seems ironic that we are speaking of Highest and best use, as I understand it, is reasonable. Maybe both Russia and the US think they have the highest and best use rationale for the lands that surround them and each other? Joe, you may be entirely too busy to mess with my thoughts below. And they really don't matter, but I wrote them anyway and have gone back and added this note before you start answering. I am on page 140 out of 174 of the book. I am going to try to finish today. he owner (so called) has the only source of water, in a desert, and many people, a billion or 10, does the number really matter? Honestly, I was not thinking in those terms. I was thinking of the people who were bought out to move them off of their land so the Truman Dam could be built and flooding could be controlled. Our area which used to be the "resort area" ended up being the water table control land so the marinas and business that were supported by tourism went belly up while the other side of the dam properties were elevated in value. Our county seat got a federal prison "to make up" for the economic lost. There was an old lady in a nursing home who said they were forced off of their farm land that their family had established. It seems that all the land around the rivers now is state/public land. I am sure there is more to it. If 10 people show up outside my gate when I have been the only person around for years and miles around, is it my fault that they want to move where I already am? Sure, I'd give them some water, then I would encourage them to move on and find a place to live that would support their needs. But I would not make them die of thirst. But neither should they run me off of my property because they have now shown up with a greater use theory. If we go with the greater use theory, then we can say that we, the white man, had a greater use for this land between sea to shining sea and therefore the Indians who were here first have no right to block railroads and settlements. Who and What determines greater use? Sometimes it seems like Johnny come lately is the determiner...as long as Johnny has the might to make it right. But certainly things should be equitable. Like maybe the 10 people who show up could move next door and did their own well. I could be neighborly and help them. What happens if they drain all the water to build a dam? Is that a good neighbor relation? |
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bear Guest
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Book Question (page 147): America is almost bled dry. The parasites on the “top” of that pyramid scheme are moving to China when the measuring device is "The Dollar," and that dollar is produced by those Legal Criminals. Joe, does it make sense to change the word when to while? (This bothered me last time around, but I couldn't put my finger on it. Today the word change seems to make it easier to read.) Let me know what you think. America is almost bled dry. The parasites on the “top” of that pyramid scheme are moving to China while the measuring device is "The Dollar," and that dollar is produced by those Legal Criminals. I like contagious 's |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,Why did Russia invade Afghanistan in the first place? A person, or a small group in agreement, sign the order, and FUND the Aggressive War for Profit, or, on the other hand a person, or small group in agreement, sign the order, and FUND the Defensive War for the profit of not being destroyed by Aggressors (criminals). The actions set in motion could be something other than my measure of it. My guess is that the person, or the small group who sign the order and FUND the expense, do so in order to maintain their power to do so. To me all sides in all wars are FUNDED and ORDERED into existence by the same most powerful group that have constituted the most powerful among us, and that group is always small, not always the same individual people in the group, of course, but the same group in power employ the same routine methods by which they are in power. My answer should then be an understanding that the small group is not Russian, or Muslim, or English, or American, or Chinese. Follow the FUNDING back to the source and who signs the ORDER to FUND the expense of invading Afghanistan? I don't know. Sergey, or someone familiar with Russian history, may be able to trace back the actual people inspired to sign the order and set the actions called war in motion, in this case. If the Russian viewpoint turns out to be an inspiration that they claim to be defensive in nature, then there is the real possibility that the origin of the inspiration to set the Dogs of War in motion are not originating in Russia, but why did the Russian decision makers fail to find a solution other than War to solve their defensive problems? The Grand Chess Board? Russian Dogs of War are mere pawns? "There was a man from Afghanistan speaking. He said there was a meeting between Afghanistan leaders and Russian leaders and the Russians opened fire and killed the Afghanistan people they were meeting with. Have you ever heard anything about that? I was probably still in high school are just out so I wasn't really paying that much attention. But the fact that the people were shot during a meeting stuck with me because it bothered me. Do you know about that?" I do not know about that, but that sounds like false propaganda, too simplistic, too much like a "Western" Hollywood Movies whereby the FUNDING for the movie is traced back to the same powerful people who funnel FUNDING into all sides of almost every War on Earth so that the small group remains in POWER; where the theme of the movie is that we (meaning the U.S. Federal Government) are the good guys and they (meaning any competitor to "Full Spectrum Dominance") are the bad guys, where we serve and protect generously and they injure and destroy greedily. Specifics are demanded where ignorance of specifics exists. From Pepe's report I understood that the US lured Russia into Afghanistan during the Carter years. But I still don't understand why. Here is where due diligence exposes a possible flaw in the subjective opinions of Pepe Escobar, which can be contrasted relative to the actual factual information reported by the same human being. The word choice "lured" appears to suggest that the clear aggressors (invaders) are not responsible for what they clearly do, but my version of events asks the question who is following orders and who is giving out orders? Is it a Russian, so called, who is "lured" or who is there merely a person in a "Russian" position having an agreement with some small group that is not Russian, which is a counterfeit Russian, in place to make sure that Russians are "lured" into doing evil things? I have to get a job done at this time. Finishing last post before moving on: Maybe both Russia and the US think they have the highest and best use rationale for the lands that surround them and each other? When all the little lies, threats, and violence used willfully to injure innocent people are added up to a whole sum total of destructive power, in one place, such as America, there is then a very powerful destructive force that can be used to destroy another, almost equally powerful force, such as Russia. Is that not an ideal set-up for a small group of people who control all the legal power to purchase in the world? Who is FUNDING any large scale aggression, and how convenient is it to have ready a large scale defender ever ready to defend against large scale aggression? How about comparing the Revolutionary War in America with the events that became known as World War II? The Declaration of Independence offers fair warning to anyone who dares to claim ownership of those people making that Declaration. The Aggressors invade anyway, but the aggressors are driven out, and large scale hostilities are temporarily on hold, but not for long. Compare that to World War II where the supposed good guys are indirectly and directly financing all sides of the large scale conflict and then the same supposed good guys are volunteering to go and defend goodness with a larger scale military force of aggression, and by some strange coincidence there ends up being two, not one, team of good guys defeating the bad guys, where the bad guys property is split in half, one half goes to the Bolsheviks, and one half goes to the Dollar Hegemony. The last thing the most powerful among us want is a One World Government known to the victims so long as the victims remain powerful enough to mount an effective defense. The victims must always be divided and fighting each other for the Business Psycho to work. The Revolutionary War almost tore down the most powerful among us. I've just learned some more on that understanding from Frank O'Collins in the last live discussion. The actual (not counterfeit) good guys were employing a productive strategy known as annuities, and in this investment process the Americans paid off most of their Revolutionary War debts, which, according to Frank, inspired the New World Order bunch, at that time based in England, to mount the invasion of America, in the War of 1812, to sack Washington and burn the records that including those annuities. I don't have all this figured out, and it is probably a case where the concept of annuities is a genuinely productive, honest, process, and therefore there is more than likely a counterfeit version that is hatched into a crime made legal with a false, half true, front, like the concept we know as Social Security. The point here is to point out that defense is exactly what it is, and it is either effective or it fails, and if it is effective then it can be effective on a scale from highest quality and lowest cost to lowest quality and highest cost, and it can still be effective defense inside that scale, then there is a fine line, and then there is false defense that is not defense, whereby the scale goes the other way, whereby it is only high in quality as measured by the criminals, as they get the most they can from the victims, and it can be lowest in cost by the same measure, measured only by the criminals, whereby the bills are paid by the victims and by the measure of the victims there is only a scale of defeat, or lack of defense, where it is all cost, and no benefit to the victims. Defense, true defense, when it is best, when it is highest quality, and when true defense is lowest in cost, there is no loss by any victim, and the only loss is measured by the criminals who fail to gain at the expense of the innocent victims. The example of effective defense is offered personally in a previous post. You or your loved one is seconds from being murdered and someone says NO and the criminal is scared into a life of honestly and productivity because of that one word spoken by that one defender. What happens if there is no one that volunteers to say NO? There is no defense, there is no effective defense, there is no ineffective defense, there is simply no defense whatsoever. Without any defense will there be no crime? Joe, you may be entirely too busy to mess with my thoughts below. And they really don't matter, but I wrote them anyway and have gone back and added this note before you start answering. I am on page 140 out of 174 of the book. I am going to try to finish today. I look forward to honest, generous, discussion. I am not too busy. Honestly, I was not thinking in those terms. I was thinking of the people who were bought out to move them off of their land so the Truman Dam could be built and flooding could be controlled. That is where it is important to get on the same page. That page is very specific and it is probably documented in many ways by many people who witnessed it first hand, and many people who may have studied it, honestly, and who may have reported on it accurately. That time period corresponds with an America that has already been taken over by the Legal Criminals with the Usurpation known as The Constitution. The time period is also after the Usurpation known as The IRS and The FED. The idea of remaining within the boundaries of voluntary association while operating within a framework of Crime made Legal is more than likely, in my opinion, because I think human beings are basically good, but the worst of human kind tends to stand out and steal the show, so to speak, so there are always going to be cases of criminals finding out how to get paid well for their type of special abilities. If it were me I would not force someone out unless there was no option and at the same time failure to force someone out would result in catastrophe for another person and the person holding-out was well aware of the catastrophe that results from their failure to yield and do so equitably. I know that last sentence may be difficult to piece together, but there can be examples offered to illustrate the concepts reported. I don't mean to say anything that is not specifically understood by me, and I know there is plenty of room for misunderstanding. Our area which used to be the "resort area" ended up being the water table control land so the marinas and business that were supported by tourism went belly up while the other side of the dam properties were elevated in value. Our county seat got a federal prison "to make up" for the economic lost. There was an old lady in a nursing home who said they were forced off of their farm land that their family had established. It seems that all the land around the rivers now is state/public land. Some criminal figures out the game, connects to the right, fellow, criminals, and with secret deals, there are victims made, and there are profits made, and even if the victims end up finding out what happened, it is in the past, and the people hired to protect victims are in on the dirty deals? That started a long time ago. I don't personally think that it is natural. I think it is unnatural behavior. I think it is only natural in the sense that the natural tendency to be honest and trusting is exploited very effectively by a few people who then figure out how to specialize in that work and that work is what I call Legal Crime. "...I would not make them die of thirst..." "...run me off of my property..." You are not the problem. Those who use any lie, any threat, or any form of violence to gain at the expense of innocent people are the problem because they will make people die of thirst and they will run people off their property. "... shown up with a greater use theory..." Am I to take that as an insult to me? I am showing up with a "greater use theory"? I am doing no such thing, but your words appear to confuse my offerings with crime made legal. If the current owners of a place in Japan where nuclear fuel is burning out of control and there is now enough poison unleashed into the ocean and the air to kill hundreds of thousands of people, then that qualifies as use. Is it highest and best use? I can be left completely out of the picture. Anyone can either volunteer to judge the "theory" as they see fit. Those who die of cancer, dying miserably, can abandon any thoughts of why they die, as they die, and the owners can use the land any way they see fit until they too realize just how well, or how poorly, they are using their land. My guess is that the users using the land to poison thousands, or millions, or billions are less likely to suffer from their use of their land because they are at least well aware of exactly how well they are using their land, and they don't call it a theory. If we go with the greater use theory, then we can say that we, the white man, had a greater use for this land between sea to shining sea and therefore the Indians who were here first have no right to block railroads and settlements. I don't call it a theory, so I'm not in the we group you mention. Best use is accurately measurable by, at least, the innocent bodies floating down the river. Best use is not a theory, it is when there are less innocent bodies floating down the river. Who and What determines greater use? Sometimes it seems like Johnny come lately is the determiner...as long as Johnny has the might to make it right. You and Frank have in common the appreciation for the Golden Rule. I don't know if you and Frank share the same concept, but the same words are shared in those three words. The Golden Rule If a determination is made by anyone then how is the determination raised to a point of authority in any case? I think that Frank says, and I agree, that The Golden Rule, means that if there is a determination made, by any authority, then the determination being made applies to everyone without exception, or it is not an authoritative determination. So you confuse what I say with what you think is relevant to what I say, and to me there is no connection whatsoever, and often there is the opposite determination made by you concerning what I say. A. Johnny, or any criminal, perpetrates a crime upon an innocent victim. B. Johnny, or any non-criminal, does not perpetrate a crime upon any innocent victim. One is one thing. The other is another thing. Who determines when a crime is perpetrated upon an innocent victim? Only one person or must there be two people? If only one person determines when a crime is perpetrated upon an innocent victims then please tell me how that works, because it is beyond my ability to understand, at this time. If two people fail to agree on a crime having been perpetrated on an innocent victim, does that mean that no crime has been perpetrated upon an innocent victim? I can't see that working out either. There will be a criminal, and typically the criminal will not confess. There will be an innocent victim, and it is not a given that the victim will admit to being a victim. That is at least 2 people involved in the crime already. Who and What determines greater use? Instead of that question, please, consider asking how? How is greater use determined? I have offered a method. If thousands of bodies are floating down the river, as an extreme example, a determination can be made, by any number of people, including the people doing the killing, and including anyone not yet, but soon to be dead, as to what is going on up-river. No need to call anyone criminal or to call anyone victim. There are dead people in the river. Up stream there will be a cause of death. The criminals may claim that it is highest and best use, since the living are now dead, as the criminals just so happen to be walking off with everything of value formerly used by the dead people. I don't claim to be making excuses for killing people. I am not offering a theory. Highest and best use can be measured by the number of bodies floating down the river, or the sudden increase in cancer deaths that just so happen to be a result of a sudden release of radioactive material flowing from a place in Japan. Please sir, please owner, please stop killing so many people, please? I don't want to die a horrible death, and I don't want my loved ones dying horrible deaths, so, please, consider my theory to be valid? It is not a theory, not to me. What happens if they drain all the water to build a dam? Is that a good neighbor relation? At the point at which crime begins is at that point. If you know how to know when that point become that point then I'm all ears. I can offer an extreme example of when that point has obvious been reached, and passed, so as to leave no more room for misunderstanding. I can only offer, and I'm not offering a theory. Bodies float down the river. That is not highest and best use, unless a criminal is doing the measuring. Back to book work: Joe, does it make sense to change the word when to while? Yes that sounds much better as it removes the opportunity to think that the idea is a question when the word used is when. I think I may have a habit of using when when I should use the word while. Yes that sounds much better as it removes the opportunity to think that the idea is a question while the word used is "when." I think I may have a habit of using "when" where I should use the word while? In any case the sentence reads better as the word "when" is replaced by the word "while," thanks. |
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bear Guest
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I've been thinking about a book today called "Ask Joe."To me all sides in all wars are FUNDED and ORDERED into existence by the same most powerful group that have constituted the most powerful among us, and that group is always small, not always the same individual people in the group, of course, but the same group in power employ the same routine methods by which they are in power....to keep their power... "Oh My God," is all I can muster. This makes me want to go outside and scream, "I am on this earth and I stand for Life." Are those the right words? This is almost as bad as understanding the Economic Hit man stuff. Except I feel stronger. Not hysterical like before. Joe, who would want to kill people for fun and profit. Fun and profit means something different to me today. So does well paid liars as I think of seeing John McCain in the Pepe link. And remember the GW If you are not with us, you are with the terrorists you linked for me and is linked in your book. I thought wars were nations being aggressive about land and protection. Nations are a thing which I was holding accountable for the actions of people. What are they doing? Playing a game like Risk or Monopoly? But in real life and real death? You used the words "to me all sides." Does that mean that you could be wrong? Or are you pretty sure you are right? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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I responded up-to-date while editing my previous response. |
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bear Guest
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"... shown up with a greater use theory..." No, please do not take that as an insult. I was not meaning it that way. I am sorry that it sounded that way. You know Joe, I think my problem is that all I can see is thru eyes that see everything turning out as crime in progress, and I have a problem fore-seeing how people following the Golden Rule can do things. You are right. I should be asking How instead of Who and What. I read this today in the book. I think you afterword explains what I am asking, but I am not asking correctly. I am too busy seeing crime in progress and cannot see that things can be done differently. The messages demanded by former victims of fraud are accurate descriptions of life after the damage inflicted by the perpetrators is overpowered and in the past. Meanwhile the suffering continues daily. The record of abuse grows from small to large, and the victims begin to find cause to share their individual stories. Similarities are discovered, and the need for remedy is realized in time. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Here is where your generous honesty shows up as being proof of the value of life. When the mind is used willfully for crime, in my case I merely think the thoughts so as to understand them, then things makes sense in that mind-set. When the mind is used on the opposite way, not the criminal way, things make sense. Example: 1. Criminal mind-set: Honesty is a fatal weakness 2. Non-criminal mind-set: Lack of honesty is a fatal weakness You wrote: You know Joe, I think my problem is that all I can see is thru eyes that see everything turning out as crime in progress, and I have a problem fore-seeing how people following the Golden Rule can do things. I think that I do know this and I know that it is very difficult to realize such things for many reasons. The power of dishonesty has no power without victims who are in some way operating under false belief that may exist in the form of confusion, if not genuine belief in false ideas. It is too much work, or it is impossible, or it is dangerous, or it is potentially destructive to my well being, to understand how the criminals do business, which leaves, power-less-ness, in the form of confusion, or semi-belief in criminality as being worth something for life as a whole or as an individual human being. How much is true concerning the work required to understand and then know the full measure of criminality? To me it is reasonably true that innocence is lost when too much criminal knowledge is transferred from the source of it, through mere study, or through actual practice, so it is true, in that sense that knowing the criminals is dangerous, destructive, and therefore it may be a good idea to specialize. It may be a good idea that you don't know so much, but then how can you defend yourself, and the answer is that you have to depend upon other sources other than yourself for you defense if you are to avoid the damage done by too much intimate knowledge of how crime works. Does that make sense? You know Joe, I think my problem is that all I can see is thru eyes that see everything turning out as crime in progress, and I have a problem fore-seeing how people following the Golden Rule can do things. How much of the criminal mind-set is already busy destroying your innocence? That is how I see it. You don't have to borrow my viewpoints. If you read my viewpoints you are then probably allowing some of the information offered into your sphere of influence. Then the information may work inside you for whatever result may be the result of such information. The information may be power-less; but compared to which power this is more powerful? 1. Might makes Right (a reasonable lie) 2. Do no harm (my wording meaning what can be expressed as The Golden Rule) So the obvious power here, in my opinion, is to ask yourself a series of competitive questions whereby the intent is to find out why you have problems seeing specific things that may be worth seeing, and it may be a good idea to find out why your focus tends to be driven with ideas concerning how the crime in progress progresses. All that can be done in private, in secret, or shared with other people, in any event. It is not easy to figure out who is friend and who is foe, for many reasons. Example: From my contact with Frank, combined with my contact with you, combined with my contact with other people, an idea struck me recently. If I can't trust myself to make myself a promise, how can I trust anyone else? If you have the answer, then you are more powerful than I am, so why would it be an accurate measure to say that I am the teacher and you are the student? Honest people share. Dishonest people dictate. Which way does one way go, and which way does the other way go every day as people switch, voluntarily, or involuntarily, from one way to the other? There is so much, way too much, information I process on this path of discovery, whereby the concept of saying that I know, yes I know, is controversial in my own mind. Why? Another question, added to the heap? Which answers work best time and again? I don't know, but I can reasonably know, and I can demonstrate, and I can offer examples to other people, and they can accept my offer and in that process the viewpoints we are stuck with can be compared by each other. That is not even possible if the idea is to demand from someone else obedience according to a perspective that I currently have going on in my mind. So I don't trust my own mind? A perpetual conflict going on in my own mind? I am doomed to confusion? Compared to what? I can compare my past self when there is no bear to help me. Is that reasonable? You are right. I should be asking How instead of Who and What. I read this today in the book. I think you afterword explains what I am asking, but I am not asking correctly. I am too busy seeing crime in progress and cannot see that things can be done differently. See how this works, and I have not yet read past those words above, see how YOU ARE RIGHT, is as contagious as smiles? Beware dear friend, of overconfidence, but how can you willfully pilot your being without a sense of doing the right thing by some process such as reason? So we meet, we compare notes, and how many times do I have to confess to you that you are my teacher at least as much as you may think that I am your teacher? Where is that information describing life after Legal Crime? That is, potentially, where I am right, in this case. Looking is what happens, then finding happens, and then looking better happens, and then finding more happens, reasonably, compared to the opposite. You found the Bible, there is where life after Legal Crime is described, and why not, and who is to say not there, and it is not me who says the information is not found there, it is me who is asking which specific information, and I am on guard for contradictions that appear in my mind because contradiction in my mind is cause for concern about what is still wrong in my mind. What will life look like after the victims shed the deceptive need to perpetuate investments in unspeakable crimes made legal? One less murder is not merely one less murder. The murderer is infected with a potential desire to perpetrate more crimes and the victim may have close loved ones who are potentially desiring to perpetrate more crimes in the form of revenge. If you get to the point where your mind is working similar to mine, then automatically there is a thought that returns concerning the idea that Love is very powerful indeed when considering how much Hate is working so powerfully to destroy life on Earth. Example: How many murders have you personally witnessed in you life? If the answer is none, as is my case, and we start adding up all the answers that are none, then that measures something that may be worth knowing. On the scale, human beings manage to preserve the power of LIFE, despite those very powerful forces that work against LIFE. How are such things measured? Which side is winning? How many bodies are floating down the river today? If the hatred wins, is there anyone left to work in the other direction? How bad are things, in a reasonably accurate measure, right now? Turn on the 6 O'clock NEWS? Turn on The Alex Jones Show? At least one of those competitive offers of NEWS admits of a competitor to the MONOPOLY POWER. Look in the Bible? How bad are things right now? What happens when power is no longer willfully consumed in the work required to make a few people more powerful than everyone else, and what happens when instead of crime being made legal that power is employed into making power abundant for all? I realize that I am quoting my own words here, but I think the questions are valid, and therefore the answers have to be accurate or the answers are potentially counterproductive if inaccurate. The thing here, striking me again, is the concept of numbers of people who are currently powerless to a point of dying helplessly in abject misery compared to existence as LIFE on Earth somewhat distant from that specific scale. What do smiles measure? What is going on in the mind of the person smiling? Can you tell a counterfeit smile from a real one? |
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bear Guest
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I am cleaning house today. I have swiftly read your reply and I am looking forward to coming back to it. I finished my first read thru the book last night. I will begin a 2nd read as soon as I can. I am looking forward to reading it a 2nd time thru. If I come across anything in my 2nd time thru that bothers me and I cannot fix it, I am going to ask you about it instead of passing over it. I think we are getting close! I also want to know, do you want to say anything about your son and Joe's Slaw? It seems that one time you told me something about him saying Joe's Law, Joe Slaw or something of the sort. I can probably go back and find the words in the abyss if you don't know what I am talking about. If you don't want to say anything that is OK too. I am thinking of it as reciprocal validation. He validates you, you publicly validate him. Validation is powerful? Validation like a true Remember this: b e a r (except your forum makes it more fancy) now there is: j o s f ? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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My son made the connection between Joe's Law and Joe's Slaw much to my delight, in good humor, because I was under the impression that he was willfully unaware of both. If that sentence can fit in, then I think the sentiment may convey well. Having the book in hand is almost unimaginable at this point. Smiles are so contagious, as I just found out, again, at a stage performance involving my daughter as the Troop redid the Musical titled The Drowsy Chaperone. |
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bear Guest
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Had a Sunday School party for my kids and had a houseful this afternoon. I am still looking forward to replying. It must be rewarding and fun to see your own daughter perform! |
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bear Guest
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Just want to tell you I am on my 2nd read. I didn't start till late this afternoon and am on page 16 out or 174. I don't have a day with the Amish tomorrow. That is next week, so I expect to do bookwork tomorrow. Hopefully it will go fast. I still owe you a reply from a discussion above, but I don't know if I should discuss or do bookwork. I think it is important to do bookwork faster than slower, do you agree, or would you rather I discuss and do bookwork at the same time? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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I think that the artist has to find the inspiration where, and when, it can be found? |
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bear Guest
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I am on page 60 of 174, second read, and I am inspired to finish sooner rather than later. I hope today as I want to play. I am afraid if I did whatever I wanted to, work would never get done. I don't suppose that Joe has that problem. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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The Joe problem boils down to powerlessness concerning the right thing to do at any given moment; in a competitive sense, like this here is right, but only right compared to this here, and that there is more along the lines of the right thing to do, but only in the sense that it is relative to this over here, and that goes on and on. There is this scale and on this scale I could be doing things that preserve life as we know it the best that I can do on that scale, and then, on the other end of the scale, I am unknowingly working to destroy all life everywhere as best as can possibly be done by one person in this time period, and each step I take, being misdirected, is another step in the wrongest direction, due to my ignorance, or due to my powerlessness to know better from worse. When I hear about someone growing tomatoes and packing the excess for later use, then that appears to me to be a right as can be, on that scale, as far as I know, right up there in the right side of things along side of nurturing copies of human beings made the old fashion way, not GMO, test tube, type, beings. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, your words made me think of this verse: Psalm 37:23 The steps of a good man are ordered by the LORD: and he delighteth in his way. I went to find that verse and the whole Psalm sounds like things we talk about: http://www.biblestudytools.com/audio-bible/kjv/psalms/37.html --------------------- I need some of your good help with bookwork as I think a word or something is missing from this sentence on page 70: "What happens if the best game in town, the highest paying job, is Legal Fraud, Legal Extortion, and all the Legal Torture and Mass Murder required to keep that game going?" What do you think? ----------------------- (I still have a counter half full of tomatoes. I expect I may try to can them tomorrow.) |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, We are working through a computer problem at work, where data was at my fingertips, but I lost it, through a series of errors, and by some stroke of fortune (savings of time and effort) my wife had saved backup copies from last year, which is much better than saving no data. Anyway, that places me away from this terminal. "What happens if the best game in town, the highest paying job, is Legal Fraud, Legal Extortion, and all the Legal Torture and Mass Murder required to keep that game going?" I think that the sentence is a typical example of how the reader may have too much work thrown at the reader all at once. How about this: When the best game in town (the highest paying job) is Legal Fraud, Legal Extortion, and all the Legal Torture and Mass Murder required to keep that going, the observer can know precisely how much crime pays by following that money trail as it pays out, because the authorities are notoriously good at keeping accurate records. So, as may be seen, the effort to make things easier may actually work, in my case, toward making things more difficult. Canning tomatoes may look easy, for example, but actually having nourishing food stored for later use, having the food right there when the consumer opens the can, is easy, looks easy, at that point, in that place, from that competitive viewpoint. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Oh, maybe authorities aught to be in quotes. <------- lost data is like spilled milk, smile, don't cry about it! |
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bear Guest
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Yes, and if it happens to be lemons instead of milk, make some lemonade (which your wife pre-made when she made that backup, and I am sure it had sugar in it! She is a smart cookie to go with that milk! - I just had to add all those colloquialisms - your spilled milk art inspired me ) I am glad you can smile Thank you for the words you sent for the book. I will incorporate them with "authorities." I am now on page 92 out of 174. |
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bear Guest
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bear calling Joe, I have a question: I have just finished with the Joe's Law chapter and am now working with John and Pat. I read the word limited here in this text: "The thing that most people may not understand concerns the difference between the concept of "public" and "private" jurisdictions in law. This applies to your question, and this has been explained to me by my trainers. These products are limited by law as to how much profit the bank can make as in the term not-for-profit may suggest. If you are familiar with the term…" Why do limits need to be set? Why can't Joe's Law work as power is produced into oversupply thru bank profits? Can that profit be used to produce more power which would then make wealth cheaper? Why does a limit have to be set on the bank's production of profit? Wouldn't the nature production of profit yield to cheaper wealth thus making interest rates lower? Pat appears to be even more confused It is accurate to account our profits as being limited by free market competition, you or anyone can start your own competitive bank. If you can understand that concept, we can move on. If I or anyone could start my own bank, then wouldn't that competition become the natural limit set on bank profits (rather than a government ceiling)? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, please also see my questions above. I am adding a new one here:What happens when power is no longer willfully consumed in the work required to make a few people more powerful than everyone else, and what happens when instead of crime being made legal that power is employed into making power abundant for all? My question has to do with human nature. Even when power is made abundant for all, will all make the effort to access the abundance? Will some squander abundance and live in poverty instead? What happens when too many people squander abundance? Joe, there are people here who do not even bother to shower. In my experience, some people are poor and choose to be clean, while others are poor and choose squalor. Proverbs 19"24 A slothful man hideth his hand in his bosom, and will not so much as bring it to his mouth again Proverbs 12:27 KJV The slothful man roasteth not that which he took in hunting: but the substance of a diligent man is precious. Even in abundance, those who are slothful will not take advantage of the situation. So their own volition causes their own condition, and that is part of liberty too. Make ones own choices and live in ones own consequences? But do those types of ill-choices impact economy and Joe's Law for the whole? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, You are now asking questions that are vital in the effort to offer a competitive viewpoint on Legal Money Matters. Example: Why do limits need to be set? The concept of a defensive power stepping into the role of offering a defensive deal has to be understood in the context of an aggressive, fraudulent, attacker, in this case the form of the attack is The Federal Reserve/Federal Income Tax/Enforcement by Federal Criminals. Failing to have that context in view fails to acknowledge that specific LIMIT already LIMITING, and therefore the offer to offer a counter to that LIMIT is not acknowledged if it is not acknowledged. If the LIMIT Enforced by the False Federal Enforcers is acknowledged, then, it can be seen by the observer, the lady seeking a new Home Loan, or a new Construction Loan for Power Products, that there are two things in view as such: 1. Legal Crime Limit 2. No Legal Crime Limit OK, so that now, if you understand the above, is the question here: "Why do limits need to be set?" The quick answer is that there does not need to be a limit set, but in context there is NO LIMIT once the LIMIT (Legal Crime) is no longer enforced by those Legal Criminals, and therefore a time exists between the old Legal Crime Limit and whatever happens next, and what happens next will be a LIMIT of some accurate measure. You pay no interest? What is interest? If interest is a Free Market cost paid by Free Traders so as to cover the costs of offering accurate accounting services (Free Market Banking Services), then the highest quality (most accurate) and lowest cost (lowest costs paid by the bankers in providing and offering the service) provider is on the shelf, or on the Web Page, or on Main Street in any City, right next to the next best provider who offers lower quality and higher cost (LIMIT). So the question again: "Why do limits need to be set?" To bridge the gap between NOW (LEGAL CRIME LIMIT) and THEN (NO LEGAL CRIME LIMIT) there has to be communication between those who offer (The pretend salesman in the pretend Free Market Government Banking Transaction Play Acting) Free Market Government Banking Services and those who may be shopping for a Home Mortgage and possibly shopping for Home Improvements, and their LIMIT will be LIMITED by whatever the Market will Bear. How many choices of Free Market Government Banking Services exist now? None. Everything is denominated in Federal Reserve Notes, and that is not a random occurrence. "Why can't Joe's Law work as power is produced into oversupply thru bank profits?" What are "profits," and how are they measured, and what power is at work to increase or decrease those accurate measures of those profits as those profits flow form one person to another person? A Fraudulent Government Banking "Service" is "profitable" right now to the tune of "profits" amounting to a few people gaining as much Legal Purchasing Power as everyone else combined, and those few people merely write themselves a "private" check that is "good" as far as the Fraudulent Government is concerned, as good as gold. That is what does exist right now. The question is, and can be answered accurately, what is the alternative to what exists right now? "Why can't Joe's Law work as power is produced into oversupply thru bank profits?" Which bank? The legally enforced fraud bank or one, and only one, alternative bank? If there is only one alternative bank, then are those "profits" more or less compared to the legally enforced fraud bank as the legally enforced fraud bank, which is ONE, and only ONE, is replaced by ONE, and only ONE replacement? If there are two Banks "profiting," in a Free Market (meaning free from Legal Crime, and free from Non-Legal Crime) then which is "profiting" more than the other, and what are they doing with those "profits" compared to what the other bank is not doing with those "profits"? What are these "profits"? Are profits the costs of doing business paid for by the buyers, and if one competitive Bank is passing on much more costs to their buyers compared to the competitive bank (the Bank that does not pass on nearly as much costs to their customers) then which competitive bank tends to gain more currency compared to which bank tending toward going out of business due to lower quality and higher prices (costs to the customers)? "Can that profit be used to produce more power which would then make wealth cheaper?" If the buyer of banking services keeps that "profit" (which is either/or an actual increase in POWER or not), as "savings," or as "cheaper banking costs," then the buyer decided if the buyer will consume those "profits" having fun, or if the buyer will invest in making more power out of less power, or if the buyer will give away that "savings" as charity. If the Bank wins the competition for market share in competition with a competitive bank, and the Bank gains that advantage or "profit" from the customer, then the Bank decides what to do, or not do, with that power. 1. Is there actually more power produced? 2. If there is actually more power produced, then who produces it, and who is in POWER to control that new power? 3. Is the power consumed? 4. Is the power invested into the process of making more power out of less power? 5. Is the power given away charitably? 6. If the power is invested into the process of making more power out of less power, then who is credited with having made that decision, and who gains that currency once that POWER does exist because of that decision to invest? "Why does a limit have to be set on the bank's production of profit?" That is a question that returns back to the Play Acting done during the imaginary discussion between a potential buyer who may be shopping in a potential Free Market Government Banking Shopping Center where many possible Free Market Government Banking Service Providers are offering Banking Services of highest potential quality at lowest potential costs. The idea there, with that LIMIT, was to start somewhere, and start somewhere other than "offering" the same Un-free Government Monopoly Banking Power lack of quality (unless you are a criminal and therefore quality means the same thing as being better able to destroy people) and the same Un-free Government Monopoly Banking Power PRICE (which is potentially everything paid by the targets to the criminals). Pick an "interest rate" number out of a hat, please, and tell me why you think that number is an accurate representation of what a competitive bank, in a competitive market, could offer to competitive shoppers looking for high quality and low cost banking services? There will be a measure of quality and cost, so what is it? If there will be a measure of quality and cost, what is that measure? There is, now, a measure of Fraud, in fact. Look at the National Debt Clock to see how National Interest is working now, right now, currently, and know the difference between what is, and what can be. What can be? What that which can be: is, then what is it? What is the Free Market Government Banking Interest Rate moved, or forced, to be that rate, once the shoppers, a total collective will power of shoppers, constitute the force that forces Free Market Government Banking Services to the highest quality, and lowest cost, that is possible at that time? Pick a number, a guess, a starting point, and see if your guess is competitive. I pick 1%, and I can offer words, and mathematical calculation, and references, whereby my guess is not picked out of a hat, so much as my guess is an educated, or competitive, guess. I've told you about the Jellybean Jar Experiment? The Wisdom of Crowds Example As it happens, the possibilities of group intelligence, at least when it came to judging questions of fact, were demonstrated by a host of experiments conducted by American sociologists and psychologists between 1920 and the mid-1950s, the heyday of research into group dynamics. Genuine things are often counterfeited because the genuine thing is good for life, powerful for productivity, and therefore a threat to the Legal Criminals who find cause to counterfeit the genuine goodness. "Wouldn't the nature production of profit yield to cheaper wealth thus making interest rates lower?" I do not understand that question, and rather than guessing, I can ask for clarification. 1. Do you mean "natural production of profit," rather than "nature production of profit," and if so, then what IS this stuff that you call "profit," how is this stuff accurately measured in fact? 2. What do you mean by "cheaper wealth," because I can guess at this point and it appears to me that you are referring to the concepts in Joe's Law at this point, whereby the only problem I can see, at this point, is the problem of accurately identifying what is, exactly, this stuff called "profit," and then who is credited with the decision to create this stuff called "profit," and does "credit" mean the same thing as "power to decide what to do with" this "profit" stuff? If I or anyone could start my own bank, then wouldn't that competition become the natural limit set on bank profits (rather than a government ceiling)? Yes, and if you build a scale, then you can build a scale from worst to best as a function of Monopoly being worst and the exact opposite being best. National Debt Clock (and all that goes with it) is on the bad side of things. Everyone having the legal POWER to start and maintain their own Legal Bank (the experiments done by Josiah Warren prove that this competitive option is viable) is on the other end of the scale. To be even more precise with building this scale, consider a possible additional extreme reaching out past The Dollar Hegemony with false Federal Reserve Notes on the bad end of the scale. What would be the result of having one person, and only one person, as absolute Banking Dictator, whereby no one, anywhere, can breath air, or eat food, without having paid "interest" to this absolute dictator, a single person, for "credits" needed to buy some air, or some food? I make a habit of building these scales as a means of working out complex, dynamic, forces, into a illustrative form. If you are just beginning to get the idea of building scales, in this way, then you may find the process useful as you become more proficient at it, as it may turn out to be a productive use of the scarce power currently available to you. My question has to do with human nature. Even when power is made abundant for all, will all make the effort to access the abundance? Will some squander abundance and live in poverty instead? What happens when too many people squander abundance? To me the question you are asking is the same question I asked above your quote. What would be the result of having one person, and only one person, as absolute Banking Dictator, whereby no one, anywhere, can breath air, or eat food, without having paid "interest" to this absolute dictator, a single person, for "credits" needed to buy some air, or some food? It is the same answer. The single person in power would not be in power for long, unless the single person in power hired fellow members of the exclusive club. Those who threaten to compete with the single power in any way (any true form of competition) will be dealt with in a few possible ways: 1. The threat will be destroyed 2. The threat will be turned, paid as an employee, subsidized, incorporated, hired on, deputized, given an offer that can't be refused, etc. What is the definition of squandering? 1. Using scarce power to destroy all competition. 2. Using scarce power to increase the number of fellow Legal Criminals who use scare power to destroy all competition. Joe, there are people here who do not even bother to shower. In my experience, some people are poor and choose to be clean, while others are poor and choose squalor. Is it merely ignorance as to the benefits of being clean, or is there more to each individual story as may be found out if someone wanted to truly help those who are stuck in abject misery or squalor? I think there are many people in the middle of the scales that can accurately measure the conditions of mankind. On the extremes are powerless people, having nothing, starving to death, for lack of something, and those with power in abundance who use that power for good (make power abundant for everyone), and those with power in abundance who use that power to keep the power they have, which is the power that takes from everyone, causing power to flow from everyone, flowing to only them, flowing only to them in their exclusive club. It is not that hard to map out with factual data. A unit of power, such as a seed, can be planted, cultivated, nurtured, and then there are many seeds. A solar panel works out the same way. It is not hard to see, once you can see it, or I may be deluding myself. So their own volition causes their own condition, and that is part of liberty too. Make ones own choices and live in ones own consequences? But do those types of ill-choices impact economy and Joe's Law for the whole? Someone who is hurting only themselves, as may be proven even to themselves, all in agreement, yes, yes, yes, without controversy, person A is hurting themselves, and no one else, willfully, as another volunteer volunteering to be a criminal, is something worthy of discussion. I agree. Much hurt, of oneself, can be seen as an injury to anyone who may love that one who is hurting oneself, too. Food for thought? Power to make more power out of less power? That is not the same subject, in my mind, as that subject is nearly opposite the subject of those who are currently, willfully, working very effectively, at destroying mankind, right now, and all those who produce anything worth stealing are financing that destruction through the use of Federal Reserve Notes (or whichever new issue of Legal Monopoly World Reserve Currency may replace that one). Helping people, actually helping people, requires that the people being helped agree that they are being helped, by some measure, or the supposed help, from the viewpoint of the target of supposed help, will fight in resistance to help that is seen as counterfeit help to that person. That is a subject worth discussing too, and I happen to have a real world example of such a human condition going on right now in my wife's relationship to her brother (I should not speak anymore on that specific process). |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I had an idea working earlier today concerning the concept of accountability. I can jot down the basics of that idea right now, and then move to the Edit work. The idea was such that each individual holds each individual to account for one's self, ones own actions, during their time alive. Perhaps I am doomed to remain in that place between life and heaven, whatever that name is that I can't remember right now. The idea was viewed as this me thing being aware of having left this present life I am currently living, and I am realizing my failures, and my successes, if there are any credited to me, by me, and in this idea, I think of God as being way too busy for me, so God trusts that I will take care of business, and like a Coach sending word through a messenger, I expect to get another chance to life again, to get back in the game, and hope that I can do better next time around. The basics of this idea is to realize that I am the one in power holding me to account while I am alive at this time, in this place. I am my power to do good or bad at this time, and it is realized that I hold me to account, in any case, since I will question any other person, any other human being, or any other number of human beings sharing similar viewpoints, concerning their judgment of me. I see no power, at this time, in me escaping this condition of me being in control of this power to judge, in any case, either internally or externally, there is no escape, I am either blessed or cursed with this power of conscience. I can start a new reply to get back to book work. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Cut and pasting from e-mail: I found one error. Not until page 50. Here: I got it, minus the bla, bla, bla, of course. But that was later, since the lie can't be exposed "publicly" despite my efforts to do so: To FORCE the liar to admit that the lair [liar] was lying, which he would not do. The other liar, the Human Resources liar, another well-paid liar, would not confess either – not in public, only in private. He had a lot of you can't have it, bla, bla, bla, too. The copy I am reading has page numbers in the Index miss-numbered beginning with Baby and Bathwater Again on page 33, where the Index lists page 34. I thought that I checked the page numbering yesterday and found it to be numbered right, but now it is not numbered right, so I'm wondering if I changed something; whichever is the case the .pdf version should be un-editable and at that point the final editing can be the final editing to be sent to the book publisher. I found some trouble in this: "I've told you the routine. It is not new. I found an example of the routine reported in that link on the U.S.S. Liberty. I found another example of the same routine in an old book titled The Lost State of Franklin where Legal Criminals solve the "Indian Problem" on the frontier with the same "Final Solution" used so often by Legal Criminals. In this example, the Legal Criminals hired very evil people to dress up as "Indians" to slaughter Settlers including babies, pregnant mothers, and toddlers – the more evil the better – and then blamed “the Indians,” spreading hatred into the Settlers so as to justify slaughtering “the Indians” who happen to be occupying that “Promised Land” (later to become Kentucky), which is rich land, good land, abundant land, but occupied by that "problem." Which is the same routine problem, over, and over, and over, and over again, where there are PEOPLE already on that "Promised Land" that Legal Criminals promise to themselves (for their own exploitation) USING their duped subjects that are subjected to the lies, threats, and violence of those same Legal Criminals doing the same old things that work time and again, over and over, and over again, and again, like a broken record or like a Business Psycho. " That is on page 58. There is mixing of past tense and current tense, if there is such a thing as current tense. "I've told you the routine. It is not new. I found an example of the routine reported in that link on the U.S.S. Liberty. I found another example of the same routine in an old book titled The Lost State of Franklin where Legal Criminals solve [solved] the [their] "Indian Problem" on the frontier with the same "Final Solution" used so often by Legal Criminals. In this example, the Legal Criminals hired very evil people to dress up as "Indians" to slaughter Settlers including babies, pregnant mothers, and toddlers – the more evil the better – and then blamed “the Indians,” spreading hatred into the Settlers so as to justify slaughtering “the Indians” who happen [happened] to be occupying that “Promised Land” (later to become Kentucky), which is [was] rich land, good land, abundant land, but occupied by that "problem." Which is the same routine problem, over, and over, and over, and over again, where there are PEOPLE already on that "Promised Land" that Legal Criminals promise to themselves (for their own exploitation) USING their duped subjects that are subjected to the lies, threats, and violence of those same Legal Criminals doing the same old things that work time and again, over and over, and over again, and again, like a broken record or like a Business Psycho. " or "I've told you the routine. It is not new. I found an example of the routine reported in that link on the U.S.S. Liberty. I found another example of the same routine in an old book titled The Lost State of Franklin where Legal Criminals solve the "Indian Problem" on the frontier with the same "Final Solution" used so often by Legal Criminals. In this example, the Legal Criminals hired [hire] very evil people to dress up as "Indians" to slaughter Settlers including babies, pregnant mothers, and toddlers – the more evil the better – and then blamed [blame] “the Indians,” spreading hatred into the Settlers so as to justify slaughtering “the Indians” who happen to be occupying that “Promised Land” (later to become Kentucky), which is rich land, good land, abundant land, but occupied by that "problem." Which is the same routine problem, over, and over, and over, and over again, where there are PEOPLE already on that "Promised Land" that Legal Criminals promise to themselves (for their own exploitation) USING their duped subjects that are subjected to the lies, threats, and violence of those same Legal Criminals doing the same old things that work time and again, over and over, and over again, and again, like a broken record or like a Business Psycho. " If you can figure out which is best, or create a better version, then please consider doing so. I have always struggled with mixing past, present, and future tense, as if my brain does not work well in the context of time. Page 65 The following is not correct: If you have not read one of my sales pitch illustrations, then you can read the one started in this thread between fictitious John (the customer) and Jane (the salesperson). The character John is the salesperson and Jane is the customer. Actually Jane is changed to Jean. I don't know if this inaccuracy is problematic and therefore in need of editing, so your help in deciding what to do, or not do, is requested. Page 69 "The reason Christians and Jews do things is to be because of a heart that loves God." Consider rewriting that sentence? I'm not sure about the cause of the difficulty in reading, but the message is understandable despite the difficulty in reading. Rewritten, by you, I am sure, will be, less difficulty in my reading the message, because you have a unique way with words; a talent...because.... Page 114 Counterpoint Joe The Sound of Silence can be deafening when considering all that is unsaid after “but”… The speaker says "but..." whereby the dots after but constitute silence, that which is unsaid, as if the speaker is leaving open the idea that "we know," like "an inside joke" and I can explain in detail concerning the example I have in mind. I was in my home town, on the National Congressional Ballot, at a Candidates Forum, which was recorded for Radio Broadcast on the Local Radio Station. After the show a person finds me, shakes my hand, and says that he agrees with what I had to say and then, like a dirty deal, he looks at me and says "But..." I got the feeling, and it stays with me, that we were supposed to wink at each other at that moment. Along the lines of the unspeakable dots being something along the lines of "if you cannot beat them, then we must join them," or "lo, I walk through the valley of death, and I fear no evil, for I am the most evil in that valley," or "you know, nudge, nudge, wink, wink, might does, after all, make right". So... Does the dots belong before or after the quote? Counterpoint Joe The Sound of Silence can be deafening when considering all that is unsaid after “but...”... At that time my thinking was much the same as today, wanting to find the worst of these criminals and then hold a Trial by Jury of whatever constitution could work to hold those people to accurate account at least. Not to hang people (might) but to know better, at least. So I was willing at that moment after "But..." to fill in the silence, but I was keen on listening, not dictating, to those who may volunteer to join the arduous struggle for liberty, in this animated contest of freedom, but..., there was only silence after but... I see now that the explanation was reported in the text following the point/counterpoint section. Page 125 Joe’s Law and Joe’s Slaw both take time to understand. One is hot and spicy with radishes, or so I hear…the other provides a key to abundance. The recipe for Joe’s Law is shared below. If you want the recipe for Joe’s Slaw, you will have to ask Joe. Joe’s Law is used here to prove the point that the American public needs to create and begin using competitive forms of currency. The addition of the recipe negates the need to ask me? Page 129 Instead of hearings, and even instead of court cases, the former victims would be inventing, producing, and employing forms of competitive purchasing power rather than being forced by effective deceit, and instead of being forced by effective threats of violence, and instead of being forced by effective violence targeting the competitors and forcing them to use of the one Counterfeit Money Produced by The FED. There in "forcing them to use of the one" is in need of taking out "of"? Page 129 ---------- I have been struggling with this part of my book, and your help is appreciated, and requested again because I have been struggling at these ideas, even now. Counterfeit power does not actually produce power, but consumes power. So The FED is actually consuming power, not producing it. With each lie – which is each unit of counterfeit money – and with each purchase that they alone make when they make money for nothing, and then when they spend the money they make for nothing but lying that is consumption. When they “loan” money that is a purchase, as they actually purchase a borrower. That is called fraud. I think a comma or something is needed to pause the idea at this point: and then when they spend the money they make for nothing but lying, that is consumption. Does it read any better? Page 145/146 ""A number of characters, of the greatest eminence in this country..." Missing in this quote is the author as such: Mr. Patrick Henry, June 9, 1788 That is one time through, and the list is much smaller. I think that there is a whole lot of work done to produce such a small book, and I think also that much of that work is "something for nothing" because bear did most of the work, and there is yet more work to be done. I did not go to the office today to work on finance files, but I did go to the office to reset the network files that were wiped out by the lightning storm. While I spent much of the day at home with the book work, it was truly satisfying to think of myself as a co-producer of a book. So, I say to myself, this is what book makers do for a living? If no one tried to write a book, there would be none. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, just want you to know I have read your comment regarding accountability and I am also cognizant of the editing notes on the last page of this string. They look like good finds. Incorporating those changes will be my first priority as time allows. The bookwork has been enjoyable and I am glad that you find it rewarding as well. I think personal reward is something that money cannot buy, or in other words, I think it is priceless. It is my privilege to assist you with Joe Quotes. A small gift for Joe after all of his generous gifts in the form of lessons in liberty. But Joe, today I looked at the DP. I found an anti-Zionism post and a pro Russia post. Those concepts bother me because they are opposite of what I have always thought.So Israel is bad and Russia is good? Really? If Israel is bad, Russia is bad as well. And I realize I am speaking of countries as if they do things. I realize it is people that do things and people that create policies and it is people that maneuver and guide events. I am not ready to give the Criminals in Russia any more credit than the Criminals in Israel. And seeing those posts almost makes me want to say you know what, "I think Israel is good and Russia is bad," because the opposite is being posted. How convenient for who knows who to be separating the US and Israel as allies. You see, I still have old patterns of thinking. OK, I didn't plan on discussing. But who else am I going to tell? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I saw those posts and I did not read them. If a person is running away from the torturers, where can a person find sanctuary? If a person running away from the torturers is finding sanctuary only in Russia, then that is a fact worth knowing. I am not in the loop on the accurate facts as to where I can run to when the torturers are looking for me to work on. If I wanted to run to Russia, to get away form the torturers, I'd be hard pressed to find the funds required to pay for the trip. I think that the facts are such that there is no place for me to run, and no place for me to hide, if the torturers (Legal Criminals running U.S.A. Inc.) want to torture me. How about this angle: When Solzhenitsyn escaped the torturers in Russia he fled to The West. That was when the regime in Russia was the Bolsheviks who were financed by Wall Street (Bankers/Legal Criminals), and so long as it was fashionable to discredit The East, Solzhenitsyn was allowed to speak in The West. There was a regime change (the collapse of Soviet Russia so called) in Russia since. Now someone critical of The West (Snowden/Assange) flees to The East to escape the torturers and is allowed to speak critically of The West while in The East. Remember how the Conservatives Republicans became Red? Remember how The Federalists became the Anti-Federalists? Is all this merely human nature, accident, random, normal, as if some natural cyclic game of musical chairs is at work? I don't think so, this is, to me, all part of the build up, and execution, of war, big war, not just two people on two sides both set to torture and murder each other for fun and profit. |
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bear Guest
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Thank you for your Russia/Israel reply. I have so many words to say and not time at the current. I had a few minutes to work on editing and am almost most done. I should be able to send the pdf either tonight or tomorrow morning, if all goes as planned. I cannot believe I sent you a product that I said I was happy with when the contents table was wrong. I am sorry Joe. You did not do anything to the copy I sent. I failed to update the table after I changed bear font, and I didn't even have Joe's Slaw in the contents list. bad bear, bad, bad, bear. You are so patient. Thank you Joe for being nice about it. I will make notes about the changes/thought process when I have finished. And if you don't like anything you see, just tell me and I'll fix. This is crazy, but I was thinking about the book comments today as I walked thru the living room, and my youngest was squeaking a wooden spindle in a piano bench by rotating it and when I asked him to quit, I called him Joe. I don't think it will go over well if Joe is in the list of names that comes out of my mouth when I am addressing one of my men. Having the dog's name as a part of the list sometimes is bad enough. Anyways, it kind of scared me that i did that. Both of your names start with J though. That is probably why. The dog's name starts with P as in Putt, so I have no excuse when Putt is part of the list before I get to the right name. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, The wrong name can be bad I'm sure, but I know of another lady who had this problem, and that lady was called Nanny. Nanny would go through the whole list as such: Bobby, Jackie, Joey, Danny, Peter, all very fast, and kind of stuttering, whenever one of us was underfoot in some way. Like: "Up, pup, pup, Bobby, ah, Jackie, ah, Joey, ah, ah, Danny, up, pu, pup, pu, Peter, oh, oh, stop it, now." That was 50 yeas ago. My sister was the oldest, we were all born about 1 year apart from each other, except for the last one, Pete, who came along 3 years after Danny. Nanny watched us often while Mom tried desperately to find her mind. The fine art of editing is what it is, and patience appears to help. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I have copied your list here and have added words in red that have to do with each correction: Cut and pasting from e-mail: I found one error. Not until page 50. Here: I got it, minus the bla, bla, bla, of course. But that was later, since the lie can't be exposed "publicly" despite my efforts to do so: To FORCE the liar to admit that the lair [liar] was lying, which he would not do. The other liar, the Human Resources liar, another well-paid liar, would not confess either – not in public, only in private. He had a lot of you can't have it, bla, bla, bla, too. Replaced lair with liar: I got it, minus the bla, bla, bla, of course. But that was later, since the lie can't be exposed "publicly" despite my efforts to do so: To FORCE the liar to admit that the liar was lying, which he would not do. The other liar, the Human Resources liar, another well-paid liar, would not confess either – not in public, only in private. He had a lot of you can't have it, bla, bla, bla, too. The copy I am reading has page numbers in the Index miss-numbered beginning with Baby and Bathwater Again on page 33, where the Index lists page 34. I thought that I checked the page numbering yesterday and found it to be numbered right, but now it is not numbered right, so I'm wondering if I changed something; whichever is the case the .pdf version should be un-editable and at that point the final editing can be the final editing to be sent to the book publisher. _________________________________________________________________________ Fixed Table of Contents Page Number and added Joe's Slaw. _________________________________________________________________________ I found some trouble in this: "I've told you the routine. It is not new. I found an example of the routine reported in that link on the U.S.S. Liberty. I found another example of the same routine in an old book titled The Lost State of Franklin where Legal Criminals solve the "Indian Problem" on the frontier with the same "Final Solution" used so often by Legal Criminals. In this example, the Legal Criminals hired very evil people to dress up as "Indians" to slaughter Settlers including babies, pregnant mothers, and toddlers – the more evil the better – and then blamed “the Indians,” spreading hatred into the Settlers so as to justify slaughtering “the Indians” who happen to be occupying that “Promised Land” (later to become Kentucky), which is rich land, good land, abundant land, but occupied by that "problem." Which is the same routine problem, over, and over, and over, and over again, where there are PEOPLE already on that "Promised Land" that Legal Criminals promise to themselves (for their own exploitation) USING their duped subjects that are subjected to the lies, threats, and violence of those same Legal Criminals doing the same old things that work time and again, over and over, and over again, and again, like a broken record or like a Business Psycho. " That is on page 58. There is mixing of past tense and current tense, if there is such a thing as current tense. "I've told you the routine. It is not new. I found an example of the routine reported in that link on the U.S.S. Liberty. I found another example of the same routine in an old book titled The Lost State of Franklin where Legal Criminals solve [solved] the [their] "Indian Problem" on the frontier with the same "Final Solution" used so often by Legal Criminals. In this example, the Legal Criminals hired very evil people to dress up as "Indians" to slaughter Settlers including babies, pregnant mothers, and toddlers – the more evil the better – and then blamed “the Indians,” spreading hatred into the Settlers so as to justify slaughtering “the Indians” who happen [happened] to be occupying that “Promised Land” (later to become Kentucky), which is [was] rich land, good land, abundant land, but occupied by that "problem." Which is the same routine problem, over, and over, and over, and over again, where there are PEOPLE already on that "Promised Land" that Legal Criminals promise to themselves (for their own exploitation) USING their duped subjects that are subjected to the lies, threats, and violence of those same Legal Criminals doing the same old things that work time and again, over and over, and over again, and again, like a broken record or like a Business Psycho. " or "I've told you the routine. It is not new. I found an example of the routine reported in that link on the U.S.S. Liberty. I found another example of the same routine in an old book titled The Lost State of Franklin where Legal Criminals solve the "Indian Problem" on the frontier with the same "Final Solution" used so often by Legal Criminals. In this example, the Legal Criminals hired [hire] very evil people to dress up as "Indians" to slaughter Settlers including babies, pregnant mothers, and toddlers – the more evil the better – and then blamed [blame] “the Indians,” spreading hatred into the Settlers so as to justify slaughtering “the Indians” who happen to be occupying that “Promised Land” (later to become Kentucky), which is rich land, good land, abundant land, but occupied by that "problem." Which is the same routine problem, over, and over, and over, and over again, where there are PEOPLE already on that "Promised Land" that Legal Criminals promise to themselves (for their own exploitation) USING their duped subjects that are subjected to the lies, threats, and violence of those same Legal Criminals doing the same old things that work time and again, over and over, and over again, and again, like a broken record or like a Business Psycho. " If you can figure out which is best, or create a better version, then please consider doing so. I have always struggled with mixing past, present, and future tense, as if my brain does not work well in the context of time. I chose the first version: I've told you the routine. It is not new. I found an example of the routine reported in that link on the U.S.S. Liberty. I found another example of the same routine in an old book titled The Lost State of Franklin where Legal Criminals solved their "Indian Problem" on the frontier with the same "Final Solution" used so often by Legal Criminals. In this example, the Legal Criminals hired very evil people to dress up as "Indians" to slaughter Settlers including babies, pregnant mothers, and toddlers – the more evil the better – and then blamed “the Indians,” spreading hatred into the Settlers so as to justify slaughtering “the Indians” who happened to be occupying that “Promised Land” (later to become Kentucky), which was rich land, good land, abundant land, but occupied by that "problem." Which is the same routine problem, over, and over, and over, and over again, where there are PEOPLE already on that "Promised Land" that Legal Criminals promise to themselves (for their own exploitation) USING their duped subjects that are subjected to the lies, threats, and violence of those same Legal Criminals doing the same old things that work time and again, over and over, and over again, and again, like a broken record or like a Business Psycho. Page 65 The following is not correct: If you have not read one of my sales pitch illustrations, then you can read the one started in this thread between fictitious John (the customer) and Jane (the salesperson). The character John is the salesperson and Jane is the customer. Actually Jane is changed to Jean. I don't know if this inaccuracy is problematic and therefore in need of editing, so your help in deciding what to do, or not do, is requested. Joe, I noticed that too when I was proofing, but my rationale was that those were the names and positions in the string. But I agree, it may be confusing to the reader of the book or it may appear that the author made an error in the book, so I have changed to completely remove the names. This option remains true to the DP string and the writing of the book. However, we could also add the names/positions corrected to reflect what they are in the book. This is my edit: If you have not read one of my sales pitch illustrations, then you can read the one started in this thread between a fictitious customer and salesperson. Page 69 "The reason Christians and Jews do things is to be because of a heart that loves God." Consider rewriting that sentence? I'm not sure about the cause of the difficulty in reading, but the message is understandable despite the difficulty in reading. Rewritten, by you, I am sure, will be, less difficulty in my reading the message, because you have a unique way with words; a talent...because.... Does this sound any better? Or is it still clunky. It it is, can you help me make it sound better? "The reason Christians and Jews are to do things is to be from a heart that loves God and people." Page 114 Counterpoint Joe The Sound of Silence can be deafening when considering all that is unsaid after “but”… The speaker says "but..." whereby the dots after but constitute silence, that which is unsaid, as if the speaker is leaving open the idea that "we know," like "an inside joke" and I can explain in detail concerning the example I have in mind. I was in my home town, on the National Congressional Ballot, at a Candidates Forum, which was recorded for Radio Broadcast on the Local Radio Station. After the show a person finds me, shakes my hand, and says that he agrees with what I had to say and then, like a dirty deal, he looks at me and says "But..." I got the feeling, and it stays with me, that we were supposed to wink at each other at that moment. Along the lines of the unspeakable dots being something along the lines of "if you cannot beat them, then we must join them," or "lo, I walk through the valley of death, and I fear no evil, for I am the most evil in that valley," or "you know, nudge, nudge, wink, wink, might does, after all, make right". So... Does the dots belong before or after the quote? Counterpoint Joe The Sound of Silence can be deafening when considering all that is unsaid after “but...”... At that time my thinking was much the same as today, wanting to find the worst of these criminals and then hold a Trial by Jury of whatever constitution could work to hold those people to accurate account at least. Not to hang people (might) but to know better, at least. So I was willing at that moment after "But..." to fill in the silence, but I was keen on listening, not dictating, to those who may volunteer to join the arduous struggle for liberty, in this animated contest of freedom, but..., there was only silence after but... I see now that the explanation was reported in the text following the point/counterpoint section. What do you think about this: Counterpoint Joe The Sound of Silence can be deafening when considering all that is unsaid after but – I also changed wording on page 115: I heard: “I agree with what you are saying, but” – silence ensued – Page 125 Joe’s Law and Joe’s Slaw both take time to understand. One is hot and spicy with radishes, or so I hear…the other provides a key to abundance. The recipe for Joe’s Law is shared below. If you want the recipe for Joe’s Slaw, you will have to ask Joe. Joe’s Law is used here to prove the point that the American public needs to create and begin using competitive forms of currency. The addition of the recipe negates the need to ask me? I liked the words I had written, that is why I didn't change them even though I had noticed them not being necessary. But I agree, it is no longer necessary to ask you and should be changed. Do you like this? Point bear Joe’s Law and Joe’s Slaw both take time to understand. One is hot and spicy with radishes, or so I hear…the other provides a key to abundance. The recipe for Joe’s Law is shared below. If you want the recipe for Joe’s Slaw, you will have look on page 151. Joe’s Law is used below to prove the point that the American public needs to create and begin using competitive forms of currency. Page 129 Instead of hearings, and even instead of court cases, the former victims would be inventing, producing, and employing forms of competitive purchasing power rather than being forced by effective deceit, and instead of being forced by effective threats of violence, and instead of being forced by effective violence targeting the competitors and forcing them to use of the one Counterfeit Money Produced by The FED. There in "forcing them to use of the one" is in need of taking out "of"? Yes, "of" should not have been there: Instead of hearings, and even instead of court cases, the former victims would be inventing, producing, and employing forms of competitive purchasing power rather than being forced by effective deceit, and instead of being forced by effective threats of violence, and instead of being forced by effective violence targeting the competitors and forcing them to use the one Counterfeit Money Produced by The FED. Page 129 ---------- I have been struggling with this part of my book, and your help is appreciated, and requested again because I have been struggling at these ideas, even now. Counterfeit power does not actually produce power, but consumes power. So The FED is actually consuming power, not producing it. With each lie – which is each unit of counterfeit money – and with each purchase that they alone make when they make money for nothing, and then when they spend the money they make for nothing but lying that is consumption. When they “loan” money that is a purchase, as they actually purchase a borrower. That is called fraud. I think a comma or something is needed to pause the idea at this point: and then when they spend the money they make for nothing but lying, that is consumption. Does it read any better? Joe, what do you think about this (I think if I had read the edit a 3rd time this paragraph would have been changed as follows. I cannot say that I would have caught the other changes that you caught.): Counterfeit power does not actually produce power, but consumes power. So The FED is actually consuming power – not producing it…with each lie, which is each unit of counterfeit money…with each purchase, which they alone make when they make money for nothing…and then each time they spend the money they make for nothing but lying, that is consumption…and when they “loan” money, it is a purchase as they actually purchase a borrower – that is called fraud. Page 145/146 ""A number of characters, of the greatest eminence in this country..." Missing in this quote is the author as such: Mr. Patrick Henry, June 9, 1788 I added the author without the "Mr." because we did not use Mr. for Henry Ford, Samuel Adams or Thomas Paine: with, yet I acknowledge that paper money would be the bane of this country. I detest it. Nothing can justify a people in resorting to it but extreme necessity. It is at rest, however, in this commonwealth. It is no longer solicited or advocated."53 —Patrick Henry, June 9, 1788 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- That is one time through, and the list is much smaller. Joe, you have very good eyes! I am embarrassed that I did not catch some of those things. Four eyes are better than 2 I think that there is a whole lot of work done to produce such a small book, and I think also that much of that work is "something for nothing" because bear did most of the work, and there is yet more work to be done. Joe, it has been a pleasure to assist you in this effort. There would have been no work for bear to do if Joe had not been so diligent in teaching bear about Liberty and Political Economy. It is funny to me to look back at last year and consider some of the things in the great abyss of words between Joe and bear. I smile now at them. Some of the funniest things were bear misunderstandings. Sometimes I got really mad at you for telling me I was seeing red. Sometimes I was afraid of you because I couldn't understand how blue could change to red, and when you would hand me the videos of those Socialist Workers Party women speaking, or whatever the group was they were with. I did not go to the office today to work on finance files, but I did go to the office to reset the network files that were wiped out by the lightning storm. While I spent much of the day at home with the book work, it was truly satisfying to think of myself as a co-producer of a book. It sounds to me like you had quite a storm there. I am glad you were able to have time to do book work. I am glad it has given you a feeling of satisfaction. So, I say to myself, this is what book makers do for a living? Isn't that what you have been doing for over a decade now? In the form of dumping information packets that travel worldwide If no one tried to write a book, there would be none. And you have, and now there is almost one more! I think I like to write in red after your words in black. It is fast and easy...of course this is all trivia Are you ready for the pdf or would you like me to make additional changes? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, "The reason Christians and Jews are to do things is to be from a heart that loves God and people." That sentence conveys much more to me, and it does so with an inventive or creative employment of words, in my opinion. The use of "are to do" explains the nature of the connection between the subject of authority and the authoritative power. "The reason Christians and Jews do things is to be because of a heart that loves God." That version may have been sending the same message, I didn't get it, if so. If there is yet more in the intended message, ideas or beliefs, a viewpoint, not yet conveyed, then I can't know how better to write the sentence, since I don't know what the intended message is, exactly, but I can guess. Example: "be from" My guess is such that the viewpoint considers the options of being from a good place or a bad place, and here again are the concepts of creation: where are we from? I like the sentence much better because it manages to inspire me to consider many things, whereby the other sentence was too ambiguous for me to even begin to guess the intended meaning. In fact, the more I think about that sentence, the more I like it, but then again that may merely be my imagination at work. The Sound of Silence can be deafening when considering all that is unsaid after but – I also changed wording on page 115: I heard: “I agree with what you are saying, but” – silence ensued – That is an example of being much more precise, leaving less room for any creative interpretation, so in that case it is much better for me, since the intended viewpoint is more likely to be conveyed with your welcome improvements. Joe’s Law and Joe’s Slaw both take time to understand. One is hot and spicy with radishes, or so I hear…the other provides a key to abundance. The recipe for Joe’s Law is shared below. If you want the recipe for Joe’s Slaw, you will have look on page 151. Joe’s Law is used below to prove the point that the American public needs to create and begin using competitive forms of currency. That fixes that up well. Counterfeit power does not actually produce power, but consumes power. So The FED is actually consuming power – not producing it…with each lie, which is each unit of counterfeit money…with each purchase, which they alone make when they make money for nothing…and then each time they spend the money they make for nothing but lying, that is consumption…and when they “loan” money, it is a purchase as they actually purchase a borrower – that is called fraud. That is in my opinion very good, it is a really tough idea, with much too many angles of view all focused into too small of a space, and you have managed to convey the meaning as if the reader is the thinker: along those lines. Thanks Four eyes are better than 2 Thanks, that is the message intended with the book, no? I can convey two things at this point. 1. My brother Jack, lost his wife, she died in her sleep, complications with dental surgery, or other things, and he has always been one of a kind, a loner type, but he is not, obviously, needing a competitive viewpoint to help him deal with new realities. 2. A local mom (mother of my daughters past friend: they grew apart after going to different schools) is missing, and 12 Sheriffs descend upon the 2 kids at the home of the missing mother, to steal all the communication information being used by the father to find the mother. The "law" (probably a prosecutor looking to make money on a conviction of the father) sent 1 Sheriff to "help" the father when the father reported the mother missing on the day that the mother went missing. 12 Sheriffs to steal things from 2 kids. 1 Sheriff to deliver the message that the "law" is in place to commit crimes for profit. So, I do nothing, but my wife goes to see if she can offer a spare computer to the father who had all his stuff stolen, while he was at work, by the 12 Sheriffs. The father, in this case, found a spare computer already, one that the 12 Sheriffs failed to find, despite there being 12 of them ransacking the house. So...we all have our special talents, and for most of us those talents are too well hidden, and therefore having help finding those talents may actually help. Perhaps, a long shot in my view, but perhaps the "Law" in the case of the missing mother, can find her where the father is so far unable to do so. There is hope. Are you ready for the pdf or would you like me to make additional changes? The book looks done, so send a .pdf, please, and I e-mailed the publisher yesterday to reopen the order if it was closed, but there is no response as of this moment. There are many competitive publishers if this one is no longer connectable. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, the Web Index page at the end of the book has been "haunting" me as I failed to go thru during my last 2 proofings as I considered it "done." So, this morning I started the daunting task of matching each of the foot note numbers with a number in the index. It all looked good until I started the search and find for 61. I had entered two 60's in the book instead of a 60 and a 61. Imagine that, the very last one I searched on was wrong. So now the book has a 61 instead of a 60 after your Liberty Day Challenge in the Afterword. I would have been sick if that had been found after the printing after I had consciously decided I "had already" proofed that once. Another thing that I am going to mention is that we give Thomas Paine multiple references in the Web Index page; however, we do not give references for Henry Ford's words, while we do give reference for George Bush's words. I think we talked about this a little early on and you were OK with it (as in giving the reader something to do if they want to find the links on the internet), but I want to ask you to be sure you are still good with the web index as is. I could contain more references. It would take a little work and a little renumbering, probably another complete re-read to find the things that should be referenced and then incorporating the references. In my mind, the only thing this effort would add to the book would be to make the book more "academically" accurate (as if I know anything about academic accuracy). I am good with whatever you want to do. I am bringing it up now because it would bother me if I didn't make sure you were satisfied. I will go ahead and send the pdf, but if you decide you want any more changes, just say so. I remember you telling me about your daughter's friend's mother. That is absolutely horrible. A nightmare. To have your mother and wife missing and to have 12 badges show up and ransack ones home. I am sorry for your brother as well. That is a very sad and unexpected way to loose a loved one. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Sad news can be overwhelming, learning from those who manage under such weight is a powerful advantage. The book Index could be expanded, and so can many other avenues, so the last well found obvious error on the Index number 61, to me, sounds like the signal to step away and consider the attempt at artwork done. I think there is much more to learn with the next step, and I am almost certain that we can still find, after printing, a few more obvious errors. The idea is to have a limited first printing, as a learning experience, a marketing tool, an editorial device, an experiment, a realization, on and on. With a printed version in hand the idea, as far as I am concerned at this point, is to look ahead toward the digital form of the same book, so any errors found in the first printing can be fixed before the book goes to the digital, open, World Wide, market place. The printer company selected, so far, may not be the right one for moving onto the digital market. More things to learn? Marketable skills? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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I see the book in e-mail at this time. Still no word back from the printer. I can send another note later in the day, to the same printer, give them some time, and then move on if they don't respond. |
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bear Guest
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OK, Joe, that sounds very good on the Index. I am satisfied knowing that you are satisfied. Yes, power is gained when one see how others bear up under a load and then make it. That idea brings 2 scripture passages to my memory: we are o 2 Corinthians 1:3 Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies, and the God of all comfort; 4 Who comforteth us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort them which are in any trouble, by the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God. (We are to comfort others as we have been comforted. Your wife is a very practical comforter as she offers a computer. That act of kindness reminds me of my sister who knows just what to do when I am in need without me even asking. Sometimes I think she is an angel.) and this passage: Galatians 1:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ. Burdens are easier when someone comes along side. Of course we still bear the brunt of it, but the load is lighter knowing someone else cares, and there are also those who are gifted in offering practical help. OK we are off to piano lessons. My oldest is also considering the trombone as his band instrument, or he may expand his piano talent. "Time will tell." A short phrase offered to bear by Joe in the vast abyss. You should have the files in your mail. I saw some things on the DP last week about people writing books and recommending certain services. Did you see any of that information? I have been so busy I have not been able to communicate well to you. I was also feeling abit bad about taking so long to edit and seeing another person already offering (on a DP post) their book as a free download. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I did not see the information on the book publishing, when you have the time can you link the page? |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, here is the link. http://www.dailypaul.com/283229/dp-special-my-book-stick-it-to-the-man-is-free-today?bt=1#main%20a[href*=%27B00CAQNHDE%27] It was started back in April which I didn't notice till today. The graphic was over at the side where the book selections are and I clicked on it because I was seeing red. You know the clenched fist raised in the air at the man is a Communist thing. I was going to ask you about it, but I did not want to bother you with my red eyes. Anyways, if you go down in the string abit you will see a discussion with the author started here: Just "bought" mine Submitted by MarcMadness on Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:25. Permalink for free! Interested in how the Kindle Select giveaway works for you, I have a book of my own I'm working on to put out in the next few months. There is some talk about "Create Space" in the discussion as well as some talk about: http://www.newselfpublishing.com You may have seen this stuff back in April. Sorry was telling you it was from last week. I guess the DP Book Talk at the right side of the screen before Users on Line has a way of resurrecting posts. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I'll check that out, still no word back from Bookmasters. I am reading through the pdf file, and it looks better as a pdf, less of the odd changes in spaces between words. I have a lunch date, and some chores, so the last effort to reconnect to Bookmasters via e-mail (one more e-mail) can be pushed to tomorrow, and then the next day I will go another route. The raised fist book may be worth checking out, I don't know if I will do so at this time. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, the table of contents page looks bad to me in the pdf. Do you see how the numbers are not right justified. I thought I had them all looking even in the word file. Do you know how to draw dots instead of using periods to make them? (Like drawing lines, but instead it would be dots?) I wonder if that would be a solution to fix that right margin. I didn't read the pdf. Joe is smart |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, If you can fix the .pdf Index page then please do, and on that note I have found 2 more problems that may be a result of opening and closing the editable word file. 1. Page 91 Money Monopoly Fraud business, what if all that POWER was exclusively spent on making Solar Panels? ow much would electricity cost per Kilowatt/Hour now? Somehow the letter "H" is missing before "ow". <---------- and I put the period after the quotation mark right here.---------------------^ 2. Page 125 Joe’s Slaw, you will have look on page 151. <------- the word "to" is missing between "have" and "look". I did not go back to see if the same things were missing since the last time I read through the final versions. It is now lunch date time, so I am not done with this latest reading. No response yet from Bookmasters. |
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bear Guest
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OK Joe, I will fix those things. I will try to figure out about the dots. I am sorry bookmasters is not responding. I have just sent Jeff some emails without attachments that I promised in the emails, and the one with the attachment had an error in it. You may not be able to trust my work today. Or any day now that I think of the 2 errors that you just told me about. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, the H isn't missing in my copy on page 91 of the word file. My copy looks like this: How much would electricity cost if every bomb, missile, military base overseas, solider, food, clothing, supplies shipped overseas, was turned back in time…all the way back to the decision to invade Pennsylvania by Washington in 1794…and instead of that investment in maintaining the Money Monopoly Fraud business, what if all that POWER was exclusively spent on making Solar Panels? How much would electricity cost per Kilowatt/Hour now? Am I not seeing the right thing? Oh, now I am going crazy. The word copy is fine, but when I cut and paste that text here on your forum the H is missing and I just opened the pdf and it is missing in the pdf. Is it missing in your copy of the word file that I sent with the pdf? Hmm. Maybe something is with that H. I'll mess with the doc and see if I can get it to quit disappearing. I fixed the "to" on page 125. Thank you for fixing missing bear words. I'll mess with the dots later. I have to get dinner now. |
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bear Guest
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I rewrote the word How and it pastes correctly now. I'll How much would electricity cost if every bomb, missile, military base overseas, solider, food, clothing, supplies shipped overseas, was turned back in time…all the way back to the decision to invade Pennsylvania by Washington in 1794…and instead of that investment in maintaining the Money Monopoly Fraud business, what if all that POWER was exclusively spent on making Solar Panels? How much would electricity cost per Kilowatt/Hour now? I made a new pdf and it converted as follows: How much would electricity cost if every bomb, missile, military base overseas, solider, food, clothing, supplies shipped overseas, was turned back in time…all the way back to the decision to invade Pennsylvania by Washington in 1794…and instead of that investment in maintaining the Money Monopoly Fraud business, what if all that POWER was exclusively spent on making Solar Panels? How much would electricity cost per Kilowatt/Hour now? ----------- So, it appears that that problem is fixed. However, that causes me concern that a letter in the book did not copy and paste nor did it convert to pdf. The letter was NOT missing the word file. I think a good look at the pdf like you are doing is in order. Perhaps it is good that Bookmasters hasn't responded yet? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, It seems to me that the better printers would be the ones that have some form of help in making sure that the print is free from errors. As part of the learning process that level of help may be discovered. Lunch was fajitas and my wife said that the father of the missing wife has "lawyered up" with the help from step dad and mom. It was also understood, through a mutual friend, that the so called "police" are not there to "protect and serve" as a rule (more so the exception). My understanding is such that the Union Lawyers are also there for nefarious reasons and those who do help are the exceptions. |
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bear Guest
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I can remember a time when a guy without insurance pulled across lanes of traffic without seeing me and I had no choice but to broadside him. I remember how angry I felt when the police officer began questioning me. I can't imagine how the family with the missing mother feels. I was listening to stuff about communist subversion activities in the US a couple of weeks ago. One of the things that stuck out to me was the information regarding the National Lawyers Guild. I can't remember what was said though. The reason I remember noting the information was because of your interest in law, otherwise it might have gone in one ear and out the other without me hearing. Anyways I did a search on the topic and found this: http://www.conservapedia.com/National_Lawyers_Guild or how about this report from 1959:http://www.archive.org/stream/communistlegalsu1959unit/communistlegalsu1959unit_djvu.txt Mr. Yerkes became a regular attendant at such sessions, which he found were actually Marxist discussions aimed at the gradual indoctrination of non-Communist lawyers with Commu- nist views.Joe, I think that part of the way the Criminals use the Communist tool in a country is to corrupt the power centers so much that nothing works anymore for the people, and so the people get really dissatisfied and jump on the revolution band wagon and the country is then more easily conquered. The president has Weather Underground connections. Why is someone who had communist connections the president of the United States? Why did blue change to red? I think we are well underway. I think I remember hearing something on one of those videos with one of the USSR guys saying their goal was that the people of America would want them to be in power. Didn't the Republican Party become infiltrated by Democrats around the Reagan years? No wonder Red is Blue and Blue is Red. It is all Red and it is Criminal Red. The Criminal Socialists took over and Criminal Socialism does not work and when those Social programs can no longer sustain the people who depend on them those people become dissatisfied as well. Criminal Communists took over Afghanistan. They killed their own people. I listened to stuff. It was like a soap opera. Russia told the Afghan Communist Dictator to ease up on the people and when he got back to Afghanisan (from Russia) the guy that was killing everyone killed him. Then the Russian Communists killed that guy and installed their own guy. Sometime during all of that they were rounding up women and children and lighting them on fire because those women and children were torturing the communist wounded soldiers with knives. I wonder why women and children would torture the wounded communist soldiers with knives? And now the US is over there killing people. Are "we" the communists now, or are "we" spreading democracy? Who are we killing over there? I think that the evil owners of this world use the good cop/bad cop routine to divide and conquer. I think we used to be the good cop. I think we do not recognize that we are the bad cop, or maybe some bad cops have taken us over. I use we and us loosely. I have a day with the Amish tomorrow. I haven't been able to figure out how to fix the dots yet. I wonder if the dots are even necessary? We are trying to purchase an owner finance house because there are no comps and the retail lender rejected the appraisal report even though "we" have already been "approved." The contract looks like it is all in the sellers favor. If one reads between the lines, we could have a year left to pay be in breech of contract for various reasons and the contract would then be void and we would be left with nothing. A lawyer drew up the contract. My understanding is such that the Union Lawyers are also there for nefarious reasons and those who do help are the exceptions. I wonder how one can get hold of one of the exceptions so that the contract is equitable for both parties and no one is left feeling exposed. I have thought of Jesus's words lately: Matthew 5:37 KJV But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil. I wonder if everyone in the whole world had followed that admonition if there would be any need for lawyers. Maybe the communists wouldn't have infiltrated the law in the 30's and the government (I refrained from using "our") would not be full of them. I almost think we were supposed to be afraid of the communists taking over our country to hide the fact that they had already taken over. No wonder we sided with them in WWII. We were them and didn't even know it. And we have been on the divide and conquer road ever since. We think it is because both sides of the war is funded? Maybe it is because both sides of the war is fought by the same people and makes for easier conquest. I think this is one of the things Joe would have to think about. My head is starting to hurt trying to sort it all out. |
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bear Guest
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More: http://www.archive.org/stream/communistlegalsu1959unit/communistlegalsu1959unit_djvu.txt Mr. Andersen has been prominent in Communist-controlled organi- I wonder if Japan and US had to be on opposing sides of WWII for the reason that both countries needed to be subverted thru the communist lawyers guild? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear,Joe, I think that part of the way the Criminals use the Communist tool in a country is to corrupt the power centers so much that nothing works anymore for the people, and so the people get really dissatisfied and jump on the revolution band wagon and the country is then more easily conquered. I am finding so much information that connects so many dots in the work done by Frank, where it is difficult for me to speak to you without having some reference to that information, but in this case I think I have one up on Frank too. You are reading information that employs the word communist as if there is significance to that word, and even a group (list of names) who are communists, and to me that is a false or miss identification of the correct list of names, and a false or miss identification of the correct name used by those criminals. All of those inventions invented by the communists to create this communism stuff is stuff used by legal criminals well before any criminal began hiding his (or her) crimes behind that communist label. You are beginning to see the concept of a Monopoly of Legal Power controlled by a small, exclusive, number of members of that Monopoly of Legal Power. Here is where the root of criminality can be followed back to the source of it, in any case, because the source of power is always criminal when these criminals gain their power by employing fraud, threats, and violence upon their innocent targets. Here is where it is a good idea to step back and realize that it is not a Monopoly of Power that is the problem, in fact a Monopoly of Power can be a very good thing, and the only reason why criminals get away with their crimes, is the reason that there is a good version of what they must counterfeit, so as to have a good looking false front to hide their crimes behind. So there is a Monopoly of Power in true authority, whereby true authority is that which works effectively at preserving life, making life better in time, making life cost less in time, and extending the time span of life longer as a relative comparison to life being controlled by false authority (crime). This is why I do not have any trouble seeing the wisdom of Scripture as it describes a single, and therefore a monopoly, of true authority. I reserve my power to understand that ONE dictate by the true authority does not apply to every situation everywhere at once, so that understanding identifies the power of competition, as I mean the word competition to mean this very thing, whereby true authority is what is it, in any given situation, because it proves to be the best way to preserve life, make life better, cost less, and perpetuate, in any given situation, at any time. To suggest that one person, one human being, has this power of true authority, this monopoly power of having the most competitive ways to do things, as Communists, Fascists, Republicans, Democrats, Federalists, Mormons, Catholics, Christians, or Bureaucrats, are apt to claim, is in my opinion confessions of the opposite, as they do not offer their competitive "advice," as would be the case in a voluntary association, they enforce their will, involuntarily, upon their targeted, and often innocent, victims. The Union of "Private" Lawyers in any age, any place, on Earth while human beings have been here, are just copies of earlier organized crime cabals, using the same routine tactic of constructing a false front that covers up their real intentions, and their real actions. Communists are sub-sets of people who are employed as lower level criminals following the orders (without question) of their employers who don't have this communist brand name on their "Private" stationary. Why is someone who had communist connections the president of the United States? If you fall back into the mind-set whereby there is this Federal Government Entity working to Serve and Protect, then you are falling deep into an abyss of falsehood. Here is where I think am one up on Frank. I think that the words written by Frank suggest that Frank thinks that The Constitution of the United States was a expression of Liberty such as can be compared to The Declaration of Independence and The Bill of Rights, but no such thing is true. The Constitution is opposite in instructing employers of the document as far as intent and actions concerning human action goes from moral thoughts and actions (voluntary associations) into immoral thoughts and actions which are merely crimes, and which are understandable in context with those immoral people who force their will (involuntary association) upon innocent people. George Washington was the first so called President. Here is a very good explanation of what George Washington was all about: Generalissimo Washington That is the typical "Strong Man" scenario. When the employer needs a hit man, a slave master, an "authority," they pick someone who can create what is now called "The cult of personality" and "Stalin" and "Hitler" are of the same constitution. Washington went right to work as "President" with the suppression of Rebellion as Washington conscripted an army (involuntary association) while "President" to go on a crime spree, a war of aggression for profit, by invading the formerly sovereign State of Pennsylvania, to crush a money competitor PROCESS that was only just beginning to emerge as a viable, organized, effort, by many people, voluntarily, to produce, and maintain, a competitive form of home grown money, which was whiskey at that time. Why is someone who had communist connections the president of the United States? Why is someone who has Royal British Crown (Bank of London) connections the "president" of a Private Company (U.S.A. Inc. LLC)? The answer is such that the private company is a false front for crime made legal and the victims are led to believe that this private company (which is a false front for crime made legal) is their POWER to command in defense against all enemies of Liberty, foreign and domestic. It is a big lie, and it was a big like as far back as 1787, as told by many people who were FOR federal government constructions and who were called, oddly enough, Anti-Federalists. Washington, Hamilton, and John Adams (Alien and Sedition Acts) were all "Federalists" (close ties with The Bank of England and the Royal British Crown). Who gave the Rebels in America The Statue of Liberty, and why? I ask because it was the French who were aiding the Rebels against the British. I think there is some deeper meaning to that Statue of Liberty exchange. The Criminal Socialists took over and Criminal Socialism does not work and when those Social programs can no longer sustain the people who depend on them those people become dissatisfied as well. Criminal whatever works fine for criminals. Why is that hard to see? The Private Corporation that currently stands in place of any POWER (at all) in defense against crimes perpetrated by large groups of organized criminals (claiming any kind of legitimate authority at all) is another organized criminal gang. Private Corporation. What do those words mean according to a person who exists in a world where power is increased because of the work done by that individual? That term, those words, Private Corporation, means one thing to on set of people, and it means another thing, to another set of people. Private Corporation, such as United States Incorporated, Limited Liability, is a false front for organized crime. Which THING is run by a President, and how is that President empowered with any power at all? 1. A Private Corporation assembled for the purpose of producing items of competitive quality for sale at competitive prices. 2. A Private Corporation assembled as a false front to hide the crimes perpetrated by the criminals upon the innocent victims (including child sex slavery). What is not on that list is anything resembling an organized effort to defend against 1 man alone, let alone assembling an organized effort to defend against the largest powerful army of criminals ever assembled (involuntarily) by any organized group of torturous, and murderous, criminals. If you are duped into a false belief that U.S.A. is an assembly of people organized in defense of Liberty, then you have not learned much from me in these years we have been discussing vital questions, seeking accurate answers. Sometime during all of that they were rounding up women and children and lighting them on fire because those women and children were torturing the communist wounded soldiers with knives. I wonder why women and children would torture the wounded communist soldiers with knives? If too many innocent people are led to believe that the way to defend Liberty is to torture and murder the torturing murderers, then what happens? If Russia went through a tough 100 year span of time where the worst torturers and murderers where in charge of the so called government, then what type of person, and what type of group do you think will overpower that false government? Another false government? Why is that hard to see? If there is now two opposing criminal forces ready to kill each other off, or die trying, then that scenario is what I call The Routine. Is there, possibly, ONE group that sets all of that destructive POWER to be exactly what it is in due time? If so, how could that ONE group be found? How about following the ONE Legal Money Power to the source of it? What will you find? You, me, anyone, will find a POWER that can buy anything that can be purchased with Legal Money. Anything. Is that a substantial POWER? Can a War be bought? How can a war be bought? Here, again, are three links that should be considered when asking these vital questions, seeking accurate answers: Buying employees hired to make War real. Money to spare to hire more employees. Who actually pays the bills when the purchases are paid in full? And now the US is over there killing people. Are "we" the communists now, or are "we" spreading democracy? Who are we killing over there? Here is someone who was hired to kill people in recent "war" purchases: Adam Kokesh Here is another: Pat Tillman Note: The setting of those "testimonies" are inside of a Private Corporation which is a False Front for Organized Crime. Frank has an interesting entomology on the word testimony. I wonder how one can get hold of one of the exceptions so that the contract is equitable for both parties and no one is left feeling exposed. I do not know if you can ever gain legal title in such a way as to then feel secure. I think it is more important to think in terms of reducing the cost of living, and along those lines there will always be criminals seeking to steal some of your power in some way. How you balance the books is not how I balance the books, so I can't be of much help. I can offer a link and a concept of making sure that whatever you do end up signing, as a contract, or whatever you want to call it, an agreement to pay an extortion fee, whatever you want to call it, the actual section of land described in great detail on the record, the paper, the official sounding, approved, stamped, measure of Earth, needs to be cleared as far as chain of title goes. The term is Abstract Title, or finding each recorded transfer of title, so as to end up with Allodial Title. Land Patents I think that you may find some feeling of security if you listen to some of the information offered by that person, and then you can, possibly, find out specific things concerning a specific area of Earth that may be of interest to bear and the precious family in her world. I don't think you can find any feeling of security if your world view is built upon a false appraisal of the current ROOT of false authority which is nothing more or less than organized crime, or the color of law, at the base of it, there in Washington D.C., which is a so called "Private" corporation. Example: If you get something that says you have this Allodial Title, according to The Federal Government, which overpowers the State Government, then as far as the current POWER structure works, you own that land, free and clear. That can be worth something to you, to your family, for a long time. That can work to reduce the amount of power you need to pay those payments demanded by those who end up demanding payments from you. If so, if you find, and get, something similar to Allodial Title, and power flowing from you to anyone demanding power from you is reduced, then that sounds like a very good way to feel better in your lifetime. If you are worried about possibly stepping on a mine (the contract is a mine field) then your fears may be overblown. Banks (so called) make sure that they get every advantage during the process of transferring title. We all work for the Banks, so called, so they (The so called banks) do as they please. Everyone is going through these mind fields, but many people are gaining some form of title, as they walk through the mine fields. So you want a title. If you get one, then make sure you record a transfer of the title to your children, so as to avoid the process called "probate," if that is at all possible. You won't get a perfect, honorable, voluntary, agreement, or equitable transfer, when dealing with the false bank, and the false government that is hired and working for the false bank, but you can minimize the injury, meaning that you can reduce the mines in the field between you, where you are now, and that goal of gaining a recorded title of ownership. I don't know the details in the paper work precisely. I can't help as a Union Lawyer or a Non-Union Lawyer, and that is why I am now reading the work done by Frank, because he looks to me like the most accurate source of information concerning which POWER is on top at this time, and which POWER will be on top (might makes right or the opposite POWER) in the near, and far, future. A deal made with criminals is only as good as long as the criminals stay in power. But your part of the deal, maintained accurately, honestly, honorably, will always be recognized as such by fellow Friends IN Liberty. So...to me the link showing how Title of Land works according to the supposed Federal Government, going back since it began 200 odd years ago, is a good way to begin finding some sense of security in knowing how that works now, from how it worked along the way up to now, in this place where this land exists. If land title is causing you stress now, then listening to that link above sounds like it may be much better than listening to information concerning the nebulous communists. Here is the link again: IF THERE IS ONE LIE KNOWN -- IS NOT ALL ELSE SUSPECT? No wonder we sided with them in WWII. There you go again. If the links offered above, on Wall Street buying FDR, buying Hitler, and Buying Stalin, are of no value to you, because the information is false, or meaningless, to you, then I can understand why you fall back into this "we sided with them" concept. So be it. I find the information offered by Anthony Sutton to fit very well into my understanding of how Legal Crime works as a Legal Money Monopoly Power. I may be wrong, of course. We were them and didn't even know it. I do not torture. I do not mass murder. I do not torture and mass murder for fun and profit. I am not part of "we," and no amount of POWER (to purchase) me into that group will do so, so please stop using the word "we" in that context with me. And we have been on the divide and conquer road ever since. Not me. Please stop. I have been on the Liberty road all my life, measured by my efforts to end the day with more productive power compared to what was available at the start of the day, and having been less than what I would have wanted to be, having made many errors, but none-the-less being on the Liberty road all my life. I cannot be bought, moved, enlisted, or joined into that "we" you speak of, it won't happen, it can't happen, it is not in me. If I am wrong, if I can be bought, if I some day join them, then may God have mercy upon my soul, because I will have sold it at that point. Yes, I can be wrong, but I do not profit, and have fun, torturing, and mass murdering, and those in that group of "we" do. I am not in that group, so please stop placing me in that group with your use of the word we. We think it is because both sides of the war is funded? Maybe it is because both sides of the war is fought by the same people and makes for easier conquest. You are not in that group either, no way, no how, so your infection, if that is what is happening still, remains to be an injury done to you, and done by those who are in that group who love to destroy. I hope that you can see past that nonsense, some day, clearly, and I am warning you again, once all that nonsense is left behind, there will be much trouble in your soul, if you are anything like I was, when I finally shed those very destructive lies. I do think the moment occurred after seeing another pile of soon to be tortured and murdered innocent people were loaded onto a truck, and I wept at my daughter's bedside, literally crying my eyes out, sobbing. You are not part of it, you are not in that group, in that sense, this sense, you are innocent, and no, please no, do not place yourself within that false world, get out of it, and do not be afraid, it won't be easy, but get the hell out of it. I mean, specifically, in reference to the so called connection between the innocent victims and "our" president of "our" Private Corporation, it is all lies, it has been all lies since they, they, they, not us, made slavery legal with The Constitution in 1788. They are evil, you are not, in that context, precisely that context, you are innocent of such things, and your guilt is measurable in measurable ways and it is not FUN and PROFIT earned by torture and mass murder. That is what causes the sobbing, the weakness, the powerlessness, to finally realize the full measure of the connection, for what it is, no longer any doubt. Then what happens? I think there is then a ground zero, and you may have already passed it, probably so, and I am just not understanding you by your words currently. From that ground zero there is much less in the way of abject fear, and much more in the way of reasonable defensive POWER. It is not easy, and if you have not gone through something similar to what I have gone through, then my warning still stands. I think this is one of the things Joe would have to think about. My head is starting to hurt trying to sort it all out. At least you have your safe place, a place to recharge, to find courage, which has to be very powerful. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear.the communist lawyers guild Are you speaking about the Bar Association? The monopoly of "legal" professionals dates back further than one of the many labels (communist) covering up the fact that they are criminals. The label (communist) may still work, as a cover, and may work as a cover in the future, but it, the word, is no different in principle, than the last one, or the next one, as a cover. Frank is describing a split among the most powerful in the form of the Jesuits aligning opposite the Illuminati. as if the labels are of some principled meaning, one side being good, or not as bad, as the other side, as if one can win and things will be better, and the other can win, and things will be worse. I see no such thing. I think both sides are maneuvered to be sides by an un-named other group having some power over both sides. Example: New? Quote: There can be no doubt we are in the middle of the greatest power struggle since World War II. It is uncertain whether the Jesuits will prevail and the system restored to order, or whether the Vatican and Illuminati will succeed in breaking the shackles of forced subservience after 200 years. No source of information I have ever found, as yet, walks the reader through time, places, people, events, reasons, explanations, logic, as comprehensively as Frank. My understanding fits these pieces into a useable form as a Power Struggle among those who have the most POWER. If those that have the most POWER order, sign a PURCHASE ORDER, for aggressive destruction, who is going to follow that purchase order? Not me. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I contacted someone at Bookmasters through their web page. The person I was dealing with no longer works at Bookmasters, and it looks like my account was lost. I sent a reply asking if I have to start over, and I forwarded some of my correspondence with the former Bookmasters employee. I have not finished reading through the last .pdf version you sent, and I can read through that version or I can read through a newer version if you have one where the word file corrects the few remaining bugs, converted to .pdf, if you want to send the new one, or if you want to wait until I read through the old one. My head is spinning too. I wonder if this book will be accepted once a Limited Liability Corporation employee, of any power, starts reading it. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I was gone all day, but I did get a chance to figure out how to fix those dots in the table of contents. I finally got smart enough to google my question. Why I didn't think of that earlier, I will never know. Anyways, I fixed those 2 mistakes and also the table of contents page so I will send a new pdf = now. Then I will rest abit. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I have the latest file and I can go through it just before sending it to the new contact at Bookmasters. Thanks |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, Thank you for letting me know you have the files. I'll be happy to help further should you find something I need to do. I will even read pdf if you want me to. Also, I wanted to cry foul when you called me out for using "we" because I had a little disclaimer that I was "using we loosely." I have given it alot of thought though. The mere fact that I would even use the word "we" "loosely" reveals that the screws run very deep. The idea that I would include myself in a group of people that rape, pillage, and torture for fun and for profit is a huge failing on my part. Thank you for helping me see once again, even more clearly. And then there is the other "we" which would just be good old Americans thinking that "we" are the knight in shining armor, when in fact "we" are one and the same as "them" - because "we/them" are controlled by the black knight. I think I was trying to say that. I was trying to say that because I used to think that "we" were on the good side because "we" were the Americans. And now I see that someone has been using Americans to do very bad things. Can a person use the word "we" when referring to the country they live in and the people they live with in that country? Do you think of yourself as part of a country? As in "we" Americans? The Amish do not celebrate 4th of July or Labor Day as a Holidays. They probably don't observe Memorial Day either. I wonder if they consider themselves Americans? They go to their own Amish one-room school house here in our community and only go to school thru 8th grade. I looked at the allodial title website. So much of that law stuff is too hard for me to understand. I wouldn't know how to do a title search to get back to the allodial title. I didn't listen to all of those talks though. Today Jeff went to see a guy that was part of the Flying Tigers in WWII. I asked Jeff if he had shot down any Nazis. Jeff told me he was in the Pacific Theater. Joe, have you ever thought about the way they call war/killing zones Theaters? Talk about the Old Coliseum Days...Instead of Ceasar watching a couple of Gladiators, or some wild beasts tear Christians apart...The Cesars of the world have killing zones called Theaters. I wonder if that is a coincidence? Jeff seemed taken back my comments regarding the word Theater...I will probably hear him using the example later. That seems to be how it works around here. He can't completely accept my words when I say them, and then I find him repeating them like they were his. It is kind of funny to me. At least some of the information is getting thru! And he is telling other people, so the news spreads one way or another I am looking forward to handing him a copy of Joe Quotes! |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, No word yet back from Bookmasters, but it is the weekend so I am giving them until Monday, before I respond, actually it is early Monday right now. I started just now on re-reading the .pdf file and I found this: Acknowledgments .............................................................................. vii Foreword ........................................................................................... viii Introduction ......................................................................................... xi That (above) is cut and pasted from the .pdf The cut and paste below is an edit I did to the word file, to match up the numbering as it should be when each page (even blank pages) are Roman Numerals? I won't try to convert the word file to .pdf unless you respond with the OK to do so, along with a reminder on how to do it, or where I need to go to get the instructions on how to convert. I am also keeping track of any other things I may yet find. Acknowledgments......................................................................................... vi Foreword...................................................................................................... viii Introduction.................................................................................................... ix I will finish the book after I ready your response here. I am on page 86. I have found no other errors and I am checking to make sure the footnotes are the same footnote numbers on the Index page here on this forum. No errors there either. I checked my e-mail and Bookmasters sent me a note. I replied with these words (just now): Ryan, I am not one for phone calls. My thinking works better in type, so I type. 100 copies, how much? I have found only 2 errors in my latest reading of the .pdf file for the book, and I will finish reading through the text today. I may be able to send the completed .pdf file for submission before this Friday; possibly sooner. Does your company have methods of proofing the text files before running 100 copies? I will be needing help selling the book. Does your company deal in digital marketing? Joe Page 144 "The Other Founders About the book: "The struggle over the U.S. Constitution in 1788 pitted The 1 above (before 788) is a footnote (small raised symbol) not a number. I can change that now in the word file. I noticed that my word file was left open on my computer, so it is possible that other things were changed while I was monkeying around with other open windows. I really think, at this point, that it would be a good idea for bear (Editor in Chief) to make these few changes to her copy of the Word file, then reformat in .pdf, and then resend the .pdf (checking or not checking through the file one more time on your own) while I check, or not, one more time too. Bookmasters, I see now, have responded. bear, Here is the reply from Bookmasters: Hello Joe, I have to wait on print pricing until I get the quote back from estimating. We can proofread before going print but in order to quote you on this service I need a sample chapter for the editorial director to review. For proofreading we have 3 levels: light, moderate and heavy. The sample will help determine the level needed for your book. We do offer marketing services. I'd like to know a little about your book. Are you doing anything is market it currently? Do you have a distributor? What are your goals for your book(s)? Are you currently utilizing social media? Thank you, I am wondering if you think it is a good idea to have your e-mail address added to this negotiating process. I don't want to suggest that I think you should, because I don't, I think that the offer is worth offering, so as to allow you the opportunity to decide what is best for bear, and family. My costs of printing will be mine, exclusively, since I am in charge of my book selling, but I do appreciate help, when help arrives from wherever help originates. I can cut and paste these messages that constitute the process of book selling here, too, and be happy with any help that you may be able to offer. As far as these words, that are yours and mine, again, the realization of any income above costs are split 50/50, as far as I am concerned. That was an old offer still standing that way. I still have more reading to do, and I am going to think about my answer (my reply) to the latest e-mail from Bookmasters. They have not yet sent a price for 100 prototype copies of the book. What happens in the event that the printer receives a file that is in some way altered while the file is under their control, and then the 100 books are misprinted? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I can get back to book work after responding to your latest, welcome, vital questions, as I share a need for accurate answers. "Can a person use the word "we" when referring to the country they live in and the people they live with in that country?" I ask people questions so as to find better answers since my answers are very likely to be not good enough, and example of a vital question is: "How does anyone accurately discriminate between friend and foe?" We are those who want to know that answer so as to disconnect from foes, if at all possible, so as never to be victims. We are not those who want to know that answer so as to connect to fellow criminals who are then working cooperatively to injure innocent victims for fun and profit. So...again...there are two worlds and if you are in one, this Liberty one, then the other one, that Criminal one, is foreign to you, a world apart. It is in the best interest of Legal Criminals to have their victims confusing Liberty and Legal Crime, as if they are one and the same thing. Is that what is happening in your case right now? Do you think of yourself as part of a country? As in "we" Americans? Since I've read Franks work on where the word America comes from, and the meaning is almost the same as a Sea of Lost Souls ready for Exploitation, then your question, in that context, is this: Do I think of myself as a lost soul in a sea of lost souls whereby each lost soul is ever ready to be exploited by those who see America as a place where a new victim is born every minute? The answer to that question is no. I linked earlier links connecting you, me, and anyone else, to recorded evidence concerning the lives of two people, one named Pat Tillman, who was murdered, and one named Adam Kokesh, where Adam Kokesh is currently held captive by those who capture lost souls and exploit whatever can be exploited out of lost souls. How do you tell friend from foe? I consider myself to be on the side of those who finally realize that it is not a good idea to keep sending every kilowatt/hour of power earned to really evil people, and I think both Pat Tillman and Adam Kokesh have figured out similar things before the one was murdered, and that one was murdered because of his "change of heart," and the other one is now kidnapped, as far as I can tell, because of his "change of heart." 1. Following criminal orders without question 2. Resisting the following of criminal orders 3. Fighting the Legal Criminals face to face When I ran for congress I was fighting the legal criminals face to face, and those who know that their "votes" are not counted, know not to let anyone else in on the secret, so they pretend to vote, while they work to ensure that the criminals remain in power. What is the meaning of the silence after "I agree with you, but-"? I am a part of a force that is NOT willful investments in perpetuating a Legal Crime Monopoly Money Power and all the Torture and Mass Murder that is required, so as to have my fun, and my profits, at the expense of so many millions, and now billions of innocent victims (innocent in the specific and not ambiguous or abstract meaning). We who willfully work to end up with abundant power instead of power scarcity forced upon the innocent are NOT in the same group as Legal Criminals. So...how do you tell friend from foe? How do you do so accurately? I wonder if they consider themselves Americans? I wonder if the Amish founding fathers figured out the same thing Frank figured out as to the entomology of the word America: sea of lost souls (or some other, similar, meaning). I wouldn't know how to do a title search to get back to the allodial title. Ask anyone who is seeking your signature on a document if they can help you get a Title Abstract or Abstract of Title, and tell them you want a complete one, not an incomplete one, and see, from that question, if you then find out how to "get back to the allodial title." You are not "getting back to the allodial title," the idea is to confirm that the title you are buying is not false in ways that are on the record, such as a title that at one time was a Tax Lean Sale, which (according to the person in the link) is a source of trouble, which is not good, if you want "Fee Simple" or "Clear Title" or "Unencumbered Title" or a title that does not have a "cloud" on it, whereby you want something as close as possible to Allodial Title according to the current rules in force, pretty much world wide, or Nation Wide at least. The link is not that difficult to understand, if the listener can remain awake, but the main point stressed was to complete a Title Abstract ( find the complete chain of title) recorded officially by those who will be judging any disputes that may arise against your claim of title, after you pay to get title, and the link stresses the importance of making sure that there are no Tax Lean Sales in that chain of title. The link stresses that Title Insurance Companies do not necessarily (or not even often) track back the chain of title (they do not preform a complete Title Abstract) for reasons explained, and that means that YOU may be holding an unenforceable Title in a case where there was a Tax Lean Sale in the chain of title, where even Title Insurance Companies may not find such things as a Tax Lean Sale in the chain of title, and so you may be buying an empty bag. If you are armed with this information then you can at least ask if the title search done is complete, and the secret hand shake type terminology for asking that question is Title Abstract, so as to end up with Allodial Title. It is like saying, OK, do I really own the property, or is this "good enough for government work" as there has not been a complete title search done, there has not been a Title Abstract done, so there may be a Tax Lean Sale done somewhere along the line, and so there may be someone out there who can take me to court and get the title stolen from them back, or at least force me into court to pay fees in defense of my supposed claim on this land? If they look at you funny, then they may not have a clue as to what you are saying, but the fact is that a Title Abstract is a real report of the full Chain of Title as far back as Land Patents, or even further back, depending upon the specific land, in the specific State, in this Involuntary Monopoly Union of Corporate States. If there is a Tax Lean Sale, or who knows what other Land Mine, in the Chain of Title, then where would such a thing be recorded? How would someone find where such things are recorded in the Chain of Title? Do you want clear title, or is it good enough to buy an empty bag? If there is a possible counter claim, such as someone who "lost" their property in a Tax Lean Sale, then such a counter claim (supposedly) must be recorded in that Chain of Title, or there is no counter claim, and if there is not counter claim, then you have the title free and clear, instead of having an empty bag. The Cesars of the world have killing zones called Theaters. I wonder if that is a coincidence? Do you want to hear the entomology of the word testimony according to Frank? He can't completely accept my words when I say them, and then I find him repeating them like they were his. That is funny. I worked for my brother for a long time, and we grew apart because of things happening at work, including his need to feel credit for being the boss, as I remember telling other workers, like me, about how things work in these Employee/Employer relationships. I said that you have to approach them in a way that enables them to take credit of the idea that you want to implement, so that they can then have a light bulb moment, and the idea is their idea, and in that way the new way of doing things is implemented. If you insist on getting credit for the new idea, it is likely that the idea will never see the light of day at work. I am looking forward to handing him a copy of Joe Quotes! Be prepared for silence. I have no idea what other people may, or may not, think about this new book you and I have created, but I am prepared for silence. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I went through the book again, this time finding 2 things, as explained earlier in this thread. The Acknowledgements are not numbered correctly, and there is a number 1 at the beginning of the date 1788 that is formatted incorrectly as a footnote number on Page 144. That is all I could find wrong. I will think about things until tomorrow. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I want you to know that I have just realized you sent me information regarding corrections. I had seen your long post in answer to my post but I did not go above that post to see that you had noted corrections. I will look into them RIGHT NOW. Sorry to have kept you waiting. bear |
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bear Guest
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Joe,Acknowledgments .............................................................................. vii When I look at BOTH the word and pdf copies of FINAL EDIT bear3d I am seeing Contents Acknowledgments .............................................................................. vii Foreword ........................................................................................... viii Introduction ......................................................................................... xi I do not think the first blank page prior to the Joe Quotes cover page should be counted in numbering. So I am thinking that Joe Quotes Title page is unnumbered page i then there is a blank unnumbered page ii then there is Dedication unnumbered page iii then there is a blank unnumbered page iv then there is Contents unnumbered page v then there is a blank unnumbered page vi then there is Acknowledgements numbered page vii (currently reads viii) then there is Foreword numbered page viii (currently reads ix) then there is Introduction numbered page xi (currently reads xii) I think TOC should read as follows: Contents Acknowledgments .............................................................................. vii Foreword ........................................................................................... viii Introduction ......................................................................................... xi I think the error is in the numbers I have at the bottom of the page because I should not have started numbering with the first blank page (which is more of a cover sheet), but Joe Quotes should be number i. Does that sound right to you? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I have fixed page 144 making 1788 all same case: The Other Founders About the book: "The struggle over the U.S. Constitution in 1788 pitted the Federalists.... |
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bear Guest
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Joe, in the vast abyss, my words to you regarding:As far as these words, that are yours and mine, again, the realization of any income above costs are split 50/50, as far as I am concerned. That was an old offer still standing that way. were along the lines of when Joe starts clearing $1000 a month profit on Joe Quotes, then Joe can decide if bear is due anything. I am serious about that Joe. As far as bear is concerned, Joe can earn $999 a month profit on Joe quotes and not even consider whether bear is due anything, but when Joe earns $1001 a month in profit, then Joe can think about bear. OK Joe? I think bookkeeping (not to be confused with bookwork) will be easier that way. And it is and has been my privilege to work with your words. It has been my privilege to read your words. bear is happy about it. I am going to be very busy raising bear cubs, so I think it is good for Joe to manage the printer and correspondence and if you want me to know things, I will be happy to know them. But if Joe can carry the burden of decision making and working with the printer, it will be easier for bear. OK? I am now going to send the new pdf and word file to you. If it does not look correct, just tell me, but I think the page numbers are correct. It is very easy to make a pdf. When you save the word file, just do SAVE AS pdf. But I will be happy to do that. It is probably nice to know there is a back up of the back up of the back up It is also important to follow the instructions regarding maintaining the embedded font, or whatever that was called. It is in the notes that you received from the printer and that I made comments on. I relooked at them the other day before I made the pdf as it had been a little while since I had done that and I wanted to make sure I did it right. We already have the fonts embedded in our word file at this point so all we have to do is save as pdf.Easy as pie. I made peach pie Saturday and picked 5 gallons of grapes today. I gave them to the Amish. I am too busy to make juice and jelly at this point. My Amish friend was delighted and she is going to give me a jar of juice as payment. I took the corn and green beans that an other Amish friend gave me to another Amish friend to can for me. The Amish are keeping me very busy with free stuff It makes me smile.And if Joe Quotes gets the Sound of Silence, bear will still smile, and I think Joe will too. Sometimes one does not see the fruit of ones work right away. I think it is a work well worth the effort and it came about in spontaneity as Joe wanted words quoted as a part of discussion and then bear started finding Joe words that were quotes in themselves...and Joe just happened to want to write a book |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I just sent the following to the printer: Hi Ryan, I have been working on finding the last few errors I can find in the book text file. I do not know what to do at this point. 1. Do I have to print out, and sign in wet ink, and then mail a copy of the contract, with a check (discount for checks?) or sign the printed contract and fax it, or is it good enough to photocopy and e-mail the printed, signed, contract, along with a credit card number (no discount?)? 2. I need more information on how to market a book if, by chance, the book becomes something that tends to sell itself, a hit, or whatever words describe something "in demand," so e-Book information, to me, sounds more important than pushing paper copies of a book that may or may not hit "critical mass," and become "in demand." 3. I can send back the check box information request form, if that has to be done that way, but I see my traveling through this process as my crawling like a baby at this point, so I will have to be patient. 4. I want to go through the .pdf book text file one more time, otherwise I would send it right now. I an anxious to see if there is any type of feedback from you, or other people at your place of work, whereby the file is looked at, and judged, and either passes, or fails, whatever tests you have in place. 5. Having at my house 100 copies would inspire me to sell 100 copies, to get them off whatever shelf I have here, so the number 100 is good in that sense, an inspiration to become a salesman, but the price savings from 25 copies to 100 copies is not much, so I don't know if the increase in copies, at this point, is wise, or unwise. I have no idea as to the marketability of the book. So, yes, I have the updated printing quote. Do you want a copy of the text file to see if it fits the required form, and to see if it conforms to the size of the already submitted book cover? Should I send another book cover file with the text file, and an e-mail copy of a signed contract (if I go with the 100 copies)? My guess is that 25, 50, or 100 copies of the first (and possibly last) printing of this book are investments in learning, if nothing else, so I need to guess how much learning I want to do at this point. Joe I was very much encouraged by my banker (my better half) as she informed me that "You don't spend much money, so it is up to you on this book investment..." Well, she didn't say investment, but this is much better than the reaction I had when I wanted to buy a 3rd guitar to start making an inventory of guitars for sale. So, it looks like I am deciding, at this point, to go with 100 copies. I have yet to read your latest reply here: I am going to be very busy raising bear cubs, so I think it is good for Joe to manage the printer and correspondence and if you want me to know things, I will be happy to know them. But if Joe can carry the burden of decision making and working with the printer, it will be easier for bear. OK? Yes, that is fine, like having a publisher on pro bono retainer. 5 gallons of grapes = a jar of juice = It makes me smile Equitable commerce measured in smiles. How is that for a standard of value? |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, In my latest reading of the finished book I have encountered a question concerning the page numbers and the page arrangements. The page numbers are now 176 total, which may or may not be a problem with the book cover file having been made for 174 pages. The page arrangements are such that the beginnings of chapters are sometimes on the left (back) side, and sometimes chapters start on the right (front) side. Is that intentional? Is it better to start new pages on the right side (front side)? I am going to see if I can learn how to use this Word program at this time. Something is not making sense, since the same file as a Word file shows the Acknowledgement on the left side, but the .pdf file shows the Acknowledgement on the right side. I will be working on this at this time, but I am sending this message too, in case you are around, and the reason for the difference between word file and .pdf is easy to find, and you have time to clue me in. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, what a mess...I want you to know I have just come back home after being in town and am looking to see why all of the sudden the book is 176 pages long. I feel that apologizing at this moment would be a bit trite because I should have checked the page count before I sent the book, but I did not even consider doing that, nor did I expect that the page count would have changed, nor did I notice when it changed. If I can say I am sorry, I do mean it, but I feel foolish at this time - like an idiot - as Joe is probably sick and tired of bear's poor job with every right to feel that way. I too will look to see if I can figure out what happened in case I am able to help in any way. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, No worries on my account please, your help is help, for sure, so discredit is not due to you from me. I sent the file back to you, with an e-mail explanation concerning my current state of helplessness when working with Word. We are close to having a quality book to share with anyone having any interest in learning our viewpoints, which is an accomplishment any way I look at it. |
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bear Guest
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I just sent you an email to see what you want me to do at this point. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I just sent a reply to Bookmasters concerning their marketing brochures offered as a Service for hire. I can forward that exchange if you want me to. |
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bear Guest
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I have been running like a crazy woman. And now finally I have some minutes to myself Joe, if you would like me to see the information about marketing, I will look at it. I don't mind. I also don't mind if you make executive decisions apart from my knowledge of it/them. It is exciting to being this close to done! And it is exciting that you are very interested in marketing the book. We might move in the next couple of weeks to a home in the country. If that should happen, I will suddenly be very busy packing and painting and cleaning. I am trying not to get too excited about it because things can always fall through. It seems everyone in this small town knows about it even though we have not told them. We are kind of private, which is kind of ridiculous because everyone else seems to talk about it, but we don't. We are still not used to the small town grapevine. So, I am telling you about it because we have just sent off paperwork to get a loan from a retirement account so we are getting close. (You know, that money that is Jeff's, but he can't have it. Seems like a guy named Joe discussed that in a book that I read often.) I am working on the book pages right now. I worked abit on it last night, but I did not succeed in the effort. Something seems crazy with the book formatting. But I do think I will get it worked out. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I sent an e-mail. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, when I open the word doc there is 174 pages. However, when I view footer the page count changes to 177 even though I haven't added any page numbers. So then I close the footer view and the page count decreases to 171 pages without adding any page numbers. But then when I open the footer again the page count jumps up to 177 without even adding page numbers. This is making me think that maybe the document page size is extending into the footer margins, but I don't know. I am going to look into the page size and see if I can discover anything. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I think this is what is wrong: close to the top of the page, maybe 1/4 of the way down, this information can be found on this website: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/211432 How Headers and Footers Affect Margin Settings With that information, and my little experiment noted in the comment above this comment, I think that with the removal and the reinsertion of the footers text is expanding. i.e., if footers were removed while pages were being moved around, the text flowed into the full length of the page leaving no margin for the footer. Then when the footers are reinserted, Word reshuffles the text so that the footer doesn't write over the text in the page. So, while we were working on the book the page numbers were on so it was not a problem. But I am thinking that maybe while some hacking was going on, maybe the page numbers turned off and then the text took up all the room at the bottom of the page and then when page numbers were re-added the text expanded creating more pages.Now that is probably confusing, but I think we found the problem. I will work at getting the footers reinserted and the pages reconfigured so that the text does not over flow the footer margin. I think that I can get that figured out. I am not sure about timing. I am running out of time today before dinner and we have church tonight. I admit I was sleepy while trying to do bookwork so I decided to take a little nap and then the phone started ringing and I was detracted for a while with helping our neighbor. But all in all, I think we are in a good spot to fix the problem at this time. Much further than I was last night or today while I was sleepy. I partially read the email you sent from bookmasters. It sounds good. I don't want you to have to go thru lots of trouble sending me things, but if it is not too much trouble it is helpful for me, because today I went back to look at the notes that the original bookmasters person you were working with to check on margin sizes, and even the size of the book. So the information is worth knowing about in case I have questions about how to do some "publishing" work, I have some references. So now I am going to break until I have a segment of time where I can devote my full attention to the footnote/paging effort as it will take a measure of concentration on my part. And I still have the mind of that fish, but not the degenerate voice that comes from that fish. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am so happy to say that I got the pages added back and the page count is 174. I am emailing you the files now. I updated the table of contents as well. Please take a look and make sure the pages/margins for binding are falling in the right format for Joe eyes. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I have what I think is the finished product. I will send it back to you on Monday for your final review before this book goes to the printer next week, or if you want it sooner, I can send it sooner, but not until I make one more look through it. I added some more quotes from Patrick Henry. I did not add any more footnotes. I extended the Sale or No Sale chapter some, based upon recent discussions we have conducted. I found one word that was plural that fits better being singular. Other than that above, the product you sent to me was done, so I think we are very close to having an actual book in hand. I am a little bit unsettled with the deal made earlier about sending you 10 copies at the cost of 10 FRNs each, as you could just as easily get those 10 copies without paying anything for them, and then if you sell them, you could buy more with the money made in selling them. I guess old prejudices concerning how equitable commerce is done are sources of unsettled feelings. In any case, to me, having other people read the book, offering feedback, helps me; besides any monetary considerations. Tonight I have to make Spaghetti sauce for a day with my brother's family, my oldest brother, not Jack, as he is returning home after awhile of being away at work. It will be good to see him. |
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bear Guest
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"I have what I think is the finished product. " That is wonderful Joe! So exciting! Send it back when you can and I'll take a final read through. Tuesday looks like my most open day. The boys starts school then. "I am a little bit unsettled with the deal made earlier about sending you 10 copies at the cost of 10 FRNs each, as you could just as easily get those 10 copies without paying anything for them, and then if you sell them, you could buy more with the money made in selling them. I guess old prejudices concerning how equitable commerce is done are sources of unsettled feelings. " Joe, I feel good about the deal. I want one signed copy for me, and then I will give the others as gifts. It is my contribution towards the printing cost as well. I want it that way. If I remember right, Jack gave $100 for printing...are you giving him 10 copies or 1? ...That may be an interesting take on gathering printing money as well as distributing a sprinkling of copies. Kind of like mini distributors. They pay $100 and get 10 copies to give away (or sell if they like). It seems like that would be a way to work with close friends and family as they have a personal interest in the author and his book...Maybe you could pretend your wife is giving you $100 and give her 10 copies as well to give as gifts. That would be $300 of the $500 printing cost, right? (And 30 of the 100 books.)Anyways, I had another thought today about your idea of selling a book for $100 and then having that person sell it for $90 and then the next $80, etc with a log in front of the book (I think that is the way you explained it). My thought was, due to my JTK Education, with open competition, is there any reason why the book cannot be marketed multiple ways? Who says there has to be a single set price AND single set way of selling your product? Does not competition say that multiple paths can be taken simultaneously? Your family may have fun with the $100 pass it down deal and may also have friends who would have fun doing that as well! That may be a lot of fun. I can see my step dad's family doing something like that. They are a fun bunch. I tend to be more on the melancholy side (one of those traits I learned about when I took one of those personality tests back in the 80's). So, it will be fun for me to give someone a copy of the book and tell them, "I am the bear in the book, please read it and see what you think." That may sound boring to Joe, but not to bear. (And bear does not like to sell things. It makes bear feel very uneasy inside. But when bear gives things away it makes her feel really good.) Maybe with the DP folks there will be a completely different way of marketing that hasn't even been thought of yet? I can see sending a signed copy to Michael as a gift. It could come out of my gift set. Who knows, Michael may even write or post about it...now that may be thinking too forward, but the thought came between my 2 ears and out my finger tips. Have fun with you family and brother. I bet Joe makes some good spaghetti! We are going to go look for a Trombone for Scott this evening. Jeff has been hunting Craig's List and has come up with several good leads. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, The following quote strikes me as a example of that which could be called genius. Does not competition say that multiple paths can be taken simultaneously? I think that you are beginning to exceed the boundaries placed upon your innocent soul, and once you have broken through, no one, ever, can put you back in such a cage. Perhaps I am presuming too much, but that sentence in quotes above looks to me like those creative ideas that are not mine, they exist, but they are not mine, and I just happen to be able to see them. Of course, the process of finding what can happen, without resort to deceit, and without resort to threats of violence, and without resort to violence, as a means of gaining power over, innocent, targeted, victims is wide open in as yet not realized possibilities. The book is not like kilowatt/hours of electricity, having a fixed measure of power, so there is great difficulty in measuring it to any value standard, and if a capitalist is going to sell it based upon voluntary capitalist pricing methods, then finding that market price is not tied down with anything other than good moral sense (no lies, threats, and violence), but to me the idea is to leverage (as you have already shown agreement) the power into greater currency. I mean, reinvesting any gains, so as to increase the number of readers, while making sure that the effort does not consume the host. The concept of equity is there, while, at the same time, the concept of competition (inventive creativity) is unfettered, in your words, as I read them. We can communicate well, compared to our capacity to do so at first blush? That may sound boring to Joe, but not to bear. There is another scale I see and on that scale are such things as running as fast as I can to start flying from a mountain while pushing my Hang Glider above me, my wings, so as to avoid much in the way of injury for failure to gain the required airspeed. A common low end of the scale phrase is "watching paint dry," and I can assure you that every comment fed back to me on this book will be much closer to a mountain take-off than watching paint dry. Maybe with the DP folks there will be a completely different way of marketing that hasn't even been thought of yet? How about this for an angle of view not often experienced by average Joe, or a bear raising a few cubs: I just received a return letter from Adam Kokesh who is currently being held without bail by the Legal Criminals in Washington D.C. The date of the hand written letter back to me is past the date that Adam was hopping to get out of jail, and he requests from me some reading material. I am going to go to the office tomorrow and print out Equitable Commerce and sent it on printer paper. If you had no problem with sending Adam Kokesh a paper version of the book, then I would do that too. Adam Kokesh has a high bandwidth terminal on the network of human beings. He can get the word out, if he is not silenced, permanently. I think it is great that Adam Kokesh is not being tortured to death for failing to obey without question. You may not understand my viewpoint precisely. I can see sending a signed copy to Michael as a gift. It could come out of my gift set. Who knows, Michael may even write or post about it...now that may be thinking too forward, but the thought ca I had not tackled that process in any way on my own, and your angle of view on connecting to The Daily Paul with the book is very competitive, leaving me with no inspiration to look for any better way to break the ice on that path. We are going to go look for a Trombone for Scott this evening. Jeff has been hunting Craig's List and has come up with several good leads. I see that I have cut off some words (important words) in the previous quote. I read them, and they were understood and appreciated, if not quoted. As to music, based upon my own experience, I strongly suggest investing on Music Theory Lessons of some kind, and if the teacher/teachers do not stress Music Theory/Framework/Scales/Meter/Rhythm/Key (frequency) then the foundation will not be built. The boy may have some fun, and may even seek the necessary information, or invent his own, but that is a very long shot, with very long odds, so the opportunity, while there is interest, aught to include basic founding instruction, tempered with entertainment value. My brother Danny was given a Trombone, I was given a Trumpet, by my mom, and we were just out of Kindergarten. It did not last long. My mom's father was a musician, trumpet player. Wind instruments may be much more fun because of the ability to shape sounds in ways that no one else ever has, which is my way of appraising the step from Piano to Guitar. Piano is very limited compared to the Guitar as to the power the artist has over the sounds that are created through the instrument. I never got past the need to train my mouth in such a way as to actually play a song with the trumpet, as far as I remember. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, we returned late this evening. I have read your reply and also see the email with attachment. Very interesting: I just received a return letter from Adam Kokesh who is currently being held without bail by the Legal Criminals in Washington D.C. I wanted to be reply quickly to say, by all means, send any paper versions you wish. This is your book, Joe, and as long as you haven't put any words into bears mouth, as far as I am concerned, you should do what you want with it. It is interesting that the Adam has asked for reading material. It is interesting that you are talking to him. How in the world do you know how to get hold of him? I really haven't kept up with Adam. I didn't know he was being held until you mentioned it a few days back and then again today. Just be careful Joe. Adam may be into things that you don't know about - things that you may not want to be a part of in the sense that he is being held without bail. I say that to someone who is a pal. I can't help sounding like a mother bear to someone older than I. OK, it is late now so I will close. Thank you for your words about music. I am hoping that Scott is getting the framework during piano lessons. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Along the lines of finding information on Adam Kokesh, to see if the phenomenon of his gaining currency, famous or infamous, are things worth knowing I found a new form of insurance that looks much like an old Idea I had called Anti-Despotism Insurance. I found out through this Insurance Provider the suggestion by someone to send Adam Kokesh personal mail. Shield Mutual That is the type of thing that will work with the hand held immobilizing defensive weapon, where the events occurring during a defensive action are uploaded to people who are then able to judge what happened, and if such things work out well, there can be a team of specialists sent to the scene of the defensive action, so as to aid in any further defense that may be required once the immobile person is no longer immobile. If you look at the first of the next two links you can hear how someone explains what can happen in a situation whereby a person with a false badge is perpetrating a crime upon an innocent victim, and that innocent victim calls for help. If it is the police (so called) perpetrating the crime, you can't call 911, and the example that proves that fact is the example when the victims in Waco Texas called 911 while the victims in Waco were being tortured and murdered by so called "Police." The second link below is a concept that is also similar to my Anti-Despotism Insurance ideas: Secret police Tyranny Alert I am reminding of the experiments done by Edison in finding a way to shed light in dark places. I can't send the reading material to Adam until the Post Office opens on Tuesday. On computer paper I have printed the entire book by Josiah Warren, but that is only one side of that paper. I can run the same paper through and print Joe Quotes on the reverse. You now have the finish (as far as I know at this point) version, and as far as I know it is approved by you until you say different. I remember now that I did add something to the book that you may not be yet aware of, you can find now on page 14 my Top 10 questions for the Presidential Candidates that were not easy to find in the many Threads on The Daily Paul. I only had room for my own questions, no answers, and none of your questions (or answers). I can't see myself cheering for The Troops who are led to slaughter innocent people in defense of a Legal Money Monopoly Fraud, which so many people are now doing with this Syria crime in progress. I can, will, and am very appreciative of someone like Adam Kokesh who realized the error of "serving" in "the military" while said military is run by criminals, and then that individual actually starts defending all that can be good in Liberty. Something like this: Honorable Mention I have trouble walking these days, my hearing is not good, I can't see very well, I get dizzy, and I have a part in a family, so my POWER of defense is limited compared to someone like Adam Kokesh. My thinking places someone like Adam Kokesh, former Military, or present Military, in the Defense of Liberty when the Legal Criminals no longer have Absolute Control over all their victims who are caught in Absolute Abject Belief in Falsehood Without Question, such as those many who are now cheering for action in Syria. When the Legal Criminals are forced out of their false offices of false authority it will be individual human beings doing that forcing, and the Legal Criminals are not going to volunteer to give up their POWER. The scenario I see, picking one out of many, involves a Puppet Government of much less POWER than it's former self, here in America, after World War III, and the real POWER will then be based in Asia, so our battles at Home will be the same principle battle, those who produce something worth stealing being the targets, and those doing the targeting, but the New Bosses will be shadows of their former selves. Russia is an example of what is on the schedule for America. Which types of people will gain control over the supplies of Surplus Wealth? 1. Criminals 2. Not 1 |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Good call on adding your top ten!!! {quote]I remember now that I did add something to the book that you may not be yet aware of, you can find now on page 14 my Top 10 questions for the Presidential Candidates that were not easy to find in the many Threads on The Daily Paul. I only had room for my own questions, no answers, and none of your questions (or answers). The only thing I would suggest about that at this point and not having read them closely is to add right justified margins so that they match the format in the rest of the book. That just stuck out to me. I think adding those top ten was a perfect way to end the chapter and to make use of the blank space. Good thinking! I have trouble walking these days, my hearing is not good, I can't see very well, I get dizzy, and I have a part in a family, so my POWER of defense is limited compared to someone like Adam Kokesh. I used to think that I would never age...that it was something that only happened to other people. I also used to not know what it was like to have health challenges. I'd say when I hit my 40's I found out what those things were like. When I was 20 I didn't know how good it felt to be 20! Thank you for the interesting links. You hand me stuff that I would never find on my own. Russia is an example of what is on the schedule for America. Which types of people will gain control over the supplies of Surplus Wealth? It seems to me like the criminals are always a step, and even if the are not, they will use any means to regain or steal what they want. After all, they are criminals. You now have the finish (as far as I know at this point) version, and as far as I know it is approved by you until you say different. I will try to read the finished version of Joe Quotes on Tuesday. We are going to visit Grandma tomorrow. We are supposed to close on the house on Wed, and I will say as soon as that happens, if it goes off without a hitch, I will become otherwise disposed for a couple of weeks. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I have changed a few more things in the book while I am trying to get the final final final, no more finals, finished product. Including a moving of text on the back side of the title page where it looks lower than the Contents page. I did that because I finally figured out how to look at the book with the PDF FILE READER so as to have back pages on the left, and front pages on the right. The Title page appears in ONE PAGE VIEW (even though the option in menu is TWO PAGE VIEW) and then the next page viewed is TWO PAGE VIEW where the left page is the back side of the Title page and the right page is the Contents page, on and on, as if turning the pages while viewing the file is a replication of turning book pages in a book. I also took out a LINK that was previously called No Statute and put in place a link called The Big Lie. I have a question on that, but I'm not wanting to delay the schedule to try to get this thing to the printer this week, so I can go or not go the printing with my small changes here, on your say so, if you trust that I have not done things against your wishes/will/better judgment. I took out a repeat reference to the Sniper and put in place a link to the actual Documentary called Waco The Big Lie produced by Linda Thomson. My question concerns the dates so I can cut and past here to illustrate what was, and what now is, in the INDEX: Was: 1. No Statute Horiuchi Fired At Waco -- Cases Found, [,]http://www.apfn.org/apfn/horiuchi.htm], November 2012 2. Deep Rooted Self-Destruction Joe Kelley, “The Daily Paul Forum: Deep rooted self-destruction,” [,]http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2829436:], November 2012. Is: 1. The Big Lie [,]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wUucANBY_8], September 2013 2. Deep Rooted Self-Destruction Joe Kelley, “The Daily Paul Forum: Deep rooted self-destruction,” [,]http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/2829436:], November 2012. I changed the date to this month, because it is this month whereby I edit this editorial change in the book. I am also set to go ahead and print up the book on the back of the paper that already has Equitable Commerce printed, where these pages will be sent to Adam Kokesh, and hopefully (in my opinion) the kidnap victim will be released, and the package is then forwarded at the cost of the kidnapers. Also, I was able to right justify the list of Candidate Questions as suggested. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, tomorrow is first day of school and I am trying to real in my bedtime so that I can get up in the mornings and have a good start to the day. I see your message and will figure out about dates. I cannot remember the rules at this moment. I think, though (hopefully) that I included a link to the rules in the forum somewhere and will look into it in the morning after I have everyone out the door. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Don't let me add to your costs, please. If needed this project can be delayed, no problem. I personally am not so strict on rules governing my writing as to need to fix a date in the Index. I am responding here to ask you to discard the last files I sent, since I have added more to the Joe's Law chapter, taking out some words, in the effort to remove a lot of confusion that exists in that chapter. I hope to be done tomorrow, and a check by you would be nice, or if you are going to be too busy, for too long, then I can ask if it is OK to just send the file to the Printer without your final walk through <---------- Real Estate Lingo I can delay too. Having more time to go through and perfect, or get to a point where I know I should not change another word. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, You still writing Joe Quotes I will wait to hear from Joe regarding bear taking a final look. At that time we will see what bear is up to. I had to look at the date thing for my own peace of mind. I suppose you didn't need to look since you used the date on which you accessed the file per http://classroom.synonym.com/format-endnotes-properly-4063.html Step 5 Include the website URL and date on which you accessed the site, if citing information found online. For example: Margarette Burnette, "5 Innocent Ways to Drive Up Car Insurance," [http://finance.yahoo.com/insurance/article/110130/5-innocent-ways-to-drive-up-car-insurance], July 2010. I found that information from a link JOE saved: http://www.power-independence.com/forum/view_post.php?post_id=5691 Have a nice day, Joe. I will now look into doing something with the big bag of garden fresh okra handed to me at church Sunday. We have such crazy schedules in this house, I can hardly plan when to use it fresh. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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I finished another reading through the book last night, having done some edit work in Joe's Law chapter to try to make The FED crimes and the IRS crimes easier to understand. I can send the finish .pdf while I go through it one more time. If you get a chance, then please consider looking for the changes at least. My last go through I checked all the text in the Index for URL Addresses and they checked out. In order to read the .pdf I have Two Page View, Show Gaps between Pages, and Show Cover Page in Two Page View checked, and the Reader Program then has the Title Page as one Page, and then all the book pages are on the correct side left to right and front to back. I am diving back into the book to see if it is finally finished for the prototype run. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Yes, send on the pdf and I will do what I can. I will look forward to reading the pdf in book format! I am glad you figured that out! I can send the finish .pdf while I go through it one more time. If you get a chance, then please consider looking for the changes at least. bear |
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bear Guest
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I know I am supposed to be reading. I am right here:Ron Paul sets the bar of wisdom, an example to strive to emulate. Another person to send a copy to? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I want to keep you up to date on my progress: I am on page 26 (page number at the bottom page of the book or 36 of 174 if looking at total page count). So far the only thing I have noted is: pg 16 - I failed to indent Henry Ford quote I did not get as far as I had hoped yesterday. I will continue at my snail's pace as I am able until you tell me otherwise. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, there is a note above this regarding my progress. I also have a change in my own words I would like added if it is not too much trouble or out of scope of where we are in this process of finishing Joe Quotes. It is in this bear comment on page 28: "I am not my own; I belong to everyone else, and this little space, this little place, I have found in writing and learning belongs to me. That may not make much sense to you, but it does to me. If that about me makes it so I am not qualified, we need to know that.... If it is possible I would like this added "to learn" after the word qualified. So that the words would read "I am not my own; I belong to everyone else, and this little space, this little place, I have found in writing and learning belongs to me. That may not make much sense to you, but it does to me. If that about me makes it so I am not qualified to learn, we need to know that.... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear. I can change those words right now in my copy, and in that way my copy will be the only copy being changed. As to page count with footers seen, or unseen, I am at a loss to understand how that works, but I can ask if that is something done with the .pdf file viewer or in Word? I ran into a problem with the change of your sentence. Should I add the many dots after the period or leave only a period after "that"? "...to learn; we need to know that." or "...to learn; we need to know that...." There is no problem in pushing off the Printer to a later date, and it is already Wednesday so you are probably very busy. No problem at all, on my end, making sure that the file is as good as it can get according to you and I, without reservation. |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, It is now 11 at night and I haven't stopped since I left the house this morning (Jeff managed to buy a used truck and a used house all in the same day, so we spent a couple of hours driving to get this truck. He is very patient when looking for a vehicle. He always seems to find what he is looking for at the price he wants to pay.) The sentence should end with a single period. I put the dots in my note to you because the sentence was a part of a larger paragraph. I am sorry for the confusion. The sentence should read: If that about me makes it so I am not qualifiedto learn; we need to know that. Thank you for changing the words for me. I do not know what you are referring to here, As to page count with footers seen, or unseen, I am at a loss to understand how that works, but I can ask if that is something done with the .pdf file viewer or in Word? but I am thinking I may have added more confusion the way I was referring to the page count. There is a page count with the numbers at the bottom of the page and those numbers are different from the total page count because the first part of the book is numbered different. Everything is fine as far as I am concerned with the page numbers and the footers. (i.e. the book is 174 pages long, but the last page does not say 174, nor should it because we start the actual numbering with chapter 1.) I am thinking that may be what we are talking about, but I am not sure. Joe, it looks like I will have very little time the next 2 weeks. I have not packed a single box because I didn't want to have my hopes up in case something fell through, so I have a major task ahead of me and we are supposed to be moved in 2 weeks and I have multiple appointments in the mix. I also am hoping to do a little painting before we move...if that all works out. I don't want to delay printing if you are ready to go, but also I don't mind having the bookwork on the back burner if that is the way you want to proceed. I just want to be upfront about my time limits so that you are not surprised. If the next 2 weeks are anything like today, I will be running ragged Tomorrow I am taking the Amish to the dentist so I may have a little time there. I also may have a little time during soccer practice, so I may have bits and pieces of time where I will need something to do (like bookwork) while waiting. Thank you for your patience. If it runs out, just say so ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I sent the file as it is to the printer with the following words sent in the same e-mail: Bookmasters, I am going to attach the .pdf file of the 174 page book already quoted for printing for Joe Kelley. This is not intending to be the final version ready for printing. I am sending this file to make sure that there are no major changes required to be done to the file in order for the file to measure up to the specifications required by Bookmaster. If there are no major changes required then the final version will be sent after at least one more reading by me or my friend who is acting as publisher, a few more or less words corrected, added, subtracted, or edited may yet be required. I just want to know if we are in the ball park with this file according to the quote, and according to the already submitted (and passed) book cover file. One thing that might be troublesome is a QR code intending to link a reader of the book to an Index Web Page. The QR code works when printed from a computer onto printer paper, and I want it to work when a reader of the book uses a cell phone to scan the Index page in the book where the QR code is to be printed. The QR code is on page 156 in the file now being sent for evaluation (if possible). Joe If it works out that I have time to go through the book another few times, and you are not able to get through it one more time, in 2 weeks, then I may get impatient. It has been a long time in the making, so another 2 weeks may be a good thing, or it may be, I don't know at this time, it may be time to just go ahead and get it printed. No response yet from Bookmasters on the latest file that includes your change to the sentence "...learning..." It must be nice to be busy, just before falling asleep. Joe P.S. Each time I re-read the following sentence I marvel at the artwork. In this chapter, you will find various concepts, things, and actions compared with one another; thus, lifting the cloak of deception so that one might peer into well-lit rooms where truth illumines thru comparison. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, On page 49 I see a possible error in the use of quotation marks: "I asked him, “WHO is not keeping obligations: College Students or the Criminals in Government?" Are there supposed to be single quote marks around the question being asked, and then double plus single marks a the end of the sentence? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Punctuation on page 49 should be: "I asked him, 'WHO is not keeping obligations: College Students or the Criminals in Government?'" Good catch! Today I have managed to fall face first out of the van into an Amish dirt driveway. My Amish friend thought I opened the door and had a heart attack or something. I also managed to lock my keys in the van while on the Amish dentist trip so Jeff had to take an hour off of work to unlock the van for me. This is the first moment I have had to even check on bookwork and I have to be at the new house in less than an hour to go thru a walk thru with the sellers so they can cue us in on any of the quirks to upkeep the place. I have only managed to pack 2 boxes which only partially emptied the china cabinet. Joe, you may loose patience with me if this is the way my next 2 weeks pan out. Good idea to send a preview to the printer to get some feedback. I will do the best I can in this mix of life I am experiencing. Yes I am going to bed busy, almost so that I can't sleep because I am too tired and yet hyped up at the same time. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Jeff is the hero, saving the day by unlocking the Van! So, at some point, at least this has happened to me, the idea of slowing down and being more deliberate, so as to avoid taking two steps back for every step forward, appears to be a good, competitive, next step. I fixed the quoting on page 49. No word back from the printer yet. My brother, his wife, and their 2 kids have recently moved, and it is taking them months to get out of one house and into another. If you can do that in 2 weeks, then you earn a few gold stars? I received a response from Bookmasters. Here it is: Hello Joe, From what I can tell given my limited software, everything looks good except for some fonts that are not embedded. Our pre-flight check will be the final test to ensure there are no issues that would effect print quality. The QR code should not be an issue if it works from your home printer and cell phone. We would produce it as is without any changes. I responded with this: Thanks for the quick response. I will try to find out why some fonts are not embedded, and how to embed them. I am new to this and my help is very busy moving. Joe I can't replace your viewpoint on the status of the book, no matter how many times I read the book looking for errors to correct, or improvements to make, since I have only my own eye (one is lazy and does not work right) to see. I am almost through another reading and I found only that quotation mark error this time around. I can read again, and I can reach my own state of satisfaction that the book is free from errors, as far as my eye can see, so far. I do have experience writing, and then publishing, or submitting articles, and then later realizing that there was an error here and there. Embedding files with Word That is what I have found so far. I just tried in Word: Save AS, then PDF, then options for PDF, click the box for ISO 19005 -1 compliant (PDF/A), and then save the file. Open the PDF with Adobe Reader, look in properties, then fonts, then notice how all the fonts now say (Embedded Subset), where they were not all Embedded according to the Adobe Reader/File/Properties/Font when saving from Word without checking the ISO 19005 -1 compliant (PDF/A) box. So.... I updated my e-mail to Bookmasters as such: I don't know if this is a new phenomenon called e-mail tag (like phone tag), but I want to add to my last e-mail with a report on my finding how to check embedded fonts and use the PDF Save Option in Word: ISO 19005 -1 compliant (PDF/A). Rechecking Adobe Reader Properties I now see all Fonts listed as (Embedded Subset). I can now look through the book again to see if I can find any more errors. Joe |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I did not fall out of the van yesterday (my lower lip looks like I took one to the jaw. I told Jeff if wasn't careful, I'd blame it on him, lol - he has never hit me, nor raised his voice at me), nor did I lock my keys in it, nor did I pack a single box, nor did I any bookwork. The only thing I did wrong yesterday was put too much in the freezer and the door wasn't shut all night... I am overwhelmed, I will not be opening my computer again until I have things under control on the home front. I hate leaving you with the Sound of Silence, but I have no options at this point. My personal cost is too great as I try to take care of multiple Amish families, I am left too spent to take care of my own. I have to rearrange my priorities today. I will contact you as soon as I can. I am sorry to do this. I am not infallible and as you know, I have read the book multiple times and am responsible for things that have been in error. I didn't even have all the fonts imbedded...a major issue and you fixed it! OK, my friend Joe, I will return when I can. If I do any bookwork in the mean time, I will just write to say where I am, but please do not expect anything. That is where I am today. I feel sorry and sad when I should feel excited and happy to be moving to the country, a life-long dream. I am in a bit of a bad place at the current. ... |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I did not do any bookwork all weekend. Today I have to continue to pack. I have 2 appointments in town and have an evening soccer game to attend. I can hardly stand not knowing how bookwork is at your end. Even though I have taken a break, your book is still in my thoughts. I hope all is well with you and yours. My mom and pop were here this weekend and Mom is a packing pro and I am feeling much better today about things. I don't know how this week will pan out, but I could not stand the Sound of Silence and had to leave you a little note today. Thank you for your patience. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Bookmasters did not reply to my last e-mail, and that may be a priority thing too. When I send the file and tell them this is it, the finished product, then they will probably put me back on their list of things to do today. I read through it finding only that quotation mark error the last time I went through the book. I want to go through it again, and I do want your final walk through complete to your satisfaction too. When you are ready I can send the latest version I have, where that quote error is fixed and where all fonts are embedded according to PDF READER. Much is going on in the world right now too, Syria, and World War III. Much is going on at home too. Whenever you are able to respond, then you will respond. Thanks for the update, and it sounds like you have extra power to hold down the new fort, reinforcements helping in the move. |
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bear Guest
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Thank you Joe I have a doc appt tomorrow. There is a chance I will be waiting in the waiting room and waiting in the patient room, so I might be able to do a little bookwork tomorrow. Is it a problem to use the pdf I already have? After all, I have managed to make it to page 38 of 174 |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I checked my sent folder and I see that you have been sent the file titled: Joe Quotes 09-02-2013. That is the finished version I have minus the fix on the sentence with a quote error. You have all the changes I made in that file other than that quote fix. I am curious to here your opinion concerning the changes I made, adding quotes to the ends of chapters, and extending the sales pitch in Sale or No Sale. I also rewrote some of the words in Joe's Law. I do not see any change in the fonts from un-embedded to embedded so far, and that may be something you might not see if there is a change, if you don't embed those fonts with the file you are reading. I have yet to read through another time. Work was busy for me the past few days. Pages 56, 57 "Saying the nation of Israel will only be restored by Messiah and that the humanly done Zionism is not according to God’s Will." bear, That quote is one of your sentences and I am finally zeroing in on it for possible improvement. I have trouble understanding that sentence even now. Each time I read it I have trouble with it. I get it, I think I get it, in a general sense, but the actual sentence appears to be the source of my trouble. Is it worth the effort to improve it before it is printed in 100 books, and who knows how many copies of E-books? That sentence may have made much more sense in context with the words before it. It (the sentence) is not now in context, so it may be a good idea to rewrite the sentence, or add the relevant sentences preceding that sentence??? Page 117 The word empathetic is the correct word and so I am replacing the wrong word in this sentence. "I do so willfully and with great interest. I cannot be emphatic, so defined." |
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bear Guest
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Joe,"Saying the nation of Israel will only be restored by Messiah and that the humanly done Zionism is not according to God’s Will." That sentence out of its original context. Thank you for bringing it to my attention. The original quote was http://www.dailypaul.com/259985/liberty-day-challenge-july-4th-2013-v2?page=1#comment-2829436 : Joe, I still haven’t ironed out my understanding of the nation of Israel as determined by the United Nations in 1948. I see religious Jews here: http://www.dailypaul.com/256465/ahmadinejad-embraces-the-jew... Should we use the complete quote? (Perhaps the first time on page 56 and then just a partial on page 57 since the context will have been established? ---------------------------------- Page 117 The word empathetic is the correct word and so I am replacing the wrong word in this sentence. "I do so willfully and with great interest. I cannot be emphatic, so defined." ------------------------ I always read empathetic when I was reading it. I never caught the mistake emphatic. Joe, even though you have one lazy eye and one eye that does not see well (I think that is what you explained to me), your eyes are better than bear eyes which began wearing glasses when she hit her 40's. I can no longer read fine print...evidently I can't even read normal print...with glasses. I read what I want to read instead of the word that is. I have said it before and I will say it again: "You are very smart Joe!" ------------------------------------- On page 142 of 174, since we have removed Joe's Slaw recipe, can we add back bear's original Point which reads: Joe’s Law and Joe Slaw both take time to understand. One is hot and spicy with radishes, or so I hear…the other…provides a key to abundance. The recipe for Joe’s Law is shared below. If you want the recipe for Joe Slaw, you will have to ask Joe. Joe’s Law is used here to prove the point that the American public needs to create and begin using competitive forms of currency. I always liked that original version and when I modified it to add the page number for the recipe I changed some of the other words as well, but now they can be changed back if OK with you. ---------------- I haven't run into any of the quotes at the end of the chapters yet. I will go back to see if I missed them before I got to page 38. I'll then go straight to Joe's Law and to Sale or No Sale to see your changes. I can also look at the chapter ends to see your new quotes before I start back at page 38 and read thru. I am not packing tonight. I am too tired, but not too tired to do bookwork. So, I will work abit tonight. Not sure how far I will get. I will keep you posted though ... |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I also have a comment above this one. But I want to also ask this question: Is page 122 of 174 the first quote that you have added to the end of a chapter? ------------------- OK also, as I am scanning thru the document to look for chapter ends/quotes added, I noticed page 151 of 174 starts lower on the page than normal. Is that the way you are wanting it? ------------------------- I am finished scanning the end of the chapters for added quotes. I just found them in 2 chapters and the 2nd one I found is a portion of the first quote I found. Is that right? (I am not sure if I am making sense. I am tired.) Both quotes were Patrick Henry. |
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bear Guest
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page 150 of 174Is that clear? Does that answer those concerns?” No, as a matter of fact it is not. I still want to know WHY this loan is a "government service," AND WHERE does this "government - our government" get its money to provide this "service"? And what right do this so called government have to offer services and limit profits? Afterall, I did lunch room duty this week. Our private Christian school has bought into the "Free" food commodities that "our" government "offers." The children are allowed 1 teaspoon of katsup for baked, saltless french-fries. There was so much whole wheat macaroni and cheese thrown away by the children, I could not lift the garbage bag out of the garbage can. A Huge 6 foot 8th grader is allowed the same portions as a 5 year old...and when the skinny 5 year old comes back for 2nds with a cleaned plate, they are told they can't have any more...the 8th grader can't have any more either even though his is nearly twice the size of all his classmates. Further more, the children may only have a 2nd serving of vegetables once a week, and must take every food on the menu whether they want it or not..."our" government says so...with this "FREE" commodity they offer...with strings attached all the way to Washington DC. They buy the commodities with MY tax MONEY, so it is MY food that they are dictating how will it will be served to MY children and every other child in schools that take this "FREE" food. So, tell me, how is this "new" government going to regulate itself and its "services" without stealing COMMODITIES from the PEOPLE regulating everything to DEATH so they people can "ENJOY" these "FREEBIES"? ...the day I did lunchroom duty was the morning of the day in which I fell out of the van on my face and locked my keys inside as well...it was quite a day. I had quite a bit to say to the GOVERNMENT "trained" lunch preparer...I told her that when we forsake our God-given common sense and follow government orders instead, we are being conditioned just like Nazi prison guards who starved people to death...because they were following orders. I was sick to my stomach at what I saw, and my conscience was violated when I was not allowed to give the child who had cleaned his plate anything else. He said, "I am still hungry." To bad kid, your school is accepting FREE COMMODITIES, and even though you are going thru a growth spurt, you cannot have any more food...while the skinny little girl after him threw her whole seaminly untouched tray of food in the garbage...what government nutrition did she consume during lunch time? None. The big 8th grader didn't get his caloric intake, the little boy who was still hungry couldn't have anymore, and the skinny little girl can just starve the rest of the day. I DONT WANT ANY FREE SERVICES. I WANT TO BE LEFT ALONE. I WANT OUR FARMERS LEFT ALONE. PLEASE, JUST LET US HELP OURSELVES. Joe, if 60% of your income was not stolen thru taxes and regulations, you wouldn't need a government service to offer you a loan. You would have your own power. -------------------- Please be sure to see the 2 replies above this one. Also, my brother-in-law has called and is COMING IN THE MORNING to start moving furniture to the new place. I AM NOT READY. Instead of getting ready, I am going to bed. I hope I wake up in the morning ready to move fast! There are still some things that need to unloaded from furniture before it can be moved. Fibromyalgia has been kicking in the last few days, so not only am I tired, I am weak and tired. 25-30 years ago, I would have stayed up all night and packed. I guess I have lost my edge, and the sad thing is, I don't care. But maybe it is just that I can't care because I just can't do what I want to do. My muscles don't let me. I was listening to some nutritional doctor saying that fibromyalgia was corrected in lambs thru nutrition. It was a condition called stiff lamb disease (I think). Anyways, I am going to look into it when I can. ----------- I haven't read Joe's Law yet. I have wanted to tell you about the lunch room all week long. I just havent had time. I really didn't have time now. Please remember to look at the 2 replies above this one...they were about bookwork. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, As I re-read the book I find more and more that your words, your perspective, our artwork, is striking, overpowering, and therefore I think you need to decide exactly what needs to be done with that remaining point of contention in this book. This: Should we use the complete quote? (Perhaps the first time on page 56 and then just a partial on page 57 since the context will have been established? My opinion is such that the way to fix this requires your focused attention, when you have time to focus your attention on this specific problem. My suggestion is that you have a lot of room before added words will use up the blank space on Page 71 and there is a blank page between Page 71, the last page of and the Deep Rooted Self Destruction, and the first page of the next chapter, so there is plenty of room to add whatever you want to add in the context of that specific discussion and the book in general. I have often considered adding more links to the INDEX so you can also open that door up and we can use up the space (1/3 of a page) left in the INDEX page. At this point I can add all the changes as you decide to make without any need for you to edit the file, send the file, or work with the file. We are close to a finished project. Why be in a hurry at this point? I always liked that original version and when I modified it to add the page number for the recipe I changed some of the other words as well, but now they can be changed back if OK with you. I can make that change now, so as not to forget, and I too prefer your actual words to my hurried version of your words in my rush to get the book to the printer. But I want to also ask this question: Is page 122 of 174 the first quote that you have added to the end of a chapter? Using Adobe (PDF) Reader I see page 123 of 174, and in the book the page number is 112, and that is where I remember adding the first quote addition by Patrick Henry, and I used a shorter quote at the end of the next chapter from the same source. OHH! I am finished scanning the end of the chapters for added quotes. I just found them in 2 chapters and the 2nd one I found is a portion of the first quote I found. Is that right? (I am not sure if I am making sense. I am tired.) Both quotes were Patrick Henry. That is right from my view. As to this: I noticed page 151 of 174 starts lower on the page than normal. Is that the way you are wanting it? I see in Word the numbers are working to find the page where the start of the text is not at the top of the page (like every other page) so I fixed that too. Thanks. I hope that you have a good night. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I was writing while you were writing last night. I hope you might have time to look back to find my words concerning Sale No Sale. I am sure it will get your goat as I see thru bear eyes and can not quite see thru Joe eyes. I used all caps. Not because I was screaming, but just so that you will note the words with bear emotion. We are moving today so this is all I can write. Thank you for allowing me the time to move and then concentrate on bookwork once again. I did go to sleep last night with the pdf of Joe Quotes being read aloud by the computer |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Thanks for directing me to vital questions I have missed. No, as a matter of fact it is not. I still want to know WHY this loan is a "government service," AND WHERE does this "government - our government" get its money to provide this "service"? And what right do this so called government have to offer services and limit profits? In order to get from point A to point B it may be a good idea to accurately measure both points first. 1. Point A Legal Money Monopoly Fraud and Extortion whereby the Extortion is a method of creating targets out of people who make something worth stealing, and then taking that which is worth stealing from those people by giving those people two really bad choices, or the lesser of two evils, which is to pay, without question, this much, or pay, without question more. Then there is the Fraud part, which covers up the Extortion part, and the Fraud part is the part where there is only ONE MONEY with which to pay all DEBTS including the DEBTS demanded by the Extortionists, and in that way the people who produce the ONE MONEY have unlimited Legal Purchasing Power. 2. Point B Anything but Point A, so long as it is not worse than Point A, and so, naturally, a competition can be started among anyone, anywhere, who may offer, voluntarily, options that are other than Point A. So, having that understood, where we are, and where we may want to go, there is then a need to invent a way to get from Point A to Point B. Self-governors can invent options, in the form of any money, of any kind, and to get the ball rolling, there can be an agreement, which is an agreement made by anyone, anytime, to use the government issue money, that is offered by contractors who submit bids to get the license to make money and sell money, so long as the money made, and sold is not as bad as Point A, and so long as the money made is not worse than Point A, or, in other words, since we have accurately identified, and understood what is Point A, we, the governors, agree, voluntarily, not to be a part of a Legal Money Monopoly Fraud that covers up Legal Extortion. I will stop there to see if that works to convey the understanding in such a way as to fill the demand for answers to the vital question. ...take this "FREE" food. You are speaking about misdirected people, or willful criminals, in control of power at a local gathering of people. How do you equate that with a concept of Equitable Commerce applied to Legal Banking? I have no idea, how you can bridge the gap, and that is why I kept on asking for your participation in a play acting of a sales event between an imaginary customer and an imaginary seller of Legal Loans in Equitable Commerce as I know such things can work, principally. If you want to get down to the base of the problems you see at the local gathering (which has nothing to do with what I am intending to convey to you), then you must figure out a better way, and then you must go to where the buck stops, and change the way things are done from wrong to right. You will have the hardest time, in my opinion, finding where the buck stops, but it is not hard to do, it just may require persistence. The "hardness" factor may merely be a problem of you encountering one, two, three, or many people who merely follow orders without question, and eventually you find the person who has the power to make those wrong rules, and then you can, at that seat of power, offer a reasonable alternative. You see Point A, in your local situation. You can (with some effort because you are intelligent, reasonable, honest, and a good person) figure out something better than Point A, so call your vision Point B, and you offer, at the seat of power, once you find the seat of power, your vision. That is how to get from Point A to Point B, in that local situation, and in that way, we are then on the same, basic, base, principled page. At the seat of power, in your local situation, you may encounter people who are not as honest, not as reasonable, not as intelligent, as you are, and so that may be problematic in getting from Point A to Point B. The World Monopoly Bank People, a number of people, are guilty of the worst crimes ever to have been set in motion by any inhuman beings. The principles are the same, perhaps the degree in which the evil, or the good, is expressed, is variable. So, tell me, how is this "new" government going to regulate itself and its "services" without stealing COMMODITIES from the PEOPLE regulating everything to DEATH so they people can "ENJOY" these "FREEBIES"? The idea concerns a takeover of the Law Power away from the Central Banking Frauds, which is the Point A spoken about earlier, and then to get the ball rolling, so as not to suffer dreaded "Economic Collapse," the place where the buck stops, which would be The President, which would be an assumption concerning the existence of an actual Federal Government (a power that was not under the control of the Banking Monopoly Criminals), and so an order is issued to solicit 10 contractors, as a starting point, whereby 10 contractors submit bids to fit a contract for replacing The Dollar Hegemony with 10 competitors who seek to offer the highest quality money products at the lowest cost to anyone. So, again, that was never discussed up until this point, since now is the timing of this discussion, at your request. If that does not make sense, then it makes sense to me that you can confuse a voluntary association, something that may seem to be foreign in concept, with an involuntary association, such as The Dollar Hegemony which is, at this time, ubiquitous. I did lunchroom duty was the morning of the day in which I fell out of the van on my face and locked my keys inside as well...it was quite a day. A true warrior, which is what you are, suffers at times. I think your story is worth knowing. I don't know what else to say about that without crushing egg shells. I know that my words may cut, at times, but I also know that my intent is to help you, because you help me. I am without shame a selfish person, while I also know that helping other people makes me happy. I think that you understand. I don't know. I have to rely upon trust. .I told her that when we forsake our God-given common sense and follow government orders instead, we are being conditioned just like Nazi prison guards who starved people to death...because they were following orders. I am following my routine of not reading ahead, so at this point I am cheering on, as if to say that my estimate of you remaining silent was an error on my part, but I have to clarify, to ask, to make sure, that you are telling me know that you actually did say those words. I think that you did, and at this point, again, I am a cheerleader. I have my pomp pomps, and I can twirl my baton. If you have had enough, then you can see how outbursts may not be the best method of communicating, so in the future, doing due diligence, you may figure out how to avoid reaching the breaking point, doing something better, doing something sooner. Again, I do not know. I DONT WANT ANY FREE SERVICES. I WANT TO BE LEFT ALONE. I WANT OUR FARMERS LEFT ALONE. PLEASE, JUST LET US HELP OURSELVES. Here is the thing that I do know. I run for President on the internet. I ran for congress on the official (costly) ballot. Why? How much better can I do things compared to sociopaths, narcissists, nihilists, psychopaths, torturers, rapists, child rapists, murderers, and mass murderers, who use fraud and extortion to gain their power over their victims? Not much better? How much better? How can I know if I do not try? So I try in my mind and in the real world, as it actually exists. You do too, and you do so because you can, you are still alive, despite all the power working to end your life. So I have my view. You have your view. They are not the same view. That is a good thing. What is similar? I don't like waste too. I don't like false claims of things being free either. Why are you assuming, if that is what you are doing, that the idea of competitive banking loans are in any way free? You have not even asked how those loans work, those loans in my viewpoint, so you automatically assume that those loans, in my view, are transfers of stolen property? You never give me any credit whatsoever while you claim to be giving me credit? So you have these shoes on your feet that have had enough and so you speak out, and you do so intending to expose the obvious wrongs, which is very good, and again I am heading the cheerleader squad on that one. So what replaces what is, where what is is not as good as what can be? Joe, if 60% of your income was not stolen thru taxes and regulations, you wouldn't need a government service to offer you a loan. You would have your own power. So, I am an honest person that you can talk to, someone that will not intentionally harm you, and so you can project your challenging, competitive, experimental, viewpoints onto me, as if I am an alter ego, a sounding board, but I am me. I am me. I spent years and years at hard labor and I don't know what exactly was stolen from me each hour? I don't know how that power produced by me was consumed in torturing and murdering so many people? You may not want to know me, and now I can tell you something that occurs to me, having to do with people so blind that they merely follow orders without question, feeding garbage, like stuffing poison down the throats, of innocent people, knowing all the while that what they are doing is wrong, and they destroy that knowing, they become beasts in the process, and they you help them see better. Is it easy? No, and it is not easy for me to resist the too comfortable employment of curse words, when speaking to you. Please be sure to see the 2 replies above this one. The page start was raised (not lowered) so it is fixed, and the Joe's Slaw point/start was returned back to the original. I can send the file for proofing. Instead of getting ready, I am going to bed. I hope I wake up in the morning ready to move fast! From my power perspective that makes sense to me. You can't run out of power and expect to have the power required to do more work. If I am not up to date, then I can get up to date because I want to be up to date, but I may have missed something, so again, I need your help. Thanks |
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bear Guest
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Joe, we just got internet access. We had to switch to a new service because our old service did not work out here on this dirt road I have read your reply fast, but I have to get sleep now. I am Pat and Pat is asking John all of those questions about those loans because Pat is old and set in her ways and she does not understand the new reality she finds herself in. She is still mad about the old reality and all the power that was stolen from her over the last 38 years or so. Make it 50...after all the power that was stolen from her parents affected her for the 12 years of life before she started earning an income. You might liken it to being shell-shocked when the words government regulations are used. Joe, how do these loans work? And thank you for restraining your language. You have kindly done that from the first time I asked, and I appreciate it. What does it mean to be shamelessly selfish? Are you selfish? Do you not have any shame? OK, I have a day with the Amish tomorrow. My mom is coming next week to spend the week with me to help me get organized. And yes, I did say those words out loud to the government trained lunch director, and many more. She may not want me to help anymore. Joe, I would trust John to do right by Pat before I would trust any government which is a group of people removed from the situation to do right by Pat. I think decisions should be local. People at the new CVS pharmacy cant even make certain decisions locally...they have to follow corporate rules. I changed pharmacies to one which is locally owned and operated and decisions are made by the owner...in-house...within government regulations...of course. I think group think is too easily taken over by criminals who are shamelessly selfish, so much so they commit crimes because they are selfish. ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, My understanding of shame has to do with my understanding of conscience, whereby there can be a confusion caused by lies. If there is confusion caused by lies, then shame may be the result of doing good things, as if conscience is "providing the means by which we suffer" instead of doing the effective work that conscience is designed to accomplish effectively. Cases in point: 1. I love to help other people, so when I do so it is a selfish act, because I love it. Do I feel shame when I do things that I love to do, because I get such a huge reward (profit) for doing things that make me so happy? What does it mean to be shamelessly selfish? Are you selfish? Do you not have any shame? If I click on an advertizement on my Facebook page where there is a woman with large breasts in view, do I feel shame? Yes, but I do it anyway. I may be confused in that department. I am not confused in the department whereby I love to help other people, so therefore I do not feel any shame when I seek out that PROFIT, that REWARD, of helping other people, even when there is no positive, or even when there is a negative, reaction to my efforts to help. I do not destroy my love of helping other people when I fail, rather, I work to find effective, rather than ineffective, ways to help other people. What is a warrior? What would a warrior look like in Liberty (where crime no longer paid so well)? And yes, I did say those words out loud to the government trained lunch director, and many more. She may not want me to help anymore. How will you know if you were helping? I think decisions should be local. In order to help, to me, I have to spell things out, and therefore I did spell things out, and I did so with a brief description of Point A and Point B. Point A is not local. Point A is a Global Criminal Legal Money Monopoly POWER. There is a local solution, in the sense that there will be (at Point B) loans between free traders, whereby the exchanges are equitable, not criminal. I tried. How will I know if I help? I changed pharmacies to one which is locally owned and operated and decisions are made by the owner...in-house...within government regulations...of course. In Liberty (borrowed from bear is the concept of being inside of Liberty) the term "government regulations" would be local, not "corporate," as those in Liberty would not be confusing Crime made Legal with self-government or voluntary government. The criminals have long ago taken over the POWER of effective medical treatment, so why call it "government regulation" when speaking about orders from the criminals that are to be followed without question? I think group think is too easily taken over by criminals who are shamelessly selfish, so much so they commit crimes because they are selfish. An example of "group think" is to refer to criminal orders (that are to be followed without question) as being orders offered by people hired to maintain "government regulations". An example of a government regulation is one that all the self-governors agree, voluntarily, to follow. Such as: It is not lawful to murder babies in a church by burning them to death while they are still alive. When a person says that the National Government is our government, my blood begins to boil. Why make such an outrageous claim as to claim that the National Government is ours, in any way, any shape, or any form, whatsoever? I can give you an example of group think. I changed pharmacies to one which is locally owned and operated and decisions are made by the owner...in-house...within government regulations...of course. What is government? What does the word mean? Where is the person sitting in the seat of power whereby that authority is ordering orders to be obeyed without question? If the idea is to communicate accurately, then trial and error may work to reach that goal, if the goal can be reached, and if the goal cannot be reached, then what is the point, or the purpose, of "communicating"? Group think? If it makes a person happy to "help" other people in a church, to "help" them by burning them alive, then such a person may consider their own actions as being "helpful," since the babies being burned alive are having their souls used for a higher purpose? The "helper" who is happy about "helping" is actually, in their own mind, a generous person, and not at all selfish? What can a misdirected person do other than harm, as they continue to provide the means by which they suffer? What is the cost of the mountain of lies? Why call criminals anything but criminals? As to the book project, I am now finding it very difficult to follow your directions on where pages in your copy line up with pages in my copy. Example: I noticed page 151 of 174 starts lower on the page than normal. That is right on my copy when opening the Word file. Page 151 of 174 is listed as page 141, and it is the Chapter OK. I moved the text up on the page to where it should be, like all the other pages in the book (as far as I know at this point). Example 2: On page 142 of 174, since we have removed Joe's Slaw recipe, can we add back bear's original Point which reads: I found the quote needing to be changed but it was not listed as Page 142 of 174. Depending upon where the page is while scrolling that quote is listed on Page 136 or 137 of 174 while I use Word to find that quote. The Page number is 127 which is the start of the chapter titled Joe's Law. Now my copy reads: Joe’s Law and Joe Slaw both take time to understand. One is hot and spicy with radishes, or so I hear…the other…provides a key to abundance. The recipe for Joe’s Law is shared below. If you want the recipe for Joe Slaw, you will have to ask Joe. Joe’s Law is used here to prove the point that the American public needs to create and begin using competitive forms of currency. That is cut and pasted from the Word file. This may be too much more power robbing work for you at this time. I am trying to keep things orderly, because I have not yet resolved at least one thing. I resolved those things above, but not this: Joe, "Saying the nation of Israel will only be restored by Messiah and that the humanly done Zionism is not according to God’s Will." That sentence out of its original context. Thank you for bringing it to my attention. The original quote was http://www.dailypaul.com/259985/liberty-day-challenge-july-4th-2013-v2?page=1#comment-2829436 : Joe, I still haven’t ironed out my understanding of the nation of Israel as determined by the United Nations in 1948. I see religious Jews here: http://www.dailypaul.com/256465/ahmadinejad-embraces-the-jew... Should we use the complete quote? (Perhaps the first time on page 56 and then just a partial on page 57 since the context will have been established? Adding more links to the INDEX appears to be required in this adjustment. That is OK, and I can then have the door open to add a few more links that are missing (but not a big deal) concerning other references like the Bill Clinton YouTube video where he says "It depends upon what is...is..." No big deal, no rush, I'm just trying to organize things some, and that last thing in double lines appears to me to be one of the last things not yet adjusted. The one other thing might be an additional response from the buyer in the Sale or No Sale transaction. If more is added to the book then I have to consider making another book cover .pdf since the book may be larger and wider. That can be done, and why not? I don't know how much more can be added, since it looks like a whole book could be added, whereby the seller and buyer require a lot more negotiating before a sale is finalized. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am very busy trying to get our lives back in some sort of order here...boxes everywhere...and stuff still in the old house...the cat made it in the load last night...time will tell how the cat will do here in the country with 2 inherited giant dogs (at least they don't chase cats). |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Thanks for the update. |
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bear Guest
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Another update: My Pop had gall bladder surgery Sat and Sun he was sent to another hospital with complications for a 2nd surgery so I have been with family on that matter. He is doing well. We are still halfway moved. Our friends are already knocking out walls in our old house and we are still getting our stuff out...we have entirely too much stuff. I expect to be out of bookwork pocket all week. I had hoped to accomplish much today in the way of moving work, but family time was on demand and my supply was spent in that direction. ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Thanks again. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Our lives are still upside down. I cannot tell when I will be able to do bookwork. Everything seems to take 3 or 4 times longer than planned. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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I am able to bear the delays in printing the book, easily, and my hope is that my desires for your help in final editing outweigh any anxious feelings I have, so don't, please don't, feel any sense of additional burden, added to your already heavy load, on my account. Be free from any obligation from me, please, other than that which you welcome in your own mind, in due time. Priorities are your responsibility, not mine, and that is how it must be, so thanks for the very welcome, but not necessary, quick update. It is nice to know that you are still able to communicate to me. It is appreciated but not necessary. I could add more, but this sentence is probably beyond necessity? |
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bear Guest
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Thank you, Joe, for understanding. It seems that I am surrounded with chaos and the book is one of those things that is dangling as I observe and orient myself in this crazy house. Not one room is finished and in place. My mom who was going to help me is helping my pop in his time of need so I feel alone and not knowing where to put things or where to start. Half my kitchen is still at the old house. I see that things will get worse here before they get better. So, I will work one step at a time. Thank you for being patient regarding bookwork. I expect to be silent again this week as I work towards order. I hope you and yours are well and that you have a good week. |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, Reporting in to say things are "looking up," since I now know which way up is. I cannot yet look in the direction of bookwork though. We are still clearing basement of old house and I am still surrounded by boxes in the new house, but things are getting better. I believe I see bookwork on the horizon. I will report in next week to let you know if I can set my headings that way yet or not. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Thanks again for the update. I hope all are well. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, we are all well as I hope the same for you and yours. I am still in panic mode as I look around and see all that needs to be done. However, rationale takes over and tells me to do one thing at a time and so I will plug a way at all of the loose ends. I will check back in on Wed and let you know what I foresee towards bookwork. I hope to accomplish much on the home front today in the way of unpacking boxes which are still more than less. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Thanks for the update. |
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bear Guest
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Joe, my mom and Pop are coming Wed thru Sun so bookwork will not occur this week. I had only expected them for Thurs according to plans made last week, but Mom has her schedule cleared til Sunday now so they will be helping me get settled thru the end of the week. I'll let you know how things look for next week. I am hoping that since I am having the extra help this week that I will be able to settle into a bookwork routine. I am sorry to have to test your patience so. I really am hoping that next week I will be able to tell you good news. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Good news is that Mom and Pop are OK. |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I went out to breakfast with the guys I once worked along side and having the discussion of the book tabled at breakfast inspires me to return to the book and read through one more time. I found a possible improvement in keeping my signature endings consistent. Also: The people at Bookmasters actually called me to see how the book was going, and I'm wondering now if someone actually read the .pdf file of the book text that I sent for a quick format check. 1. Example: Pate vii is: Joe’s words, “Cui bono?” —bear Page x has: I hope the example is worth the cost of reading. —Joe While Page 35: How much of it is prejudice made legal? — Joe 2. Page 4: The Crusades, and World War II. Knowing how to get past the resistance to factual, accurate information is a handy skill that works to get past and get around the false, inaccurate, deceptive versions of history. Is it an improvement: The Crusades, and World War II. Knowing how to get past the resistance to factual (accurate) information is a handy skill that works to get past and get around the false (inaccurate) deceptive versions of history. 3. Page 56 "Saying the nation of Israel will only be restored by Messiah and that the humanly done Zionism is not according to God’s Will." I think those words could be rephrased or as you have suggested those words can be added to a larger context with another sentence or paragraph added to the book. 4. Page 78 If you were on a Jury (a real Jury, not a counterfeit one), you could ask anyone whose profession is relevant to the case, and you could judge the case on professional evidence discovered during the case, and then actual people could be held accountable for those crimes. How about the following change? If you were on a Jury (a real Jury, not a counterfeit one), you could question anyone whose profession is relevant to the case, and you could judge the case on professional evidence discovered during the case, and then actual people could be held accountable for those crimes. 5. Page 80 The problem with connectivity is such that destructive things can travel as well as productive things, and if someone were to confuse destructive things with productive things, they may BLAME the medium of exchange because they fail to judge the stuff being transferred accurately. How about the following change? The problem with connectivity is such that destructive things can travel as well as productive things, and if someone were to confuse destructive things with productive things, they may BLAME the medium of exchange because they fail to accurately judge the stuff being transferred. 6. Page |
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bear Guest
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Hi Joe, My plan was to contact you today to make sure the file I currently have is the file that I should start using again. Things are feeling better on the homefront so I thought I'd begin trying to read thru again in my down time. I cannot promise much down time at the current, but I will begin to make it a priority instead of taking a nap due to sheer mental/physical exhaustion. I think I am past that phase now. I see you have left me some questions so I will begin to answer those now. 1. concerning signatures, I agree, they should all be formatted the same. --------------------------------------- 2. Good call on improvement! I like it and now read the information correctly (or as you intended): The Crusades, and World War II. Knowing how to get past the resistance to factual (accurate) information is a handy skill that works to get past and get around the false (inaccurate) deceptive versions of history. --------------------------------------- 3. Page 56 "Saying the nation of Israel will only be restored by Messiah and that the humanly done Zionism is not according to God’s Will." I think those words could be rephrased or as you have suggested those words can be added to a larger context with another sentence or paragraph added to the book. ---- Joe, Which do you prefer? Rephrasing or adding more info? Did I already send you info, or is it still in my hopper? ----------------------------------- 4. The change sounds good to me: If you were on a Jury (a real Jury, not a counterfeit one), you could question anyone whose profession is relevant to the case, and you could judge the case on professional evidence discovered during the case, and then actual people could be held accountable for those crimes. --------------------------------------- 5. Big improvement!!! Makes a difference in the way the sentence is read/understood! How about the following change? The problem with connectivity is such that destructive things can travel as well as productive things, and if someone were to confuse destructive things with productive things, they may BLAME the medium of exchange because they fail to accurately judge the stuff being transferred. -------------------------- 6. is left blank. Were you still writing and I have interrupted? ------------------------------ Do you think you need to resend me the file so we can be sure I am on correct version? I admit, I have lost track...it is like most everything in my house...I think I know where it is, but it may have moved, or been re-arranged, or even thrown away...by me or someone else being "helpful." My Pop is back in the hospital. But they appear to have everything under control Are you and yours all well? Nice to know bookmasters is now calling you! ... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I was out all day today and tomorrow will be another outing for family stuff, so this reply is late, and the next may be late too. I can ask for you to rephrase (page 56) the sentence, if possible, or if not possible then add the context that is required to make the sentence work better in the book, and then I can update all these new changes into the book, and send you the latest copy from these most current changes. At breakfast I talked to the friend (co-worker) who helped me during the run for congress, and it was very good to re-establish our discussions where we left off, even if our time was very limited, as it is not often I am able to discuss topics with anyone. For some reason my viewpoint is foreign to most people, therefore it is rare to have a discussion partner. I think Dave, my past discussion partner, is very interested in hearing how our (bear discussion partner) discussions transpired. I told Dave I'd give him a book, and he said: "I'd rather buy one". So...I can hold off sending the latest .pdf file of the book until you can reply here (or in e-mail) with an adjustment to that sentence (or that message) on page 56, and then I can adjust the book accordingly, and then send the latest version back to you. Thanks, and I hope you can enjoy your new home, and start a new garden? |
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bear Guest
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Joe, Thanks for the direction. I am going to try to start on bookwork first thing in the morning. Today is the first day I am home this week so I have some catching up to do on the home front today. Hopefully I will send you words for page 56 in the morning. I am glad you had opportunity to catch up with old buddies. It is nice to be able to pick those relations back up where they left off. We are enjoying our home. It still feels like we are on vacation. The house is a burmed A-frame with the feeling of a cabin. Spring will tell if a garden is in order. There is much to do to bring the fences back into order. An older guy told me that winter is the time to check fences because leaves and grass will die down to reveal fencing...common "country" sense which I still need to sharpen. The boys spend little time in the house. That makes me happy. TV and computer games are on the back burner as I had hoped. OK, I better get started on my chores. Our dog got hit by a 4-wheeler yesterday while we were gone and we haven't been able to find her so I spent an hour outside this morning looking and calling; thus, my morning is already gone without having accomplished much. I wish you and yours good family time, bear |
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bear Guest
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Joe, regarding page 56: Saying the nation of Israel will only be restored by Messiah and that the humanly done Zionism is not according to God’s WillHow about if we change the sentence to read: Recently, I watched a video ( http://youtu.be/_Kp8t0fz3cE ) showing religious Jewish men meeting with Ahmadinejad. Those religious Jews were against Zionism. In that video, they indicated that the nation of Israel will only be restored supernaturally by Messiah and that current humanly accomplished Zionism is not according to God’s Will. I had never heard anything like that before. Joe, I am sorry it has taken me so long to write that small paragraph of words. It was easy enough. I guess I was just overwhelmed with all that was on my plate that I could not make myself think about those words. If you do not like the video link in the new version it can be deleted. Our dog came home this morning. However, the other cat that was too wild for me to catch was still at the old house and I had been feeding him trying to catch him and when I went to the old house yesterday he was in the road hurt, still alive, and still too wild for me to catch. I don't know if he had been hit or poisoned. He has hidden under a porch and I can't get him and I don't know whether he will make it. I did get hold of his scruff yesterday and he felt cold and I did not have much to hang on to. He ended up kicking and scratching me before he ran away. Time will tell. I don't know why I go thru so much trouble for a cat that is so wild. Seeing him in that condition hurt me more than our missing dog. Of course no one else really cares about that cat and everyone else was worried about the dog. I didn't tell the boys about the cat as they had enough to worry about. Thankfully the dog came home this morning with no signs of injury. She is full of burs though and I am not sure how I will manage getting them out of her thick long hair. I do think I have the current version of the book, but I would feel better if you would resend me your copy. Thanks, Joe, for your patience these past weeks. I can now see a light at the end of the tunnel, but there is still much work to do. I kind of want to get an antique booth to sell my stuff that I will not be using at the new house. For some reason that seems easier to me than to have a garage sale or to just drop it off at the Samaritan Center. Parting ways with the "stuff" seems easier if I display it in a booth and retail it. Sounds like work, but it also sounds fun. OK, I have to go sweep the floor and porch and start the chores I did not accomplish yesterday and hopefully do some unpacking too. I will wait to hear back from you. bear |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, I am going to add the new sentence (without the link because that creates a need to change all the numbering in the Index) and then send you a copy of the latest book version. We know someone who has been fighting infection from cat bite in her hand, a very long process of healing, a very serious infection; watch out. Another cat story involves a wild cat that my Aunt fed while she visited my Mom before my Mom died in that same house. The cat would not let anyone near the cat until the day my Mom died, and then that cat went right up to my wife as if they were best friends. My wife was the one my Mom kept close, not me. So...a garden in 2014; more tomatoes? I love tomatoes, few good ones here in California (perhaps GMO). |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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Sending now |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I saw in my email that I have a message with an attachment from you. I have not opened the message or my email lately because Friday we found out that here in the country we do not have unlimited internet access. What we thought was a speed rating was actually data package rating and we have exceeded our allowance and doubled our bill... and now for this cycle which ends Nov 12 we only have 25% left. This is new to us and we are not sure how we will proceed. I can't listen to YouTube at will, etc, and I don't know if I can open the book yet. Jeff and I need to talk about it. I am not even sure how much data I transferred opening your website, but I thought maybe it was less than my email because I don't delete old messages so I have over 1000 messages that need cleaned out. I am only on this morning because I need to look up a greek word for my sunday school lesson and thought this to be a good time to contact you. We are also in a financial bind at the moment because our friends who are going to buy our house are remodeling it before they are buying it so we do not have that house payment offsetting our house payment, etc. What a mess... |
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Joe Kelley Administrator
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bear, Thanks for the update. I am in a similar position with finances. The solutions to these accounting problems may include book sale earnings. I don't know if that is on the horizon, in fact, but the book that may sell is almost already written, an indisputable fact. Each step is a learning process. I could send a CD via mail. I am patient in any case, the book idea on my end is forming into another non-fiction book titled Legal Crime and I have already picked out another cover from my daughters artwork. I could get that new book started and in that way I can be less anxious about the first book, allowing both books to move along at whatever pace works best. Writing a new book without the help of your previous volume of generous help (which was as much or more than my own volume of productive capacity) will definitely teach me the value of having so much help with hammering out words on the anvil. Grammar and punctuation accuracy, and consistency, is gaining in my process of writing because of your generous help. Thanks |
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bear Guest
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Joe, I am happy to hear about the starting of a new book: "Legal Crime" When it is finished I think Willl should get a copy lol Anyways, my plan is to go to McDonalds and use their free wifi service to download the book. Then it will be on my computer. I will not stay logged into the internet here, but will be able send you book comments, etc. All at once as I will record the info in Word and then copy and paste to your website maybe once a day or something like that. I hope to get to McDonalds tomorrow. Thanks for your patience Joe. |
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